As a "hardcore" game people will downplay it as "get good". But yes I've played around 1500 hours and there are a ton of inconsistencies including damage output.
@@solidus1995at least there you can point out to either transparent stats in the name of balance or to netcode issues when your shots inexplicably not hitting where they're supposed to (and that's a whole can of worms i lack the technical knowledge to put to the test to begin with). Here it's (thankfully) a fairly inconsequential quirk that only messes with your timings if you play long enough to learn them
Didn't expect you to only have 540 subs... great video, I really enjoyed watching it. I like your humor and I have such nostalgia for Black & White... I've always preferred 2, tho
Thanks for the kind words, much appreciated. When you're small, you rely on the luck of the algorithm beyond a certain point I guess. As a fun fact, since I posted my Humankind re-visit video in December, I gained +50% subscribers compared to the previous 3 years combined, and many more people seem to see my videos in their feeds compared to before. And I can't say I did anything radically different on either side of this moment besides my constant path of learning. Either way I don't complain, I like doing what I do, and only my real-life responsibilities stop me from making them more often. I actually never got to play B&W2, so I'm definitely interested in getting my hands on it. I remember that a criticism it had was the creature interactions being simplified, hence why I didn't try it back then.
*Problems:* - I enjoyed Black & White but wasn't too fond of the magic select system. - Also, aiming and throwing magic was quite inconvenient as well. - Dragging the hand to move around the world was tedious. - I had to manually mouse over buildings to view town stats. - I wanted to teach my creature the lightning spell, but it was a tedious process because my creature would often take damage from it. - Building was kind of inconvenient. *Solutions:* - Make it so the magic was selected through a radial wheel. - Aim with a slingshot mechanic rather than a throwing mechanic, I'd enjoy it more. - To fix the dragging mechanic, just replace it with WASD. - For the complaint about the game's lack of data displayed, maybe allow statistics to show through holding TAB. - At least lower the friendly fire damage onto your own creature. - Instead of scaffolding, just let us open up a crafting menu. Other than that, it was a good time.
-Radial wheel? Ew, no. The game already had clickable miracle icons next to the display for the gestures you could use to activate them. Clicking the button wouldn't give you as powerful a cast of the ability as you could get with a precise gesture, but would give you better than the bottom-tier version of a messed up input. Also, the tracking wasn't nearly as glitchy as this video suggests, but the game was the first one to prompt me to actually be careful about keeping my mouse ball clean (because it's old enough that optical mice were still quite rare). Given that there was a click to select spell option, hotkeys for them would have made sense. -Aiming and throwing was reliable if you had a good mouse and were good with it. A slingshot mechanic wouldn't be any less fiddly or idiosyncratic, and wouldn't be any less prone to glitches caused by the engine not being designed with modern hardware in mind. -I'd actually say "add WASD movement" rather than "replace" - allow the dragging mechanic to still be used, if the player wants. -A customisable (but still limited and streamlined) HUD would be a good option too, but a "press tab to see more information" option would probably help a lot too. -I disagree on this one. But then, I trained my creature to eat rocks and taught it to throw fireballs by setting it on fire a bunch -_- I was a monster. -I'd be in favour of building/crafting menus, but not radial ones. Except if that's limited to the console/gamepad controls, make it a proper menu designed for a mouse and keyboard when you're using a mouse and keyboard.
I think my complaints regarding the accuracy of gesture recognition are due to me playing on widescreen instead of 4:3 as most monitors were back then. I remember that some spells were annoyingly difficult to trigger even when done correctly even the first time I played it, but I was a dumb kid so what the hell did I know lol
@@DarthZombie510 When the game came out, optical mice were rare, and not reliable unless you had a specialised mousepad to use them on. Most people used analog ball mice, and those needed careful and regular cleaning to have a decent degree of precision. If you weren't regularly opening up your mouse and cleaning the ball and rollers, playing Black&White would have made the gestures suck. And I haven't tried playing the game on a widescreen computer (not yet anyway, I still have my CD somewhere), but I've heard it doesn't like modern PCs, and that might be part of the reason. There were reasons it would often feel janky without *technically* being the game itself at fault, though, and there are more reasons now than there were back then. It did have its flaws, of course, but the controls being unresponsive wasn't one of them if you knew how to look after your mouse.
Black & White, along with Morrowind, was one of the literal first two games I ever owned. I had no internet back then, and no access to game magazines. So it couldn't fail any expectations of mine and I absolutely loved it. Couldn't touch how much I enjoyed Morrowind though ^^
I saw a really negative and dismissive ad/review for Morowind on Toonami, but was captivated by the images. Gave it a try and sure-enough, double platinum.
@@operator8014 Nah man. For all the dunking Todd Howard takes nowadays, Morrowind influenced RPGs ever since with its design. Haters don't know how important it was.
Molyneux is a sh*t-heel. He hasn't made a single decent game except fable and he does the Todd Howard thing of promising stuff he has no intention of building. He makes games and abandons them constantly and refuses REFUSES to look back. He thinks he's an autor but he's the same calibur of hack as the rest of the industry.
The sad thing is that you're right, but at the same time in the past he wasn't like this. Black & White was the first time he over promised, and he did so by a long shot. He did quite a few good things before he ended up as Todd Howard without as anything to show for it
@@DarthZombie510 At least Sid Meyers is still our here making games for game's sake. Are the new civilizations a little, meh? Sure, but they're trying new stuff and I've never heard anyone say, "DARN that Sid Meiers!" Maybe I'm just biased because Pirates! Is like, one of the best games of all time. Lol
@@GnohmPolaeon.B.OniShartz Civ benefits from having different main designers in charge of each game. Sid Meiers has an important role, but each new title dares to experiment and push new ideas. That, and he had a good eye on finding and nurturing talent like Soren Johnson, Jake Solomon with XCOM, Jon Shafer and so on. In other words, Sid Meier didn't have the ego of trying to do everything by himself and saw value in fresh blood pushing concepts forward.
@@DarthZombie510 I sort of figured as much, yeah. Yeah, that's generally how competent management works. Delegation not interference. I don't know that Paul does much if any delegations and I can imagine him staring over the desk of the artists making a million anal insights no one can do anything about. Like how I can imagine Todd Howard reading the update logs, getting frustrated his favorite pet NPC didn't get the dialogue he included yet, then shutting down production for two weeks to go through ALL the dailogue because now he's paranoid more dialogue is missing. Mind you, he doesn't care about the dialogue, he only hired one voice actor, he's terrified one of his quips didn't make it in and knows with his full heart of hearts without that quip, that side-bar joke, people won't fully appreciate his autistic genius. Yeah, my bad. I need to actively avoid Howard or I go off. Lmao, Sid is a hero tho. At least comparatively. Then there's studios like From and Larion (now). Some older studios are still kicking and still basically the same like Obsidian. Largely, and I'm just realizing this, any studio that didn't cash in and start making Console Exclusives regularly. There's also many new studios where unfortunately the publisher, like Paradox, isn't evil but still greedy and that makes them do stupid sh*t but otherwise the games are good and the deva don't push agendas or leave things half-finished. I just play the sh*t out of indy, I'm so over saturated by video games that the quality doesn't even matter so much, you can tell when a game is made for the enjoyment of playing the game and when it's a cash grab and I just assume from the sales pages what the intention is. If you insist on the look and feel of your game, emphasis on the quality of story and you released your first dlc within a year from launch I know you put all your money into the lighting effects and your story is written by a fanfic author off of fiver. Good games flatly tell you what they're about, how they're basically played, with a short theming that actually exposits part of the story rather than tout on that the story is wonderful. Basically, I don't play Triple A or anything adjacent and if ypur game's description or ad reads or watches like a AAA studio, telling me nothing and hiding behind a thin veil of flashy action and thunderous title cards straight from PowerPoint, I just don't. I also just don't play any game from any studio that has had anti-consumer controversy more than a couple times. That's as much for my own sanity as it is for the industry. The Uh, "titans" of this industry (and the players too for that matter) don't seem to realize that we don't have to put up with ANY bull. Between Indy Devs, Dev Farms, Back-Logs, Roms, and the handful of exemplar AA studios the gaming market is actually massively over saturated and without doing any research I know the AAA world knows this because for the longest time and even now to some degree they refuse to allow backwards compatability with Nintendo going so far as to release the same titles since N64 with minor paint jobs GOING SO FAR that now they just flat-out remaster old games and slap a brand new price on them. I think Mario RPG (The First One) is 70 dollars where it was 35 back in the day brand new. Damn, I'm rambling this week. My bad. Lmao
I loved Black & White as a teenager, as I had no hype at all and had never heard of the game before playing it. Which I think definitely helped! Same thing with Fable, actually- didn't see any hype and so liked what was there. Got lucky!
@@DarthZombie510 Disagree about fable being better. Black and White was an awesome, unique game that has never really been replicated before or since. Fable was a kind of generic ARPG. Not a BAD game exactly, just not anything that stands out. I would replay Black and White RIGHT NOW if I could get saving to work properly. I see no reason to ever replay Fable. To be clear, I'd never even heard of Black and White either when I bought it. Just saw it on a shelf somewhere at CompUSA possibly in a discount bin and picked it up on the box alone. Also, I look at B&W more as a simulator and less a competition even in the maps that are set up as god vs god. I very much appreciate the slow pace and love developing the creature and villiage. Moving on to the next island is the last thing I want to do and only once I've exhausted the available content and collected tons of stuff (miracles, resources, unique items) that I can carry through the portal do I ever consider it. B&W2 completely lost that and made the focus entirely on winning, which is the real reason why that game was completely awful.
Fable was ok and charming in its own way, but definitely not overhyped like B&W was. You can keep saves of B&W, that's how i kept playing after almost giving up on it. If you install the game and patches (including the community) in Program Files and run the exe in Administrator, it works fine.
@@DarthZombie510 I had an issue with it the last time I attempted to play where basically no userdata was able to save. That means things like the creature's brain file and your god icon. Pretty sure actual game progress worked, but without the creature "remembering" it was kind of pointless.
The games Bullfrog was putting out in the '90s had a huge effect on me, so many original ideas and concepts, such creativity! When I see Molyneux's antics these days I think back to my teenage self being so inspired and it does make me feel sad.
15:20 wow i am suprised to hear this, i was under the impression for the longest time, that fanning hurts draw speed, thought it was a bug, thanks for putting all this together i know it was a lot of effort!
Funnily enough, I thought it was the other way around. Shows how much our brains can screw us over without hard numbers in front of us. Glad that you enjoyed it, much appreciated!
@@DarthZombie510 100% its been spread around as a known bug from hunt vets for a long time, same thing with people thinking the allamo is slower cycle time then normal romero, just a feelings over facts thing. and of course!
The differing swap speed is a feature. It's why I use a pax instead of a scottfield even when all the neckbeards on reddit are like "wHy dOeS tHe pAx eVeN eXiSt lOl" Then I reply "If two hunters shoot at eachother with a primary weapon and they only injure, the one with the faster swapping speed secondary will win the engagement, assuming that second shot lands. Which is why I carry a pax instead of a scottfield" Then I get downvoted because according to these turds, the swap speeds are either the same or they dont matter
In some cases i think it's a feature, but in others it looks like an oversight. I like the Pax, it feels easy to control too, getting the follow-up shot is a bit more tricky on the other one.. Shame they put all the custom ammo on the Scottfield, because the Spitfire is really strong with FMJ.
@@DarthZombie510 That's understandable. I know that english is a lot harder for people who speak slavic languages natively. I think your prounounciation and articulation is great though! (Besides giving great information about swap times, I am now interested in peoples individual time perception. So thanks a lot! :D)
@@dem4xed i'm romanian, despite how the accent sounds in english, it's actually a romance language. The issue is that most sounds are formed in different areas of the mouth and throat, hence the transitions i can use in my language are useless in english and vice-versa. People who know me say that I sound like a completely different person, so I'm not surprised lol
@@DarthZombie510 Aha romanian! Then forgive me the mistake. I understand this well though, since I currently try to learn polish (coming from german and english) and I notice that I also have to learn many sounds completely new and speak slower therefor. And even just switching from german to english makes my voice change a lot, so I cam imagine that the voice change must be huge for you 😄
I like quick swapping. And once I was wondering: does pax draw faster than the scottfield? I tested it frame by frame and in fact yes, it's about 17 frames faster, and I wanted to make a video comparing all pistols in the game and how well they can be using for quickswapping, but you already did it and proved that pax is actually faster. Great video anyway
@@kam3shek that's how the idea behind the video was born. I was sure something was off with the Officer, and naturally I had to expand to all guns so I catch all discrepancies
Bring up a lot of good points on the specifics of Hunt. The level and world design is definitely my favorite and are key to your appreciation of the senses and movement in the game. Trying to scale some of the trickier, unintended surfaces is a little finicky with the servers at times (but really fun if you've ever seen Ebenezer Screw's videos), but the sight lines, routes throughout, and the different characters of the compounds are great. Sometimes the boss lair concept makes some compounds more infamous than others (Stillwayer Bayou's basements aren't typically well-liked, Scupper Lake needed a rework, too), but if you try to do the unconventional in Hunt and play above the banishment instead of next to it, you're usually satisfied with the novelty if not success. The consumables, tools, special ammos, and AI add a lot of flashy tricks to the sandbox that pair well with the longer cycling times of the weapons, too. Hunt's really unique and hopefully it gets a team deathmatch mode before its servers are sunset to experience more of those hectic multi-team engagements.
Excellent job. I definitely appreciated the historical awareness (the weapon update column and public data). I only started playing the game in Fall 2023, so it's very useful in gaining perspective. Hunt can be a pretty cumbersome game to document and test mechanics and the shooting range was a nice addition, but grossly incomplete and really should be more like a trainer mode that doesn't mind breaking immersion. As far as the data...holy smokes. Inconsistent doesn't even begin to describe it, which is what kind of has me worried about the bullet drop update, which I would otherwise be pretty enthusiastic for.
Happy that you like it. I thought it's important to note when each weapon was added, because the weapon posture thing showed that Crytek forgot about that particular attribute some time after release, so it made me wonder if the same thing happened here. I am not as pessimistic about the bullet drop changes, because Crytek is pretty thorough when they put their minds to it. This weapon swap thing most likely happened because they stopped paying attention about it at least intermittently [since some things DO make sense]. And 100% agree about the shooting range. A bunch of guns don't show up, including stuff that was already in the game when they released the new mode. Same for traits and custom ammo types. Their resources were stretched pretty thin, so stuff like this makes me think they added it mostly due to player demand, not because they thought it was an important thing to add.
@@DarthZombie510 Besides a new map being an obvious win, every other change has me pretty happy, especially the trap rework. The weirdest thing about the range is they still were updating it, adding an event table for Tide of Desolation. However, after the event they removed the table and those weapons can't be found in the range now. And because you need to have a character with the gear enter the range, if you don't have everything unlocked or the hunt dollars to purchase, you just can't access them in the range at all. On a similar note, I hope the trials "explore" mode gets kept and updated to include ai and weapons, but we'll see.
I really felt the issues with swapping after the quickswap nerf. I do hope you build a spreadsheet for quickswapping, i know it would be an huge task. Anytime a new gun comes out I try out quickswapping immediately and wow. Mako you bad.
Thing is it's not straightforward to test, especially since i'm not a master quickswapper usually. Also i'm afraid i might miss some details since i started playing around the time Crytek did its last adjustment on it, so I don't have the context of pre-nerf quickswapping
@@DarthZombie510 one way you could streamline it is using a macro. most gaming mouse brands have a decent macro system. As far as the old context... i wouldn't worry about that. just collect data on time between firing one gun to firing the other. thats all we need in practice. I really do feel that people would be surprised at the variation in quickswap timings with some guns. Mako is probably the newest gun with horrid QS time. Looking forward to whatever data dump you do next ;)
Great job done. I think it would have been worthwhile to include in the study not only the speed of the shot from the lowered position, but also the speed of aiming through the front sight followed by the shot.
I thought about it but decided against it, because it would've risked being more inconsistent. I'm also not sure if ADS "locks" the firing at its end like aiming from the hip does
This is the end state of many iteration of changes done to end quick swapping meta. 100% intended... And it is not just the swap speed, there is also added sway logic after swapping.
Didn't the quickswapping fix only involve locking the post-shot animation in ADS? I'm not sure the values are intended though, they're a bit all over the place
@@DarthZombie510 Nope, there was a period of like a year where crytek was dancing around quick swapping with small changes. ADS lock was added long past that. And change to speed wasn't added specifically for quick swapping but devs where like "during this time we also thought that pulling upercut and mosin at the same speed doesn't make sense". I remember watching dev stream where they explain this change but when was it specifically idk.
I don't think they've been diligent enough with this, even for their 1.0 arsenal. At least on average pistols, rifles and shotguns are in line with what would make sense, but you still have plenty of situations that shouldn't happen. I bet it's the same situation as the posture bug, a variable that was looked into by one dev, but not by another. I say this because in all of their post-launch dev streams and patch notes they made zero mentions about this topic, although you can argue that the niche-ness of the topic is what did it.
honestly after about 200h of playtime i felt a lot of inconsistencies in the game regarding damage, projectile speed, dynamite damage etc. it's probably combination of spaghetti code and server related issues, but still the fact that the game that is rooted soo much on hardcore, precise shooting the inconsistencies like these really ruin the experience for me, maybe 15 of august will be a change for the better
The bullet speed and damage are very consistent and the way it's calculated is pretty transparent. Each gun has its own damage and bullet velocity, while the ammo type determines the damage drop off and penetration ability. In reality the speed of the bullet is also determined more by the gun than the caliber, so it gives devs plenty excuse to use these things as a way to balance the arsenal.
@@DarthZombie510 I understand all of these concepts and as I said there were a lot of situations when that data didn't corelate to what happened in game, for example crossbow dealing between 130 and 140 to the body instead of just killing, shotguns not killing point blank but oneshotting from 10+ meters (standard ammo), hv ammo hitting later then standard ammo (shooting each other with enemy, hitmarker later), getting killed by a dynamite through wall, dynamite exploding on someone's head not dealing a bit of damage, these things happened to me
Crossbows are very likely to hit the arms. If your opponent is looking straight at you in ADS, his arms cover a large part of his torso. Bolts and arrows are the only ammo type that doesn't penetrate limbs, so you're screwed if you're unlucky. Shotguns have a random spread, and their crosshairs are a lot larger than the area where pellets go. The latter part is actually a problem because it tricks players into thinking "my opponent's gonna die" when the shot misses them completely. The HV situation sounds more like a lag/trade window issue to me. Another big problem of the game that I dearly hope they'll address. Explosions are kinda bullshit, I'll give you that. The game isn't very clear how small a crack has to be to "block" an explosion. Frags are even worse because the shrapnel pens one layer of wood for some reason.
