the people commenting on the way that David giggles saying it's out of nervousness is so funny. He can barely keep it together because Peter Thiel keeps saying exactly the wrong things and thus supporting David's position
Since 2008, we have been living in a system of "Socialism for the rich, and austerity for everyone else". This is not my opinion, this is an empirical fact, these are the words of academic yanis varoufakis. It cannot be argued, hairs cannot be split. Deal with it. We're already in socialism, just not the kind that actually helps society.
Don’t quit your day job. Your career writing fiction (claiming Graeber is comparable to a 17-year old, etc) is really bad. And if you care so much about delusional losers, wait till I tell you about Peter Thiel! You ain’t foolin’ NOBODY. Log off and renew your library card. You’re in too deep, and you can’t handle it. Sorry boutcha.
This is all superficial. The real question is, what secret military technologies that could transform our lives have the powers that be been suppressing? It's moronic to dismiss this idea as a "conspiracy theory".
Thiel speaks like the new Technofeudalists, who define the basic premisde of psychopathy - manipulation and complete control. Thiel admitted he wsd on a 'supercharged courser and became a lawyer for six months in order to keep his 'underhanded' actions stifled through owning a buildoig full of lawyers in DC and a slough of slimy K-Street lobbyists well equipped with tax deductible 'business dinners'. PALANTIR....Did you seer the scowl come over the psychopath's ugly fascist face? Psaypal was "rentier" all the way. It had no ATOMS as Thiel called it. No just, he dealt in electrons within a silicon chip doped to handle a binary 0 and 1 system. That was his billionaire-making PRODUCT....He was born PRIVILEGED along with the MUSKRAT...So was Trump, He tried creating a "university" before Thiel had the idea of stealing young entrepreneurs' ideas. Try and sue them, eh?...T oo bad the world money markets will crash. "Stock Buybacks" is the real inflation. You pump your company's money in to stock buybacks, it drives your share prices up. HUGE BONUS for the Corp Execs who get paid in stick options.. Thiel is a rich squirmy leech who was born a scion at the beginning of the Technofeudal Age, or Dark Tech Age...Creativity is dead. Artificial reproduction of encoded culture is "moving minds" but bodies of flesh grow stale and lethargic..NIHILISM....ENNUI....ALIENATION, ISOLATION. CLIMATE DESTRUCTION AND ENDLESS RESOURCE WARS....THAT'S PROGRESS!... No wonder we're "Amusing Ourselves To Death" (Neil Postman).. Trolling the Internet is the world's newest pastime. "Too much man. too much"
Interesting to hear Peter Thiel talk about not wanting to change politics or think political change is important, when he's literally bank rolling some of the most right wing politicians running for office 😂
This is so good! i'm glad I found this, I respect both these guys perspectives and love their books. They differ philosophically, sometimes in polarising ways, yet are both so intelligent and valuable. Such a mature discussion and glad they can sit and enjoy each other's presence enough to not cut each other off and throw in low comments on each others character (mostly). Graeber, I miss you.
Just another technocrat saying things like "political atheist", some weird discourse of "going against the grain" even though the host and Graeber clearly pushed him in a humiliating corner when they brought up Palantir, a literal collaboration with the most estabilished of all forces in the country. The complete unprepared fool then goes on citing Airbnb and online schooling as things that will "really change our society". I know he is only a businessman protecting his business and all, but its always depressing to actually listen to the representatives of this side of the political spectrum and see that they have embrassingly little to no substance. Thank you for posting this conversation in video! I listened to the podcast, but watching Thiel's stressed face and Graber's relaxed and joking disposition while hammering him down intellectually made my week.
Thiel pretending David simply proposed to print more money "so there is more money for everyone" says so much more about Thiel than David, loool. Can he be that stupid to think David is that stupid? But even if this is a sneaky-snake-trick once again: This is still ridiculous for a sneaky trick! Such a bucket-head move and some trolls here in comments say Thiel dominated the debate. omg, this is comedy my friends!
26:30 here is an example how Thiel "debates" saying: "get someone to the moon... with a decentralized chaotic system" <---- see how he sneaks "chaotic" simply into it, just casually implicating decentralized = chaotic. loool what a sneaky sneakson. Thiels vibe in this video reminds me of Zuck, as if they were twins. tf. and is his point basically "let billionairs rome as free as possible, just relax, they will do the good stuff eeeermmm like pAypAL - did I say PaYPaL enough times???" looool
@Graeberwave was he targeted by rw forces over the years? Did his name appear on lists passed around social media? Did other prominent leftwing academics also die in and around the same period? Did austerity impact him in anyway? Or the cancelling and stigma he received have a impact on his general wellbeing?? There are questions. But it may not be as nefarious as I've suggested.
@@DJWESG1I don't know the answers to your questions but he died of what was putatively a rare condition that in terms of physiologically what happened could possibly have also been caused by poisoning, and I do know he was an effective and extreme disruptor of the intellectual world view common to the age and definitely a major threat to the ruling class and economic order. He was clearly getting closer and closer to transformational and revolutionary theory from all of his fruitful analysis over the years
@@antonroux6737 Death due to Covid related implications are rare because the disease is new. Don't just toss fuel into this conspiracy without having a solid base for it.
46:17 predictably Thiel talking about Silicon Valley being the leader in innovation and creating new social forms in our society aged poorly. Not only is big tech not spurning the state its tech bros pretend to hate, it's complicit with the machine of oppression and surveillance. Big tech and tech bro "freedom" to do whatever they want aren't the vanguards, they can only reinvent forms of oppression and exploitation because they are still capitalist institutions with the logic that entails.
@@SignOfCalm if you don’t know about why Thiel is a problem and not to be adulated, then I strongly advise you log off the internet and renew your library card.
@@SignOfCalm and I’m bitter? Sure. I can’t be? You’re the taste police? Meanwhile Thiel is a crypto fascist, and backs such candidates clamoring for said fascism. There is no way you haven’t seen that in your algorithm given your adulation of him. The headlines cover his activities. But since we play who is tasting what, let me say what your taste is.
I think the phrase 'outside job' helps us better. Flipping Alex Jones on his head, we take it a little further and ask what sort of relationship did Jones have with Stone in the late 90s, and if the 'deep state' and the 'marxists' are actually a thing, and maybe it's simply the republican party, bannon and Co, with a little help from Blackwater.
And this is what happens one you take two experts in one field and get them to talk about something they know nothing about. Both of them fail to understand that engineering challenges have intrinsic difficulties you won't get over by rearranging the management structure and sources of funding. The Manhattan project and the moon landings were enormous projects but they're nothing compared with the things Graeber expected to be a reality by the 2000's. An immortality pill is a ridiculous idea unless we're counting some sort of army of nanobots that can restore human cells and that would require the very "bit technology" he sort of dismissed to go way beyond what we're currently capalbe of. Teleportation is a physical impossibility as far as our models go. Building a city on Mars could be possible if we really dedicated ourselves to it, but what the hell do we want a city on Mars for?
The point is just flying way over your head. Peter thiel is not an expert. He is a guy with a lot of money (who boosts far right candidates no less). You should log off and renew your library card.
@@Graeberwave ironically you missed the point of my comment completely and went for nitpicking on the detail of whether we should call Thiel an expert investor instead of addressing the actual reason for my comment: neither of them knows anything about how science and engineering progress or how they are impacted by economics and politics.
@@davidp.7620 in the Utopia of Rules (a book he wrote), the whole thing is about the socioeconomic processes that affect technology, innovation, etc. You knew so much before. Log off and renew your library card.
@@Graeberwave he addresses those points (in fact both of them do) but they get almost anything wrong because they know nothing about science or engineering. Neither man has ever worked in any engineering project and they make this fact obvious from the very first intervention. Basically the stuff they think we should have gotten already but the "system" has prevented us from it can be classified into thee groups: - Physical impossibilities: ideas as ridiculous as teleportation or an immortality pill. - Things that would require much more development in the "bit technologies" they keep dismissing like curing cancer. By the way, their ignorance is clearly shown by the fact that they talk about "curing cancer" as one single challenge instead of a diverse group of different problems we'd need to solve for different types of cancer. - Projects we can already do but have no reason to. We can already send robots to Mars and start building there, we just don't want to spend an enormous amount of resources that are better spent somewhere else. There are problems you just can't solve by wanting it very badly. Science is not politics. Just because something is written on a book it doesn't mean it's automatically true. If the points Graeber makes on "The Utopia of Rules" are similar to the ones he made here, then the book is a very bad one and not worth the readers' time, no matter how many condescending notes you want to end your comments with.
