With the intro of mh3 I think historic needs almost a total revamp. The cards that were just brought into the format are so much stronger than the cards that have been rebalanced over the years. For instance, why the hell is four color omnath five mana in historic when we can play guide of souls and necrodominance? Why is bolt banned when we can play galvanic discharge? They either need to “unbalance” some of the rebalanced cards which I’d prefer or ban a whole slew of cards from mh3 which would suck.
It's not like un-alchemizing Omnath or Alrund's Epiphany is going to make those cards playable. Historic will remain MH3 Block Constructed until you deal with Ajani and the intentionally pushed energy cards that just demolish any kind of fair deck. Unbanning Bolt and Counterspell sure as hell isn't going to help with the meta being 70% RWx Bombardment and 20% RWU sweeper tribal. This isn't even to mention problem cards like Symmetry Sage and Yawgmoth that were *already* ruining Historic and never got touched. If you banned all of MH3 today, the format would still suck, because nobody at WotC has paid any attention to it in years and just let it fester.
Fwiw, Bolt is never dead in a matchup as it can go face while Discharge can be virtually dead. Before Discharge, Red did not have a guaranteed 3 damage burn spell to hit creatures for 1 mana at instant speed which put it way behind Black in the removal department when compared to Fatal Push. You can talk about the whole Energy control package being an issue, but I think Bolt is more problematic than Discharge, especially since Wizards was a top tier deck pre-MH3 that would have gladly added Bolt to Wizard's Lightning in their Burn package that could go face.
It doesn't help that a lot of the cards on the historic ban lost were added very early into the formats life cycle, some of them probably wouldn't be on the ban lost if they were added to the format today
Bolt at least is still generically better than Discharge. I don't think either should be legal. Unbanning Bolt doesn't fix Discharge, it makes the problem worse. Now red has TWO stupid good 1 mana removal spells.
Hey, here's a comment. Recover as best you can and thanks for the commentary and conceptual consideration of the game. There have been off-the-cuff things you've mentioned in gameplay videos that have been very useful to me in a broad philosophical sense and I appreciate that a lot.
Respectfully I still think that Pioneer earns that distinction. Between low format engagement, an increasingly topheavy metagame and WotC's minimal acknowledgment the format exists because they can't heavily monetize it yet and it's just plainly an unpleasant time being a Pioneer player.
@@SurlyDuff814 However dull you might think Amalia/Phoenix/Sorin/Nykthos/Waste Not/Te5eri is, there are plenty of T2 decks that can still compete. The power disparity in Historic is so bad that your only options are to play MH3 RW aggro, MH3 RWU control, or some kind of combo deck with everyone's favorite broken Alchemy tutors. It doesn't even feel like you're playing Magic in the Historic queues right now.
i miss when historic was where we could play our rotated standard cards. instead they immediately added additional cards to the format making most of those standard cards worthless.
Yeah that was the whole point of historic when it came out. A place to play your rotated standard cards and play old decks with new cards as well. Was a brewers format but became a block constructed set with MH3
Cruised to mythic with Boros energy last month, probably lost 1 game between platinum and mythic. Felt completely unfair in the historic meta and no one was one it. Came back after magiccon queued up on historic and literally every deck is boros. I guess I need to find the counter to my own deck.
i got a dragonstorm deck for historic and timeless thats really good. Here it is. 4 faithless looting, 4 dragonstorm, 4 strike it rich, 4 ruby medallion, 4 fable of mirror, 4 seasoned pyro, 4 cathartic pyre, 4 mizzex mastery, 3 terror of peaks, 1 myrimm sentinal wurm, 1 inferno of the star, 1 drakuseth maw of flames, 2 gamble, 4 spikefiled hazard. 16 mountains. Ruby makes the deck alot faster. Ive beat boros energy with this deck. And i play 4 botherhoods end in SB for go wide decks. Only con of my deck is its a GY strategy, and being mono red it has limited SB options. However the card draw ,tokens, and combo kill makes it good.
"There's no one in Vintage trying to really break it" Jim says after one of the biggest prize pool events in Magic history just happened as a Vintage tournament.
The issue with historic right now is that you either have to attack with MH3 cards, or answer MH3 attackers with MH3 sweepers. Because too much of the good interaction is otherwise banned in historic. I'm thinking of getting into timeless, but I don't like that that's just a lot of the same cards over and over as well.
Dude, competitive timless from platinum to mithyc is only historic mh3 decks with little upgrade. But essentially you have the same cards and the same issues. Mtg is ruined… 1 and 2 mana card are better than 6 mana card. 2 mana ajany is better than an old 6 mana planeswalker like Liliana/vraska. This is a problem and they decided that it won’t be solved.
this deck has been a pain to play against. all those triggers lol reminds me when cat cauldron decks were popular and you just sat there through all their triggers getting pinged lol. my hardest match up used to be blue red wizards now its this energy deck. it has so much synergy
I feel like ban the flip walkers in Historic and, maybe, one of either Ocelot Pride or Guide of Souls and Historic gets to play with the neat new cards and won't have had the powerlevel punch up beyond what it had when Historic Horizons (MH1 and 2's weaker cards) dropped.
i actually didn't know the ban list in historic. its kind of funny seeing all the new cards now knowing whats on the list. i wonder if an unbanning is coming or something.
I started running this deck after hearing about it through someone saying boogie man in reference to historic when talking about draft. Deck is really fun I had to sub a bunch of the cards but in turn have found ruby collector to be really strong as a 1 of curious what you think.
I really think its worth dropping the leonin vanguard for fable of the mirror breaker, copying ocelots and fable tokens is too busted. And if your dropping lurrus i think phlage over esper sentinel is also nice
I think not playing lootmonger is a big miss. I understand the appeal of the cat heavy version but I find it’s a bit more fragile to wipes. Also hitting critical mass of red cards for ajani is important.
I agreen. Phlage is just as powerful as Uro within Historic's context. It trades potential ramp and a cantrip for board control and a faster win condition, but I feel the powerlevel is equivalent in Historic, and thus will require a ban. For Modern, I think Phlage is only slightly worse than Uro, but is still excellent. I bet it'll be one of the new boogeymen of Modern once Nadu is banned.
Phlage is even better than Uro, because it's in white, a color you *have* to play now for Wrath of the Skies. Uro is only really better in formats with Force of Will.
I can get not finding modern fun rn, but idk that it's not conductive to brewing; of course you have to brew for power but the best version of decks can take a lot of time to find, like rakdos scam was not a good deck in the first 10 months after mh2
2 mana planes walker kills sooo many brews in my opinion. I was sick of life gain mono white now it's just reinforced by this crap. Stop power creeping the fun out of your game wotc. Not every game mode has to win by turn 3!
Yeah, Modern is Atrocious now and will be unfortunately. Maby ban them in Modern all of them and rename them to LEgacy Hprizom. Or at least all the overpowered cards and make Legacy an competitive format also so the cards still can be used by the ones who have bought them
On the topic of power creep, if they decide to print the flipped version of delver as a straight up 3/2 flier for one blue mana, would it be playable in modern or legacy?
Maybe not Modern (more removal running around), but it would be gross in Legacy. Getting to play a 1 drop that aggressive with Daze and Force of Will backing it up would suck to play against. Delver needing essentially a coin flip on upkeep to transform helps balance it. It also importantly wouldn't be soft to Bowmasters any more.
That's similar to what Dragon Rage's Channeler is, though it's Red (so it doesn't pitch to Forces) and you can't always get it "flipped" on turn one. The forced attack can be awkward at times, but it also surveils on noncreatures which is pretty big.
I feel like this deck needs Soul Warden + Voice of the Blessed to break the mirror. Because if they have either they’ll probably just go over top of you
There's definitely an element of old man yells at clouds with modern brewing. Regardless of MH the more cards in the format, the more likely very powerful format defining cards get printed or synergies get pushed to max. With enough cards, eventually, some decks are going to have the gas and begin to define the format. Eventually, given enough time, every format will become less diverse. That's why you rotate or highly curate.
heres a theory: esper sentinel is really bad. a one mana 1/1 is not doing it anymore. in modern magic every card is drawing so many cards and doing so much stuff, it feels like every game is a game about tempo rather than card advantage
