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I appreciate you sympathizing with the poors who wanna learn but have to (get to) do so a few turns at a time in the backcountry. RU-vid and forums have been great for picking up a tip here and there to focus on every time I go out.
Hi, Great Video. I’ve tried shortening my bindings. I’ve done a figure 8 but I was wondering if I could shorten them anymore without buying new bindings? Could I buy a shorter cord?
Fun to see the old stuff. My 1st tele boot in 1982 was a pair of 1950's ankle high leather lace up downhill boots that Gary Mechan the local wasatch cobbler converted to a telemark sole for me. I then skied Asolo extremes and the scarpa boot niece boot that you showed in the video. The 2 buckle neon scarpa boot was called the boot sauvage. I started working at Black Diamond in 92 and tested the 1st prototype terminator. We then took a pair to the band saw and cut the cuff down and had Gary Mechan cut down the inner boot to make the 1st T2 prototype, which I 1st tested out trying to get the 2nd Tele descent of the Grand Teton with Andrew McClean. Brings back fond memories. Thanks for the overview.
I’ve found a very nice compromise in all of these characteristics. Rockered tip and lightly rockered tail, a huge amount of camber (by today’s standards) between the rocker sections, fairly even round flex, 18-19 m radius (depending on length), 100 underfoot, so floaty enough but also carvy when the conditions are right. Also, I found them to be perfect as a learning ski. Forgiving, but when loaded gives plenty of rebound (I mentioned the generous camber)… so when I’m wearing my salesman hat (White Pine Touring in PC, in case you’re wondering) I call it the “you get out of it what you put into it” ski. You can ride them leisurely or you can drive them (not super hard, but I did say compromise earlier). What ski is it? The Bent Chetler 100.
These boots are extremely comfortable but don’t last. Bought a fresh pair for the 23/24 season. Right bellows crease cracked on my big toe day 9 and the left did the same day 18. When the first crease crack occurred scarpa and the shop I bought them from said it was user error. Don’t expect boots to last forever but probably should have made out out of December with them. To add insult the dealer told me I needed to learn how to turn. Never skied with the dude once ever. By day 70 the bellows on both boots were completely destroyed after multiple attempts of saving them with tape to flex seal and everything between. Biggest disappointment of the ski season. Buyer be ware of the lack of customer service provided on a defective product. Going for the crispi next season.
Ripping turns, but this is more correctly termed a "delayed lead change." It could also be called "edge change before lead change." It's early edging and pressure on the new inside foot while it is still in more of an alpine stance from the previous turn.
My last Tele-skis were Salomon X-Scream (yes, the yellow one!), which I bought in Bergen, Norway, i August 1998. Now I am too weak to do tele with much grace, I am afraid, so its alpine all the way….
On those kick turns. Are you mounting your pin line on the balance point? I have trouble doing these because I'm mounting boot center on recommended and It seems like the tail of the ski always drags. This is especially true if I'm climbing with the spring/cable in place (using Transit). But, even with no cables the tail drags unlike what I'm seeing in your video. Thanks!
I'm seeing people mount them on more narrow skis but it does seem to have the power to drive a wider ski! And plus it's a back country binding, so if it can't drive 106, what's the pointtt
Been skiing the binding for a bit after transitioning from the 75mm binding. I think they're adjusted too stiff and the video helped in doing an adjustment. Is there a video which discusses tension setting based on weight and aggressiveness?
Does this apply to newer 75mm gear as well? I’ve noticed the NTN folks are generally in a more compact stance than the older duck bill dudes. Am just learning on a 75mm setup so would appreciate any guidance :)
Always appreciate your videos. I learn so much from them. I just switched to NTN a few weeks ago after 20 yrs on 75mm. I was having some trouble getting in sync on the first days out and thought it was the skis (wider with more rocker than my old ones and I mostly ski icy hardpack). But I didn't even consider the bellows and binding stiffness. After watching this video, I put on my old T1s, and sure enough, WAY harder to flex the bellows than the TX Pro. When I got the T1's years ago, I thought they were too stiff but I adapted to ski more aggressively. I'll have to adapt to this TxPro. In theory, I prefer a softer bellows just for more freedom of movement. But since you mentioned the springs, I think putting stiffy springs in my Outlaw X bindings could help me bridge the gap to adapt my technique. Thanks as always, keep up the good work!
In PMTS (developed for Alpine carving), Harald Harb points out that to tip the boot and the ski to the edge, one needs a movement that would tip the boot (and initiate the movement further up the kinematic chain - in the ankle, knee and then the hip) with minimal force (so as not to tire oneself out). So he suggests that when we want to tip the boot - and the ski that's attached to it - on to the big toe edge, instead of trying to force the big toe down through the compacted snow of the piste, one should tip the foot inside the boot up and roll it onto the big toe side - so the foot ends up standing on its big toe side, pronating the foot, starting the pronation by lifting the pinky toe side of the foot up and rolling the foot to the big toe side - down the path of least resistance. The foot will then push against the big toe side of the boot laterally, creating a tipping force with minimal effort. It will also move the ankle, that will push against the side of the cuff of the boot, and then the knee will engage, following a 'windshield wiper'-style trajectory, being actively pulled by the muscles of the hip. That adds a strong leverage to the tipping movement, initiated by the small and presice movement of the foot. Harb also suggests that the tipping of the skis into the new turn should be initiated with the free leg (in Alpine skiing you unload one leg - the inside leg of the future turn - and balance on the other leg. The unloaded leg is called 'free leg' in PMTS. Actually, when carving, you balance on the big toe edge of the load-bearing leg's foot, and to get to that edge, you start the movement chain with the free leg, as that requires the least possible effort to get the job done). Ted Ligety and Lindsey Vonn ski with this technique, among many other successful alpine skiing pro athletes and around 20k amateur Alpine carving enthusiasts. I have personally tried PMTS (got the ebook from Amazon) and it helped me to go from snowplow turns to parallel carving turns in about 2 days (and I am a very slow learner). I wonder if PMTS could be adapted (at least partially) to tele skiing? I mean - in tele skiing, one still needs to tip the skis, right?
I am lucky and have NTN and 75 mm plastic and leather. I ski them all. Love the range of motion on 75 mm. Love the strength of NTN for going hard days. Love the challenge of leather.
Also... As I mentioned before, I think telemark is once again trapped in a sorta limited scope mindset that is killing its longevity. In the 80s it was skinny ski on XC trad that made it a curious novelty. Today it is a semi-resort setup with BC access capability confines. In the 90s, when tele had its popularity hay day, the thinking was its pre-AT BC access-ability was its strong point. and certainly many people bought into the marketing, but in reality far few in actual number skied tele to access the BC than they did to ski resort, which is where the money is. It is cool and a helluva achievement that some folks are hucking tricks in the BC like junior Tanner Halls, and honestly the gear is pretty much topped out in that realm, and it is cool that some guys are doing a pretty good job of it in park, but if tele is to actually thrive it needs to to focus more and evolve in regards to resort and skied out side country. Miedjo had a great concept with its introduction of the AT heel. As good as the idea was of tele or not option though, the M-AT heel is pretty much so weak it is only a "once in a rare thing to use" affair. But the concept is the future. Most old school telemarkers from my era (1980s) hated evolution. But the sport evolved despite these luddites. Today, if the gear is engineered right, one can have it all; tele or alpine when and where-ever one wants and to a high degree of skill and capability. Unfortunately though the MFG part of the equation is stuck on the downward cycle of an over-saturated emphasis focus on BC capability when what the sport needs is a focus on what an every day skier could enjoy about telemarking resort. And at least for me, Telemark skiing resort is a blast. So what would that argument look like? Everything gets kinda boring after a while, especially when one's skill peaks, which is sooner than later for many skiers over the age of say 25. And many who get bored switch to snowboard. Nothing wrong with that. But what if telemark was marketed cool again? This isn't going to be done on RU-vid with a post-rasta, pressed coffee guy hucking cliffs anymore. No shortages there anymore. Nor is it going to be folks riding park switch. The X games don't drive sales today. I mean that all is part of it, but the thing to revive this sport and bring innovation is people riding resort and having a good go of it, where being on tele isn't a handicap to circumnavigate, but a legit, new and readily achievable and comfortable way to ski what they are already skiing, AND with the option of locking down the heel when it strikes them to do so. This is the variety and option that alpine doesn't have but telemark does. If only the industry could see and develop it. Die hard teles who dismiss me here, well I get it, but... I see rigidity as the problem and not the solution. If it were up to that mindset we would all still be on skinny skis and leather boots, which BTW was actually fun back then. But many wanted more. And then the sport progressed leaps and bounds past all that but then mostly stopped. Why? Loss of interest by the masses. And it wasn't just the advent of good AT gear. No. No it wasn't exactly. I've seen a lot of AT skiers on the slope that I really can't imagine seeing in the BC. It was coolness of the advent of new AT gear. And even now, AT gear sales seem to be waning. But alpine itself really isn't. I think the Tele MFG world needs to take note. Make tele new again. Please make resort-focused gear again. Just a suggestion.
Some thoughts... I hear what you are saying about the "telemark feel," but there is another aspect of it that is more specific. The unique thing about tele, more-so than alpine I feel (I do both) is that different telemark gear requires somewhat different techniques, and for the most part tele is self-taught. I mean it is still a drop knee turn no matter what you are on, but if you are used to a "ramped" G3 or Red Chili, and a duckbill, you are not only going to be adjusted to the "elf toe" balance point, the instability while flat footed, but you will also be used to a longer ramp up in edge grip, and for many they have learned to use this with an "expert effect." And then there is the issue of ski choice and how those choices work with the binding in particular. I think for a lot of people, once they find the combo that works best for them for what they are loving to do, they really don't want to start the hunt again, or learn new techniques and start the combo hunt, especially when they were happily managing what they are used to. And a lot of us telemarkers are getting pretty old. Old dog new tricks? Personally, I started as a young teen in 1982 on lace-ups and skinny 3 pin skis, which were trad, but ironically resort focused, perhaps even more than today when everyone seems to want a BC ski to ski primarily in-resort. My first boots were the single boot Asolo Extreme lace ups. First skis were 210cm Kazama "Telemark Edge(s)" with Asolo 3 pin bindings. Choinard (BD) weren't even a ski thing yet. The stuff was horrible, but I learned how to use it well, racing and doing mogul tournys with high end results by the mid-80s. And I longed for and envisioned a day when the sport could break from its trad prison cell of leather, skinny skis and 3 pin. Back then people were proud to have or to try to master such crap gear, and they openly hated on anyone trying to break the sport out. But eventually, begrudgingly it did evolve. In fact it almost seems a joke that anyone today skiing a plastic boot on a post-80s BC ski would claim "trad" status just because they aren't on NTN. Having been there for basically every iteration of the telemark ski setup, having used and evolved with them all, if there is one setup I miss, it was the first gen, leather/plastic cuffed 1984 Merrill Super Comp matched with the super cambered Kazama Telemark Comp (or even a few years later, utilizing a Dynastar Course GS ski, (much to the disgust of the then "community"). Its not that it was a better setup than my current variety, today using several different skis with Outlaw bindings and TX Pros to match conditions; no, it is what I could specifically do with my old, old ass gear in very specific, although albeit normal resort conditions. I will go so far as to say that with just 8 ft of "edge of the run" width, on steep groom, I could tear up that terrain with surgical quick turns that is truly more challenging on my newer, heavier and more damp gear, whether I'm on a slalom ski or what not. It was just a setup that worked really, really well for that in particular. Seriously! And of all the skiing I've done, amazingly great conditions and scenarios, those turns, on old shit, down the sides of say a run like The Plunge at Teluride, were the most enjoyable , graceful but aggro "feeling" turns I have ever done. The skis just popped back then, and the tips came around on their own when unweighted. And edging was a matter of depth of drop knee and rear foot bias. And I miss that. Of course, in other conditions, the old setup could ski like horror story bad. If I could have a set-up that did that and what my modern gear can do... Sign me up. But everything is give and take. Personally, having tried it all now, most all the new modern bindings, variety of boot, skis et all I'll take the new, but I can't blame someone wanting to keep doing the very particular thing they love about the turn, even if it is not the latest thing. And even if it isn't the best they could be on for all things in general. It's really not a matter of money, or even feel I think, but more-so the experiencing of it. Let's be honest... The greatest thing about NTN (all varieties) is also its curse to the duckbill accustomed crowd. And that is to say that NTN has great flat-foot stability but comes on in a severe and shocking way for those who cut their teeth with the duckbills. In fact, when I bought the very first gen Scarpa TX's to match with the first gen Rottelfella NTN bindings, on day one while trying to rip short radius "POP" turns, I tore my ACL in half, also breaking my tibia, and tearing my LCL. I was not prepared for how NTN worked. On a side note, I'm going old man here now by saying, for me as bad as the limiting nature of old trad confines were back in the 80's, what is at least equally bad today is the confines of making tele gear that can also backcounty. Build one or build the other. But be honest industry... Most people may dream about being BC slayers, but in reality most are resort folks. And in resort is where most people ski and see skiing, and that is where the gear can most evolve and regain traction. One can ski pow on tongue depressors. All the binding MFGs make a toe that can free the heel like AT. And lightweight boots with sucky padding are now the only game in town. The field is saturated with crap, LT gear. Focus on building resort gear for resort ripping. Please save yourselves from yourselves otherwise telemark will continue to fade into the stupid novelty of mono-boarding, which would be sad in that mono-boarding is and was never a highly capable way of skiing, whereas telemark actually is.
Loving this One Hot Minute. I’ve always found it helpful to think about stepping forward (“a boot width”) into a shallow lunge… which implies weighting and stepping off the inside ski… which helps keep the fight tight. This approach helps setup ready for carving from turn to turn as riders progress. All the best for the rest of the northern hemisphere season
Yes, the accuracy of grinding the plate in 0.01 mm is very important. Older shoes must be adjusted with a file at the leading edge. The plane must be filed there. On the skeletons.
I’ve lost about 10 Black Diamond tail clips., until I decided to change my tails. They are expensive and more importantly can ruin your skin day. As I see it, it’s just a wrong design.
