This RU-vid channel is about super-efficient heating solutions for residential and commercial properties. This channel will show you how to design, install, and commission modern and ultra efficient heating systems using weather-compensated gas boilers, domestic hot water priority set ups, and renewable technology such as: air source, ground source, and lake source heat pumps, solar thermal and solar PV installations.
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Could I do away with the pump/mixer if I only had one heat curve (e.g. a bungalow or house with upstairs designed to work at low temps as well)? I have the same assembly as in the video but want to remove pump noise (and electricity cost). I have a 111 25kW combi so can I assume I can remove all external pumps.
@@UrbanPlumbers I think I understand what you mean. Given that my house heat loss is around 6-7kW at -5, and my boiler can modulate down to 2.5kW, I should be fine. It's also weather compensated so flow temps never go above 45 degrees C anyway
I had the 200W installed after you referred me to Alton & Ellis. Tommy did a great job and i'm happy to say that our house was 2-3 degrees warmer last winter compared to the winter before but we used the same amount of gas which is a testament to the efficiency (my old boiler was a G rated undercounter potterton). I'm going to have underfloor heating installed on my ground floor as a single zone to ~40m2 and need an output of 80W/m2. Unfortunately Tommy is all booked up with ASHP so a local guy is taking it on. He's been on to Viessmann technical support to figure out the setup with advanced weather comp . Hopefully it will all end happily - any top tips or gotchas let me know. I think they've recommended low loss headers rather than close coupled Ts - probably gonna cost me an arm and a leg in Viessmann branded gear!
You can't design any system correctly without calculating the heat loss. The 35kW boiler in this video is clearly there because the heat loss wasn't calculated.
thank you for the quality content over there,may i ask if the flow and return pipes to and from the manifold are 22mm pipes? did you use tee 22/28/22 right after the 3way valve? thank you
@@UrbanPlumbers well the cost b/w 22 and 28 mm pipes is something :D i was asking just for personal interest. in my home im doing the same work just using 2 fancoils instead of 2 ufh manifold and i was looking forward to see where to reduce the diameter of the main flow pipe if right after the 3way valve with a tee 22/28/22 and that might just be the best solution i got to save some money instead of going full 28mm. thank you again
How do I find someone who can upgrade my current underfloor heating set up in this way in north London. Vaillant ecotec 635, Megaflo underfloor heating on ground floor, cast iron radiators on the first floor.
Just wanted to say thank you very much for your videos. Ive managed to set my gravity central heating up at home as a hot water priority system thanks to information i got from your videos that wasn't even in the boiler manual (SL2 on an ideal boiler ignoring flow temperature setting). Education on this subject is severely lacking in the UK and we desparately need more people like yourself spreading the good word.
My under floor heating is permanently on boiler running continuously even when not calling for heat. actuter valves on the off position.is that a wiring problem incorrectly wired?
most of the problems seen here appear to be basic tick box/cheat sheet to do basic stuff correct. how they got the things so basically wrong is gobsmacking.
Great video- but I imagine it’s with additional caveats. What about preventing cycling? If you don’t have a minimal volume of water in the pipes and rads (usually 30l plus) when temperatures are milder - the compressor will be stop starting rapidly, the hp unable to operate long enough to get in to peek state before being switched off. Resulting in higher running costs and significant lifetime reduction on the compressor- which is extremely expensive to replace.
@@UrbanPlumbers Having a minimal volume of water in a heat pump system can contribute to more frequent cycling of the compressor. The low thermal mass provided by just the water in the internal coils and piping leads to quicker temperature changes, triggering the heat pump to turn on and off more often. Increasing the water volume, such as by adding a buffer tank, provides greater thermal mass that helps smooth out temperature fluctuations and prevents rapid cycling. While there is an optimal water volume that balances thermal mass and practical considerations, generally a larger water volume is better for reducing cycling in a heat pump system. Is my understanding of why manufacturers are pushing it or have a minimum water content in schematics. Happy to be corrected.
@MrMikeberry0 only on a first cycle - I have tested this extensively - if running open loop with no zoning this is almost never a problem. Heat pumps cycle on power most of the time and not lack of volume
@@UrbanPlumbers I imagine that your testing has worked precisely because you have done open loop, no zoning, removing trvs so the water volume in the pipes and rads combined would exceed the 30 litres in the majority of cases. Potential damage to the compressors though maybe unknown at this point. Not many open loop (that dont meet the minimum water content) installations have been in place for 15 years. My concern is that if we are not precise with this - the system may work - but the compressor will wear out and only last half its potential lifespan. I’m new to heat pumps 👍
Does anyone know what the requirements are for the isolator for the monobloc - I am wondering if I can install the electrical isolator switch in my utility (inside the house) rather than beside the monobloc on the outside
8mm copper - 50 years old. Sounds like it could be made to work, but probably better replumbing before we get a heat pump? Is a manifold set up better for heat pumps (all radiators no underfloor heating). I could essentially replace all the existing runs but upsize the pipes from 22/8 to 28/15mm. Plastic pipe so no joints between manifold and rads?
Hey Szymon, great work. Can I ask what sort of wall panels have you used in your plant room? All the plumbing looks mint on the black background. Is it some kind of plywood?
I believe you are using wrong wiring nest. For mixed+non-mixed circuits needs to be used according to Vaillant documentation VR-70, not VR-71 and the NTC should not be on the non-mixed circuit but on the hydraulic separator (sysflow). Vaillant support is sometimes saying craps about having VR-70 only accessory to VR-71 because VR-71 is powering eBus while VR-70 not but in practice the eBUS bus gets power for other eBUS powered devices from boiler (VR-70 doesn't drain any power from eBUS - it has it's own power supply). I am using VR-70 even with single non-mixed circuit (and no other mixed circuit) separated from heater by plate heat exchanger where the sysflow is on secondary hot output from plate exchanger so my VRC 720f can control the real flow going to the non-mixed circuit where is variable flow rate from magna3 autoadapt pump. In my case the vr-70 is used only for the sysflow sensor. To be honest, the vaillant control are so poor in giving monitoring feedback that I am using additional temperature DS18B20 sensors with ShellyAddon to monitor boiler output & return and plate exchanger output & return so I can see whether primary flow from the boiler is optimal or not. I am thinking to put extra controller for pwm modulation of the primary pump (using Protherm Medved KKS 48 kW system boiler with external pump - rebranded Vaillant Ecovit PRO VKK 486/5) which would be based on temperature differences on primary and secondary sides of plate exchanger adjusting flow rate in the boiler circuit to have flow rates equal on both sides. It is unfortunate that there is no reasonably priced controller which would synchronise boiler pump flow rate with sum of flow rates on distribution circuits. Reason why I am using plate exchanger is due to pressure difference - boiler side 2 BAR, distribution side 4.5 BAR (30m tall building). Also I don't like much Vaillant's VR 921, it provides so little information - don't understand why it can not give ionisation current and can not configure remotely heat curve.
In my own house I have a 40 l buffer with 7 kW Vaillant. 22 mm primaries for 5 m with all rads piped in 15 mm. Would the system perform better without the buffer ?
Hello sir, I have a two story house, and two nest thermostat on each floor. The second floor thermostat works just fine on cooling, however if I only turn on the first floor, the AC unit is keep short cycling but fan will stay on. They are wired exactly the same, but the second floor works fine but first floor keep short cycling. When I turn on both, it also works fine. And yes I have a zoning system too. Thanks in advance!
I can’t seem to see expansion vessel as a part of your setup nor can I see it on the schematics. Am I right to assume expansion vessel is still necessary in this type of system ? Thank you very much. Absolutely enjoy your videos. One of my favourite channels on RU-vid.
We would love a heat pump. But our house is a mid terrace 1890 property with a total width of 15 ft. The back of the house is an extension with all glass bifold doors, so can't install it there. Plus no room for a water tank, hence our current combi gas boiler. If the heat pump could go in the shed at the bottom of the garden it could work, but at nearly 50ft away don't think that will work. Looks like we're staying with gas.
I have an ecoTec Plus 832 combi fitted October 22 with the flap. The installer fitted the Hive Mini. Please can you explain if I would be better swapping it for a Vaillant Hive equivalent and if so what type? They never said anything at the time about it not being compliant or not good :( thank you.
Ha my guess was a of COP 3.8. It seem like a lot of people are achieving this kind of level with a well managed heat pump during those really cold periods.
Is that 32mm OD or ID or outside diameter or inside diameter? Maybe some 2 to 3 mm thick copper pipe would help retain the heat. Copper is a good heat conductor copper pipe all the way
I heat my entire house and apartment with a Viessmann Vitodens 100-W. These are two zones and one zone for our super store hot water. I feel sorry for our gas company because they do not make much money on us. We live in New England and it gets cold. My boiler runs at about 98% efficiency with no heat loss. The only time it makes noise is when the lighter needs replacing after about 5 years or so. The unit is in the basement and when it is running, it clicks lightly, that's about it!
Would be great to see an existing gas boiler S Plan, Y Plan or S Plan Plus system optimised the @HeatGeek way to show how badly the industry is wasting gas and inefficient systems still being deployed
Is the external orientation of the heat pump crucial to the efficiency? In my house the options are limited and the free space is only on the north side. Thank you!! Great video as always.
Could you tell me more about how you achieved such a high DHW COP? (Currently shown as 4.6) Looks like a Joule cyclone cylinder, and I guess you use the Vaillant Arotherm plus 5 kW in Eco mode? What size cylinder is it? What's the smaller tank, I thought you said you didn't use a buffer?
Currently using Newark 6m2 coil cylinder that replaced the Joule. Water heated to 44c using 0c offset, eco setting and also quiet mode to further drop heat pump power.
Hi Szymon. We've just bought an UFH system from Wunda (I know, I know. I was a fool!). After watching and learning from this video I've returned the actuators and control box, and bought a Vaillent SensoComfort which will work properly with our modern Vaillent Combi Boiler by running much lower temperatures and using weather compensation. QUESTION - Do I also need to remove the blending valve at the manifold? Or is it possible to close it tight to prevent blending? 2 bed Bungalow, 65sqm, UFH only (no radiators). And looking to install heat pump in the near future.
Thinking of using this set up on my own system. Large 3 bed flat all underfloor. Going to try using the new Navien ncb 700 with navicirc, 1:10 ratio , so one of the best modulations in a combi i belive and also a very compact boiler....questionable heat exchanger leaks , but have been assured that if it leaks witin the 12 year warrenty they will replace it,no questions asked obviously must be serviced ect.....anyway i digress. Runs 3 showers so need for the cylinder anymore. All Towel rads 3 in total will all run off underfloor manifold and be controlled seperatly with 2 ports and seperate timers for summer towel heating individually they will run on under floor temp at (low temp) as there only heating towels obviously. Boiler will run of weather comp. Do you think this set up would work , i dont think ill need a dedicated wireing center to control different temps as all will be low temp udf and t rads and the boiler will switch between heating and hotwater using its own divertor internally. Provided i have enough head on the pump in the boiler i think i could get away without manifold pump. If not i could add the pump to it after. The pumps might fight against each other should i add the kimbo header then to counteract this. Whats your thoughts and would also appreciate anyone elses view that really understand these types of installs as you say its a new way of thinking and majority of udf heating companies wont have a clue. They just want to sell you more kit. Wanted to try this a few years ago on another of my own developments but was a bit tentative in doing so. Thanks for making this video and explaining it so well. Think i met you on kimbos course a couple of years back. Just to add ill have one stat for udf temp and time control potioned in the flat and as the boiler is just ticking over ill heat the whole flat and not zone at all at a nice 21 or 22 degrees when im home. If im not there, its off,as it wont be a, in screed system. It'll be overlay underfloor so very responsive 20 minutes and floors are warm and can feel the heat. Advice much appriciated.
Excellent educational video. How do you go about matching the flow rates on both sides. As in the ciculator in the outdoor unit modulates up and down based on demand and the indooor one you have wont? Have you ever thought of buying the same circulator that the outdoor unit has and using that as the post buffer circulator and then using the same pwm control that the outdoor unit uses to also control the pwm on the post buffer circulator?
