Hey, I just wanted to share a resource that might help you with all your math hammer. I didn't make this sheet, I just filled it out with votann statelines. It also gives a pretty interested stat - points spent per point killed. Basically the point efficiency of the output on the units. Hope this helps! docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZMskFCgzhTTgok1bD_yGytkFsV4_wkUj1dGlKpEs224/edit?usp=drivesdk
It's shorthand for rules that allow you to pick your models up off the table and put them back down later, usually using Deep Strike. Things like Hypercrypt Necrons, Grey Knights, Warp Talons, and winged daemon princes all have "uppy, downy" rules.
Thanks for another great video!! And I absolutely love these videos. Jake I believe it was from tabletop tactics gave you a shout out on one of their live streams a few days ago saying he wanted to be on the channel! Keep up the work for the fellow Kin!!!
I love the insight here! The Berserks having those tactical Plasma Axes is cool to see. I almost went with them, but in my local scene, 3W models are really prevalent so i chose hammers for the consistency there. If hordes get more popular I'll need to get some axe units for sure though.
It means you take 8 of the models and put them in a straight line 2" apart from each other and put the last 2 on the end to make triangles. This is because with 7 or more models in a unit you need to be within 2" of 2 models to be in unit coherence. They end up making a sort of bow tie shape in the end because of this.
I am a Votann player and newish to 40k, nids were my first army hated them and picked up votann combat patrol box and I now have i think just under 3k points of models. I havent lost a match yet among my friends, even coming back from a 30 point deficit turn 1 after losing over half my army. I beat a 2k space marines army with less than 1k points of votann. They are super fun and really good, I cant wait to see what the codex brings us. Also when I built my bikes i accidently put the hover wheel, that links to the base, on backwards and had to hard glue them to the base. I also have 3 more bikes from my second combat patrol box that i refuse to build because i dislike them. I did magnetize my entire patrol box and kinda regretted it. I have it setup as wysiwyg as far as what you need to actually swap out.
we play a lot of doubles as well. IDK if thats what team events are, I am assuming its more like how starcraft did team events, but we have a lot of fun doing that.
Love Votann as well, just a very nice humble army that plays clean game. Team events in this instance refers to 8 players with 8 respective armies playing 8 unique games per “round” at an event. The scores of each team member are then added together to get a total VP We discuss the format in a little more detail in the first quarter of the video if you want a bigger breakdown!
Ion beamers dont require stratagem to boost their output and do and average of almost 8 dmg into a hekaton equivalent. Also they are a better overwatch into stuff like 8bound and also better dmg into t12 vehicles.
Thanks for the vid! I have a question about allocating wounds to the E-COGs and Ironkin: assuming the Iron Master is attached to a 6-Kin Thunderkyn squad, does your opponent is determine the wound roll on the toughness of the Thunderkyn or the ECOG models? This came up in a game I played last week and we were stumped lol
My understanding is that at the time of the wound roll, your opponent is declaring an attack on the thunderkyn which means using their toughness. Once the wounds go through, you determine which models in the unit are rolling saves first (allocating to the ecogs) They effectively act as a blank
Started running him in a double Hekaton list and its been pretty good! I have him lead a brick of Hearthkyn to keep him safe and slightly buff the squad. Healing a Hekaton for 3 got me a few groans xD Tried him with Thunderkyns but I don't really like them right now. Feels like you bring them in from reserves, kill one thing and spend the rest of the game trying to get to the action with their 5".
I love this unit so much. His model and his little buddies are so good! Although admittedly his battlefield performance isn't as amazing as his model. He's fine, he just makes the thunderkyn unit pretty pricey for what they can do. I still like that combo and run it a lot, but his big brick of thunderkyn and helpers is like a B for performance, but the models are an easy A+. And has been pointed out by others you can run him with hearthkyn but like... why? I mean, it's cute and fun in casual games but never something you'd be looking to do in anything more competitive than a beer and pretzels match. I do hope he gets a little polish in the codex and maybe some more things he can lead but even if he doesn't I think he's still a fine unit.
He is in almost all my Lists because his modell and his little helpers are soo good looking and the brôkhyrs in general are by far my favorite unit type ^^
Nah man I tried experimenting with them in an earlier draft of this list and they really underperformed over 5 or so games. Too slow, too short a threat range, too large a footprint. They definitely have play in some archetypes but wasn’t really my style
Yeah game 1 vs sisters deff looking like could win that game with a gameplan prepared (mostly how to play the map and spending 10-15 mins to identity that) also I love crons I run silent king tho!!! Full shooting rerolls and ignore mods super nice should try that type list with the doomstalkers!
Great callout on taking the time to assess a game plan even if it costs you a few minutes of inactivity. The entire game is basically set from deployment so getting an idea of what you want to do early on is massively helpful! Overall a fairly close game, might have been winnable but didn’t really have a game plan that I felt confident I could execute due to general inexperience into the army (what should trade what, priority targets, etc). I do think the scores should have been a bit tighter but still a good struggle for the dwarves lol
Missed it for game 1! I judged the girls with the shields, the 10man squad that flies, morven vahl gang, and I think one of the transports. In hindsight should have been the triumph for the last choice but I assumed it played hidden all game. Not entirely the case haha
Yeah that would be funny hahaha. Berserk’s are definitely viable in their current form but I do think it’s more archetype dependent (how you want to be using them)
@@VotannVersus40Koddly I find that after turn 1, they are much more useful than the Yaegirs. Everyone keeps going on and on about Yaegirs, but the Berserks fit into a Sagi, the mole launcher is hysterical, a team of 5 is more maneuverable than the Yaegir 10, and oddly, I have found them just as pathetically (un)lethal as the Yaegir 10. That said, they are +20 for 5 less models, and they are easier to kill technically since there are 5 less of them, AND they can’t infiltrate, but… Decisions must be made. Thank you for continually posting the incredible and the lessons learned, as well as all the unit stuff. Everyone refers to your YT but no one seems to subscribe or watch to the end, which is crap.
Thanks Thinkabout, very kind of you to say! I do think the biggest advantage the yaegirs have over the berserks is the ability to infiltrate. Really helps you get somewhere from turn 0 and set up an objective vs the berserks which would take an extra turn to get there
Thanks for the advice. I'm working on building up a Combat Patrol, but for my first 1000pt list, I have 10 Warriors, 5 Bezerks, 1 Sagitaur, and 1 Hekaton. Initially, I assumed I would put the Bezerks in the Sag and the Warriors in the HLF (5 Hearthguard deep strike in with the Kahl), but now I think I should split the Warriors. 5 can start on the Sag, and the other 5 can start on point, embark the HLF with the Bezerks, and then drive them to a midfield objective. I was going to add a solo Einhyr Champion to the HLF, but I may cut him for a unit of Yaegir.
"Luv me hold, luv me kin an luv me rail rifle simple as."-Jon Kin moments after spiking the devastating wounds against my mates demon prince which just survived two sagi and hekaton shooting at him. Love my casino kin load outs.
I’m really sad the fists are objectively better than plasma blades. They just look so cool that I know I’m going to use them and I’ll never not be thinking about how unoptimal they are
I love this format! It’s especially important for me to see your play-by-play, when you draw what happens in each game. I’ve not seen anyone else do this and it has so much value for me to see.
This channel is everything I need as a somewhat new warhammer 40K player (only played 5-6 games) and starting with Votann❤ Video request, I would LOVE a strategy video with a “rock paper scissors” theme, like what are the general categories of units across the factions/game, and would be good against what; like, what would be good agains infantry and what would be good against vehicles, based on Strength, Toughness, number of wounds, etc. Really enjoy your content, keep it up!
Was looking forward to this ! Common mistake i see often which you also made were the following: 1.dropping yeigers to deny your opponent movement rather then deploying them to create space for your own push 2. Deployment should be set up to go for your natural expantion objective (the one that has a L set up to hide inside facing towards the enemy) And then rotate towards that side.. While stalling thr enemys rotation. This should ensure you always get shooting angles or are outside of enemys threats and mass army while gaining map control) Last i would have used the berserkers to stall the oppisite side of where my opponents going to push from to have some threat and killing power esp melee(staging in the center also works like game 2) Fixing these simple deployment errors would prob gain you very easy turn 1s and also steady turn 2s and gaining some free movement with stronger deployment (placing models as far up as possible while being safe but also knowing where the army shall move without placing units to pivot left or right as a reactive style)
Hey man! Thanks for the amazing feedback here. I remember us speaking about natural expansions and the incentive to rotate around wtc tables, which I 100% see the value in after the nids matchup. I didn’t see it at the time but you’re absolutely correct. If I expanded on the southern side first it would have allowed for continuous angles into the center of the table while still being able to contest his expansion north. The yaegir deployment is something I have the least comfort with as it’s the first time I have access to infiltrators so I definitely think in this game they were wasted potential Thanks again and will put this in practice for my next game!
I think we have somewhat of a high risk playstyle where we have to be aggressive to play for primary but we can get caught out either out of position or we open ourselves up to being ground down. It’s a fun playstyle because it can go either way but it’s a hard balance to get right. Great job and keep up the great coverage of the kin.
You say long format, but it's not even that long. I love this format, reviewing what units worked and didn't in actual play. Mathhammer will disappoint you every time
One thing you could do if we wanted to get another champ into the list is dropping the 3rd Sagi and beserks to include a champ with 5 more hearthguard turning one of your hearguard into a 10 man (probably paired with the appraising glare), alternatively if you get your 3rd Hekaton you could fit it by dropping the beserks and 3rd sagi as well
I'm a huge fan of the cyclic ion cannon, I used to look at it like the ugly stepchild, but in the last few games, it's really done its job. I use my Hekaton as a gun platform first and a troop carrier second, and when I took the SP heavy conversion beamer, I found myself often having issues staying outside 12 against some matchups. I wanna move forward and support my troops and get into those good firing lanes while still dropping off infantry, but the beamer makes me wanna stay back. I was at odds with it. While yes it's less damage against tougher vehicles and really elite units. I found that just having another infantry mulcher has helped my army more so that I can free up my hearth guard or have a unit of beserks riding shotgun only to pop out to deal with what the hekaton can't. I'm also a fan of putting ancestral sentences on it, and with the beamer, you'd lose out on the sustain 2, but with the ion! I easily make back the hekaton's points back and more some.
8 man hammer 2 fist unit with double gruge can blender nearly anything, in land fort to get them up board at full numbers genuine can just start sweeping up a center line, and consolation into melee after youve attacked can get you to kill 2 units in melee, warriors pride into a high armour no invul is crazy to
