Feeling shame and/or guilt for immoral actions/thoughts is a good thing. The problem nowadays is that folks (myself included) have become so indifferent and cynical to bad behavior.
Shame resiliency for me is this; "You might think that I am a bad person and that I should be shamed and feel shame for who you perceive for me to be based on your judgement, but I know that in my heart of hearts that I am a good person at my core and that will take precedence over your opinion of me because I care enough about myself to have my back when your intention is to tear me down emotionally and make me feel small."
When you say “shame on you” to a child, it’s damaging. At that moment, it’s not about the child, it’s about the parent - their insecurities, fears, frustrations, and their own shame that they are projecting on to the child.
I still feel that shame play the part and who you want others to be shame on you for taking that puppy shame on you for drinking while you're pregnant if you don't feel shame your narcissistic what do you call it shame or guilt
if you feel guilty without much shame you might change that behaviour, BUT if you feel a deep sense of shame then your understanding of yourself is that "of course" you are doing terrible things because you feel & believe you are inherently such a terrible person, so when someone says "shame on you", it doesn't help change the bad behaviour
there's some major MORAL CONFUSION going on here!!!! See it's this sort of POP PSYHCOLOGY that's getting us into some MAJOR trouble!!!! ALL SHAME ISN'T BAD!!! PEDOS REPEATE OFFENDERS, ETC. ARE SHAMELESS!!! THAT'S WHAT ALLOWS THEM TO COMMITT THESE HENIOUS CRIMES TO BEGIN WITH!!! THERE'S NO SHAME!!! ALL SHAME ISN'T BAD!!! IT FORCES HARDENED PEOPLE TO THINK ABOUT THEMSELVES!!! SOME PEOPLE WHO THINK OF THEMSELVES AS BEING BAD ARE THINKING RIGHT!!!
I'm sorry to disagree with you, but this is not just some superficial "Pop Psychology" as you're describing it. You need to watch more of Brene Brown's speeches to completely understand what she means here. She is not coming up with these things off of the top of her head, this is backed up by a dozen years of research. Another thing is that, you just described psychopaths and sociopaths who have no capacity for feeling shame. That's why they can commit "THESE HEINOUS CRIMES". And besides, even if they were to have the capacity for these feelings about themselves, shame would not be the right word. As Brene describes in this video (along with many others) Shame is the self-condemnation that says, "I AM bad, therefore I cannot change." While Guilt is the realization that says, "I DID something bad, this needs to change." Therefore, guilt IS the necessary factor for these people who have done terrible, horrible things with their lives. Only then can they bring an end to their anger, violence, and greed.
YOU'RE MAKING THIS WAY TOO HARD! I UNDERSTAND my line of reasoning COMPLETELY!!!! There is a SUCH THING AS "HEALTHY WELL-BALANCED SHAME"... Anyone with a well developed CONSCIOUS has that... All SHAME is NOT BAD!!! Some people live with TREMENDOUS SHAME BECAUSE ALL THE HORRIBLE WILLLFUL THINGS THEY HAVE DONE TO OTHER PEOPLE... they're JUST REAPING WHAT THEY HAVE SOWN....
I'm sure you think you understand. (Your obsession with caps lock emphasizes that) But I don't think I'm the one making this complicated. Its actually very simple. There is no such thing as a healthy sense of, "I'm a mistake." There is only a healthy sense of, "What I did was completely wrong." In your first comment you said that shame, "forces hardened people to think about themselves" but this is still confusing shame with guilt. The point that's being made is that shame does NOT make you think about the things you've done. Rather, it compels you to continue on with your bad choices because you believe that you are inherently bad, evil, and corrupt. Anyone with a well developed conscience (not sure I would call it "CONSCIOUS") has a healthy sense of guilt. Not shame. Also, anyone with a well developed conscience would know to research and understand someone's point of view before labeling it, "dangerous." Especially when it's the one thing that could change someone's perspective on worthiness and hope for a better life.
so powerful -- shame is so misunderstood --'shame on you' spoken with no understanding of the deep wounding it carries -- blessed to have the clear and divine voice of Brene Brown -- so much appreciation for what you have offered me and those who I get to touch -- thank you
GUILT is directly connected to sinfulness and therefore in a sense it defines us. YET Father GOD separates behavior and self worth ... HE convicts us of our wrong behavior having the faith in us to change because HE sees in us the potential to change.
I do not believe that guilt is good. I see guilt as a sense of condemnation of myself about my behavior where as I know that Father GOD never piles guilt on us ... HE rather convicts us ... which is pointing out that the specific behavior is not beneficial to us or others with the belief that we can change our behavior. I have been raised to feel guilty and with it to feel bad about myself for doing such a thing.
Religious or not, guilt is a good thing perceived properly. When you have guilt, you know you've done wrong and normally you'll take steps to correct it. Shamefulness is another story...
You should feel guilty about bad behavior. We know from childhood when we've done something wrong even if we cannot understand it completely because we are still developing.
This sort of psychology is useful, but I can't help but feel it is grounded in some fundamental misreading of the psyche - it somehow thinks that all we need to do is name parts and tendencies and then we can control everything - Ego psych, the psych is deeper and darker than this, even though these distinctions are useful, I can't help but think that seeing the lack of the Ego's sovereignty is also important, especially where feelings of guilt are concerned
For me, shame comes for a sense of feeling unworthy. We acquire these feelings from our parents and caregivers when we are growing up. Thoughts like; "I am bad." or "I am no good." hold us back, especially if we repeat them over and over again in our heads. Hi, my name is Omar and I felt ashamed and depressed for a long time until I got help and got my life back If you are feeling ashamed or depressed and looking for help please see my YT depression self help videos on my DepressionHero channel
sure, but what is an informed conscience driven by? is 'conscience' a moral construct residing in the head, composed of behaviors that are socially deemed 'good' or 'bad'? or is it an embodied, intuitive signalling within the viscera that tells the (limbic) brain 'this feels wrong' or 'this feels right'? I would argue that morality, conscience, and healthy shame all derive from the same neurophysiological place, are innate, not learned, and occur spontaneously and reliably in intact people
'embarrassment' is another way of saying HEALTHY shame same thing your face flushes, your body tingles, you get that 'oops' overexposed feeling it's how you *feel*, within yourself, that you've over-reached your *own* boundaries and you can adjust your behavior until your body feels 'right' again by contrast, 'toxic' shame is a constant sense of unworthiness, a smothering blanket of I-am-badness that poisons every moment of your life not a temporary re-direct they should have different names
"Shame cannot hold on when we name it." I love this. I also love the distinction between saying "I am embarrassed" vs "I feel shame." Thank you Brene...I love your work and use it often in my own (I work in mental health)
there's a difference between 'toxic shame' (I am gross, bad, unworthy - don't look at me), and 'healthy shame' (I'm at a fancy party in a bikini and I feel underdressed) one is a systemic, deeply-ingrained sense of unworthiness; the other is what healthy people feel, instinctively, when they've overstepped one of their OWN boundaries the difference couldn't be starker and neither is the same as 'guilt', which is a whole different conversation
I agree. You only need to look at the opposite extreme of shamelessness to see that without even a little shame, people would have no conscience. Why follow rules at all? Humility, empathy, valuing other humans.. don’t these all require some form of shame? Otherwise one just does whatever one wants, consequences be darned.
This is a classic for me. It gets me excited to hear such clearity on the subject. Shame molds us with out our conscious understanding. The more we can name and release that shame, the more we can find our authenitic self.
dr brene brown - so fantastic to know you going deep into an area where humans seems to avoid. Its difficult because its so dark, and hopefully thru you more can be unravel.
