While I will agree that it's a particularly egregious example of the show sabotaging itself, and I went into Series 10 knowing that Simm would be returning... I have to admit, when it finally happened, I _was_ still actually somewhat surprised. I didn't know which episode he'd be appearing in, and he played his role of Mr. Razor so well that I genuinely didn't recognize him until the big reveal. Still would've been _way_ better not knowing beforehand at all, but at least for me it wasn't _completely_ soured.
The reason for the leak of Simm returning in World Enough and Time was done because someone working on set had supposedly blabbed to The Sun newspaper who were going to print it as a story, so basically the BBC decided just to get in there first.
There was also a live flub moments before the official reveal of Peter Capaldi as #12. I don't recall who it was who was talking on screen on that broadcast, but they said something like, "I was talking with Peter" and then I think they realized their error and after a short pause added "Davison".
I remember watching the series 10 premiere and getting so hyped upon seeing Simm in the coming soon trailer. But it did sting to learn while watching the episode that it was always meant to be a surprise reveal. I would've much preferred realising as it was happening instead of literally within a minute of his introduction as Razor. But the moment itself was still great.
That's honestly why I love seeing RU-vidr's who react to series 10 and skip the "Next time" segments. Their shock when John Simm's Master is revealed in World Enough and Time was the exact reaction everyone else should've gotten. So while many didn't get that surprise, there are still people nowadays who do.
Doctor Who once did an opposite of next time on. For season 2 of new who the BBC had this texting service where they would send you this mini prequel clip an episode. Tardis "Tardisodes, also stylised as TARDISodes, were mini-episodes which served as prologues for each episode of series two of the BBC Wales version of Doctor Who.They were made available serially, with a new one debuting in the week prior to the episode to which they were attached. They were primarily meant to be seen on mobile telephones and were released to paying phone subscribers first. As each week progressed, however, the BBC made them available as webcasts. The Tardisodes were meant to accompany the BBC's Doctor Who tie-in websites for series two. "
I thankfully managed to remain spoiler-free at the time - I didn't have a real TV so was only going on iPlayer to watch DW, and as a point of principle never watched the "Next Time" stuff. I'm so glad about that, because the reveal was so fun. I'm decent with faces so I was like "I swear I've seen Razor before, just can't place them", which only enhanced the reveal.
@@DanBen07 depends how far away the episode is. I don't watch the "next time" because it's only a week (typically). I've watched the 60th trailers for example
Apparently the reason for simm's return of the master was due it getting leaked online before the first episode of that series aired and the BBC had no choice but to include him in the trailer after the episode finished
That thumbnail legit made me think that john simm was returning again as the master before I read the title! I'd like to see him return and see him regenerate into a new master (I believe Missy is many incarnations after him). Maybe he regenerated into dhawan?
In reality, in my Doctor Who, Missy is actually a stolen body, but one that the Master was connected to mentally via a machine. Missy's death would cause the Master to wake up from this experience and he would regenerate thanks to a second stolen body he had successfully incorporated into his regenerations, this body would be played by Ben Miller, the person who played the Sheriff in Robot of Sherwood
@@mattthesilent777RED The first two subordinate clauses in your tirade literally disagree with each other entirely. This is yet more proof of how deluded you clearly are; you can’t even be bothered to make your ramblings internally consistent, let alone make actual sense in the real world!
Well in 'The Doctor Falls' Missy does talk to the Master about remembering being him, and the tone they take is very famiiar, as if she is his direct replacement. In 'Cold Water' she talks about having left Gallifrey, and we know the Saxon Master was last seen on Gallifrey. So that means he must have left Gallifrey after it came out of the pocket universe in 'Time of the Doctor', had some adventures, then ended up on the Mondas ship, having burned out his TARDIS. He then gets killed by Missy, who he also kills, telling her not to try regenerating. The animosity and closeness between them is very up-front, implying you're to think they are successive regenerations. It's an odd relationship. She is conflicted, almost ambivalent towards him. While he both hates her and is drawn to her. Missy is kind of detached mad, while the Saxon Master is angry and cruel mad. Maybe the shock of regenerating into the very person who had just killed him sent the Master (then Missy) potty. In effect it's Missy's own little time-loop. She causes herself to be created (by killing her previous self), and to finally die (killed by the same previous self just before he dies). She is both the cause of her creation and of her demise. But if you think about it there's an obvious way out of this. The Master knows that Missy is his next regeneration, and is convinced he's killed her. "This was always where we've always been going. This is our perfect ending." But the Saxon regeneration isn't that clever. He's forgotten that what he knows, his future self will know. Which is Missy. There's no point in trying to kill your future self, as your future self will have years to preparee for it. Maybe that's why Missy's laughing, as she lays on the ground, pretending to be hurt, when she's actually wearing an anti-Laser-Spanner device. Then she waits until the Master has disappeared down the lift, to die and turn into her, and just gets up, dusts herself off and heads off to have more adventures with Big Finish. Eventually she regenerates into Sacha Dhawan, by which time he's still round the bend, only angry again. So he goes go back to Gallifrey and destroys it. Pretty much fits with what we see on screen, can't think of any evidence to the contrary. There we are. Sorted. No contradictions, nice and easy. Simm-Gomez-Dhawan.
@@lorisarvendu Doctor Who canon is that when a time lord meets another of their selves, the earlier self *cannot remember* the meeting once they part. It's explicitly stated in the 50th anniversary special that Ten and the War Doctor won't remember that they tried to save Gallifrey instead of destroy it. Nine might remember meeting the Moment, but he wouldn't remember anything after the wormhole opened up and the other two got involved. As far as he's concerned, he was about to use the Moment, and then he was in the TARDIS regenerating; he probably assumed it was spillover from the Moment that killed him. (But he'd remember that she'd said his punishment for using her would be that he'd survive.) It's an interesting question how much Missy remembers. My assumption would be that as soon as Missy appeared at the other end of the ship, the effect would start, so that there would be no memory of all the time he was with Bill. Otherwise he'd remember seeing his other self on the TV screen, and that would seem to be contradicted by "The Three Doctors" since One only saw Two and Three on a screen, but Two had no memory of that meeting.
Here's 1 you missed, the description for Heaven Sent on the iplayer (and possibly other streaming sites) spoils the ending of the episode. In the description towards the end it says "Pursued by the fearsome creature known only as the Veil, he must attempt the impossible. *If he makes it through, Gallifrey is waiting... *" YEAH GREAT JOB GUYS. Just spoil what was one of the most epic, jaw dropping reveals ever. What idiot wrote that? I'm glad I saw the episode live otherwise I'd be really annoyed if I read that before seeing the episode.
I’m actually surprised the Radio Times cover featuring the Human Dalek hybrid a week before the episode was transmitted wasn’t mentioned in this, cos that was a major spoiler
I'm glad the spoiler at the end of Fear Her was mentioned, I've been arguing about this on the doctor who youtube video asking "What did you think was hiding in the Void Ship?" Obviously Daleks they spoiled it in the previous episode!
It is telling that some of the best twists have been about the master - Jacobi and then later Dhawan. Simm returning could have been among those if they hadn't spoiled it.
None of these were spoiled for me and it was a special surprise for my doctor to come back as 14. But I will never forgive the entire concept of regen being spoiled for me. I was talking to a friend about DW who was watching 12 while I was watching 9. I had ZERO idea the doctor she was watching was a different actor. She told me I was approaching the David Tenant era and explained regen. ...every time I rewatch 9's Regen, I am sad for the lack of surprise.
How about the announcement that Christopher Eccleston was leaving Doctor Who even though Christopher Eccleston hadn't given his official word on his leaving Doctor Who. Oops!
Surprised that titling a Series 1 (New Who) episode "Dalek" didn't make this list! Again, meant to be a big deal in the rebooted universe, but spoiled by both the episode title and (I think?) the "Next Time..." trail on the previous episode.
Please correct if I'm wrong- but I do remember reading a long time ago that a British newspaper found out Simm was returning... and was going to post it and spoil it for Everyone anyway... so the BBC thought "if the fans are going to find out, they'll find out through us and not someone else "
Simm returning as the master genuinely was a surprise to me, given what I've just watched, I have no idea how I managed that, I mean, I definitely wouldn't have read the news article, so either I missed the previous episode entirely the firdt time round, or I didn't watch the next time trailer at the end, either way, Simm returning was a complete and total shock to me at the time and I am so happy it was
Other such times the BBC and Doctor Who spoiled it self 1. Christopher Eccleston to step down as The Doctor 2. Paul McGann taking part and having filmed a min-episode for the 50th Anniversary 3. Paul McGann's Web-Isode leaking days in advance of the scheduled air date 4. The Return of Captain Jack during Jodie's era
McGann's return was spoilered for me as when that 50th anniversary minisode appeared on the BBC iPlayer, someone had helpfully put up an image of McGann (from the TV movie, I think). That was just a little bit of a hint...
I actually forgot about the Daleks death ray in the finale trailer, so I exploded with joy when The Cult of Skaro came out of the Sphere and that cliffhanger still gives me goose bumps to this day.
Slightly off topic, but I would like to see Russell T Davies think outside the box (or TARDIS) and do a retro episode in the campy, low budget style of the Tom Baker era doctor...maybe revisiting a world from that era 🤔
I would welcome that! In those days you could understand every word spoken, unlike today's mumbling that gets drowned out by loud orchestral music that isn't necessary!
Low quality, campy, shaky sets, wobbly Aliens and washing up liquid bottles spaceships wouldnt work for modern audiences. They wouldn't get it and it would be slated. Also think how terrible they'd look with the high definition Huge screens people have now. I understand what you mean but I really think it wouldn't work today 😕
@@weatherwitchandfelinefamiliars It depends how this episode is produced. UK soap operas are still made in pretty much the same way & remain popular. If it was down to me, I would make such an episode in black-and-white for the atmospheric effect alone. It looks like The Space Pirates: Episodes 4, 5 & 6 have been found so, we now wait to see how they appear to a modern audience.
One that was missed was in Journey’s End. It isn’t a huge one but at the end of The Stolen Earth, 10 is regenerating and the beginning of the Journey’s End shows the Previously scenes ending with the regeneration right before the opening credits. During the opening credits, David Tennant’s name is still there, meaning he would still be the doctor. It’s not a huge spoiler, but it kind of makes the scene a bit anticlimactic seeing his name and realizing he isn’t going anywhere. It didn’t spoil how his face would stay the same though, but it is a bit revealing.
I really don’t like the NewWho weaponized regeneration. I like the fan theory that the Time Lords did that for the Time War. But, why not upgrade the time pods so it doesn’t damage the T.A.R.D.I.S.
I feel like season 1 of the revival having an episode called "Dalek" with the previous episode showing a Dalek in the "next time" thing was also a spoiler. Kind of takes away the mystery of the episode when we already know that it's a Dalek.
Slight correction on the series 8 leaks: it was actually the first 5 or so episodes that leaked in 2014 not just the first 2! The scripts might have been only for the first two though because I only recall coming across Deep Breath in my research. I'd be curious to see if those copies still exist online anywhere, they'll be a fun piece of the shows history one day imo
It'd be cool to get a spoiler free regeneration, with the cliffhanger cut on the regeneration and no one knows who's going to play the next. Almost like 2 -> 3.
Spoilering will be met with... nothing. No one will do anything about it, and it will keep happening because no one likes fun anymore. To be fair and precise, not all of these are examples of "spoilering", which is the act of posting spoilers with the intent to ruin someone's experience. Some were just boneheads being boneheaded. I am, of course, mostly immune, given my hermit-like existence. But any one of these likely would have led to my incarceration. I don't like hurting people, but sometimes it's necessary. Don't post spoilers. You're not as cool as you think. Let people have their fun. It's safer in the long run.
They should of left the 13th Doctors regeneration panning out with doctor who will return in 2023 and then wait till the 60th to announce David Tennant and Catherine Tate’s return
I learned to mute Twitter on the Doctor Who air day…after the BBC spoiled the reveal of Missie as the Master for those of us in a time zone other than GMT🤦♀️
The Five Doctors novelization release before the episode aired on the TV in the 80s. I don't know this counts as spoiled but when Doctor Who Came Back in 2005 wasn't surprised because in an anniversary special a few years before one of the 80s doctors said that he heard it was coming in a few years. The season 2 of new who they did like this text service and you could get like a prequel clips to an episode. I can't remember if they spoils the sontarans look for New who s4 with radio times. I remember some images like those aliens made out of human fat all over taxi. Before Matt Smith's first episode they release the clip on red button of him hanging out the TARDIS going past Big Ben I remember watching it over and over. I also remember watching a clip of Clara and the doctor on an aeroplane over & over but not sure where & pretty sure it was shown before the episode. I think some episode previews ok if it's not too spoiler. Matt Smith had some othere mini episodes that was set before an episode or season. When companion Bill Potts was announced thay release the scene from the episode but in the actual episode it wasn't exactly the same. Jodie Whittaker era. In her first season at the beginning of one of the episodes they did have a trailer of sorts music listing all the guest stars with the actors names. Some RU-vidrs were warning people that the showrunner might change the doctor as we know them which turned out to be the timeless child. I also had lots of moments and Doctor Who were they were surprised and it was not spoiled and I didn't know it was going to happen.
Luckily I think I managed to miss most of these Spoilers. I knew that John Simm was returning as the Master for Series 10 thanks to the BBC News article, but due to happenstance I missed a few episodes airing and had to catch up on them on BBC Iplayer. I therefore skipped the "Next Time" trailer for "World Enough and Time" and went straight to the episode and got to experience the full Master reveal un-spoilt. One leak that I was surprised was missed was the early appearance of Dalek Sec at the 2006 BAFTAs roughly a month before the airing of "Army of Ghosts". RTD is reported to have said "Oh for fucks sake, it's the black one" upon seeing it turn up on stage.
I always hated it when there was a big reveal of the enemy, like the Daleks or the Cybermen (for example, who is in the ship in The Power of the Daleks) but of course they spoil the surprise by adding the enemy in the title of the episode. So usually it's not a case of "Who could it be?" it's a case of "When are they showing up?"
I was so annoyed that they kept teasing the end of the Ponds' adventures! I basically never try to keep up with Dr. Who live any more because if I do I'm constantly spoiled.
To be fair peter capaldis final season I watched the first 2 episodes and the watched the final episodes because I really just hated the direction they were going that series and then I found out John Simm was coming back so I came back. So I watched all of the bits with Clara in and then gave up after weird space water girlfriend showed up until John Simm came back 😂
The last entry is patr of why I do not watch much of the "next time" trailers. I did not have the Simm return spoiled and I think that's part of why I view the season 10 finale to be the best finale of the show
I think you’ll find most people still watched TV in black and white when Season 8 was released. Not entirely sure of the relevance here, though. (Unless, of course, you meant to say Series 8 instead, which does get a mention in such a context in this video?)
I've not read an issue for years, but for ages at the beginning of New Who, the worst culprits for spoilers were the BBC themselves, or more particularly, the Radio Times. New Monster? Cover story. Shock return? Cover story. Ambiguous cover image? This is how we did it SFX-explanation article. They would have lost nothing, and could have gained so much appreciation if they had only saved such deep dives into episodes for the week *following* broadcast.
And there are episode and story title that also gives us spoilers. Such as anything with the Deleks or Cybermen in the title let's us know that it has Daleks and Cybermen in it so we can't really be surprised that they show up in it. So there was no point in making the reveal a big surprise. Any story or episode with the name of the bad guy in it has already ruined the surprise
I live in America, and DW Power of the Doctor was like at night for me, but when it was screened for Britain, it was not even lunch for me!! And YT Poster a video and I saw it!! Yeah, I knew David was 14 before I knew and saw the Power Of The Doctor Well, yeah!
The inclusion of the black dalek “sec” in the season 2 finale was ruined when it appeared at an awards show some weeks earlier. RTD and co were accepting an award when a dalek was meant to come on and accept the award with them. But someone in charge of brining the dalek to the awards show brought the black one which wasnt meant to be seen till it appeared at the end of ‘army of ghosts’.
The Impossible astronaut has always bothered me for this reason.... Matt Smith's doctor was on his final regeneration as we discovered in his last season... so. when the astronbaut shot him....just what was he regenerating IN to? there shouldnt have BEEN any regeneration energy at all!
Well as it was confirmed at the end of Series 6, It obviously wasn't The Doctor, the Robot that took his Identity to fake his death also faked the Regeneration, which is probably why it had a unique effect. And probably told the robot's inner team to fake it so not to immediately let his friends know something is wrong.
It's explained in the series finale The Wedding of River Song. spoilers below That was never The Doctor. It was a robot duplicate. The regeneration energy was presumably just special effects.
To be honest even if they didn't announce that simm was returning it was obvious that the character he was disguised as in the episode was simm, you could easily tell...the prosthetics were good but the voice gave it away
The Witchfinders: a classic? You have to be kidding, right? Terrible, terrible, terrible episode. One of the very worst I can remember and I have been watching my whole life (though I can't remember anything before the Troughton era)
One of the benefits of living Down Under in the pre-internet days. Things were hardly ever spoiled, and you knew what to avoid to prevent possible spoilers. These days, if you don’t want your favourite show spoiled, you have to go off-grid, out bush, or you just might have your favourite show spoiled by read something completely unrelated to it (either by an ad, or just some douche posting something in a comment…).
I remember when Night of the Doctor was released, there was an article in The Age online (a Melbourne newspaper). It said McGann had returned and basically gave the whole plot away in a sentence or two. Unfortunately that was before I had seen or even knew about the episode.
The John Simms returning really fucked me off as they said it was already spoiled so they may as well put it in the trailer, well I didn't know he was coming back. They could have just left him out of it for the people who didn't know he was returning to enjoy the surprise.
I'm afraid the bad makeup and the voice would have spoiled Simm's return for me, even if it wasn't spoiled. Anthony Ainley had better disguises than Simm, and that's saying something!
Tom Baker is my favorite doctor. He brought such fun and energy to the role. David Tennant is the only other to come close enough to make the series good again. that's why he was so popular with fans as well 5 series is a good run. Tom had 7.
For me simms master returning was a huge surprise because I watched much later on my dvd because I was not loving that season as I found bill to be quite annoying
The John Simm return spoiler soured almost all of season 10 for me!! I knew from the start, so I was expecting it some time early or half way through, constantly mildly disappointed as I realised it was for the finale! When the inhabitant of the vault was still a secret, I heard the four knocks coming from it and obviously now that was meant to hint at Missy, but those knocks were always associated with Simm's Master the most of all! So even though it was amazing to see her again, I was disappointed that it wasn't him! Her whole arc of gradually turning good was so compelling but I knew her past self would eventually show up to ruin it! And then the first half of the finale. Should have been the best episode ever, and without the context of spoilers it really is a work of art!! They also spoiled the return of the Mondasian Cybermen, imagine if they hadn't! A horror story of people gradually replacing their bodies, the true context of what Cybermen are, even that alone would have been such a great reveal! That was what that final scene was set up to be, two massive gut-punch reveals at once, and honestly whenever I rewatch it now it feels just the same as rewatching any other fantastic twist, analysing all the tension growing moments and appreciating what it is, except I never had that first proper surprise reaction! The closest thing to shock at the Master's return I felt was, when I had more than a split second to look at the guy's face, the sudden realisation that it was him under the mask! Literally he offered Bill some tea and I was like "don't drink the tea!! Oh, they shouldn't have spoiled this, that would have been such a cool surprise..." (Also, the fact that Missy died turning good was then undercut by the Master's return as a horrific villain again later on, but that's just inevitable I guess I mean they are the Master.) I just wonder, when would I have worked it out if I hadn't known? It was fairly obvious that the Cyberman they found was Bill, that half of the scene was probably always going to be dramatic irony for me, but what about the Master? Maybe when he revealed he knew exactly who Missy was? But then I might have assumed her future self had been there and that he was her minion causing a predestination paradox. When he said "you wouldn't be so self-destructive" emphasis on the "self" perhaps? Probably when he followed that up with "neither would I" and stopped threatening her, and almost definitely by the point he was all like "I love disguises, do you still like disguises?" but even then I might have assumed he was some never-before-seen incarnation of the past Master played by a new actor, and that point really was seconds before, and the other points were intercut between the Doctor finding Bill so I wouldn't have had time to think about it, so I still probably would have been completely blown away by John Simm's return!! It would have been such a brilliant twist, even if they'd still spoiled the Mondasian Cybermen for marketing!
I think that revealing who the next Doctor will be is a bit of a spoiler. I think we should find out as the Doctor himself/herself finds out. When Ncuti is done as the Doctor, let *that* regeneration be the reveal to everyone. But yeah... Simm's announcement was the biggest blunder. Why, BBC? Why?
If we're talking the BBC giving out spoilers, all they seem to be doing for the new series is dishing out spoilers! I know they're trying to drum up hype, but there must be a better way of doing it.
...which is why I always try to avoid spoilers and "in the next episode" tags on shows. Fortunately my memory is bad enough to normally forget rumours I couldn't avoid before the show airs. :)
Series 1 Daleks in the 2-Part Finale They Spoiled in the Next time of Boom Town. And bar Mcgann, all the Doctors they leaked months beforehand in Power of the Doctor.
Oh as far as actors appearing multiple 🤖times in different roles within the same franchise. 📺I have yet to find anything to beat Jeffrey Combs's 👨👨🏽👨🏻👨eight times on Star Trek.
I am 65 👴 . I remember watching the first episode🤖. I've been hooked ever since🚀. Good and bad and sometimes down right awful.👩🚀 But always watchable. 📺
