I own several Rocks and a number of Kimbers, among other brands. Of the two, I like my Kimbers better, but the RIAs are nothing to sneeze at and perform remarkably well. $400 or $4000, get what you enjoy and what you can or are willing to afford.
I picked up a used Commander RIA about 5yrs ago (I did a couple of videos on it) for $400. It looked hardly used and was returned to the store probably for the reasons I discovered. 1- Failure to Feed - The Armscor Mags were a major part of the issue - No issue with Kimber. I stretched the spring and the issue disappeared at least temporarily. 2- Related to #1 - The feed ramp was rough. Feed Ramp and Barrel Ramp were polished, the spring stretched and the FTF was taken care of. 3- The gun was highly inaccurate. POI was about 3.5" off. It turned out that the sights were off. RIA used 5mm sights, and the gun needed 3mm. To complicate things they use Israeli sights so the gun is machined in metric and I needed a gunsmith to machine the sight mounts. I used this as an opportunity to switch to Dawson Night Sights since the gun came with blackout sights, which are pretty useless at night. 4- The Bull Barrell required a wire to be placed in the guide rod to break the gun down. While in the shop I had the GS add a 2nd hole to the rod 1/8" in front of the stock hole which as a Lefty made it quite a bit easier to break it down. I now had a very accurate pistol and I love it. The GS cost ~$150, so in the end it cost me $550. As I used it more, I found it to be quite enjoyable to use and treated it to a Crimson Trace Laser Grip for another ~$150
Ya I’ve heard people having really good experiences and not so good. Mine was 100 percent and I had zero issues other then it would start jamming when it would get dirty
I don’t know where you are getting the Rock Island for $400, I got the Rock Island tactical exactly like the one shown in the video for $557. The Rock Island has been built in 4140 steel used to build airplane frames. The dual safety works excellent. The trigger is very good. The parts are solid and very accurate.
@@ScotchNThings Cabela, is a good store. Rock Islands are good guns, however there are people that think the only good 1911s are the Wilson’s and the Kimber 1911. I am a smart shopper buying reliable handguns and rifles putting the brand aside.
@Murdered5.2 Ram Thanks and I do not behold tremendous experience with Kimbers and sorry for my negativity. I go with Glocks being the best pistol for the money. If I carried everyday on the Job I would opt for Sig Sauer P226, 9 mil (Made in West Germany) or more so H.K. chambered in .45.
I am a gunsmith of 29 years. Even have a degree in gunsmithing. I prefer to build off rock island GI models, and turn them into beasts. I do this in between building race guns, etc.
By accident or by design, you have made some very good points. In my opinion,the differences in firearms usually manifest themselves after considerable use. Most of my 1911s never see the range, probably because my time there is limited. The two that I shoot every week are the Magnum Research Desert Eagle Stainless (.45) and the Dan Wesson Pointman Stainless (9mm). Occasionally I take a 10mm as well, the RIA Rock Ultra HC, which needs at least another 500 rounds to be broken in. Or the Ruger SR1911 target which needed no break in. And I share your opinion of the Rapide-- it is a very good looking gun.
I love my Rapide!! Got about 600 rounds through mine and it’s been great..I got mine on a great deal brand new for $1200...that Rapide is a sexy beast! Mine actually eats aluminum case ammo well
Sam Henderson I haven’t shot a competition since last summer. When ammo went crazy I just sat on what I had. I take my edc out every week to shoot but that’s been it.
The ambi safety causes the trigger not to reset that’s why a lot of higher end 1911’s don’t have it. I had that issue when I built my RIA but a simple safety swap fixed the problem and it’s ran flawless since. Never had a single jam. 1911’s are hit or miss really but tbh I’ll take a RIA over a Colt, or Kimber because they just work
I carried a Kimber custom tle RL II for work and Duty everyday. I know a lot of guys bash on Kimber but I personally have never had a problem with them. I am a big proponent carry whatever 1911 you like as long as it works. A 1911 is like an AK were AR-15 pattern rifle, almost everyone makes it and it's still considered the same thing
@@ScotchNThings I've gotten very lucky by some people standards because every Kimber I've fired has worked flawlessly with the exception of magazine related issues.
I’m sure some have their problems just like any manufacturer. But it seems like it’s just people who are brand loyal like with Glock vs whoever or Ford vs chevy.
Seriously my friend- there's a world of difference in how a $1,500 1911 feels and operates and a $500 1911. Long term reliability could also be a major difference, but hard to tell until you're down the road. Rock Island has a great reputation, nothing against them but I'd take the Rapide any day over the RIA. I've had very positive experience with all but one Kimber that I've owned. Thanks for the review.
Same here; Only problem I had was a simple fix in Kimber mags. I “ONLY” use Wilson Combat mags now in all my 1911s! I currently use two Kimber’s in my EDC rotation, My Kimber Pro Raptor ll in 45 acp. is my dream gun & Kimber’s K6s 357 magnum snub nosed revolver have been Awesome firearm’s in EVERY way! Maybe one day I will try Kimber’s Rapide 1911 in 45 acp.#Kimber❤#1911🔥
I have had 1911 from $350 - $4,000. You can reach appoint that you money isn’t getting you more. What you pay for in the higher end guns is for the craftsman’s time to give the pistol the ultimate finished look. I will say most will be more accurate than most shooters. I have several Kimbers and they range from $750 to $1,800. To be honest they shoot equally well. I paid the extra for the cool factor.
Great review... do what makes you happy... For most of us there is no difference... personally, I sent my late wife’s S&W Scandium Commander to WC when she passed and so now I have $2,700 into a S&W with custom grips... It’s the second most accurate handgun I own; it was worth it as it belonged to her... my P49 is just that much more accurate...
I think some people hate on both of them because there has been a lot of cycling issues with both brands in the past, but I've heard the opposite as well about both. Not sure if it was just a production issue or bad luck or even just the ammo they ran, hard to say. I like them both still debating on what to get as I'm limited here in California.
If your wondering if a kimber is worth the extra cash and yes it is. I’ve struggled with other weapons to tighten the groups meanwhile I pick up the kimber and all us sudden it’s no problem. I think it’s all in the trigger and the kimber I got dint even have a cool name of course I paid 1200.00.
Kimbers in NJ stay in the gunsmithing shop. I was told by several gunsmiths to avoid purchasing a kimber. I just pulled the trigger and purchased the Smith & Wesson E series 1911 45 acp
If they are made to mil spec yes they are similar. But parts material barrel quality and tolerances are not the same. While RI is a budget Phillipines made the other is US. We must understand folks maker cut cost some how to produce a price point product I own both and more and have run them through tests for the duration of 30 years plus. from RI to Knight Hawk and everything in between. Yes RI can tack 1" at 10 yards if you tune it up the inside are rough wipe a patch and it will snag. Polish it down dissect guts polish those and you have a toss around rough and tough 1911.
I have a RIA. It IS a custom gun. I’ve done all the work myself and ALL the parts on that gun, came with the gun. It, now, is flawless in fit, function and EVERY area that matters to ME and cost only my own time and elbow grease to make it so. It is my everyday carry gun and will remain so. I now have no need or use for ANY other 1911 but my Rock Island.
When I bought mine, I was cleaning it and lost the bushing, had to order another one. Well, .I also bought a Bushing range. Problems solve, the RIA is quite accurate and reliable. I honestly care less about the finish. I do care reliability and performance.
I love the ambisafety. I will not spend a $1,000 in a handgun. As a combat veteran to me all I care is reliability, the looks, I really don’t care as long as it goes bang when you squeeze the trigger.
One of my EDC's is a Kimber Pro Carry 2. I paid like 1000 bucks for it and its definitely a high quality 1911 for its price range. Mine has no rattle either. I've had zero reliability issues with about 400 rounds in. The only negative I have in mind is that Kimber's take down differently than most other 1911's and I honestly don't like it. With mine you need a little Allen wrench tool to hold the slide back. I don't like my guns being tool dependent to take down and properly maintain.
I just purchased a RIA 1911 A1 military replica today for $675. I’m kinda sad to say that I think other than the trigger smoothness, the RI seems to be tighter tolerances and a little more accurate. I love my kimber, but maybe just this particular RI was made in a better than average batch? I don’t know, but the slide and everything is tighter. I will be doing some comparisons as far as accuracy and durability soon, but it seems to good to be true at this point.
Normally I am a very practical guy and do not go for all those bells and whistles which just look good and do not add much functionality. However, I have a soft spot for 1911s. I consider them more of a work of art than actually regular practical thing. Thus I go for the expensive custom looking ones just to be able to enjoy it by just looking at it.
I got my rapide for 1200 as well. i dont know anything about the rock45 my first 45 was a colt. i loved my colt however when i got my first kimber i liked it so much i got the new rapide amd love it more. kimber also builds a great rifle. i would buy a kimber agian and agian. i think a kimber is as good as a colt. there are a lot of good 45s . i have three and the two newest ones are kimber!
@@ScotchNThings yeah I'm normaly a rifle guy but I'll tell you that rapide is very nice to shoot as you well know. It's becoming one of my favorites too!!!🇺🇸
Kimber:. Overpriced for what you get, the retail price is to cover the costs of those glossy full page ads in the gun rags. I always found that Springfield Armory gives a better value or get a Dan Wesson I'd you want to go between production models and semi custom lines like Wilson, et Al.
I dont know where u guys are finding rock island 1911s for 400$ there are some online sights that start bidding on used ones for 400$ but a new one will run 550-700 depending on grip and sight options u choose.... these are not cheap guns and rock island makes more 1911s than any other manufacturer and have been for many years the platform is pretty much the same for all 1911s the money comes when cnc work is involved machinist are expensive because we make this world go around 😀
Nice comparison. As far as I’m concerned their both worth 1500 and have a beater and a prize is a good idea. But good luck not beating them both now that you have your grove back. All you need now is a Wilson Combat!
I don't have any insider information, so I have no idea of the actual numbers, but a better comparison in terms of quality is not retail, but manufacturing costs. I would bet the Kimber costs more to manufacture, but I bet the ratio of the costs are closer than the ration of the MSRP's. when you have them both in hand, the finishing of just the edge work of the part on the Kimber show more work in smoothing the edges and that costs money, it's not like the cost the same. random guessing the Kimber costs a little less than twice as much to make and sells for 2.5 times the amount. Again I don't know anything about the actual costs of either, but I think Rock Island makes money on volume and their fixed costs and sunk R&D costs are lower. Kimber is always refreshing their line.
I will also say this: having owned Kimber, Rock Island, Sig and Para Ordinance 1911's, the quality of the fit and finish is definitely different from brand to brand, but I have seen just as much variation in accuracy and reliability between specimens of the similar models within the same brand as I have seen between brands. admission: My sample size has not been large enough to know if the "good" guns show up more often in some brands, but I have seen some great guns and some stinkers in all the brands I have owned (except for Sig and para, I have only owned a few of either and have not had a truly "bad" one of either, but they varied somewhat as well). Most of the stinkers could be improved by a gunsmith though, so I call it setup, maybe? I think if you get a great example of either, it'll run. If you get a stinker, you will curse the brand forever! :)
Nice video, but you didn't talk about accuracy or reliability, I think that's the most important issue with either gun. I have a Kimber raptor SS ll and I love it, I also have an ole Springfield mil-spec 45, love it also
Accuracy is about the same. But I’ve heard horror stories on both sides. Reliability in just my sample size is about the same. They get real dirty they both malfunction.
There really is no real performance gains in buying a custom gun VS a high$ factory/semi-custom gun. Or over a full factory gun with MIM parts. Spending more money won't make a mediocre shooter instantly a master-class shooter. You should have more of a piece of mind that the more expensive gun will stand the test of time better. Won't have any movement when you wiggle the slide or trigger. Small details like this. Rest is cosmetic. Just as it is comparing a $10k+ watch to a $300 watch. Both accurate and will do the job. One is quieter and heavier, use precious metal, and maybe a gem. Some might even prefer the feel of a Colt. Where there would be a little movement in the slide/trigger if wiggled. Knowing that since the tolerances aren't as tight it would be less likely to jam shooting in a dusty outdoor range. The tighter the tolerances the more cleaning/lubing.. More regularly. Is the owner willing to spend the time?
Finish is cheap on the RI ? Who cares get it cerekpted for like $100 and youve still only dropped $500 on a reliable 1911 . Put a lighter hammer spring in for like 10lb for a better trigger pull weight and youve still only spent a third of the kimbers cost. Spent your remaining thousand bucks on ammo and practice
I went to a NRA pistol instructor course with my Rock Island. Many of the guys were shooting two thousand dollar pistols. I had a Kimber in my bag at the range. But I used the RIA for a reason. It's not the pistol it's the shooter. If one has money and competes then go for it. Personally I love Kimber
Ya for finishing work and it looks better. But honestly if I closed my eyes while shooting both I probably couldn’t tell the difference. But I’m not a 1911 expert just a fan.
4 года назад
They all kill! I'll take my EAA Witness over that overpriced paperweight any day! JUST KIDDING,I just can't afford a Kimber!😂😂😂😂
@@ScotchNThings Correct, both guns are solid, everything depends what you want them for, for competitions, self defense or simply plinking. The ones that hardly and sarcastically criticize both of these firearms are simply idiots that have never carried a handgun neither in real combat or personal protection. Airsoft and video games is the only conflict they have seen in their lives besides arguing with their mother over pancakes and cornflake serial brands. Simply imbeciles!! You just do have you have to do and keep moving forward. Good video!
Please do yourself a favor, do some more research on why they put what on for parts and why they say what they say! This will help you sound and speak on knowledge vs jumping into the water without seeing how deep the water is! Invest in time to see why a Wilson Combat is an all around superior gun than both of those on the table! To each his and God Bless!
I bet you’ve NEVER owned a Kimber in your life! If you did, you’d know WHY they are the #1 maker of 1911’s in the US. PERIOD. They take pride in what they make, and give the “Gucci” 1911’s: Les Bear, Dan Wesson, STI, etc., a run for their money. I’ve seen too many videos about 2020 Dan Wesson 1911’s recently, the SS models, galling, and having to be returned for a COMPLETE slide and/or a frame replacement because of this. I’ve NEVER heard of a Kimber galling to the point you cannot remove the slide from the frame, even with a hammer! As with Dan Wesson SS 1911’s. And these are $2K++ Guns!! Search the videos and see if I’m not correct. I KNOW I am. And I respect Dan Wesson, as a gun maker, but their QC lately, has gone to crap. And to make matters WORSE! They are accusing owners of improper lubrication, which is just adding salt to these DW owner’s wounds. How dare they! One owner with this problem, owns six Dan Wesson 1911’s. You’d think (he does) KNOW how to PROPERLY lubricate a Dan Wesson 1911! He has over $12K++ invested in Dan Wesson 1911’s! He’s NOT a new owner of Dan Wesson’s, or 1911’s! So, my opinion of Dan Wesson has changed. NOTHING made by man is ever “perfect”. But stop bashing Kimber, unless you can show a reason to. They aren’t perfect either! NOTHING IS! But it’s how you treat your customers that’s important! Kimber has been nothing but respectful and kind to me. And I’ve had NO/ZERO problems with my Kimber, soon to be: Kimber’s so far. But if I do, I am 100% confident they WILL take care of me. David out.
So, tomglpn, what’s the “PERFECT” 1911 maker?? I gave you concrete evidence it’s NOT Dan Wesson, do you need links? It’s not Kimber, even though I’ve NEVER had one issue with mine. I have a perfectly made 1990 Taurus blued 357 magnum revolver. I’d put it up against a S&W 357 mag. revolver as to accuracy and quality. BEAUTIFUL pistol. Pre-tell, what do you think is the “perfect” gun??? Obviously not Kimber, as you infer. I’ve told you and everyone about DW’s SS 1911’s QC issues. We are dying to know! Who makes a perfect 1911, or other pistol???
That's coming from trolls. From 1995 to present, Kimber was/is/continues to be the biggest American seller/maker of 1911s in the US. Don't listen to trolls, they are very miniscule in number compared to the satisfied Kimber owners.
1911s only have feeding issues polish the feeding ramp and lower end of the barrel and get a Wilson combat or sig mag they have a higher angle and feed any round every time. I EDC a 1911 an trust it 100 percent. Know the firearm you carry.
I have seen dozens of kimber reviews and almost all of them have feed issues. Everyone I've ever spoken to whose owned one has said the same. You say some people trash talk Rock Island, honestly I don't believe you. Never heard of anyone who shit talked them who knew what they were saying.
I’ve never had issues with any of my kimbers or my rock. Only thing was mag related. And there are plenty of people to talk trash on rock but they’ve never actually fired one
