Mechatron I tried to get as a physical copy for over three years and didn't get much help from Free League, so I gave up on the system and the company.
If I can add a few more sources for people who want to immerse themselves in the legends: 'Merlin'--a TV show based around the characters when they were young, watching them grow into their famous roles. 'The Warlord Chroniclse'--a trilogy of books ('The Winter King', 'Enemy of God', and 'Excalibur') by Bernard Cornwell, which grounds the story in more realistic terms, and has some of the best battles ever written. 'The Idylls of the King' by Alfred, Lord Tennyson--an epic poem that covers the stories and really creates a mythical feel. Enjoy! (And thanks as usual for the video, Dave)
Actually Pendragon doesn't depict 6th century Britain and Britanny, but an epitomized assumption of what an idealized knighthood should look like from a late medieval poets perspective. 6th century didn't even have knights at all. Tournaments, Platemail, heraldry, falconry, curtly love had not been invented yet, and the core books explicitly state that. Pendragon is Renaissance knighthood projected onto dark ages Britain, it is as stated above kind of a Malory hack... A more medieval fantasy Arthurian setting may be Mythic Britain, and it can be easily adapted to Pendragon. I love Pendragon very much, it was my 2nd rpg I ever played in the early 90s. But players should always have in mind that it is a literacy adaption. Much in the game is a severe anachronism, some things become a thing centuries, almost a millennium later. This doesn't matter, it's is a really great game as is. It's just not about 6th century Britain, mythic Britain for Mythras isn't either though ;) both are fantasy rpgs...
In terms of shows/inspiration, I'm kinda hopeful about The Pendragon Cycle - coming out late this year or early next. I loved those books as a kid (read in middle school) and the behind-the-scenes about it look solid. Still too early to say - but it could be good. The series starts even before Merlin was born - the first book is about Merlin's parents. Lawhead added a whole Atlantis vibe to the start - which fit surprisingly well.
Lev Grossman's The Bright Sword just came out this summer and is an astonishing new Arthurian novel. Whether or not you liked the Magicians novels (I loved them), if you're interested in Arthurian stories, this is a run-don't-walk recommendation. Very comparable to The Green Knight and one of the best books I've read ever.
If I remember correctly, the first printing of the core rulebook (which I have) was in need to a fairly substantial errata due to errors, typos, and some layout issues that while fixed in future printing and pdf means that if you get one of those books you will either need the errata on a phone, nearby computer, or printed out with your book. If you get the book in physical, I have heard that some of the first printings are out there and getting shipped out to those that don't know this or are uniformed.
I picked up the Pendragon 6e core book when it came out. It's an impressive piece of work that I will never run; the system itself is not supremely difficult but I could not for the life of me figure out how to run a Pendragon from that book alone. Moreover, IMO, that core book did not provide enough tools for the GM. It feels like it has to be paired up with the starter box or with some sort of GM box.
Chaosium's quickstart for Rivers of London also uses a solo choose your own adventure to teach the rules. It really reminds me of the old D&D basic box's solo play intro adventure, which was my intro to ttrpgs. Honestly, I wish more games did this.
Modiphius churn out a lot of franchise RPGs & it feels very much like an automated money making exercise. Which is why I don't consider any of their products. Some of the games they make are for things I like - but I wont buy them because I feel they are produced as a trend exploting strategy rather than with love. Maybe my perception is wrong? I also wonder this about Free League these days, but I have a few of their products & they seem very different & made with a great deal of passion.
Great work, Dave. Another vote for full rulebook video. I'm very curious how the overall framework has been developed in this last edition. Particularly in terms of generational play. Additionally, another video idea is the Gauntlets The Between, which is having a Backerkit text release now
I really don't think the Legend of the Sword movie would be a good fit for inspiration here. Personally, I find it pretty bad, but that's subjective; what's important is that it has a completely different, non-knightly, tone, and it changes so much about the legend's story that it's no longer recognizable. Instead, I would HIGHLY recommend the old Merlin two-part mini-series, with Sam Neil as the titular character. Good adaptation, great actors, fantastic music; some of the effects did age quite poorly, but others still look really neat, and the other good points of the film really outweigh the bad. And, honestly, I'd throw the Knight's Tale into the mix. It's just charming, and it does have some knightly vibes. If you can put Monty Python on the list, then I can recommend Knight's Tale=\)
Surprised you didn't mention Merlin as a TV source. Probably not the most accurate but was definitely of great interest to me. That said the actual Pendragon game probably isn't. Far to grounded in real medieval history, not enough fantasy for my tastes.
I totally had it in the video but I used footage from the show and was told to cut it from the video or have the whole thing demonetized. And I didn't have enough time to delist, re-edit and repost. So yeah.
@@DaveThaumavore I thought I heard a snippet of the name Merlin right before it cuts to the next reference. Yeah totally understand why you had to remove it, though hate that you had to remove it to begin with. Surely lists like the one you included would drive interest in old TV media. :( :( Great video overall though.
I would love to hear your further thoughts on the full rules, and even the campaign, as I think this is a special and significant release in TTRPG history.
From what I read online the core book is more of a player guide without gm tools. I wanted to ask if anyone knows if the core book atleast contains everything from the box set (rules wise)
Free League failed me multiple times to get a physical copy of my book, the last time taking my money, then cancelling my order without explanation over a month later to tell me it was out of stock at time of order. So they sat on my money for something they knew they could not deliver for over a month without so much as a sorry, just a canceled order. When I reached out to them, then they replied with a half-hearted sorry, but could not explain why it took them so long to respond. I have not dealt with them since.
@@WinterIgnatius they fixed their Out Of Stock issues on their website, but can understand not wanting to risk getting stung again. Sorry to hear about your experiences.
@@DaveThaumavore This was years agp and I long ago got a PDF copy, but wanted a physical one as it was advertised as a core supplement. Just felt jilted by the whole situation over the course of three years.
I've been playing Pendragon for three years, recently started a new campaign with the new 6e materials. The player who picked Dame Lynelle got some ridiculously good rolls. She cut King Lot's sword in half (got a critical success while he got a fumble-I pulled back the old 5.2e rule for this particular situation), killed King Nym in 511, and killed King Uriens in 512 (not in the adventure in the book; I put an extra battle in the campaign). She knighted Arthur, and she's now married to Arthur's brother and has two kids with him, but she's in love with the famous knight Sir Hervis de Revels. Our Sir Avalloc was a loyal friend to the party, but got himself cut in half vertically when they went to raid the Saxons. Our Sir Evrain seduced a woman with Chaste 21 in the first session, which then led to him being accused of rape by Princess Guinevere. The woman's father then challenged him to a duel of honor, which he accepted and lost horribly, leading to everyone believing the accusation to be true. The next year, he was captured by King Nym, and when Dame Lynelle came to rescue him, he fought unarmored against six knights, taking many injuries, but killing them all before succumbing to his injuries. Our Cadwallon fumbled a Trusting roll when Arthur drew the sword in the stone and developed a Jealousy Obsession for Arthur, refusing to be knighted by him and refusing to join his household knights. Instead, he joined the household of one of Arthur's discontented lords who will cause major problems for Arthur in the Conquest Period. Altogether it's going wonderfully and we're having a blast. This is my third time running Pendragon, and hopefully will be my first time reaching the end of the campaign! Please do review the other two books. Would love to hear your thoughts!
I want to add Bernard Cornwell’s Warlord Trilogy for a very realistic look at virtues and vices of knights and no magic. There’s also been a recent series but I haven’t seen it.
Since you mentioned The Green Knight, A24 actually made a Green Knight rpg that seems to take at least a little inspiration from Pendragon. Might be worth checking out on here sometime
There is going to be rules for Magicians. A book called Codex Mirabilis is going to be talking about having "Side Character" Magicians, almost player run NPCs with more compressed rules that can do crazy stuff like magic and miracles. The healing rate is murder, so be ready to keep non-player healers around and have the Player Knights ready with replacements or alternatives for their presence in a game. Dont get too attached - best advice from me. I get the Combat gripes, and I might wonder if there is a good hack out there for more streamlined combat. 5e Pendragon had less of it, but I don't know if it is enough.
I hope that people get more excited about this game, it seems incredible. Seems being the key word, the released core book is bare bones to put it kindly. Probably my only RPG purchasing regret, it's filled with sections that basically say we will add the rules in another book. Which would be fine if it was a GM Guide, but I think I've counted about 4 different unpublished books that have been referenced in the first 100 pages. Comparing it to Runequest, another core book that was released by the same company, its 150 pages of less content and it shows. Something is wrong if the family history in a Pendragon game feels skimmed over compared to Runequest. The new edition has a tagline that basically says "be the knight that you want". The core book allows you to build a grand total of... 1 culture and 1 region in that culture. I really wanted to like Pendragon 6E but there won't be much to like for years. So buyer beware.
Your video on Pirate Borg made me spend money on Kickstarter and I'm eyeing Pendragon since a couple of months. My wallet won't agree with my demand but please: review the Core Rulebook and The Grey Knight.
The Pendragon Starter Set is the most railroaded TTRPG I have ever played. • Rules scattered among ALL booklets and books. There are rules, that are ONLY explained in solo-adventure. So you MUST play it to get them. • Combat is so complex and has so many options, but you will literally just hit your opponent. And btw, you are allowed to fight ONLY 1vs1. Cause fighting 2 knights against 1 knight is dishonor. And when you fight against archers - you either just suffer damage, or run away (I understand the realism, but not the game idea here). • Combat event cards are strange af. If your leader fails the Strategy roll, you will miss the special interesting encounters and events. And btw, every battle in this starter is scripted. You fight JUST for glory, you have no option to influence the outcome of the battle. You either participate or skip it - that's the whole point of battles. • Adventures start pretty good, but god damn, the railroad takes it all from you. One time the game gives you two options - to reject the bandit's offer or to accept it and attack some caravans. You know what? If you choose to raid, you will lose the scenario and fail your main mission. And not because you did something dishonest. Hell no. You fail because it takes WAY TOO MUCH TIME to get treasures and split them. The most stupid nonsense I have ever read. Don't get me wrong. I understand that this is not even close to my culture. I really wanted to get to know the Arthurian legends, theme and the whole idea. But the game looks like you just recreating some events and not even taking the main part in them. You are just a viewer, visitor, or guest, but never the main hero. From the designer's perspective, authors don't even try to teach you to run Pendragon. They tell you that you have one right option, while others are not even considered.
That... in the starter set, that is kinda true. But the dice can carry you forward in the battles. I had players become big damn heroes. The scripts of the battle only keeping them down once in a while. Having the script win will often draw the players into the middle of the fight. I think you *kinda* missed some of the points about the archers. The Starter Set never gets around to describe it, but the full Great Pendragon Campaign is supposed to have a discussion of the variables to either keep players in their own level or have thrust direct into the big events where they can replace the canon characters... except Arthur, Guinevere and Lancelot. The Adventures are written by people who wrote adventures in the 80ies, I personally change a lot when I run this game.
@@Growls I understand that battles are all about a chance to get famous. But for players, it's like an XP-grinding mechanic. Either do it or skip it if you want to play this character tomorrow. So this is the first turn event on the second day of The Battle of Bedegraine. Archery exchange. If the Player‑knights are part of this Event (i.e., if the Intensity roll is a success), select the Archers encounter automatically, but with no chance to engage the enemy. (The conroi commander’s Battle roll determines how many rounds of arrow barrage the knights must endure, regardless of chosen posture, as detailed under “Encountering Missile Weapons” in the Battle rules." You just suffer attacks. Imagine your hero can die cause you get this stuff in the first turn of battle. These moments of Pendragon I can't understand. They are much beyond my mind.
I mean it's a game that kind of expects you to be bought into what it's doing. A lot of your character's major decisions will be guided by die rolls, but then people being guided by their virtues and vices are very much a part of the genre. I do think Pendragon is not really a good way to get into it from an outside perspective, and the starter set is more about getting you into playing the game more than introducing you to Arthurian type fantasy.
"Knights are not supposed to use bows and crossbows" would be a great rule, if there wasn't a pregen character (Dame Damura), that specialises on Bows and described as "Pick this character if you wish to play a knight adept with bow and arrow". Imagine player's face, when he picks Damura and can't even play her, cause her specialisation dishonores him.
She'll excel as a Hunter Knight, where they can use bows and quest for special animals on hunts for glory. Not sure if that distinction is covered in the Starter Set but the scenarios give opportunity for her to get glory this way. In knightly combat she'll have to rely on the knightly arms.
@@pnptcn For the purpose of gaining glory from hunting you have a skil - "Hunting". Which is 10 for Damura. Bow is a combat skill and she has 15 ranks in it. So it doesn't work this way. She is primarily bowman and only then not a bad hunter.
@@sonder_ua The Hunting roll is to find and run your quarry down. Once you find the quarry you have to engage it with some kind of weapon to bring it down. I suppose you can skip this part if you find the combat system too wargamey and resolve the hunt in a single roll if you like.
You are not supposed to use Ranged Weapons against knights. Saxons, Picts and suchlike can be shot with a bow, but it is not as Glorious (You get a 10th of the Glory) and monsters can be hunted and defeated - Hunting is usually used to track things, so she is amazing hitting stags once it's found.
@@pnptcn Didnt see such rules in starter. Hunting described as - To find the results of a common hunt, simply roll Hunting against the quarry’s Avoidance value. Alternatively there is Falconry. Since there are two of these skills, it is very strange to force player roll another Bow check. Two checks on a single hunt task is smth strange.
Dang, I missed the Backer Kit funding campaign. At least I was able to pre-order! This sounds like just the thing I need to get over the "I'm just not that into D&D5e anymore" rut.
Great review. I watched the glass canon podcast play it this gencon and had to grab a copy of the core book - it's got a lot of great content. Combat does at times feel like a different game because of its wargaminess - it feels like I'm required to have the combat pages open 24/7 when playing it. It is however, very fun.
Love your reviews - properly comprehensive and entertaining at the same time. Which is why, having decided this one’s not for me, I feel like I’ve made an informed choice. Thanks!
Chaosium have designed some cracking games. BRP could be the no. 1 rpg, if they only worked out how to mass-market themselves.. (and they produced a dedicated Fantasy setting similar to other rpgs with wizards, rangers, paladins etc.)
