A mind-boggling commonality seems to be that people in not only the academic community but the scientific community are valued for thinking independently and for diversity of ideas. These characteristics are not attractive to the leaders in these communities- new people are expected to fall in line and understand that they are cogs in a much larger and more expansive world. The cherry on top is the amount of blind faith that people put in these people. There is a certain unspoken amount of infallibility that is attached to people in these worlds- COVID exposed that. "Trust the Science" was another way of validating so-called "experts"; the "credentialed" class. Successfully making it through an elite college is buying one's way into the elite class in our society.
I have worked at universities in 6 different countries. I am earning as much, probably more than I would in real-world industries. I love conducting field research, learning about business people, their journeys, their words of wisdom... most of all, I love publishing my work based on my own merits, not by being friends of journal editors. I made the right decision to move to academia, with all the cheating, nepotism, hypocrisy and wokeism. However, I know it will be much harder to work here in 10-15 years and I do not think I would be able to cope with the increasing wokeism.
@@cherylhurst Mmmm, really? Do I need to explain it to someone living in Canada? It will be risky because WOKE RU-vid is watching. How about?: People following the woke narrative that predominates on many campuses, such as taking certain political/moral and other stances just because they are the flavour of the day or because people want to feel virtue signalling and morally 'superior' by taking the side of the alleged underprivileged groups while despising other groups implicitly/explicitly or directly/indirectly.
I am exactly like what you have told. Now I am doing postdocter and I am doing well. But I can't feel passion at all, and I am struggling to quit and find a new job for more than one year. But I realize more and more that it is time to change.
I can relate to what you are telling: I already had those feelings while being a student, I couldn’t see myself doing all that difficult stuff that seemed totally irrelevant to me for years and years. I ended up taking a job in IT, I was lucky I guess, but is was my best decision ever together with marrying my wife. Good objectives, good results, mine and of the teams I worked with, I went working every day as a very happy person.
I work as a software engineer in the industry, and I’ve wondered a few times if I should pursue an academic path in natural sciences, since that’s where my heart has been since I was little. I’ve mostly been surrounded by industry viewpoints, so it’s really refreshing to get such insight from the academic side. Thank you!
Thank you for pointing out money as the first factor. I have burden to support my parents and my spouse and kids. Also, the time spend should be translated well into your compensation.
Incubating careers in the endowment supported fantasy land of academic employment breeds the disgusting liberal philosophies of people who are out of touch with the real world. I've never had an academic I explain that to even begin to understand it. The look on their faces is "What?? Why I never!" when it's the theme of every single critical commentary about academia from the outside real world.
@@cherylhurst Thanks for the reply and power to you. I work in IT and have worked with several academically associated clients. They are all the same. It is mind blowing to me. None of them could ever function in a private industry organization.
@@cherylhurst Incubating careers in the endowment supported fantasy land of academic employment breeds the disgusting liberal philosophies of people who are out of touch with the real world. I've never had an academic I explain that to even begin to understand it. The look on their faces is "What?? Why I never!" when it's the theme of every single critical commentary about academia from the outside real world.
@@cherylhurst Incubating careers in the endowment supported fantasy land of academic employment breeds the disgusting liberal philosophies of people who are out of touch with the real world. I've never had an academic I explain that to even begin to understand it. The look on their faces is "What?? Why I never!" when it's the theme of every single critical commentary about academia from the outside real world.
How about having something in your name in academia vs industry? In academia you have your own public appearance through papers and conference talks, while in industry, in most cases, you are just behind the scenes.
Yup that can definitely be true, but you can also do talks etc and make a name in industry. Very few people outside of academia care about papers anyway, so either way your “name” is typically in a small circle.
There's a lot of good advice in your video. I experienced the same thing as you. I was burned out and desperate but I knew I couldn't just quit. So I forced myself to stay until I'd find another job. It took me 1.5 years to find a new job. It was a terrible, terrible time for me. At the same time I had 2 friends who experienced something similar, but unlike me, they just quit without having looked for a job beforehand. Now, both have a new job. So, in my opinion, there is no clear path that you need to take. Maybe I could have saved myself from 1.5 years of horror or maybe it was the right decision. I'd say it depends on the particular situation.
I'm a doctor and academic medicine sucks. University hiring in my country is totally racial. Extreme bureaucracy... What medication I can give, who I answer to. I'm an expert medical specialist, but no autonomy and progression as I'm a different race.
I was one of the first students to voluntarily not take an academic job after leaving graduating from my PhD program almost 50 years ago; I had a lot of trouble finding a non-academic job, and got offered on tenure-track position at a decent university (thanks to my advisor). After my first job, though, it was much easier, and i certainly make a lot more money (and had more fun) in Silicon Valley than I would have as an academic mathematician. What I found odd, though now I think it's funny and a little pathetic, is how angry some of my professors (though not my advisor) got at my 'defection'. Apparently for more than a decade I was a 'cautionary tale' in the department. You'd think they had better things to talk about.
The point is: there are TOO MANY PEOPLE engaged in graduate study in the USA and Great Britain. There are too many paid slaves-oops, I meant teaching and research assistants and adjunct instructors-busily engaged in that path to nowhere: NO PROMOTION to something better paying and more meaningful. Graduate school was not designed to absorb, productively and with good reimbusement, the number of people it is now taking in each year. And DON'T EVEN THINK of there being jobs outside of the coil of academia that have some minimal relation to all the years you sat through, and all the work you did in Cinema Studies, Ethno-Queer (that word still is offensive to me; it is GAY) Studies, Art History, History in general, Political Science, Philosophy, Religion, ad nauseum. And do you think that your university is going to move you into some corner office with an Assistant Prof. title plate nailed on its door, a decent salary, a workable teaching schedule, once you finish up your endless PhD? Better bet: buy a lottery ticket and follow the televised winnings.
Pointlessness??!! Of course. THAT is the essence of academia. Burnout and quitting consumes perhaps the majority of people employed in academia-especially at the graduate level. Don't expect creativity or self-respect to be welling up constantly from your work in academia, or your presence there as a PhD student, engaged in studying for that endless thesis.
Thanks for making this honest, helpful video. I've been working in academia for almost two decades now but am seriously looking to exit and do something else. The only thing I like about it is being able to open the minds of young people.
I thought I’d miss that, but actually find I can make a stronger influence in the real world when not having to exist within the confines of academia! Good luck xx
Hi Сheryl! I'm Vasylyna. I wanted to contact you with a collaboration opportunity that aligns perfectly with your RU-vid channel. Where can I write you?
4 месяца назад
You don't need to talk to much, everyone understands how toxic the academia is.
In academia promotions are so much more murky. You have to satisfy I don't know how many people and everything is personal. Usually, there will be some unqualified people who are running the show. Maybe they got hired because they failed in corporate world. Now they want to link business and academia, so it will happen more often. In business world your boss or management move around you to any position. You can have any title you can think of. If you are making money for the firm, you are good as you are.
Absolutely agree, it’s not EASIER to get a promotion, but you know *whats next* in terms of expectation. But totally agree the decisions etc are murky!
Oh, you exactly described how I feel about my employment in academia. I had all the feelings but couldn't find the right words, but you captured my feelings exactly. Thank you for this video.
I absolutely relate to the apathy part. This video showed up for me just as I'm about to take the plunge of quitting my academia job, especially since I've been recently denied promotion after years of working as an adjunct instructor. Thank you for your honesty and insight!
They never promote adjuncts. As in business, once you prove you're willing to stick around in a dead-end job for crap wages, they will never respect you. Run from such positions!
I have been an MD for 20 years. After the pandemic, my job became unbearable. My life was heavily affected by the new conditions in which it was supposed that a doctor and medical researcher had to work: no rights, continued psychological abuses, no respect. I started a psychological consult, and it helped me to regain myself. I am a human, have my rights, and deserve respect: if, after 20 years, this is not clear, it is time to leave. I have saved during my career, so money was not an issue. I resigned on July 1st, the best day in my life. I will remember forever my responsible screaming at me: "You cannot do this! (plus various insults)" and me smiling and telling her: "I already did; have good times." I graduated in philosophy in less than a year. Now, I am a writer for an excellent philosophical magazine. I am also a consultant for an ADV company, where my skills are appreciated. I do not work more than I can: I am trying to work the less I can. It is not easy to quit, but if you reach the "enough is enough" point, it is the best decision you can make. We are not a job; we are human beings.
New follower conquered. I really love the way you explain your ideas. I left my 20-year job last year; it was no longer sustainable. It was the best decision I could have taken. Thank you for sharing
While I have a blend of attended schooling and obtained a Psyd at a non-name brand school, it’s hard to believe misunderstanding in academia of what it means to be published? I learned something new! Thanks for sharing.
It's been more than three years since I quit my permanent teaching position and moved to another city for settling down. It felt really good initially to quit and I looked forward to a new set of opportunities. But, in the competitive market, I haven't found another position. I remain jobless, very distracted and anxious, unable to progress and produce good academic articles. With a PhD in Humanities, I don't think if there is anything interesting in the industry for me. Hopefully I'll get new perspectives on my current situation soon. Some of the comments here are, and your video of course, is comforting and making me less guilty for resigning.
I really hope it works out for you - it can be a scary time. The market is very competitive and you might not find something you love right away but can learn a lot by trying new things!
The pointlessness is really horrible. It is a really bad sign when you realise that the paper that you are writing is for only one reason, and that is to add to your c.v. The research isn't interesting, it doesn't solve a real problem, it just is there because you have to have an output. Then it gets rejected, and you have to make major changes to this paper that you didn't want to write in the first place. Several people I know left to go to industry, and they now work on things that have a purpose. I retired.
Hi Cheryl, thanks for the content, I always find it really helpful. I am still dithering in leaving academia, for some reason I have a strong sense of guilt in leaving my spv, as if I owe him anything. Well of course he helps me to grow as a person, but it makes no sense that thinking about leaving academia comes across as betrayal in my head. Anyway, can you talk about how to prepare interview with company? Especially if asked about why you leave academia (well, my instinct be lyke, 'I am tired of being underpaid, overworked and have to live by the notion of publish or parish. Now give me the job please,' but I know that's not way to go 😁 ). Cheers!
You definitely don’t owe them anything, but that is a hard mindset to shift! They want you to be happy. In terms of interview, I definitely can - I would recommend talking about how you want to apply the theoretical components you’ve learned to the corporate environment because that’s what makes academics an asset! Good luck!
I wasnt an academic but was a corporate lawyer for many years. I'm now chasing a career as an electronic nusic producer, so a lot of the reasons you gave for leaving i strongly resonate with. Thanks for the video!
Wow how exciting!! I’m doing something similar alongside my corporate role (something more aligned to the arts/creativity) and it’s so much more fulfilling. Good luck with it all!
I really liked your content and would like to offer you an interesting cooperation. However, unfortunately, I couldn't find your work email anywhere. Could you please tell me how I can contact you?
Thank you SO much for this video. As an organizational psychology graduate student contemplating leaving academia, this video was immensely helpful and resonated so much.
