I've got the bug bad! I plan to do an ocw test tomorrow with my savage 10 GRS in .308. And I will definitely be attending the 2 day course you all offer. Its just a matter of when. Thanks for the info on how to interpret these groups. I see your website says the 175gr .308 does well with 42.4 gr of IMR 4895. I loaded before i read that so we'll see how it shoots at 42.3 and 42.6. Thanks again.
Hi Dan, I'm very late to this thread so hope you can answer. The way you explain it in the video is very clear, but to me it's different from the instructions on your site? On your site, your instructions are to pick the 3 groups with closes POI. The middle charge is your OCW. In the video however you pick your scatter group and then add 1.5% to charge to find your OCW load. I'm confused. Which one of these should I do?
I can do consultatoins, it's 45 dollars for the work. We do a phone call, and exchange emails. Choosing the powder charge range correctly can help you save components, and expedite the process. The best powder charge range will vary from cartridge to cartridges, and depend also on powder chosen, and bullet, of course. See the "consulting" page at the OCWreloading dot com site.
now that was simple and straight forward. is 42.6 max load in reloading manual ? Einstein would be proud of you as he was quoted as saying " if you can't explain something in simple form maybe you don't understand it yourself" :)
We knew that lower charges, up to 40 grains were safe (tested prior), and we wanted to get the potential from the cartridge. Thank you for watching! :)
@@FuelTankerMan Glad you did, juat to remind you the world is hungry for Bang Steel knowledge. They don't have to be 30 minute heavily produced videos. But Eric Corti a and Texas Plinker have videos of 500yd and 1,000yd challenges that subscribers show up for and try their luck at long range shooting.
Not paying attention to ES/SD at 100 yards is fine, but at longer distances, those larger spreads will definitely become apparent. Seating depth changes the harmonics to fine tune an optimal charge weight found using a good Chrono. IMO
I'm having issues interpreting my OCW series shot as per the OCW guidelines, round robin, waiting 1 minute between shots. I had an exact zero, and this is out of a semi-auto. None of the groups were particularly tight, although there is some tightening of a couple of groups. I always thought that it was more important to triangulate center of each group (given 3 shots per charge) and plot its center to the closest point of aim/point of impact, rather than looking strictly at group sizes. So what do I do if all groups were bad, but some better than others however the better ones landing further from point of aim, and worse groups closer to point of aim, which would you choose as the OCW? That's my issue. I can go 1.5% either way, but I don't know which one to choose.....(I've been doing Satterlees before and doing velocity nodes with seating depth tweaking, but wanted to use this proven better method for this new rifle) Is there a paid service where I can send the photos of targets and you figure out what my actual OCW is?
In the middle of July it will take MUCH LONGER than 1 minute to allow the barrel to cool any at all. Please give it more time to cool. I keep a fan blowing along the length of my barrel when doing OCW tests. I wait at least a minute between shots, and I'll wait sometimes 5 to 10 mins between strings while the fans are doing their thing. Also between shots and strings I use a barrel cooler to blow cool air through the barrel so it's cooling on the inside and outside between shots and strings.
Bare with me, but i have a 2nd question. Given how the groups drastically open between 40.6 and 40.9, how do you know the accuracy node is between 40.3 and 40.6 instead of being at 40.6, or even 40.7? Im looking at the target and its telling me that the accuracy node is closer to 40.6 than it is 40.3, but because 40.9 is so bad, it doesn't tell me which side of 40.6 i should be looking at.
We were .3 grains away from the bad 40.0 grain group at 40.3 ... it shot okay, but one shot was to the right. In other words, 40.3 was too close to the scatter node. At 40.6 grains, we see a great group, but we're .3 grains away from the next scatter node area in the 41 grain range. So it's best to be as far from those two scatter nodes as we can be, which in this case is 40.5 grains. And since this video was made, the owner of the rifle has done some extraordinary shooting, even making hits at 2165 yards with the 40.5 grain charge. It comes in level (very little vertical spread) at long range, so it's a good load. The initial "break in" charge of 41 grains was through a brand new barrel, with no fouling at all. Had we kept shooting the 41 grain charge, it would have revealed itself as a non-optimal charge, and we see this in the round-robin test.
@@bangsteellongrangeshooting3413 I know you probably don't give 2 rips about my opinion, and will probably think that I'm just an armchair internet troll, but I'm going to share my thoughts anyway. Maybe there's something that will be helpful to you. First, I think your statistician was wrong. Your round robin technique DOES take into account barrel heat and fowling better than any other technique. The problem is that for the rate of fire you are experiencing, and the limited number of rounds fired, heat and fowling are not statistically significant factors on your group size. If you wanted to prove that with this rifle and load, shoot 5 three shot groups round robin style with your optimal load, and then shoot a group of 15 rounds at the same bull. The round robin groups will be bigger. That's because you're shifting your point of aim (and natural point of aim) after every shot. This will impart a LOT more variation on your group than what you get from barrel heat or fowling. If this were not the case, to tier F class shooters would not be able to clean targets at 1K. The wouldn't know whether the shifts in their impacts were from heat and fowling, or changes in wind and mirage. If you want to shoot a "round robin" like this, you need to use a video system that will track your shots and allow you to use the same point of aim for every shot. This will keep from adding additional sources of variation that mask the impact of heat, fowling, and even powder charge weight for that matter. That, or keep doing what you're doing now because you're happy with the results :)
@@nospam3409 If you're right, tens of thousands of satisfied clients are wrong. Just google Dan Newberry and OCW and check the ratio; there are occasional detractors, but the overwhelming majority of shooters have used the OCW method and found great results. If the system wasn't solid, it would have been proven faulty many years ago. It works. Try it. :)
@@bangsteellongrangeshooting3413 I believe you on the ratio, and finding an optimum charge weight. Its the way that you shoot the round robin that I call into question. My personal experience tells me that shooting the round robin like that at multiple bulls imparts more variation than it removes. Honestly, I don't put a lot of weight into "satisfied customers" because very few shooters that I've met can shoot accurately. The overwhelming majority believe that an honest 1 MOA rifle and load is accurate. For me, if I a bolt action rifle can only shoot 1 MOA right out of the box, its going back in the box and getting sold. My bare minimum accuracy requirement for a bolt action rifle is repeatable 1/2 MOA at 100 yds with a tuned reload. Over the course of the past 30 years of competitive shooting , I've only met maybe 50 shooters who honestly understand that every decent bolt action rifle is capable of that. The overwhelming majority of those shooters were met while I was competing in 3 position small bore where our conference had 4 of the top 10 NCAA rifle teams, and at least 3 members of the US Olympic Shooting team during any given year. Since graduating in the 90s, I'd say that number is less than 10. All of that to say that it doesn't take much in regards to accuracy to impress tens of thousands of customers.
@@nospam3409 here is an interview I did with Erik Cortina. I'm not saying he subscribes to the OCW method, but he and I had a good discussion about that, and other things. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-oTWDUZ8Awig.html
So if you're test method is the most statically relavent, and you have a good trigger puller, I have an honest questio. You say that you are expecting a scatter node at 41.1gr. Accordingly, 40.9gr and 41.2 gr ar not looking very good. Why did 41.0 gr put 4 out of 5 shots into the same hole?
I have the chronograph virus, but I'm taking my supplements and vitamins to get rid of it. Spent 200 damn bullets trying to find a load on a 300 Norma. My fault, maybe I shouldn't have been a numbnuts and use 3 different powders. I was mostly looking for max pressure, but I did this OCW last week and found an area to test. Let's see how it works. With 300 Win Mag, it was easy, 76-77gr of H1000 was dead on at a mile.
@@bangsteellongrangeshooting3413 bonjour s'il vous plais puis avoir un PDF de vos Targets pour évaluations des charges merci beaucoup cordialement Michel b, France 🇨🇵
I actually like both brands of brass. Use Peterson in my 6.5 creed and lapua in my 300Prc. I guess if the neck is getting into your jacket, you could use a mandrel to open it up from new
I took Dan’s class back in the fall of 2015. The amount of knowledge I gained from those 2 days was amazing. I just bummed that I didn’t get to take level 2 due to some health issues. But I’m getting back to reloading and ready to go.
I will try to do another video in the future which will show two of the nodes. In this case (and in most cases) we know *about* where we want the velocity to be, so we only cover that area. Thank you for the suggestion--we should do a two node OCW test, I agree.
Dan is the man! Appreciate the wisdom that he's giving you guys at no cost. Trolls always shoot tighter groups at extreme distances with unproven techniques, however, Dan's explaining how this works and what you can expect.
You should see dirt on all of the impacts... the shredding bullets cut a trench in the ground below the steel. The higher impacts may not kick up much dust but anything middle target to lower will definitely leave a ground signature.
OCW test has nothing to do with group size, it only has to do with point of impact. in my opinion the node is at 40.6. how can you detect a scatter node? and why 3%?
@@campnoutdoors1621 yeah because this "fella" knows nothing. He only has his own long range shooting school and is well known throughout the long range shooting community for his OCW method or perfection of it. Myself and many others I know have gotten his help building our loads and never been let down.
Way to go. I have an original Smith & Wesson Schofield and I shoot it too. Go look at my video. Jesse James Last Pistol. I've shot it over 500 times since I've owned it
David, that is FASCINATING! An amazing video and there can be no doubt that you indeed have Jesse James' Schofield. This Schofield we have (it is my son's, given to him by a family member. This Schofield belonged to Civil War veteran John Floyd Fletcher, and he handed it down a couple of generations. Interestingly, this revolver has two notched carved into the walnut grip. There is no story about those notches... so we don't know what, if anything, they mean. Anyway, thank you for commenting here, and for alerting us to the amazing video you've made about your Schofield--the Jesse James Schofield, no doubt. :)
What about seating depth? I'm trying to work up a load for a Savage 110 elite precision in 338lm . Running a Berger 300gr tactical hybrid on h1000. the problem is I only have .5 lb of h1000 left and activity searching for some more. So I guess I'm going to have to drop the h1k until I find more and move on to Ramshot magnum. This cartridge is kicking my butt.
With Ramshot Magnum, load 86.2 grains with the 300's in Lapua brass. We use 89.3 grains of Retumbo with 300's in our Savage... and you'd be around 88.7 grains with H1000 (that's an estimate).
@@bangsteellongrangeshooting3413 I have been running 93gr of h1k. I'm trying to keep the speed up. Maybe I need to give up on that and back the charge up some. I talked to a guy a friend of mine knows. He's loaded 338 before. I got 2 in damn near the same hole and 1 flyer. a few times I got 2 touching or very close and a flyer. This was during in my seating testing and he said I may need to just shoot twice, let it cool and try that. How far are you from the lands in your load? Thanks for the help! I've reached out to a few people on here and no one wants to share any input on 338lm.
We are fortunate that we have long range targets to observe actual vertical dispersion, and the vertical spread was very good. We don't chronograph during the OCW test, but will in some cases check velocity after we arrive at the OCW load recipe... but of course, actual vertical dispersion at ranges past 800 yards or so is the best indicator of tight velocity spread.
