Hi Sam do you like this machine? There is not much information about the Brugnetti, seems has a peculiar function brewing directly from the hx tube. Do you think it's worth restoring it. Thanks!!
hey man, thanks for watching but what's up with the aggressive and condescending tone? It's got a drip tray underneath to catch the drips, otherwise how else would I clean the tray area? Definitely not putting the entire machine into dishwasher lol
and just fyi in case you are puzzled, I was using a transparent plastic tray that is just short enough to fit under the grate. I posted this on HB too if you wanted to have a look. Chill down, and peace~
thank you! It probably depends on the coffee and grinder too. I am using medium roast here with a conical burr grinder, both which give more persistent crema (not an indicator of taste though). The ratio was probably around 1:2 or so (limited by the piston volume), can't remember exactly now haha
@@samlaw5040 Gotcha, I was looking for the weight of coffee you used for your 1:2 ratio. I can fit a little more than 14gs in my portafilter, but I just wanted to see how much you were using.
@@markblosser4685 I see. I am pretty sure I used 12g in the basket generally on the La Pav. But have used up to 14g (especially lighter roast that are more dense) with similar ish results. You can lock in the PF and then quickly remove it to see if it hits the shower screen. I think it's ok even for the screen to kiss the puck slightly (but ideally the puck should just be a tad lower than the screen). The Pavoni levers are pretty forgiving in that sense, but getting the right temperature is another story haha
It's one of the last first gen according to francesco's site (that's what I used as a reference but you may be referring to other reference which is fine. It doesn't matter much anyway, it doesn't change they are great machines and piece of history). The grouphead is water-heated rather than steam heated, you can tell from the shape of the grouphead too.
Nice video... quick question if you don't mind... when you install the main shaft and tighten things down about how much force did you find is needed to properly seat things? Can't really understand the video as I'm totally deaf and CC isn't available on my end. Thanks!
Thanks! It's been a while since I used my Helor.... From memory I just went with my gut feeling and it was about finger tight. It should feel right and shouldn't feel like you're breaking the grinder. If in doubt, do it on the looser side. The worst case is it would come loose after a while. If that happens, I would tighten it a little more the next time.
Hey Corey, that is blue E61 Sillicone gasket from Cafelat. It's a bit thinner than the stock gasket, so either you let it be (your pf will lock in a bit further no biggies) or you can use an additional 0.5mm spacer with the sillicone gasket and it will work like the stock gasket.
@@samlaw5040 Perfect! I have a spare so I'll install that this evening. I'm having an issue with water jets leaking around the shower screen as well - trying to sort out a solution for that. Saw your post regarding the mesh behind the shower screen - so I'll be trying that as well!
Good luck! If you get a puck screen (53mmx1mm might be the one) and layer it behind the shower screen I think that will work well! I don’t have the Aurora anymore (bad decision in retrospect) but that’s what I will try if I still have mine.
Oh, and a little side leakage isn’t necessarily a bad thing (may even be desirable for a fuller coverage of pick wetting), as long as the water is not not predominantly coming from the side.
I've recently got a 2nd gen and still trying to wrap my head around this. Tons of the science technique I read makes no sense to me. There's a hole (or two) to let water and/or steam into the grouphead from the boiler that sits about 2/3's the way up. Lever down...water flows in above the piston and stays there helping the group heat up. Lever mid way...hole is blocked. Lever up...water flows into coffee area below the piston. IMO, Pumping at the top as in video simply unblocks and blocks water entry below the piston into the coffee area and neither increases total volume nor pressure. (Maybe even push a little dirty water back into the boiler before the hole is blocked). Total is limited by the cylinder volume. However a partial or even a full pull and THEN refilling the coffee area by returning the piston above the water inlet will increase total volume in coffee area and so extracted. Of course doing so will alter extraction physics and so taste/texture. Next, pressure is dependent on puck compression and "pull" force, and nothing (directly) to do with multiple pumps. Other gurus advocate multi pumping from lever down to midway as a way to expedite pre-heating. Since the inlet is above the piston with the lever down, what can that do but alternately allowing water in and pushing it back out to the boiler above the piston? Maybe it helps circulate/stir hotter water from the boiler? That's my take - all I read confuses me..even from the gurus. Keyword..I'm 'confused'.
It all boils down to pressure (no pun intended), more pressure through the puck=higher extraction=better flavor (generally). Boiler=s1. Grouphead=s2 The machine starts with a high pressure in s1, and standard pressure in s2. When the lever reaches the top, the volume of s1 and s2 equalizes. When you press down, pressure of s1 stays the same, while pressure of s2 increases from manual pressure exerted. Each time you press, you increase total pressure through the grounds. In these machines, you can’t really increase steam pressure, but you can increase pressure manually. The hard part is finding the balance between high extraction (for better sweetness, complexity, and overall taste) and lower ratio (for better vibrancy, texture, and overall flavor). That’s honestly the case for all espresso. Hope this helps!
Sure, it is a 230V machine. It won't explode, there is a pressure regulating valve like any espresso machine, so the machine doesnt go above 1.2 bar. But you do need to shut it down after 30 minutes or 1 hour, otherwise the boiler might boil dry and may damage the element.
Mine is the 1976 model. Can you do a video showing you taking the portafilter off after the shot, how long do you wait, I saw a video of guy pumping the handle to decrease the pressure on a 1980’s model. I’m currently restoring mine hope to use it soon. COVID lockdown has slowed progress.
I no longer have the Pavoni to shoot another video unfortunately. After the shot is done and that coffee liquid has stopped flowing, you can remove the portafilter immediately with no issue. If the coffee is still flowing (indicating residual pressure is still in the group head), then just lift the handle slightly (2cm or so) and this will remove the pressure and it will be safe to remove. I wouldn't pump the handle post-extraction/shot, just to avoid pushing coffee water back into the boiler (not sure if it's possible but I don't see a reason to do that). Good luck with your restoration, they're great machines!
I have a 1975... Hence, exactly like yours. It is imperative that you upgrade your machine with a pressure gauge. When the release valve hisses is around 2.5 bar and the coffee will be burned and bitter... granted that you are able to lower the lever at that pressure (which makes the machine dangerous) I personally never pull a Espresso shot above 0.8 bars. Another must to have is a semiprofessional coffee grinder. I would suggest you also to acquire a bottomless portafilter but not only to diagnose the extraction but also because it allows you to skip the portafilter warm-up phase.
Hi Sam - Thanks for uploading this (old) video! Quick question: Is this better than the Hand Crank version (HC-P)?.. and do you feel the PG needs a stand?
Hi AD, you're welcome, glad it's of value after so many years! Interesting also is that I still have the Rossa PG. Between this and the HC-P I personally prefer the PG as it's easier to use and to master to me. But refilling the gas cylinder might not be for everyone unless you have a good shock/floor pump. Mine is an aluminium Rossa (sub-1kg) so I can hold it steadily and it works perfectly fine without a stand. If holding the Rossa becomes a chore at some point, you can also find some cups that the Rossa can sit in (8-oz Duralex glass for example).
@@Lnguyen217 It''s a really tough one. I probably wouldn't if I am doing it again. I just needed a scale and a timer, no need for special modes or app which I don't use. I think there are other cheaper alternative these day. The response time of the cheaper scale is typically slower though (brewista is fast, but not the fastest either).
the newer Brewista 2.0 has this taring issue too. I can confirm this as I bought one and sold at a loss. The one in video is Brewista 1.0. It's not a unit fault, but design/programming flaw (perhaps a case of sacrifing accuracy for faster response time).
hey Mikkel, sorry that the message comes one month later haha. The shape of the kettle spout was the reason I believe. Using my gooseneck Brewista, I too get brown water. Anyway, I don't think it makes any difference in the cup so I wouldnt worry about it
Hi sam. How are you liking your robot? I think recall you being heavily invested in coffee over many years and would love to get your honest thoughts. I am in the market for an espresso maker to replace my daily driver (mypressi twist v2). Looking for something minimalist that gives me a bit more control over my shot and less fussy to set up.
Hi Scott, I am keeping mine! I don't use it every day though (watching my caffeine intake) because the spring lever machine takes care of the morning coffee. If I am going minimalist, I could see myself using the Robot as my daily driver. In fact, I took the Robot on a 3-week trip and it had worked extremely well. Very easy to setup (you just need a sink and a kettle), waayyy less fuss compared to all other unpowered machines I've used before. There're of course some unique characteristics/some-call-it-quirks of the machine that you will get used to. Nothing deal breaking - just minor things/learning curve issues like the tamping process with tall basket, the way how the portafilter locks in, the arms could be a bit rounder, some tendency to have minor coffee spray etc. But it's damn near perfect for a semi-portable manual device. I would highly recommend it if you're looking for a manual machine and that if the price is not an issue (they will last for decades if not more. The build quality is unbelievably overkill in some aspects).
@@samlaw5040 awesome.. thanks Sam for your reply. I also have one more question.. Is the pro model worth getting? The pressure gauge, which in its incorporation seems to be more of an afterthought than a necessity, takes away from the original visual Robot concept. Did you find it more helpful to have in tuning your shots? I think while pressure gauges are needed on electric pump machines for tuning shots, I'm not really sure if it's worth sacrificing the clean look of the Robot, given my eyes are on the flow itself and not the gauge... As you know adjusting the pressure directly in real time is the main advantage of direct lever machines so the actual measurement is more informative than crucial. What do you think? Would the quality of your shots be less without it?
I have the same machine, have not been able to pull a shot like that. Any tips? Specifically, how do you know when the water is hot enough? Are you using the I or II heat setting? How far do you fill the reservoir? What's your technique with pumping the lever? Thanks in advance.
Hi Eric. The most important thing is make sure you're using freshly roasted coffee (roasted less than 3 weeks) and the crema will come naturally. From cold, I set it on heat setting II. Once it starts hissing, I turn the heat down to setting I. Do about 3-6 partial pumps to bring the group up to temperature. If you have a temperature strip on the group, it should be between 70-90 deg Celcius. Then, go on and pull a shot. If I need to make a milk drink, I will turn then the heat up. Reservoir is always filled to at least mid way and I aim for 80% on the sight glass. Not super important, you just want to make sure you have enough water to pull a shot. The multi-pumping is to increase the preinfusion pressure and volume, so that I can get a bigger shot. Good luck!
James Hoffman had a neat trick for getting rid of static. He measures the beans, then dips the handle of a demitasse spoon in water (so it picks up just a drop's worth) and gives the beans a quick stir before putting in the grinder. Works every time.
Thanks Eric. Yes I do that nowadays (also known as RDT, Reiss Droplet Technique by some). One good spray from an atomizer typically takes care of the static. Neat hack! But I no longer have the HG-1 haha...
Sam Law whay did you sell it? What grinder do you have now? I may consider a used hg-1 but it still expensive for a hand grinder! Share your thoughts on it please.
Hi Samuel. In my opinion they are very close in taste that I wouldn't sweat about it. The Rosco feels more solid and perhaps easier to grind/grip due to the smaller-diameter barrel. The Helor is well made too, but it's biggest strength is its portability - almost half the weight of Rosco Mini (~600g versus 1kg).
yeah, both of them really look very beautiful. i already read a lot of review in home-barista, including yours. sam, if you dont mind, i need a little suggestion from you. which one do you prefer, pharos 2.0 or kinu m47 v3? - pharos ($400) vs m47 ($450) in my country - i have a doubt about m47 magnet durability in its catch jar - i only use medium-dark / dark roast - not for traveling, only home used - will be paired exclusively with Andre's EspressoForge - i only concern about the taste they will produce, i dont mind about the size or ergonomic. maybe you can give me a little insight before buying, sorry for the trouble Sam, thx! :D
No problem, glad to be of help! I have never used a m47 so can't really offer much on that. But what I do know is I seem to get better shots from bigger conical burrs (Pharos, Robur, Compak K10, Monolith, Helor Stance etc) than either the Helor 101 or Rosco Mini (may be a preconceived bias I don't know...). The inner burr of Kinu m47 is only about 2mm larger than the '38' mm burrs, so I suspect they're probably more similar to each other than to a 68mm conical like the Pharos. So if taste is the only criteria you are concerned with, I would go with a Pharos. Perhaps get the Pharos 2.0 which seems to have solved some of the major ergonomic drawbacks.
Hey, I'd like to send you a financial tip for putting your guide together on home-barista.com. Have a way I can do that? Thank you so much for putting it together!
Thanks mate, glad that the guide has helped in some way! Your offer is graciously appreciated. I'm just a hobbyist and didn't expect a financial gain out of this. I guess the best way to reciprocate is to pay it forward to others - probably by participating on Home Barista and spread the words for good coffees! :p But really appreciate the thought, and enjoy your Helor 101!
hello Ian. Thanks for the comment. Like I said, it doesn't usually happen and that was an accident I overlooked, probably from setting up the camera etc (it was an impromptu decision to make a video). I even had a bean stuck underneath the scale (accident x2 Murphy's law rulez). To take that video with a decent lighting, I had to set up a holder for the cam, change the ceiling light to a blue-cool light,rather than the warm light that we normally use. Too much hassle for nothing. But I decided the video is fine and not to retake (hey accident does occur and this is just a hobby). We don't live in a perfect world, and I don't get paid for my effort to post the vid. :) I don't really mind nor it was my intention to influence anyone. Feels free to make up your own mind. But I do enjoy the grinder FWIW.
Btw, the weigh in is really important as it affects the flow/extraction directly. The weigh out was just to judge how much retention was there - that was a new grinder and I was still getting to know it. I don't weigh the grind output nowadays as the variation is nothing - bugger all. If you mess up the dose in, your extraction will be affected big time. The 'dirty' basket, not so much. It consists of, like what 0.5% TDS? After diluting with 40mL of 11% TDS espresso it's fine you can't tell a difference I'd bet. :p
Good grief. That basket wasn't very dirty, can see just a little residue from the previous shot. Some "shops" don't clean the basket at all between shots and the bottom of the basket is not exposed by open portafilters. Maybe the basket gets washed at the end of the day at "shops". ;)
Not quite. I have only tried my friend's Feldgrind briefly and think it's a sweet grinder. I think at this level, they're pretty much the same and I doubt there's much difference in the cup. The Feldgrind and Helor will travel easily. The Helor seems built more robustly than the Feldgrind, but the Feldgrind should travel a bit easier due to the stowable handle. The M47 will take the super built crown (based on what I read), but maybe better as a home grinder with occasional light travelling.
Yes, it's an actual steamer. About 200ml boiler with 600 watt heater, plenty powerful for one cup. No longer in production unfortunately. It is sometimes available here on Ebay Australia.
Are you having alignment issues with your grinder? Every other one I've seen creates a symmetric cone of coffee. This looked like it was coming entirely from one side -- or was that just lighting making it appear that way?
Hi Eric, you're right it's coming off one side. Not an alignment issue though - I've added a 'restrictor' foil disc inside the funnel so the ground only exits at one side. This allows mixing of the grind before they fall into the basket. This way, the ground are more homogenous and much less need for WDT distribution.
Hey Rob, they sure are. This was years ago where OE was the source of EVERYTHING levers and there's no alternative baskets. So yeah, I believe it is the original basket. :)
Hi Sam: I noticed that you use the Rosco grinders. I know that steel burrs have to be replaced eventually, but most of the time in commercial machines with high speed grinding. Ross told be that he does not think the Rosco burrs have to be replaced at all. I also can see that one part of the burrs is integrated into the cutter head, thus, it is difficult to remove if I ever need to do so. What is your input on this? Thanks
***** Hi Tamas, you're right. In fact most burrs will have to be replaced eventually (if you want excellent performance). The question is when or why. If there was no accidents (rocks), I think it'll be expected to last many years(probably 10 years). But still eventually it'll need to be replaced. The Rosco's inner burr is easy to swap, but I suspect the outer will require a special tool. I guess Ross is the only could do that, but I'm pretty sure he can sell the tool if you want it.
***** Sure. Let me know too if he replies. I will be interested and may want to replace the burrs on mine one day. My email is sam.lawqk@gmail.com if you don't mind to share. Cheers.
I noticed you have a Caravel AND a Rossa. Just curious, which of the two makes a better shot? Or maybe my question is .. Can you do a pressure profile on the Caravel as well?
Hi Aaron, I 'did' have both of those. For 'me' Rossa wins hands down without comparison for quality of shots. Technically speaking with the Caravel you 'can' do pressure profiling, but it's very limited. The pressure reads like weak-pull for 4s,medium pull for 10s and ends with declining strength. There's no way to control it properly. Pressure profiling is on another level on the Rossa - true profiling. 0.5 bar for preinfusion, 7 bar extraction, declining down to 4 bar etc etc. And you can repeat that shots after shots. That is invalueable.
Hi, what do you mean by "wins hands down without comparison for quality of shots". Do you mean that the caravel is better had you considered the quality of shots? And that the Rossa is just more portable? I'm sorry, I'm not a native speaker :(
It takes about 5-10 minutes to get to boil. Once it's there, I just do a few flushes to heat up the group. It doesn't need to be left on for warming up.
