After years of working, writing, and editing for others, we want to set on our own independent way. We are not experts, nor do we have fancy titles under our belts. What we do have is a passion for storytelling, finished drafts we would like to publish, and few lessons we’ve picked along the way. We are the story Gibbons, and you are welcome to join our journey.
One of the issues here is, even though he was "standing by his morals" or "had been traumatized by past events," this does not change that he did not think through the full consequences of his actions. You can kind of see the panic when his eyes immediately dart to his children... That's when the reality sets in, of how badly he messed up. He may have known his wife and kids were strong, but yes, he severely underestimated the pettiness of the Lannisters. It's because of Ned's confrontation that both Cersei and Joffrey torment Sansa, it's because of this confrontation that the Lannisters continued looking for ways to not only defeat Robb, but ruin Winterfell entirely (which added to Sansa's later mistreatment from Ramsay), and by extension, it's because of this that Bran ultimately seeks out darker powers (which are actually very corrupt), and Arya ultimately does that too in her own way (which, again, unlike the show, is NOT a good thing). Matter of fact, Cersei and Joffrey ultimately end up trying to kill all of Robert's bastard children anyway, in much the same way that Ned was supposedly trying to prevent. By outing their secret, he gave them motivation to do that. Ultimately, the vast number of consequences greatly outweighed any benefit. His moral grand-standing, without proper strategy, RUINED his entire family, and many others affected by his actions. In many ways this proves that his actions were still very selfish and short-sighted. This is just an excuse/reason we already know of, and take into account, when coming to this conclusion. It does not change the fact. If you said that he was actually several moves ahead, had tried keeping his kids safe, knowing all of this would happen, and was ACTUALLY being meticulous in his decision, that would change the perspective. Unfortunately the consequences prove otherwise. Ned is an example that, having good intentions on its own, is not enough, and even good morals can hide a sliver of selfishness. Varys' confrontation is incredibly important, because it reveals that Ned does NOT actually care about the Realm, as much as he wants others to believe that he does... If he had, and had truly been meticulous, he would have actually waited for proof, and revealed it to the people. But he didn't have any. Just a hunch, which he prematurely announced to the world, leaving too much room for doubt. And this only further allowed the Lannisters to make so many allies.
Thank you for watching, and thank you for your comments. You bring up some interesting points. We are now working on a new video discussing Ned's ACTUAL plan from the book. We hope we will be able to address your explanation of Ned's actions.
It's not. It's one of the dumbest, most nonsensical action series to come out in years. And what it calls world-building is just nightclubs, old computers and some latin? Lazy.
Personal preferences aside, John Wick is still a billion dollars franchise with four (!) very financially profitable movies. So we had to ask HOW. We hope we managed to do that.
Ned failed to replace everyone on the small council who would be disloyal to him the way that Tyrion got rid of Lord Janis. Ned should have removed Little Finger as master of the coin. Had him arrested and seized his assets for the sake of securing the crown. Ned's failure to remove Little Finger meant that he convinced the gold cloaks to side with Cersci and Joffery.
Maybe you have a point. If you read Ned’s chapters you see that he doesn’t know who to trust, and hesitant to trust anyone. Replacing all of the council with his own people never crossed his mind.
Good? John Wick as to be one of the corniest actions series of all time. awkward dialogue, unreasonably violent and bloody action, weird humor just to name some issues. Hard pass.
First, thank you for watching and commenting. Personal preferences aside, John Wick is a billion dollars franchise with four movies that grossed a nice income for their studios. That means that despite the shortcomings of the movies, studios keep making John Wick movies, and people are hungry for more. That begs the question of the video: with a simple story, and prolonged fight scenes, how did these movies became so popular? I hope we managed to do that.
@@marca9955 I guess you are right. But as a small channel we have to be as short as we can in our titles. Maybe "why so many people think John Wick is Good" would be a better title, but it doesn't score as high.
There is a longer version to this video where we place some hints from Game of Thrones, but we wanted to focus the video, so we edited out. In principle, you are right.
Meyer Briggs personality types are pseudoscience. Reproducing pseudoscience is harmful. Not possible to continue a video that supports this and mentions it in the introduction.
Thank you for the time you did watch and for your comment. Though Myers-Brigs Type Indicator is no less valid or reliable than other personality tests, we found it extremely helpful in analyzing and creating fictional characters. Though real life is more complex than a simple test, in storytelling we seek to simplify matters so we can communicate a cohesive story. Sorry you didn’t like this video, hopefully you would like the upcoming one.
@@TheStoryGibbons Meyer Briggs is not reproduced in academia. It is the equivalent of astrology and tarot. One can practice astrology and tarot as a means of self-reflection and disregard the esoteric aspects of it but meyer briggs is usually claiming to be somewhat reliable and "serious", which it is not.
@@TheStoryGibbons Yes, meyer briggs IS less valid and reliable than other personality tests. There are personality tests that are reproduced in an academic setting and are peer reviewed. The big five comes to mind. While personality in general are not very scientific, there are some that are constantly mentioned in newer, peer reviewed articles and briggs is not one of them.
@@TheStoryGibbons The introduction and using meyer briggs like that is no different than saying "Since Ned Stark is a gemini and geminis are too trusting.." or "when I thought of Ned Stark I did some tarot reading and the results will shock you"
Thank you for saying that. We too think it is a fun movie, and one worth watching in the cinema, which begs the question even more: why opening weekend was so bad. We hope that the good word of mouth will pick the movie up in box office numbers.
@@TheStoryGibbons I think another reason is people aren't really giving movies a good review because people don't go to the theaters anymore, they just stay home and watch it on their TV, the movie industry is dying, this generation isn't big on theaters like it was back in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s, back then it was so much fun and exciting and that's what this generation is lacking.
@@shannonbuckley3631 In general, I think you are right. It is harder for movies to draw crowds to theatres these days. However, some movies are managing to do it. For example, Bad Boys 4 is is yet to finish its first week and has already made half of what it needs to break even. So, I agree with you, but this is why it is interesting to learn and understand why certain movies succeed and others did not.
Thank you for your time and comment. Though Myers-Brigs Type Indicator is no less valid or reliable than other personality tests, we found it extremely helpful in analyzing and creating fictional characters. Though real life is more complex than a simple test, in storytelling we seek to simplify matters so we can communicate a cohesive story.
@@TheStoryGibbons You're welcome for the engagement :) But no, while no personality can be flawless, the MBTI and its derivatives are remarkably worse than other personality tests, specially because of its binary character, but also the lack of adapting the test/questions/interpretation to a given society and its cultural traits. MBTI is a bad test by itself, and it gets worse if you try to apply it worldwide, but going cross-universes to Westeros is surely a landmark!
@@fabiorzfreitas I can see your point, and appreciate the discussion (I personally think it interesting). I guess the reason we are using it is its simplicity and it gives us a clear-cut way to describe different characters. At no point are we suggesting any psychological model, nor do we recommend anyone to take any personality test (I myself, as part of a previous job, took few and got different results, sometimes from the same test in different points of time). This is just a tool we found useful as a foundation for forming a fictional character. Not the all-in-one tool. It is like the "hero's journey". It a popular tool, deeply flawed in its research, and more wrong than right. However, any storytelling class will start with it since its providing the foundations to understand storytelling. I hope it makes sense.
@@TheStoryGibbons Well, that's not at all a fair comparison, it probably falls under false symmetry. "The Hero's Journey" is a way broader concept than you're suggesting. Its usage in Anthropology, Literature, Sociology, Historiography and other fields is prior to Psychology's borrowing of the concept in order to support a flawed application/branch of Psychology. The MBTI, however, is a concept exclusive to and developed in Psychology, it has one single definition: it's a personality psychometric, regardless if it's used in clinical practice or producing entertainment. By themselves, these statements cause no harm, but there's a catch: the increasing popularity of the MBTI is not accompanied by this disclaimer. There are thousands of people spending money, getting frustrated, disregarding Psychometry and Psychology in general, and suffering because they're led to believe (exactly because of the MBTI's widespread) and interpret the results of a test that doesn't even have a single proper way of being assessed: there's no "valid application" of the MBTI that could be useful. Actually, try to reimagine this video as if it were based on zodiac signs. Thankfully, those have already been bashed enough over decades that this doesn't even try to pose itself as science. On the other hand, the MBTI does so, thus being classified as pseudoscientific. And one of the saddest things about pseudoscience is that very often people will choose it instead of proper [mental] healthcare.
@@fabiorzfreitas I can see your point. Perhaps next time we use the tool we place a warning on the screen, or develop the tool a bit more, so it will not presume to be something it is not. Well, you live and learn.
There's another reason why he would've warned her he found out about the incest. Robert had a towering temper, and it's likely that once he found out he would've beaten Cersei and her children to death with his bare hands. And he would've found out, because from Ned's view, the Lannisters had killed his mentor and tried to kill his son to keep their secret hidden. He wouldn't want them to stay in power. But Robert killing Cersei would've brought the Lannisters down upon the kingdom, especially the Kingslayer, who would've killed Robert in battle for the death of his sister. His telling her was his way to get her to realise she needs to cut her losses and get out of there before Robert returned. I think Ned's flaw is not realising that there are people in King's Landing who will do anything to gain power and rule.
While I agree with the thesis of this video, and think it does a better job making its case than most aSoI&F videos on RU-vid, there is a glaring shortcoming with regard to Ned's thoughts on Robert's willingness to murder Rhaegar's relatives who were not even born when he died. Forget Aerys and Duskendale, that never even crosses Ned's mind. The real reason he is so worried about this behavior in Robert is because Ned himself is hiding Rhaegar's SON! He is not thinking of Denys Darklyn, he is thinking of JON SNOW! If Robert is frothing in outrage over the miniscule, nonsensical threat that Ned so handily and logically dismisses in the council meeting (note that the show heavily edited that argument from the books to make Ned look worse, removing some of his arguments, giving Littlefinger and Robert the last word, even though their points are REALLY stupid, and cutting Barristan from the meeting, so the audience does not see the best man in the room besides Ned agreeing with him), if Robert is willing to murder a girl, with no claim to the throne, who was merely a sister Rhaegar had never even known existed, he was, for damn sure, not going to tolerate a son, especially one conceived in a womb Robert regards as his rightful property! The whole POINT of R+L=J to the story is NOT about Jon having magic dragon blood or a claim to the Iron Throne, it's about NED and how that fact, that his sister gave birth to the son of a Targaryen, drives so much of what he does. Ned is protecting Cersei because of the parallels between her children and Jon. He argues for Dany's life because of the parallels between her and Jon. He spits on Renly's & Littlefinger's recommendations to use Cersei's kids as tools to power because he is thinking of Jon being used against Robert. He refuses to talk about Jon's origins, despite having a fake mom who was willing to play along, because he is not allowing anyone to get too close a look at the story, even at the cost to his marriage, or the risk of annoying Robert by sticking up for marital fidelity. He is repulsed by Tywin Lannister in part because he knows what Tywin would do to Rhaegar's child to protect his grandchildren's inheritance. He tells Catelyn to take the kids to visit Lysa, because he is thinking of his sister and her orphaned baby. A few other points: Ned's confrontation with Cersei did NOT seal his fate. Rather, it was Robert's death that allowed the Lannister coup to succeed, through sheer dumb luck on Cersei's part, and it was Ned's agreement to confess and accept the deal offered by Varys in the dungeons that resulted in his death. Had he held out a little longer, Robb's victories would have made a prisoner exchange inevitable. Littlefinger was the only one with any real power who wanted him dead, and his power sources were too indirect to go against the Lannisters treating him with kid gloves and guarding him to ensure Jaime's safe return. Ned telling Cersei was also not much of a strategic disadvantage. Like Robb sending Theon home, the smart play for the other team was so blindingly obvious, the Starks could not believe that they would be stupid enough to go over to the attack, much less that their attacks would succeed. In both cases, Cersei manages to kill Robert, and Theon manages to take Winterfell, by incredible luck, and not through any skill. In each case, the only sane way out was the one offered by the Starks, but Balon and Cersei both chose to jump off a cliff, and managed to land safely through no achievement of their own. And even with the incredible good luck she had, all Cersei did was delay the death of her children. If she had run, Joffrey would likely still be alive, Myrcella would have two ears and she and Tommen would not be facing whatever doom will take them in the coming books. So you can't even say that Ned was being stupid in thinking he had the advantage. Cersei was just too stupid to see the inevitable outcome of her actions. And the video, while making good points about Ned's principled decision to refrain from infanticide, does not go far enough. Everyone who kills children does not long succeed at their objective. The Mad King's willingness to kill innocents roused enemies against him and he was overthrown as no Targaryen ever had been before. Tywin's massacre of the royal family earned him the undying enmity of House Martell, which resulted in their interference with Tyrion's trial and Myrcella's maiming. When Robb is going to war, Catelyn reminds him of Tywin's history of child murder, not to dissuade him from taking arms against the Lion of the Rock, but to make sure he knows he HAS to win. Joffrey's cruelty and abuses drive the Martells to murder him. Theon's murder of the millers' boys causes no one in the North to fear him, it just makes him even more hated. His threat to hang Ser Rodrik's daughter does not deter the Stark loyalists, and only gains him the contempt of his own men. And, of course, Khal Drogo had exactly zero interest in fighting to claim an "iron chair", until Robert sent assassins after his wife and unborn son. Hell, Tywin killing Rhaegar's children did not stop a Targaryen restoration! If Aegon had been spared, and sent to the Wall or the Faith, then Jon Connington could drag the most attractive Targaryen-looing fake prince that was ever raised across the Narrow Sea with the Golden Company at his back, and whoever was on the Iron Throne could just haul the real Aegon out to show the people he was alive. Throughout the story it is shown that murdering children does not actually work, in the long term.
Wow! What an incredible response! I really enjoyed reading it, and learned a lot. The point of this video was to try and intrigue people to give Ned’s plan a second thought. As you mentioned, most people think of Ned through the eyes of the show, and not much through the book’s. All we wanted to say is that simply going to Cerci without a plan and lots of mercy because of honor does not fit Ned’s personality type. Now, WHAT was his plan is an entirely different question we intend to explore in another video that will come soon enough. We will definitely consider your comment in this upcoming video. Thank you for taking the time to watch and comment. We do not take it lightly and hope you will enjoy our coming House of the Dragon video. PLEASE keep sharing your thoughts and let us know where we can get better. Have a great weekend!
There was a very good chance that Ned really would have just been sent to the Wall, a fate I'm sure he wouldn't have entirely minded. He would probably loved it. Littlefinger really was the hitch in that plan
Ned and Cat both were stupid and destroyed their family, sometimes you have to get yourself in the pit to slay the rats, it was his mistake and he paid for it.
When we set out to do this video, we thought that their honour drove them to make the wrong decisions. However, when we study Ned's personality, we realized that he had a different motivation altogether.
Sorry, but Ned WAS a fool here. Cersei even TELLS him he made a mistake warning her. She was NEVER just going to flee. It was obvious to anyone who was not an idiot that she'd off Robert or Ned rather than risk Ned telling him OR have to leave her position of power. THAT is why he was naive. He expected that warning to save them but not harm HIM or his plans. You give Ned that flattering description, but don't tell us how he fits it. He doesn't. He trusts Littlefinger, just because his wife says they are friends even though they haven't seen each other since they were teenagers and he's been a politician in KL that entire time, playing the game. That is stupid AND naive. He warns Cersei, even after he knows she's willing to cuck the King, ie. commit treason. Expecting her to just give up and go home is stupid and naive. If she's committed it once, she can do it again.
I think you are right about our video. We had a limited time and had to pick and choose what to focus on. What was Ned's plan? I think we will make another video soon trying to figure that out. I don't believe he thought Cerci would be the kind of woman to run away. In the book (p.610), it is evident he had a plan. It did not work, but he had one. The point of this video was to suggest that his motivation was not Honour, but something else altogether.
@@TheStoryGibbons well even if he did, it wasn't a very good one, as it failed the moment he told her. Therefore he was still naive and stupid, both for believing whatever it was would work AND for warning her. And his motivation was clearly honour - ''I'll have no more dead children'' or whatever it is he said. If it wasn't honour, he'd have modified 'his plan' and taken Renly's advice and moved the second Robert died to have Cersei and her Kids in custody, but no, that 'lacked honour'.
@@DraconimLt I think you have some good points, and I think it is worth looking into it in depth. I think we will make a video about it, right after our House of the Dragon video. What ACTUALLY was Ned's plan? Not a-100% sure yet, but it fell apart when Cat lost Tyrion (p.610). I think we will take your points and read again Ned's chapters again to figure it out.
Your explanation of why Ned is an idiot presupposes some super power of Cersei's to "off Robert or Ned" at will. He gave the warning, because there was no rational option otherwise on the table for Cersei. Her murder of Robert was sheer dumb luck. It relied on him drinking enough to be impaired when he encountered the boar, which was a random occurrence that could not be predicted, much less timed, and even that barely worked, because he remained functional enough to kill it. A hair less drunk and Robert wins that fight easy, and comes home in triumph. A hair more drunk, and Robert is too incoherent to order his protectors away, or is so visibly drunk that they decide they can ignore his orders and whisk him away to safety. A lot more drunk, and he passes out before he can even find the boar. Cersei risked her life, her children's lives and her House's survival on buying a lottery ticket, and she happened to get phenomenally lucky. Cersei decided to play Russian Roulette with a fully loaded gun, but it happened to jam. Ned knew that there was no reasonably possible outcome where Cersei survives, so he told her, with the assurance of perfect safety. The idea that Robert was doomed the moment Cersei decided to kill him is from Varys' gaslighting Ned in the dungeon. Varys wants Ned to give up, because he wants the Lannisters to hang on to power for a little longer. He knows King Stannis, with the Starks & friends at his side, will utterly shred a Dothraki invasion and then crush Aegon & the Golden Company, so for his long term schemes to come to fruition, he needs Ned off the board and Joffrey on the throne. So he lies to Ned to make it seem like everything is all his fault and the only way to save his children from the consequence of his blunder is to confess, take the deal from the Lannisters and go to the Wall. Varys is full of shit, and Ned was sick and suffering privation, so it sounded reasonable to him.
@@DraconimLt It was not about honor, it was about children and their safety. Ned's entire adult life has consisted of a series of dishonorable but highly moral actions, such as hiding a Targaryen bastard from his friend and king, telling the whole world that he cheated on his wife, and raising his supposed bastard in her home, on a par with her children. He tells Arya it was okay to lie about Nymeria, he changes Robert's will and lies to him. Hell, there is nothing honorable about letting Cersei go! Honor demands Ned seek amend for pushing Bran, justice for her crimes, and obedience to his king. Honor requires Ned to inform Robert ASAP. Renly's plan was also bullshit, and only benefitted Renly. Renly was trying to get power himself, and did not want Stannis to take the throne. He wanted to carry out a coup that would make the leader (Ned) look like a rebel and traitor, just to eliminate his rivals at court. If Ned did all that, King Stannis would have to take notice, so Ned would be forced to side with Renly. It was the same with Littlefinger's plan. These things would only have compromised Ned and given no guarantees of safety. They would have left Ned square in the middle of a Tywin vs Stannis war, with both sides seeing him as the guy have to kill to get a hold of the throne.
Sadly Lucas thinks he is primarily an editor, other than his writing of dialogue his editing is pretty bad (damn good producer though). The films he made between 1971 through to 1983 where his best and all where edited and or re-edited (saved) by his wife. It's a bit sad and amusing that he is repeatedly attempting to re-edit (ruin) her editing of his films to prove himself right (or its just coincidence). Their divorce may or may not be a factor, only they know and we don't for sure but since his wife left Lucas's films have been crap. I don't hate prequels I hate being bored by boring films.
Bottom line..George was just too much in love with his toys..When he was limited on the original trilogy he had to use his brain and focus on story..But now that he could play within the digital world he went nuts and focused on that instead of good story and character.Plus none of it matched what was revealed in the original trilogy.
This week is 25 years since the release of episode 1. In addition, I don’t believe we made a hate video since we don’t make videos on movies and series we don’t like. This is just a presentation of two critical storytelling flaws that didn’t get enough attention.
I agree with you. I think people are wrong who assume Ned Stark was a fool and Littlefinger so smart. This is totally wrong. It was not stupidity or naivety which caused Ned to reveal the truth and face his own possible death at the hand of those he sought mercy from. In the end both Littlefinger and Ned Stark died, but before Ned died he left with a legacy, character, self-respect and people loving him, Littlefinger left with virtually nothing. So was Littlefinger really smarter than Ned Stark? I don't think so. I would actually argue that Ned was the smarter of the two.
Its only stupid in hindsight since Bobby dies. If Robert didnt get killed by the Boar (which noone could have foreseen) it wouldnt have mattered one bit warning Cersei and her kids
You are right. But I believe Cersei orchestrated the death of King Robert AFTER Ned told her of his intentions. I may be wrong about it, but that is what I remember from the books. King Robert went hunting before, Cersei sought his death after.
@@TheStoryGibbons even so many variables in her plot, would he get too drunk, would he meet a boar, would he still not beat it, would kingsguard not protect him etc
I just looked it up in the first book (p.611), @northernsupernova1. The problem with the wine, according to Varys, was not that Robert got drunk, but that the wine was poisoned. The boar just finished the job. This is why Varys tells Ned: "It was not wine that killed the king. It was your mercy."
We ARE working on a "Phantom Menace" video, so some words may have found their way into this video. As long as we are still talking about dragons and not the Force, I guess we are OK :)
This show is fantastic But for the love of god do not call this a reboot It literally picks up after the last episode There's nothing rebooty about this
Ned has a lot of trauma from seeing the Targaryen children dead after the sack of King's Landing. I think this is the main reason for warning Cersei. He doesn't want to see innocent children die again.
I think he can't help but think about how that could have been Jon. If he hadn't found Lyanna when he did, Jon may have been taken and eventually killed for being Rhaegar's son. It has to be traumatic just to think about how had Robert known the truth, he would have ripped baby Jon from Ned's arms and killed him without much thought
Yeah that's why every episode is getting better and why this series is BREAKING the internet..... With your critique, perhaps YOU should direct the show moving forward
Thank you for watching and for your comment. We love the show, and think it is the best thing Marvel had put out since End Game. In this channel we are talking ONLY about shows and stories we LOVE (that is why we will never make videos about Rebel Moon or Rings of Power). Episode 5 was epic. We did not see 8 yet, but heard it was out of this world. All we wanted was to explain why the show runners divided episodes 4 and 6 so unnaturally, and came to the conclusion that the show runners love of the source material led them to this decision. Hope that makes sense :)
By the way, you are always welcome to watch our video explaining why we love the show: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Ce7WIbCtz1g.html.
This makes more sense. I got so confused when watching the Netflix series because I am used to the plot from the ATLA animated series. So yes you fixed it 👍
Thank you for watching. The live action version actually had MORE minutes than the animated one. The problem was the amount of stories you could sensibly tell during those minutes (i.e. 22 short stories vs. 8 long ones). The stories they included from season 2 had different reasons. For example, they felt Azula would be a greater screen presence as a villain than general Zaho.
