Really good pairing there!

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware It is and Intel just put out a new bios as they have dug deeper and discovered other reasons to the failure problem. That makes me feel better ☺ Oh I will sub I forgot to to.

@@OzzyFan80 Thanks so much! Really appreciate it! As to the bios/microcode update, yeah, hopefully that will solve any future instability issues; however, still step carefully. I have a 13700K in my rig and I updated, but also am keeping an eye on it for the foreseeable future. I figure we won't know 100% for sure that this has fixed the issue for several months. I'll keep an eye out for news for it though.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware yeah that is the bummer thing is we won't know. I know I look at the news often and get the Intel news letter. I have my monitors going and before the fix came out I shut my PC down on hot days. Looking forward to future vids from you.

I get that! I don't plan on selling mine at any time in the future. Not so much as for the value of it, but for the sentimentality of it! There are still some good deals on the used market selling as gpus or even pcs if you ever decide you want it again :)

Thanks I got a lucky find indeed! Yeah, EVGA + 1080 Ti= ultimate nostalgia. Sad to know that it was in bad condition, hope the refurbishment went well and you got a great price for it!

Great question! And a tough one too. On the one hand the 6800 xt (not to be confused with the regular 6800) is around 30% higher in price at about a 20% uplift from the 6750 xt which is at a historical low in price right now. On the other hand, the 6800 xt has 16 GB of vram vs. the 12 GB on the 6750 xt. But, as I said in the video, I don't believe the vram is as important as some people would like to think it is. From a pure dollar perspective, I'd have to side with the 6750 xt. But if the 6800 xt price comes down any time soon, by about $30 to $40, then it's a foot race and I think the vram would be your deciding factor in that scenario.

LOL! Yeah, it will be interesting to see what the TDP and thermal limits are on the 50 series upon rollout. They and the AIB partners have been getting better at cooling at higher levels, but at a high cost to the consumers. So, as long as someone goes with a mATX or ATX case, with a decent amount of properly integrated fans, cooling shouldn't be a problem. That being said, the speculation is that the power draw for the upper end cards will be 450W-500W at a minimum. So if you get a 5090 or 5080, I'd think your safest bet, depending on the build, is to start at 850W PSU as a minimum, but probably better off at 1000W and above.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware I went with a 1000W when I bought my 4090. It is a tight fit with 4090 and AIO 360 in a Mid tower. I use a lot less power than stock from 950mv undervolt.

@scipher99 Yeah, I did a similar thing, went with a 1200W Corsair Shift with my 4090, with the same undervolt as you. I went with the 1200W for two reasons: 1. To have plenty of headroom and 2. In case I decide to get a 5090 (depending on price and performance and availability) and in case I wanted to take a serious look at the arrow lake cpus if/when they come out.

Their prices are better, no doubt. Their main downside is that historically they've had game driver support issues and have trailed behind DLSS with FSR results, though they have been improving. There's also the perception that NVIDIA is better or has more consumer confidence, which is why NVIDIA still has about a 85% market share.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware not necessarily AMD drivers worked perfectly well it’s just people don’t understand how their drivers work I’ve been in AMD graphics card

Thanks for your experience with it! Yeah, as I said in the video, I don't plan on doing much more with it (I have a 4090 in my main rig). I got it mostly as a conversational and show piece :)

Lucky guess? ;)

I don't know that it belongs in the same tier as its performance is more limiting than the 1080 Ti by a long ways; however, the RX 580 8GB should still be a conversation to have as it is still a somewhat relevant card, specifically in the budget build arena. Unfortunately though, there will no longer be any driver support for that card, moving forward.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware I meant as in bang for your Buck and how long it lasted

Great points! I agree that the pricing model for the cards is a problem for sure. As to the card being a goat, it isn't the straight fps performance that makes it the goat, it's the fact that the card came out 8 years ago and can still compete in the current market of gpus and at a fraction of the cost of those current gpus.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware exactly, and specifically it can still compete because there are cards that hit that same performance levels you got your 1080 ti, 2070 super 2080 2080 super rtx 3060, and if you at these cards on ebay with the sold and completed items filters all these cards go for roughly the same price used and working. nvidia has been stagnant for the most part besides the 4090, and while AMD has made progress they were behind, and still haven't really caught up to nvidia completely. and this is what I mean by it's not really the goat gpu, it was the flagship gpu of it's generation with almost the complete die, usually those kind of cards tend to have really good staying power, what we should really be looking forward to is is the 4090 with it's 24gb of vram still going to be usuable in 5 to 6 years and I think it'll be more than chugging along to be fair. Mind you the 4090 isn't even the full die, which is just insane.

Yep, some say they didn't know what they had released until it was too late.

Nice! It's an awesome card!

That's a good point and another excuse for me to make another spreadsheet!! If I get enough people asking for that kind of comparison, I'd be more than happy to put something together, maybe even go back to the 20 and 10 series cards!

That's closer to a 40% gain, 115.6 fps vs 82.3 fps at 1080P across 25 games, as per Techpowerup's testing. Still not a huge gain, but, better than 30% at least.

At that price point, if you got the 3060 used at that price, you unfortunately overpaid (currently goes for about $175 to $200 USD on the used market). If you got it new, relative to the price you paid, you would be better served if it's a recent purchase to return it and get the 4060 which performs about 15%-20% better than the 3060 overall at about the same price point (based on current US prices). Also, if you still have the 1660 Ti, you can offset some of your cost as that card still goes for about $80 to $110 on the used market. In other words, you should look at the cost vs. performance of the 1660 Ti vs the 4060 which has an overall performance boost between 55% to more than 70% in performance at about the same price point of the new 3060. Hope this helps!!

Indeed!

Thanks for the sub! Really appreciate it!

Thanks a lot!

Thanks! Appreciate that! If you're talking about chapters, I tried that a few times and it kind of messed up my metrics to figure out areas of the video I needed to focus on. But if I get enough people asking for that, I'd be more than happy to try it again :)

Interesting thought! I'll have to see how I can implement that. Thanks!

Easy: 100-200 nothing 200-300: RX 6600 300-500: RX 6600 XT, RX 7600, 3060, 4060 Basically you can’t really get a new “good” GPU for under 500$. The second-hand/preowned market is the place to look at.

@@eye776 this is just factually wrong. who would pay more than maybe 300 for a rx 7600 xt or rtx 4060, there are plenty of gpus that are good at certain price points. and you don't have to go and get a used gpu to get a good deal.

@eye776 As a matter of fact in the next week or two, I'll be posting a video of one I bought recently on the used market!

@kodemdotexe4925 It also depends on what you want it to do, so a person that primarily games at 1080p and sometimes 1440p, there are certainly a number of new gpus that can do that sub $500 or even sub $400. But if you want more out of it, or you want to "future proof" your gpu over the next 5 years, I think that above $500 is the probable area right now for new gpus.

Very much agreed! Without knowing what is coming, buying something can be a costly mistake!

Thanks so much! It means a lot to know that!

Thanks for the suggestions and compliment! With this level of data, it's tough to not have it be crowded. I had thought about doing a different kind of chart, more graphic in nature, but it would be hard for people to follow as graphic charts can look pretty chaotic or hard to identify specific data points. I plan on doing follow up vids in the future similar to my plan for the gpu vids, perhaps once a month or every couple of months and hopefully I'll be able to figure out something easier to follow by then. As to the color scales, I like your idea of identifying those outliers of high price vs. low frames, but I think perhaps a differentiating color to highlight those specific cpu's. What do you think?

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware I'm not sure if a different color would illustrate that they cost a lot but produce low frames compared to other CPUs to me the point of cost per frame is to show you shouldn't buy product A if product B cost lost and is 1.better, 2 equal or just about equal 3. only a little behind like around 80 to 90% of the same performance. and there's a lot of cpu's listed so maybe having them listed by the performance tiers or core count like the i/r3 i/r5 i/r7 i/r9 things like that, or using multiple graphs might be the solution

Perhaps, I'll have to think about that and how to possibly implement such comparisons without extending the video lengths too much (youtube seems to have problems with new channels having vids that are too long :/). But to be clear, I was thinking of highlighting them in a differentiating color and then discussing them. I don't know if it needs to be granular as to cross comparisons and percentages of performance within those comparisons since that would possibly make the chart(s) even more complex and possibly even harder to follow. I'll have to consider it though! But, I do agree that if some cpu's really stand out as outliers, that could be beneficial to point those out whether they are great buys or bad buys, but if I get more specific than that, it would probably exponentially increase the video length!

Yep! That's why I mentioned their problems in the vid and highlighted them in yellow for the average cost per frame results :) Thanks for mentioning it!

It also had to do with the motherboard manufacturers pushing those enthusiast boards. It was also discovered that the CPU even though running at high temps continued to do so. I guess they were not throttling down. I just know that Intel has done more research and just released a new bios. I have a new Rig with a 14700 kf and I am not worried. It is obviously a bad problem to have an isn't a little thing but AMD has a high failure rate anything can break at any given day. I will admit I monitor my voltages everyday while PC is on. Which I would never done if not for the problem that they had.

Yes, I mentioned that the results by TechPowerUp was with utilizing a RTX 4090 to give each cpu zero impedance and measure the max possible results.

Great catch! I based the chart on the tests ran by TechPowerUp, and their results didn't have that cpu on it :/ That being said, I would think that it would rank somewhere between the 7950X3D and the 7900X as to its results as well as cost per frame. Thanks for pointing that out!!

Thanks! If I get more people asking me to fix their pc's, I'll definitely film and post them!

Thanks so much! Yeah, it was a great deal, unfortunately now the Founders Edition is sold out from what I can tell, so now the only place to get it is on the used market :(

That's a good all around cpu for gaming at 1440p and 4k, it's a little in the worrisome range in the cost per frame at 1080p, but at 1440p, it's a solid performer and cost effective!

I would wait for now to see what is offered and what those prices are before buying that gpu. A good example of this, specifically for gaming, was the 9000 series cpus that came out where the uplift was very small vs the 7000 series cpus at a price point much higher than the current prices of the 7000 series. This result in turn raised the prices of the 7800X3D by more than 27% recently. Similarly, if the 5000 series gpus turns out unimpressive, it would raise the prices of the 4000 series gpus in theory. BUT if the new gpus outperform the 4000 series by a decent amount, it should theoretically lower the price of the 4000 series. As well, the 4060 Ti is an okay gpu, not great, and certainly might have a problem with games in the near future even with 16gb of vram, and at the current prices, that gpu would not be a great buy.

Intel isn't having as much of a problem with the i5's, I wouldn't be overly concerned with that for the 13th and 14th gen, especially if you update the recent microcode/bios. That being said, it's a bit of a shaky time for them for certain. If I were buying new, and wanted Intel, I'd probably go with 12th gen i5 or i7 for gaming which keeps you in the LGA 1700 socket for when they finally resolve the problems, thus giving you enough headroom for future upgrades. Otherwise, I'd wait on a new build with current gen stuff right now for both Intel and AMD, they are both having their share of problems right now.

Agreed, but some people will pay a decent premium for the convenience and "safety" of the tech support and warranty, especially those that are unaware of the large cost differences.

Yeah I agree that pc seems way over priced though from the vid seems like there's reasons... I just wouldn't pay that much for that pc

A lot of people would probably feel that way if they knew how things are priced and the reasons for it. Some people would still buy such a pc for the convenience and safety though!

Thanks so much! Really appreciate the compliment!

Yeah, I think the motherboard is from an old Dell prebuilt pc

7800x3D may become a GOAT for AMD (depending on if there is a 9800x3D and if so, how it performs) since the rollout of Zen 5 is not good compared to Zen 4. Right now the 7800x3D is low in inventory for new and getting a bit competitive on the used market. If you want to get one, I'd get one either ASAP or wait until either end of year or Q1 2025 to see how the market is for it since you can always find a used one, but the price may shift massively up or down depending on Zen 5 news.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware thank you i get it

Nice! Let me know how that turns out!

For it's price, it's not bad. It's comparable to the RTX 4060 or the RX 6600 and is primarily good as a cost per frame at 1080p. At today's prices, once you get into 1440p gaming or above, it's cost per frame starts showing that it's under powered. That being said, with Intel's recent progress with XeSS and driver compatibility, it's starting to look better, but for 1440p gaming, its price needs to be closer to about where it was last month, around $180 would be a sweet spot for that card.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware i'm getting a deal in 3060 ti used 1 yr warranty at 240 Doller, 3070 used 1 yr warranty at 260 Doller and Arc a750 new 220 Doller should i wait for arc gpu price down? and thanks for the reply

I'd wait for the Arc A750, especially since Battlemage gpus are going to be announced probably this fall. The A750 price at $220 is a little too high for its value. The 3060 ti performs better by a decent clip than the A750 and on the used market is going for between $220 to $280, so with a 1 yr warranty, $240 is a decent price (I'd rather see it near $220 due to age of the card). And the 3070 performs a little better than the 3060 ti and is currently going for between $230 to $300 on the used market, so the $260 price is decent with a 1 yr warranty (though I'd like to see that one at about $240 or lower). All in all the two Nvidia cards are a decent deal at your prices, depending on the coverage that the warranty is providing. If you are planning on using these for pc or component flips then look into whether or not that 1 yr warranty is transferrable. Bottom line, good prices on the RTXs, not a good price on that A750.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware Okay, thank you for your valuable response. I have a 2050 laptop. I think I should wait a couple of months with it until the new GPU launches from Intel. Until then, these used ones can fall further. Also, the 40 series will be widely available on the used market, which is not the case at this moment. Thanks again, you helped me a lot. I'm from India. Here, PC-related creators are fewer, and they don't upload frequently. So, for a normal user without knowledge, there's always a chance of being robbed by sellers. Have a nice day! 😊🙏

Glad I could help!! Love having viewers and subs from other countries!! If you know of others in your same spot, feel free to share this video or my channel with them! Thanks for watching!!

Right now, you're better off waiting to see what comes to market (possibly as late as Q1 2025. That can help you to figure out (after 3rd party benchmarking is done) the best price to performance for the dollar. In doing so, it will also possibly drive prices down on older models when the new models roll out. Conversely, there have been times where it either drives older model pricing up or they stay the same, it will depend on inventory vs. demand. I'd also keep an eye on what AMD is doing with their FSR and RT improvements between now and then to see if there is benefit there. The best apples for apples comparison for you would be the 4070 Ti Super vs. the 7900 xt. I'd only look at the 7900 GRE if you are looking to maximize $/frame and still remain at 16GB Vram.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware Thank You for your help. Your data is great. I look forward to future videos. Also the 6800 has been a great card.... I got it in November of last year for $380.... best value 1440p card ever, and for it being 4 years old it holds up well in AAA games, i think.

@@themachine4008 Thanks! It keeps me going, making vids when I get feedback like that! The 6800, for its price range, is a great card. It should be good for at least a few more years. If you do replace it, I'd suggest selling it used on jawa or ebay to recoup some of what you spend on the new card.

Thanks a lot! Always great to get that kind of feedback!

Happy to help! I think the 4070 Super is the slightly better choice from a performance standpoint but the 7800 xt has the better price by about $100 and it has 16 gb of vram vs. the Super that has 12 gb vram so it might be the smarter buy in the long run. Either choice has good performance, even in 4k (no RT). Let me know what you end up getting!

Glad your friend is okay so far, I'd let him know that if he's comfortable with it, to maybe lower some of the bios cpu settings (and maybe the ram, especially if xmp is enabled) for now rather than updating the bios until we know more as to the effectiveness of intel's "fix". Meanwhile, at this point, I wouldn't worry too much about your 4070 Super unless you're seeing some hotspots over 80-85c. If you are, you may want to repaste and/or undervolt your gpu until you can do so or find someone who can.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware good advice! I'll tell my friend and keep an eye on my gpu

I like what you've done with these build vids but I'd like to see some where you talk about the parts you pick to

Interesting! You're not the first to ask me about this. I'll have to look into doing that on my next build! Thanks for the feedback!

Glad I could help!

Thanks a lot! I'm glad it helped!

Thanks a lot! That's a great question! I think that over the short term there is a slight higher value to DLSS but FSR (and XeSS for Intel) are making larger strides in frame gen and even RT. So I think that in the long term it will become a footrace on which of these gets the lead in the market. In other words, in the long run, I think the relative value of DLSS/FSR/XeSS will end up being nearly indistinguishable; however, right now DLSS has the slight edge especially if you involve RT.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware So if you were to include what the fps would be with upscaling the price to performance might change to the better....right, but like you said dlss has the edge right now..... especially at lower resolutions. But i am no expert. i have a rx 6800. It was a good buy, but my wife has the 4070 and i think dlss does a better job. guess i cant complain. i got the card for $360 in April. I am just wondering if i should get a 4070 super...i am worried about the 12gb of vram.

For the most part, I believe the RX 6800 has the better value long term over the 4070 Super. A lot would have to change for that to be otherwise. I think from a price to performance standpoint you made a great choice.

@@Lead-a-Horse-PC-Hardware k......Ty for the feedback and your time....and sorry for the long discussion.

It's my pleasure! I enjoy talking to my viewers and subscribers!!