Every time I try this the ascender ends up too far away to reach after I load my rappel device again. Wondering if this technique only works with an old tibloc since you can knock it down at the end. I’m having a hard time finding a reliable, easy, non-sketchy way to pass a knot. I like this one, but I’m not sure what the trick is.
Look at the video between times 1:35 and 1:45. If you set these distances wrong you will be too far from your ascender when done. A decent way to figure out the length you need for your safety tether is to use a string of carabineers instead of the teather. Try the process over and over (in a safe space of course) and play with varying the number of carabineers in the chain. When you find what works, that is the length to aim for when selecting a tether. Note that mine was too long in the video so I shortened it by doubling it over. The length you need will depend on you and your gear (your arm length, how much does your harness waist stretch, etc). Note that if you mount your descender on your harness in an extended mode (using a dog bone or adding in a rapid to change orientation) this will make it harder to use this technique. You descender should be worn close to the belay loop and not extended.
@@lukegalyan452 Thanks for the thorough response, Luke! I think I figured out what I was doing wrong: My lock-off on my rappel device was a bit too loosey goosey. When I was more intentional about making sure the rope was super tight in the lock off, that fixed the issue with the ascender traveling up the rope too far when loading the rappel device.
Technically yes. Some canyoneers have for year been using what they refer to as a stone or stein knot (they may even have the wrong name for that, I am not sure). The stone knot is a way to isolate the strands of a double strand rappel so people can rappel on both strands. Fast forward years later and this toggling idea hits the canyon community. While the community was developing this idea the knot they used was the knot shown here. Even though it is a marlin spike hitch, the knot is tied similar to and looks similar to the stone knot, so ... People referred to it as a stone knot. Let's just say the name stuck and we all call it the stone knot while it is technically a marlin spike hitch. Don't let the wrongly named knot get in the way of exploring this toggle concept for canyoneering as it's a pretty useful tool
@@lukegalyan452 kind of like if group A calls God "butch" and group B calls God "Mr. Big Guy", no matter what they call him they are both worshipping the same God ? Different names and lingo for different communities. Gotcha 😊 Thanks
Love my sqwurel and admire your work. You make excellent, innovative gear and your tutorial videos are very informative and helpful. Thanks for everything you do for the canyoneering community. You rock.
Thank you...I think. I got some super glue on my polycarbonate eyeglass lenses and I was wondering how Acetone would react to polycarbonate. Know I know. Guess I'll scrap my glasses! 🤓☹
No green!?!? Colour matters man! Appreciate the clear and concise demo of the differences between the 3 and 4; despite the lack of green, I'll definitely benefit from the improvements.
Weight is the biggest issue here. I’m for these systems over twice the weight or more weight via a rope large enough to repel. The other option is to block the one line and pull that. Which I see as better than this, if the situation allows.
Hi Wyatt, version 3 is a major upgrade from version 1. Version two got a little more refined friction adjustments, made the ear smaller, pulled in the last nub of tail hole 3 and other tweaks. Version 3 got considerably smaller and lighter, further refined the friction settings and greatly reduced rope twist. Versions 1 and 2 twisted the rope a lot but version 3 twists very little. Oh, and the other hole is just to make the device lighter by removing unneeded material. Version 4 is again what I would consider a major upgrade considering it now handles double rope well. And to see what has changed from version 3 to version 4, well, the video covers that.
Canyon Zone www.canyonzone.com/ carries.the Sqwurel but he does not have this version 4 yet and is sold out of version 3.. We have talked and are.working on getting these to him but do not have a date yet. Keep checking Canyon Zone or reach out and contact them to ask.
I really like using mine. Nice design improvements. Hopefully the aluminum quality is higher, the last ones wore out rather quick compared to my other devices.
Hi Sam. The canyons you do (wet and sandy are very abrasive) will greatly affect how long they last. All of my rappel devices over the past 8 years are always made with 7075 T6 aluminum. Same aluminum most other devices are made from. I ask for meterial certs on metal used to confirm proper grade and sometimes send a random one out to a third party for tensile and alloy testing to further confirm correct aluminum alloy. The Sqwurel is made from the same alloy as you other devices.
I would hands down say the Sqwurel. The friction adjustment is handy in a lot of situations and is intuitive and is in smaller increments so you are less likely to find your self stuck between too little friction and too much. But, as the inventor of the Sqwurel, and previous user of the ats, I am obviously biased.
any fabrication can buildup stresses on polycarbonate & C., and at that point any chemical that can attack that kind of plastics will result in crazing, which is a bunch of small cracks on the surface. Had it happening on optical elements making homemade camera lenses, clearcoat on headlights had the same effect if not done properly and saw it happening often enough on boats windows when people was trying to clean the with the wrong product (lots of girls trying to clean the residue of a sticker from the boat will reach for the nailpolish remover). If the part is bending while you throw the acetone on it crazing will start a crack and that crack is more likely to form right away on the stressed surface under tension and will open all the way through since its that side of the sheet that is resisting the bend. It behaves much like tempered glass at that point. If the piece is instead just resting then chemicals might just ruin the surface, if crazing were to happen there could be weakening to a certain extent. One way to reduce the crazing at rest is annealing the piece (heating to the temperature prescribed for the type of plastic, maintaining the set temperature for hours depending on thickness and then cooling very slowly). However bent areas will end accumulating stress
T-shaped sticks will catch more easily in rocks, cracks, bushes, etc when the Smooth Operator is being retrieved and falling down the varied terrain. As streamlined of a shape as you can get is best. There is more to consider than simply the rigging for rappel. Hope that helps.
@@lukegalyan452 another idea. you may try to modify those sticks. to make the ends of the stick spiral. just to turn them on 90 degree to create a spiral. In this case when knot is under load stick will stay in the knot because spiral forces will keep it in, at the same time when knot is not under load it will take the same amount of force to pull the stick off.
@@Estereos That has already been tried by others and it is a bit underwhelming. But just and FYI when loaded the stick can not be pulled out. Go try it, it is amazing. In order for the stick to pull out, the knot needs to rotate to allow a straight down pull out. With the rappelers weight on the rope you can not pull the stick because the stone knot will not rotate. I do this exercise for people to get them familiar with that idea. Reppal down to the bottom and lock-off on rappel about 2 feet off the deck so you are a safe distance to the ground but still fully weighting the rope. Then have a friend try to pull the release cord. They wont pull the stick free. Now let yourself off the rope and have the same friend pull the stick free with ease. As to the spiral making it more difficult to pull when not weighted this can be a very bad thing with some ropes. Not all ropes are the same. A stiff rope will release the stick more easily while a supple bendy rope will hold the stick so tight it can be VERY difficult to release. When using Canyon Lux rope (for example) the rope can grab the stick so well that it can take two people pulling together with full body weight to get the stick out. When using ropes like this I tend to only stick the Smooth Operator only about one third or the way in (more stick sticking out on the pull cord side). Doing this allows more leverage to rotate the knot easier and that makes it easier to get the stick out. You should go try some of this in a safe place and see what I mean. There really are a lot of nuances to this. Speaking of nuances, it is VERY important you learn to tie the stone knot in a twist free configuration. Not doing so can in some cases stick your rope. See my video on that as this is a non-intuitive nuance. It takes some thinking to really wrap your head around it. Againi test in a safe place. Lots of little things to learn with this.
To to defeat polycarbonate: Heat, their light saber would easily do it it “melts” around 230-320 F Acetone - this causes it to become real brittle and crack incredibly easily Polycarbonate is bullet proof and even strong ins wouldn’t be able to break sheets this thick You could also melt the steal supports, or break the bolts to get in the box Either way it is incredibly strong compared to the other boxes
Hi A H, True, once weighted the Smooth Operator is not going to be able to be pulled out. In practice, sometimes we use the safety carabiners and sometimes we do not. Judgment on case by case determines this. There are times where the Smooth Operator is positioned in an odd place where the person getting on rappel needs to downclimb over or around the Smooth Operator resulting in a lot of un-weighted movement of the anchor system. Care and attention to detail can prevent most of the problems. However it can at times be comforting to know the safety carabiners are in place and it is not possible to accidentally compromise the system. The last person would remove the carabiner(s) and be the one to pay attention and be careful. Sometimes the safety carabiners are not needed and we use them anyway just to help make people feel good about what is happening. In some cases you may call this safety theater but even that has is uses to keep everyone feeling safe. Redundancy is not theater per se. Climbers generally do not like the lack of redundancy in the systems canyoneers use. Are the multiple anchor points climbers use considered "safety theater" since at least one of the other anchors isn't going anywhere"?
@@lukegalyan452 I agree with your points. To answer your question about redundancy, I do believe there is a lot of ridiculous ideology in, especially anchor building. Belay station has 2 or 3 bolts, you make an anchor using two cords like a quad anchor a doubled sliding x. Redundant. But we all go down on one rope weather it’s double strand or srt it’s still a single rope. So no matter what you do it’s never truly redundant at some point. I use an F stick often & have faith in it staying put under load & keep it under load. Same goes for my Beal Escaper & when I do a macrame knot. Climbing is a dangerous sport & gravity always wins, I don’t think anything can change that. So far we’ve all just been lucky. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoyed the video & appreciate your content.
Thanks Luke - any reason why you couldn't use jumbo mode double stranded and skip to the second ladder bar to add friction? I almost never need to add friction double stranded but I'm just curious
If going double rope you likely would not need to add friction, so jumping to the second tail hole is fine. However if you are using jumbo or behemoth modes and going single rope, jumping to the second tail hole robs you of the option to gain maximum friction if needed. Fyi double rope rappels are best saved for short 15 to 20 foot drops. Single rope rappel makes for a.smoother ride, keeps the pull side free in the event it is needed for rescue and single rope allows you to convert to ascending if needed. Single rope rappels are the preferred mode for may reasons.
You lose all ability to assess the knot and fiddlestick with other people rappelling on it so it is more like you are rigging solo. The whole point of this video is Luke expressing why he thinks it's important not to rerig as the last person.
Why don't you explain the difference between a stone knot and a stuck knot. Show how easy it is to stuff it up and the consequences of such an easy mistake.
Give up mate, Simple. ill informed egoes are dangerous. Go out onto the wild ( ya know, over the hedge ) get a few under your belt and keep it to yourself.
Hi Luke. My fiddlestick is a piece of bamboo I cut from the same stand as my hiking staff (which also acts as an extra tent pole at times). It is a wonderful sound hearing the clink of my bamboo fiddlestick/toggle/marlin spike as it tumbles down that granite slab at Shorncliffe. Then I know my rope will follow and I don't have to go the long way round to clear my anchor-point. By the way, I use a buntline hitch to join the thinner tagline cord to my fiddlestick. I also replace the midline clove hitch anchor with a pile hitch onto my carabiner. So simple to tie/untie and just as secure as a clove. Tomorrow, I am lucky enough in Covid-free Brisbane, Aust, to go abseiling at Kangaroo Point near the CBD. Hope you and yours are well. Happy abseiling. Mark Gallagher
Well the thing is that the bottom of the stick is under great tension, and there is always going to be some very minor crack at the bottom thats pulled apart by it. Now dunk that part into acetone that dissolves the stuff, and get acetone into the crack, and it will weaken it letting the crack go through. (Basically how welding cracks go crazy duze to rusting)
Hmmm. Sir could this basicly be done with a thick toggle of green wood? wouldnt i achieve the same result out in the field stuck in a survival situation? :)
Hey Luke, I'm busy watching lots of YT vids. I'm a total canyoneering beginner who's looking to buy the right gear. I wondered why you would use the Sqwurel and not just say a Black Diamond ATC coupled with a prussik loop attached to the leg loop of your harness. I know canyoneers are typically rappelling, however, with the ATC if there ever comes a time when you need to bring a climber up you can do this safely with an ATC. It just seems to me that the ATC has more use scenarios. I'm guessing here but perhaps it's because the Sqwurel can provide more varied levels of friction. I'd love to know if you can spare a second to reply.
Hi A Wood. Climbing is all about the up while canyoneering is all about the down and getting past obstacles. That seems too obvious to state but it makes a huge difference in techniques used. When canyoneering we rarely / almost never "bring some one up" in the climbing sense. On the occasions where we do the distances are short (30 or 40 feet would be a pretty big) the climbing is not high grade and there are places to tie in or we just sit in a secure position and anchor a rope from a harness. Its pretty simple and straight forward to belay someone up in the rare cases it happens. Wile bringing some one up is rare, needing variable friction is one of the most common needs when canyoneering. First consider the ropes used. There are fat or skinny ropes, stiff or supple ropes, clean or super sandy ropes, water soaked or dry ropes. Unlike climbing where one set of ropes is used and they are kept clean, canyoneering gets rope wet at times, full of sand at times and multiple ropes are used. It is very common for a group of people to canyoneer together and each pitch in ropes to complete the needed gear list so on one route you will have those fat or supple etc ropes. Unlike climbing where most of the rappels are clean and simply straight down, canyoneering often has rappels with awkward starts where a lot of friction from the device is desired to start the rappel then ramp down the friction once over the edge. Some of the rappels are very long upwards of 300 plus so varying the friction is very helpful there. Some rappels go over multiple stages witha vertical section between. Anchor choice can affect the desired amount of friction but thats a different tangent. When belaying someone down a difficult downclimb, it is also handy to have variable friction. A z rig from the harness as you suggest is cumbersome and takes substantial effort compared to simply choosing a tail hole on the Sqwurel. Both work but with the constant need to choose friction level, something adjustable on the fly like the Sqwurel really does make life nice. As a side note Sqwurel 1 and 2 both had significant rope twist. Sqwurel 3 is now out and has very little rope twist which is a huge improvement. Hope this helps answer your question.
I forgot to mention a majority of rappels while canyoneering are done on single rope. Double rope rappels are common on short 15 to 20 foot raps in the interest of time. Longer rappels are generally done with single rope. Single rope rappels allow the pull strad to be used in emergency since its free, keep rope tangling to a minumum and allow the use of more advanced anchors like the Smooth Operator, sand trap and water trap. Single rope also works best when varying the friction on a device.
@@lukegalyan452 Thanks very much Luke, I understand now, especially as I can visualise single rope raps, and as you mention the issues with varied ropes and ropes covered in gloopy wet mud. I have much to learn, but YT is a big help.
