@christopherknoop there are still people into them and a demand for sure!

Yeah, that's the current plan. I have a pretty good idea of how the boat moves along with them, but no idea on how it moves along with 35 HP motors. My concern is that my great grandfather switched them out years ago due to being underpowered. I tow the boat roughly 45 minutes to get to the lake, but there are occasions when I will tow it several hours if I'm going on a weekend trip. So obviously, lighter weight on the back of the boat would help out there, alot. If I find a pair of really nice original 35 HP motors in the exact color and year that I want, it may be hard to resist trying them. I've already stashed a set of NOS twin shipmaster controls in case I do find them. The hard part of giving up the 50's also isn't just the extra power and power tilt. It's also all the MASSIVE amount of spares that I have for them as well - spare parts, props of every pitch, fuel tanks, etc. Alot of stuff that I'll have to re-stock moving to the older ones. Thanks for the comments and thoughts on it!!!! -Brock

@Steve8587 thanks!!!

That's good to know. Sounds like it may be a good idea to swap out the impeller!

Yes it is, thanks! Funny how much of that stuff back then is styled in that way also!

Nice!!! Yeah, they really were beautiful motors during their time. I also really like the Johnson Meteor version of the motor you had also! Super cool.

@@bobfrievalt6392 we have a couple of 58 Starflites as well! We actually mounted one up originally before firing these. The styling of the johnson just fit much better with this boat. The Evinrude has more of a 1960s look to it. Fuel consumption seems to be a big issue 😅

Which models, and in what way? The older twin cylinders seem to do fine with them, if needed (versus running them in my "test sock"). At least in terms of how much water comes out of the exhaust comparatively. I have a vintage Tempo flush adaptor that fits over the main intake tube near the exhaust (which I figured would work better than muffs), but oddly enough it doesn't. I spent a long time trying to find one as well, as they're fairly rare and was pretty disappointed when I tried it. Looks like a taco shell with a hose adaptor on it. Do they run the same? Absolutely not. Which is why I don't bother tuning on them until the exhaust is submerged.

@@retro_grade all i know is they need the impeller to be fully submarged to push water as they are not tight fitting (not self priming) and sometimes the muffs dont provide enough pressure.

Not sure, but you could try this for starters. Pretty much what mine would do until I tapped on the turn signal module underneath the seat as shown in the short. (The module could also be bad and need replaced as well). From what I've seen, that's most likely. Also make sure your key is on all the way.....seems like I've seen where those can get stuck midway as well?

That's good to know 🤣 The guy I bought them from told me that at wide open, it could burn through a can in a half an hour....

Oh, I've got a manual if needed and have done several water pumps. I'm sure it'll get changed out before it hits the water, maybe even lower unit seals while it's off. It's possible the last guy who owned it changed it out, as he's an outboard enthusiast...but even then, that's like 6 or 7 years. And they're so easy on the larger motors typically because of the split design shift shaft which can be disconnected at the side (versus the smaller ones that require power head removal). I guess I'm not sure why we made such a deal of it pumping water....other than primarily to make sure we could continue running it for a couple minutes on the stand. I thought the spray was pretty weak, but I've also run very few older engines that have thermostats on them. On the OMC stuff, I've oddly enough seen very few impellers that are rotted, broken, failed....it's typically as you said, with the vanes pre-set into position, worn, and creating a weaker stream. Seems fine until you throw a new one in and then it's evident. We'll probably throw an impeller in it, change the lower unit oil out, throw it on the boat, and try it before doing much else (points adjustment, carb service, etc). We're pretty sure we'll end up keeping it on there but it is a large motor so there is a VERY slight possibilty we may switch to a 35 instead.

The main one is, but water also comes in through the side as well. It was pulling in water fine using the earmuffs (probably could use a new water pump at minimum though). I have an old Perko adapter that fits over the tube you're referring to, and oddly enough it doesn't work that great....the ear muffs or adapters that fit on the side of the motor work better. Also, even if that tube is under the water (which this one was), it won't necessarily pump. The pump inside needs to be submerged completely. Running the engines in buckets/barrels is mainly more due to have correct jetting and hearing how they sound. Engines run on muffs don't run quite how they will when actually sitting in the water.

@@retro_grade can’t wait to see this project finished. I think you’re located close to me. There aren’t enough classic boats here.

@@frogcassady same here! Everything goes slow when you have too many project though, LOL. What area are you located in? Yeah....Kentucky, and much of the south in general, is DRY of classic boats and motors. It's really sad....

@@retro_grade Cincinnati area. Grew up boating in Maine and still do a lot of boating up there. Classic boat heaven.

The bucket broke as well after dumping it out......my wife asked me how it happened and I just blamed it on "kids".

Enough smoke to baske in and provide the full experience. If we end up killing the planet running our two cycle engine and manage to outpace all of the industrial pollution around the world, then we've really outdone ourselves some how!!! 👏

I agree, and not having to worry about mixing gas too! Although, I do love a good smell of two stroke smoke from time to time.

@WilcoxGarageRecovery If you can't handle mixing gas, you can't handle boating!!! Probably a pontoon boat owner......

Anyone can run into a boat shop and buy a bland, boring, plastic covered new engine. Not everyone has the skill and class to run the oldies! - Official Retro_Grade Response

The reasons that you mention here are the EXACT reasons that I choose to run old outboards (fuel consumption I'll give to you, I guess.....on the larger engines is likely better, I could care less on the smaller ones). Sure, if you're out fishing, for instance, fine - yeah, a 4-stroke is nice. Starts right up (at least when they're new....give them some years and see how that pans out), runs quiet. But, if I'm out boating, I hate them.....there's no sound, no smell, nothing. They're boring, they have no soul. They look cheap, bloated, and hideous. Why anyone would mount one on an old boat is beyond me. Any time I see a beatiful hull like this and my eyes follow the lines, once they reach a new motor on the back I either vomit, cry, or both....then promptly walk away in disgust. I've had a couple of newer 4 cycle motors I've purchased in my life when I lost my way as a classic boat/motor enthusiast, and I was instantly reminded why I hate them so much the moment I took them out on the water. Sold each one a week after purchase/use, every time....and it real restraint on my part to not just unscrew the transom clamps and drop them overboard 😂 -Brock

Well, in all fairness, while the "$400 motor" portion of the title was defintely added so that RU-vid would actually promote it to more than 100 people (missing accomplished there), this was definitely not a motor that we picked up off the street because it was a "good deal" and we couldn't afford anything else. This was the EXACT motor that we wanted to re-motor this boat with, and one of us drove nearly 4 hours one evening to pick it up, along with another one exactly like it. They're becoming fairly rare, and it's the first one either of us have seen in person. Now, personally....we would have titled the video "BEAUTIFUL 1958 Johnson Super Seahorse Fat Fifty First Start". But, we've unfortunately had to start wising up on our thumbnails and titles to make them more reachable to the "general public" :)

They'll do good in a drum when completely submerged. Ours just wasn't large enough. I have seen them pump fairly strong as well when hooked to a hose, but I'm also used to motors without a thermostat. The biggest different is that motors don't run the same on muffs / hose hookup as they do when actually submerged, with the exhaust under water. Which is why we didn't bother tuning on the carburetor or anyting else once it ran, as it's fairly pointless. If we don't get a barrel large enough we'll save that activity for the lake.

@romanlahage5144 yeah it probably would. Getting it out from under the motor when full though is the pain. I normally use cheap dry bags and fill with water that work great. But the lower unit is too wide on that motor to fit into one.

@scottporter6201 oddly enough, I don't have a big barrel to run in. I got so sick of storing one and dumping it out every time. For smaller motors, I actually use a cheap Walmart dry bag, pull it up around the lower unit and tie to the motor, and fill it with water. When I'm done, push in on the clip and let it drop. It works great. However, the larger motors won't even fit in the larger 20l ones, too wide. At some point I'd like to custom stitch one up. And most times with the larger engines if I get them started on muffs, I just take the boat to the lake anyways :) Thanks for the comments!

@scottporter6201 there are, but the problem is that you don't know any better initially and get too far invested to go back. GoPro has that name, but they're slowly losing it the last couple of years. DJI or Insta 360 is the way to go and will be what we use next. But with the channels staggeringly slow growth, I'm reluctant to drop another dime into it for quite some time. It'll be years before I make up the several grand that I'm already in the hole on 😅

@Calvintherock nice! For starters, I'd say join the Ralliart Revolution Facebook group. Alot of guys on there who have had these cars for years and know a bit about them. For tuning, Rickerman seems to be the "go to" that everyone suggested to go with. On the SST it's critical that you have a tuner who knows that car. Apparently alot of them dont. And then there's the SST which is a whole other animal. For parts and resources/services on those, Kosmic and Jack's Transmissions are your go tos. More people like Kozmic than Jack's from what I've seen. Hopefully this helps! Punchy little daily drivers when dialed in and working right!

@@gregmcnamara9229 tower of power and dockbuster!

More like tower of crap 😂

​@johnboy5167 you are literally the first person I've ever heard refer to a 6 cylinder mercury as crap.

@Steve-e4b it hadn't been started in many years, and the carburetor was out of adjustment. Started on one pull once cleared out and run, and she works like a charm on the lake now

I have two JIS sets made by Vessel.....one with oil resistant brown handles (shown in the video) and one set with thru tangs so they can be struck on the head with a hammer/mallet. The bits that I was using in the Milwaukee impact are JIS bits, also made by Vessel....and I do have #2 and #3 sizes of them. I just checked and I did say to use a JIS screwdriver at 9:49. I maybe should have mentioned it earlier for removing the screws.

Yeah, I'd say so. In the meantime, you can watch the video of me zooming across the lake with my MK75 Dockbuster :) ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ae1eM1ivi4o.html

Thanks! Yeah, I remember seeing one years ago and wanting one since. They certainly didn't make many (1500 I think?)! Most fun model I've ever ridden on, I love it.

Nice! It's certainly a very easy, straighforward job. Must faster than running a wire back to the battery.

Thanks! They push it along decently well, for sure. Right now, I'm running 21 pitch stainless steel props, and I can get about 35 mph out of her :)

Thanks, appreciate it! There's a Go Pro riding one too, make sure to check that out if you haven't already.

Not sure, it's been a bit. There aren't too many in the stock sizes around, but I want to say that IRC still makes ones in the correct sizes and tread patterns.

@@retro_grade ok thanks

@jimbob3030 I was too, 40 is as fast as I've gotten with it. Good compression, new points, practically new engine. I think that these Feathercraft hulls reach a point where they just don't want to be pushed faster. Lack of hull rigidity probably plays a part im guessing. I have read the the Rocket ii and flyer models are quick.. I bet if the engine was on a heavier but faster design fiberglass hull of around the same period it'd move quicker.

@@retro_grade That makes sense. I have a 68 Lonestar Malibu 14' riveted heavier built aluminum runabout, which I'm about to put a 30hp Tohatsu 4 stroke on. I'm hoping to get it to between 30-35mph with the right prop. It just amazes me how many more HP it can take just to get an extra few mph. Exponentially more power doesn't seem to gain a whole lot.

​@@jimbob3030 - it will probably do that, no issues, aside from the newer four stroke being heavier possibly. In the future, I'd like to put a MK78 on the Feathercraft to see if it can squeeze a few more MPH out of it with 10 more horsepower, but I'm skeptical it will make a difference at all. Then, my 1960 18' Alumacraft Queen Merrie with twin Johnson 50 HP engines on it will go 34 to 35 mph loaded down, same as the Vagabond. And it's not a "racey" looking hull at all, and rated for 90 HP. (Whereas the Vagabond was suggsted for 30 I think?). So yeah, it gets to a point where more HP just equals more weight :)

Yeah, and the sad part is I never appreciated them or thought about the rarity until bringing it all back. Up until then, they were just beat up cushions we sat on. I've retraced the several series of wrong moves that led me to tearing apart the blue one, and it still kills me. Since then, I've retired the 3 remaining red ones to display status and have been stocking up on period correct kapok cushions that fit with the boat. They're becoming harder to find that one would imagine. I've thought about reproducing some of the vintage patterns and wonder how much of a market there is for that. The 70s to 90s Johnsons/Evinrudes are kindof plain looking and sounding (compared to Mercs anyways) and NEVER run smooth (oddly even with CDI ignition) but yeah, they seem to last like cockroaches. I've seen a couple burn holes in pistons running too lean but that's about it. And the lower units will take anything. A few years back, my dad hit a submerged rock reef at about 20 mph in 1978 Mark Twain...luckily he cut power to it just once he saw it and just before hitting, but nevertheless it hit hard. The 1976 Johnson 140HP took it like a champ, just left a few scrapes and maybe bent the skeg....I was shocked it was still on. As you said as well, they sit all year (maybe several) and start up every time 😂 That's cool that you'd go up to Canada and portage across to other spots. There's a small lake that feeds into a tiny waterfall about an hour down the lake from our cabin. Years ago, family and friends had an older wooden boat stashed up in the woods that they'd drag to the stream (carry the tank, motor, and all the gear) and go upriver to the small lake to walleye fish. I have old 8mm film of them doing it as well, pretty cool stuff. Thanks for the comment! -Brock

Nice, sounds like a screamin' deal also!

Ha! They typically do when dialed in right and decent compression.

@@retro_grade working on it 🤞

Thanks! What year are the Johnson 35's, same year? I'm curious to know what top speed and pickup you get out of them. My main concern is that great grandpa went to the 50s because the 35s weren't enough horsepower (since the boat is rated for 90).

@@paulhare662 I have one as well, in the original blue binder. They're gold in terms of necessary information to service these old engines

@@retro_grade I got mine to the point of cranking, 125 PSI compression, good spark. Carb parts and wiring became an expensive problem so I sold it before I was in over my wallet. Best wishes with restoring your engines.

@paulhare662 thanks! Yeah some of the parts are getting rare. Points are 90 bucks now 😂

SOLD!!!

Das ist es auf jeden Fall! Wurde auch bei einer Auktion für ein STEAL verkauft, für die Hälfte des Preises, für den es hätte verkauft werden sollen. Eines der weniger beliebten BMW-Modelle, das sich nie durchgesetzt hat. Ein sehr seltenes Fahrrad, das viel Spaß beim Fahren macht, ich hätte es wahrscheinlich behalten sollen.

I have a couple of tripods....although, not really sure how those would help the shakiness that you're describing for the "entire video" (did you really watch the whole thing????). As most of the shots were me walking around the boat....not standing in place. A gimbal would help with this, however, and I have one of those as well. It is, however, a PITA to set up and I typically only use it when shooting with my Sony A6600 camera. This video was shot on my GoPro Hero 10, as it was easy to climb in and out of the boat and move around with. Typically, its built in stabalization is enough to not require use of a gimbal. I'm watching the video now, and still don't see what you're talking about in terms of shakiness? As far as the "cringe" music you're referring to, that comes from a roughly $15 per month subscription to Epimemic Sound. If you think that music is bad, then try anything that RU-vid offers for free. I guess with music, you can't make anyone happy really - either it keeps the video flowing, isn't too intrusive and they don't notice it (or comment on it), or you get the one guy who says it's "cringe". Not sure if those people don't like the genre or would rather the video be played in silience (which, to me, I think is more worse/dry/boring). Either way, it's hard to make everyone happy. I've been on RU-vid enough now to not expect anyone to stick around the entire video. Unless it has a half naked woman in it or some extreme "shock value" to it, anything over 30 seconds is probably doing pretty good 😂

@@retro_grade Maybe just turn the volume down a bit more, or duck it more when talking. I noticed it was a bit loud sometimes. Cheers!

​@@ADDvanced thanks for the feedback, I will keep that in mind for the next one. I want to say volume was ducked about 50 percent on average when talking. I actually mess with that ALOT, and have found it varies tremendously depending if you're watching on a phone, computer monitor, airpods, TV, etc. My monitor (which I'm editing on) typically sounds the quietest so it fools me at times. I get very OCD with it and I've caught myself adjusting the ducking levels by 5 percent increments, I kid you not, it's ridiculous. On earlier videos, I'd watch what I posted on the TV and on several occasions re-exported and uploaded a new version with adjusted levels. I've started since realizing "perfection is the enemy" and try to just move on. I've always wondered what other people's experience is with music and how they get it down. The volume, type of music for what's going on, etc, seems to be an art. Or maybe I'm just bad at it. After seeing this, I'll start erring on the side of quiet in future videos. You've got more experience in this than I do, so I appreciate seeing this. Thanks for the feedback!!! 👍👍

I assume you mean from the Johnson 50's to the older Johnson 35's? While most people have told me to stick with the 50's, I'm glad that I see one comment suggesting this option :) Years ago, I said that if I ever ended up with that boat, the only way I'd have it is if it had the original 35 HP twins on it, as the 70's models just didn't look cool enough. Now, I'm bent. I definitley did source a set of NOS twin controls for the old motors though. It may be one of those deals that if a very nice looking set of those motors come my way at the right price, I may just have to pull the trigger on this idea. Or, if one of the 50 HP motors ever blows up. Thanks for the comment! -Brock

Thanks! It's certainly a cool old boat for sure, and it's grown on me through the years from just being an "old family fishing boat" to a cool original 1960's Alumacraft. (Previously I was more on the flashy "Feathercraft" kick). You'll definitely see more of it (have alot of footage that hasn't been ediited yet), as well as other vintage boats as well 👍

Thanks! That's what I'll likely end up doing, at least for the foreseeable future....

Yeah, that's what I figure the route will be, at least for now. It's hard to swap out a couple of perfectly fine (and still vintage) motors to something with less horsepower and lacking power trim. I'm pretty much a stickler on original paint, so I'll likely keep them stock, hoewever, and try to replace the gouged up inside decals. -Brock

Ha, thanks! I'm glad you found the channel though the Alumacraft episodes! We're kindof all over the place and have a little bit of everything. Boats, bikes, (some cars)....serious/sentimental, immature and at times idiotic. While we'll still keep doing some bike stuff here and there, the focus, at least as of now, is more towards the boat side. We certainly hope the channel grows as well, it's definitely been a grind! Thank you so much for the compliments! -Brock

Thanks, appreciate it!

I know....I'm still tearing myself apart though over the blue one getting scrapped out 😒

Yep, gotta love the direct drive Mercs! Haven't broken any docks with mine yet though, no issues there :)