I have the FP-90. If you initially find this one unimpressive, remember that it's probably because it's set at it's default piano sound and this keyboard is made to be customized to your own taste. It has a PIANO DESIGNER feature where you customize the sound from how much the lid is open (like in a grand piano) to single key tuning/character/volume custom options. I was able to get it at the perfect tone that I like after much tweaking.
Yes - both actually have quite a lot of customizing that can be done to get to the perfect tone. AND the FP90 has the modelling engine for acoustic pianos, putting it in the same category as the RD2000 stage piano for piano tone quality...it's quite impressive. Glad to hear that you've got the FP90 sounding just the way you want it! -stu
I appreciated this comment. I've been watching a lot of videos about the FP-90 and was set to pull the trigger on one because the videos all sound so good. But when I was actually playing in the store I found that most of the piano voices sounded artificial. Not in the higher register, but in the mid to low notes. I was frustrated because I have not watched a video where it sounded bad, and wasn't expecting to be underwhelmed in person. In your experience, do you think that adjusting the settings would fix that? I haven't ruled out the possibility that my expectations are greater than they should be. I've been a musician for a long time, but piano is new to me. I've only been playing since July, but my piano is an early 1920's Baldwin grand. So maybe I was expecting it to feel and sound more like an acoustic piano than is even possible. Just curious to know more about your perspective. I don't want to walk away from a good thing because I'm looking for it to be something it isn't, and I'm not sure that there is going to be something better at the same price point.
Cy, would you care to share your FP-90 settings? I've been playing around with the piano designer for some time but have yet to achieve the sound I hear on these recordings. I'd really appreciate it.
Roland is a good, quality, well-built and reliable instrument. I don't hear of many issues with them. They have a bolder attack and maybe bolder tone than Kawai or Yamaha so, you work with that. You work with the quality of any instrument to make music that fits the tone and manner of that instrument. It's not one is better or not, they both have great qualities. I think Nord, Roland, Kawai and Yamaha are all top tier. I can't include Casio though they can be expressive too.
I currently own two acoustic pianos one of them is a Charles R Walter that is in MINT condition and I love it. I play 55% classical music and 45%Pop. Would you recommend the Roland FP90X or Yamaha P515? I already have a Yamaha P255 but would like to upgrade. Non of the stores I’ve called or went to have any of the digital pianos I mentioned to test out 😭
Guys/girls I purchased the Kawai es920 and I’m very pleased with it.I sold my acoustic Yamaha B1 and purchased the Kawai for convenient and as we all know the es8 was very good but the es920 is an improved version of an already excellent keyboard.so highly recommendable
You’re a complete clown for selling the Acoustic upright Yamaha B1. I have the Kawai ES920 as well but would never ever sell my acoustic Charles R Walter upright piano. The Kawai ES920 is good for a dígital piano but it’s just not as resonant or great feeling as a good upright piano. I also have an older Yamaha P255 that sounds digital compared to the Kawai ES920. Either way the Kawai ES920 is not as good as a good acoustic upright piano. You messed up
I listened to these 2 a few months ago. It was difficult to decide which sounded best. The Kawai sounded smooth, mellow but almost boring/ relaxing. The Roland had more resonance, more excitement but as though it was trying too hard impress. On initial listen think the Roland sounded more impressive and I would have chose that one but the Kawai was beautiful. Both are excellent.
Thank you for this great comparism of these 2 pianos. Apart from all the informations and how you present them I just like the way you seem to dive into the sound when you play and how you manage to describe it. Great Job.
Thank you! This is exactly what I needed. I am a guitarist, who pretends to play piano. I love to have a piano around, and I am returning to digital for a variety of reasons, but at the top of the list is the ability to have accompaniment and versatility without hassle. I also have a young daughter, and I want her to learn piano. I had it narrowed-down to these two, and now I have a much clearer picture. I have watched other videos that were quite good, but focused entirely on sound, at the cost of failing to explore the options for someone like me - who will record basic stuff and use piano as backup. Your explanation of action and key-weighting was fantastic. I have wanted to side-by-side these two, but finding one store that sells both is an issue; my guess is that a dealer must contract with one or the other. Lacking the ability to do this, it would have been very difficult for me to have compared. Great video, huge help
You know the sound that gives warmth to my own playing style on a ‘real’ piano is the string resonance, that comes from pedaling and holding notes down while continuing to play - and I’ve found that Kawai’s ESs and MPs do THAT better than any other electronic or sampled piano....
@@MerriamPianos I believe the Kawai‘s audio signal is not the line out, but the camera mic picking up the ES-8’s speaker sound. I can hear some room reverb in there and no stereo separation. The Roland on the other side sounds like line out. That might be the reason for the volume difference.
The sounds on the ES8 are much better. Roland's Supernatural modelling has its quirks. I've owned FP90 before and sold it off. The sustain is unnatural and sometimes the note gets really loud.
Stu please add the following to each review: Action with no sound: are the keys loud compare, Privia to newer models? It would be nice to test high frequency triplets on one note, escapement velocity test? thank you, mike
Fantastic comparison. I love videos like this they really give a more realistic impression of what the pianos are like without trying them in person. Thanks Stu. I'm going to wait for the Kawai ES9 because I love the piano sound of the ES8 and hopefully the ES9 should come with the technical upgrades of the newer rival models.
Hi Meli - Thanks for the comment! We'll be waiting a bit longer for an ES8 update, since we didn't see anything at NAMM this year. The very earliest I think we'll see something is either July 2020, or NAMM 2021. They recently upgraded the sensor strip on the ES8's, so I imagine that may have kicked the product refresh cycle down the road 6-12 months. Just my guess! -stu
After watching several videos from you I finally decided to buy a fp90 at your store few hours ago. I’m super excited to pick it up next week. I also tried es8 while I was there, it sounds great, but the key action is not as good as fp90 imo.
Thanks again Stu, I appreciate you reviewing the key edge shape and the keybed cushioning - non-pianists don't realize how important these factors are (especially for young children learning to play - the last thing they need is a tiring or injuring key action!). The starkest difference in my location (Asia) is actually the price (the ES8 is USD $400-$500 cheaper than the FP-90) - the FP-90 is great, but it's not worth paying 20%-30% extra for. Roland need to price the FP-90 more competitively.
Last year, I upgraded my first DP wich was a Roland F20. I tried the FP 60 and FP 90 and I felt really disappointed. I didn`t like either the rubbery action (I liked the action of the F20) or the sound (I only tried the first piano sound and I had enough). After trying other DP`s I ended up buying the Kawai and I don`t regret although the sound throgh the speakers is kind of disappointing (compared with the F20). As I usually listen through headphones it`s OK. And it`s clearly more realistic than the F20.
You're the MVP, also timestamps in the description 👍 edit: also would love a review/showcase of the brandnew Roland RD88, which seems super good for its price
Great demo and very good comparison. I have a one question which one is more suitable for classical piano player and it will be great if you can suggest some other higher model for me as I am learning a classical music & I already have a yamaha U1J Acoustic piano. I have found 2 options one is MP11se and second is Kawai CA79 which is a new model, unfortunately I haven’t try both model but Kawai Grand feel action’s are very highly suggested in many reviews...It will be great if you can help me with this. Thank you so much 😊
Bhavesh Mistry As it says here in the demo, you have to try for yourself. But if it helps, I have a Kawai CA97 which I love, but my piano teacher who plays at concert pianist level uses an FP90 constantly and loves it (he says the keyboard is very similar to the Steinway). He also uses Pianoteq as the modelled piano, so the internal sounds are irrelevant. Have a look at him playing at Phil Best Piano here on RU-vid.
I realized it is the upper partials that you mention that gives the piano its unique sound. For this very same reason to large of speakers don't work to well. The tone becomes too bassy, Again I love your playing. The harmonic complexity provides the necessary sonority to actually evaluate the tone of the instrument. At my computer, with about 1" speakers, the Kawai sounds the best, but both are very good. Which is the easiest to transport? Back on the subject of wattage, it can depend on the speaker magnets, and the efficiency of the amplifier. Some of the new LED light bulbs put out tremendously bright light at very low wattage. As a drummer, I can tell your for sure the accompaniment feel on the Roland is much better. That short sample from the Roland was right in the groove. The Kawai sounded horribly mechanical.
You don't have to have complexity of tone to have a great tone, however. And in digitals, a lot of complexity is dialed in and it seems like modified reverb to my ears. For acoustics, Fazioli, Yamaha, to a degree Bosendorfer give a more fundamental tone and a lower amount of sympathetic resonance in their piano than does Steinway and Kawai. Therefore, you tend to get what some would call clean vs.complex sounding instrument. The bass notes of the ES8 are strong and the piano has a darker quality but to my ears, the Roland, less dark, is clearer but still there is a lot of "processed resonance" going on. It's all OK, you learn the instrument but I think all of these digital instruments have their compromises that even acoustic pianos have. Acoustics are just more natural in their compromises.
I'm looking at these two and the yamaha p-515, but I currently have a yamaha with very heavy key action and people say the p515 is heavy as well, so I'm probably not going for that one. Meanwhile these two both seem really good, but the FP90 is 200€ more expensive in my country, so I might go for the Kawai. (1400 vs 1200€) I'm mostly interested in having good piano sounds, and the ones on the kawai seem really good.
Jesus man, I can't choose. Hearing mixed reviews about the fp-90x due to modelling sound, but always played an fp-80 which I find great. But that Kawai sounds so great as well...
Hi Gregman 01, yep, it's a big difference (we do touch on it a few times in the vid) in the quantity of tones. The FP90 definitely has a wider range of settings where it's well-equipped. The ES8 still stands as an excellent acoustic piano alternative for certain stage settings or smaller home environments - even with the unlimited polyphony on the FP90, the ES8 88-note sampling holds its own :). Hope you enjoyed the video, and thanks for the comment! -stu
All those sounds don’t mean anything if the keys don’t feel right. I’ve been a Yamaha guy and recently tried the ES8 and was really impressed, the action is really special, very expressive, you should def try one out. The p515 is actually a pretty good alternative, but has much heavier feel, and I’m getting tired of the standard Yamaha piano sounds.
Fer De Armas Haven’t tried the FP90 but I’ve never cared for the Roland feel, it has a weird spongy/bouncy action that feels unnatural. To me the p515 feels like a slightly heavier p125, so if you like the feel of Yamahas lower models you’ll probably like the 515. The ES8 is the only one I’ve tried that can fool my brain into thinking that I’m playing an acoustic piano, the action and key surfaces just feel right.
@@TodaysEdition Thanks for answer my friend, are you tried the older ES7?, it feel faster and lighter than the ES8?, are you a trained classical or jazz player?...
Great comparison. Unfortunately, I still cannot decide which one to buy. But I noticed one mistake: The ES-8 is also available in white, therefore, the overview in the last part of the video should be updated.
That comparison would be good for people who already own the ES8, I guess, but I'd really like to see the "updated" version of *this* comparison: the new ES920 vs the new FP-90X. I need someone to tell me why I should (or should not) spend $600 more for the FP-90X than the ES920.
Im trying to decide what keyoboard to buy, and this was a very helpful video. Im just curious, was the ES8 recorded with a room mic? I've loved how it sounds in every other video of yours ive seen it in, but in this video the tone seems very muted and muddy.
I own a Roland fp-90. I love the keyboard action, but have been unable to get anything close to the clarity and realism of sound through the inboard speakers that's represented in this video. When the sound levels are turned down, the sound is clinky and insufficiently robust. When I turn it up, it quickly becomes too loud and hard to control. I just can't find the sweet spot and I never get the clarity and realism that you do. Is there an adjustment or set of adjustments I might try? If I can't "get it right," I'll try to sell the unit, but I'd much rather find the adjustment that delivers the sound quality that you're achieving. Btw, the sound is Ok through high-end headphones but only on the upright settings.
Helle there hahha I used to have the same issue; pretty soon I found the sweet sport where with headphones sounds amazing and I really had a bad time making it sound as good with the speakers at higher volumen. The key is in "piano designer". (Single note key adjustment and the frequency). I was going to sell it too but man the PHA-50 action is amazing, I really love it so I strongly recomend you not to sell it. Because, for me, the only action that is better is the one of the Kawai MP11 (MP11SE). I love it too but not as portable as FP-90. Other option can be get the FP-90X with a slightly better piano sound and a few dollars apart.
@@rawcoconutgirl why Is that funny? I own two acoustic pianos (one of them is handmade) and a digital Yamaha P255. These things are pretty cheap compared to a real piano....
@@rawcoconutgirl also, it’s cool you live in Hawaii. I was just in Honolulu for a week and considering moving there. It’s way too loud and chaotic here in Chicago
Excellent comparison! I have some experience with the Kawai ES8 and several Roland digital piano models. My favorite, by far is my old Roland FP7F, while I will be donating my Kawai ES8 to the local high school music department. My reasons are the difficult menu navigation with the small screen (a similar problem with the Roland FP90), along with limited bass response with the ES8 (I had to add a iLoud speaker system to get bass splits to sound right). I also have a Roland FP80 which is good, but lacks the subtle dynamic playability of my old Roland FP7F.
CLASSICAL PIANO QUESTION: DYNAMICS: Is it possible to "play" (meaning play as if on a grand piano) pp thru ff (or ppp thru fff) and get the proper output volume for a fixed volume setting? Digital pianos' Achilles heel are pianissimos. Does anyone offer a "calibrated output" to reproduce the actual sampled grand playing experience.
It's indeed all about personal taste. Both pianos are great BUT.... I have the Kawai for 1 year and I can't use it anymore one stage!! The triple sensors starts to fail. A general problem for the Kawai and that's realy a shame!!!
Raf Van Brandt Hey there- have you already had them replaced by your dealer? Kawai recently redesigned and changed production on ES8 to resolve the issue you’re referring to. I’d look into it and see if you can get a part replacement covered under warranty. Cheers, Stu
Jitin Misra, we received written confirmation from the factory that they have designed a new key switch board with a completely new rubber key switch cup. The new rubber cups are blue in color, which makes it easy to differentiate between the old and new (if you open it up). Based on what we have seen, the new design seems to have completely resolved the previous service issues that some customers were experiencing. Thanks!-stu
@@MerriamPianos is there any chance you can resend email (vitali85@list.ru). I want to make remote order and make sure shop has new version. Would be nice to have written confirmation from factory for the shop
In my opinion, FP 90 has more features than the ES8 and you can create your own sound depends on your taste.. Other digital pianos are mostly samples from previous models.
These reviews are quite helpful, but I sure wish you'd also run your audio outs to a mixer, rather than using a mic to record the keyboards's built-in speakers...That's like pointing a video cam at a monitor. You could've included a segment where you recorded the speakers, to show how they differ. But to hear the sounds the keyboards actually create, only Line Outs are legitimate.
zeppy13131 Hi Zeppy, both the ES8 and the Roland have stereo line outs running to a mixer for the video, plus my lapel mic. There’s actually no room mic at all, just those three audio sources. I think you’re suggesting that we completely kill the lapel sound so you’re only hearing the line outs, which we may try for future videos. I’ll just need to plan to not talk for a few minutes...lol easier said than done! Thanks for the comment, -Stu
@@MerriamPianos I'd rather hear the onboard speakers as they sound recorded. I think you do a good job with the audio. The bottom line is the final speakers affect the audio tremendously, and most of us are listening to your demos through our computer's speakers.
@Merriam Music The Kawai acoustic piano sounds like it’s mono. I’m listening to this video with good headphones. Are you sure the inputs on your mixer were panned hard left & right for the Kawai? It’s really a big difference imo. It’s actually hard to believe - something sounds very wrong! Otherwise a very nice and comprehensive review, thanks!
Sounds like the ES-8’s audio is not the line out - I can hear some room reverb in there and no stereo separation. Might be why the Roland seems louder, because we can hear the direct line out vs the speaker‘s sound on the Kawai.
Question on GM2 samples: The Roland FP-90 has the GM2 samples included. The soon-to-arrive ES920 does not. Does this make any difference to the sounds that the keyboard can generate, or does it only affect the playback of an external MIDI stream? Thanks.
@@AngeloTsocosMusic which Kawai do you have and what did you need to replace? I am afraid I would not be able to do any repairs once the 5 year warranty runs out...
I don't recall if I ever tested the Kawai ES8 but if the key bottoms are as spongy and squishy as the Grand Feel II action found on the CA67/97/68/98 models then I don't think I'd consider it. The piano sound on the ES8 in this video is so very nice though!
@@taizanmeidou *Actually, you are incorrect and did not pay attention to the difference in weights and overall build. Typical snooty comment on your part, tho.*
I own the original Kawai ES1 that I purchased almost 20 years ago, and am finally deciding to upgrade ... tough decision. I've been watching reviews for the past 3 weeks and am slightly leaning toward the fp-90. Thanks for the great review.
The kawai is better! Trust me. And the audio here is not compliment the kawai. I use to have Roland RD800. And now i have the Kawai Mp7se (same sound and action as the es8) and the kawai is better sound and better key action.
Great review! But as a classical and jazz pianist, learning flamenco, could you tell something about the repetition mechanique? How fast can you repeat the same note? Quite important to me......
First of all, very nice playing with a solid technique. Was this a recording the speaker sounds or a direct input. the Roland sound considerable brighter, bu that could be the amplifier, or just the settings. I own an ES7 which I love, and am eagerly waiting for the ES9 or some other model to supersede the ES8. As an industry insider, can you please shed some light on it? Thank you in advance.
Thank you for this comparison ; i own a es8 ; I find that the es8 sounds better with earphones than with his own loudspeaker ; what can i use to replace the louspeakers of es8 : monitoring speakers (powered), keyboard amplifier, audio hi-fi device, ... ? What audio system do you use in this demo, please ?
@@gustavopaulette3496 I didn't really publish videos since I'm pretty much a novice still. My videos are unlisted so i can share with just friends. But here is one. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-90kTsVykqMg.html
Stu, I worry about the 'age' of the ES8 and was really hoping for an ES9 at NAMM this year (which didn't come). Do you think the ES8 remains a viable long-term purchase in 2020, or would it be better to wait for its successor?
Hi Scott - great question. I know there was some anticipation that the ES8 would be replaced this year. I know that they redesigned some core elements of the ES8 in late 2019, so that may have pushed back the development of the ES9 by 6-12 months. To answer your question, I think with the upgraded sensor strips, I do think the ES8 remains musically relevant in 2020 without question. In my mind the only major knock against it is the lack of Bluetooth Audio or MIDI - aside from that I love the thing. -stu
@@ferdearmas8732 FP90 is better. You have to go in a store and try these, personally I utterly despise the FP90. Feels like total shit to my fingers. But objectively, it's action is better designed. Key feel is another thing... the keys feel like a bunch of spongy marshmallows. I'd rank them ES8, 515, and FP90 in terms of feel. Same order for sound quality (the FP90 sounds like shit)
Kawai getting new sound engine of Onkyo that known as producer of audiophile high end speakers that you can find in Kawai CN 29 and Kawai CN 39 and newer Kawai CA series. Sound completely change in new Kawai digital pianos, they become best sound digital pianos and Kawai invested hard in headset technology. Kawai become more superior than any Roland series in sound quality.
Hello, Stu, I'm sorry, but all Roland digital pianos sound like pressed by a tuppa bowl... Just unnatural, for plastic, muffy. Or, if you use the piano app, suddenly metallic and "piniii," you understand? 😂
The korg rh3 has no relation to the kawai action.. its build by korg self... been around for a decade, where the kawai RH3 is and evolution in the past 2 or 3 years from kwais rh2 action...
Yes, that's correct. The NORD Grand however does use the RH3 from Kawai. I think I may have said Korg and then quickly corrected myself to Nord in the video when referencing this. Generally though, wouldn't it be nice if the two companies didn't select the EXACT SAME abbreviation for their actions? Thanks for the comment! -stu
