And the two companies are actually unrelated. Pratt and Whitney Tool made the prototype radial engines and the castings had PW embossed on it. The engine company didn’t have a name yet and the navy put the manufacturer down as Pratt and Whitney in the test report.
Well Mark, for once I’m stuck for words, what a fantastic addition to your workshop, your enthusiasm and appreciation along with your understanding of its application shines through! Thanks for a great video and all best wishes for the project.
Thank you for saving this old reliable piece of American firearms history. Truly amazing as to how it cuts rifling into a rifle barrel. Cheers from Nevada
What a great find! Thanks for sharing. I have a WF Barnes #6 lathe, patent date 1880, don't know the date of manufacture. They really knew how to build machines back then!
That was fascinating to watch, all of the motions both rotary and reciprocating timed to cut a rotary grove down the length of the bore. Mechanical engineering old school.
Oh My !! What a find. I absolutely love these old machines. This is going to be an excellent journey into barrel making. Congrats on coming home with this one.
This is a huge step in your restoration programme! To have barrels rifled on an original P&W machine is a big authenticity stamp on any restoration, and to be custodian of this wonderful machine is a great honour, interesting that you have a gain twist profile to experiment with, as you point out of course the rifling is just one step in making the barrel, and the barrel blank requires many more stages before it is a usable barrel, this machine can also produce 7 groove rifling, which of course cannot be done on a CNC programme, so you have one up on that process! Many thanks for posting! Chris B.
"... from 1873 until the factory shut down in 1859." That's quite a "glitch in the Matrix", as my son was wont to say. 🤨😉. As a machinist of some years (before CNC and during), this is something that I have wanted to see for a good many years. From the lack of chip scatter, I'd guess that this beauty is cutting on the 'pull' stroke, so as to prevent binding, wander and chatter. All guesswork, of course, but the concepts remain the same. Oh, scrape cutters, naturally (writing as I watch). You are quite right, you got the best deal of the show.
If that machine was kept in running order and used all those years in its original life and from then up until now... that makes it a pretty special item. People have definitely lost track of just how capable our ancestors were with mechanical technology that we would require CNC machinery to do now... just because a technology is old, doesn't mean it is no longer useful... hopefully we won't ever have to go back to relying on the older slower ways. But remembering the previous technologies means we still have an advantage if we have to start over from scratch... people take the technologies we have today as a given, but life on this planet has gone through some devastating setbacks before... nice to see useful knowledge preserved. Great video, thanks!
✔️ I can personally verify that the company started in 1873 and _later_ shut down in 1859. You see, my great grandson worked there from 1872 to 1858, whereupon he quit and got a job at NASA as a ramjet engineer in 1856. *(Just kidding. I personally make timeline mistakes from time to time).
Wow! You are all in now! To be able to take a rifle that is in good condition, but with a garbage bore and make it a shooter is awesome. Congratulations!
Haha! Note that after the first clip of it running, it got much quieter. I shut down the camera and remounted the motor to line up the pulleys and the squeak went away. I couldn't have taken that for very long before it drove me crazy. :)
@@thecinnabar8442 LOLOLOLOL!!!! Oh, of course, once I made the comment, THEN it stops squeaking!!! Yeah, she was noisy as all get out at first. I love that machine! I just rolled home with an old No. 4 Rolling Block with a rather toasted barrel so this was an appropriate video to keep with the theme of the day! Can't wait to see the performance from your barrels! A lot of folks don't realize what you can wring out of an old barrel or old machines.
Amazing how P&W went from gun making to aircraft engines! I live just a few miles from P&W here in Connecticut. Great find and historical piece of tooling.
Actually it makes a lot of sense that they made guns than airplane engine because once they had guns, mounting them on planes was in big demand by the military and lots of money to be made so they knew it was a smart move to ingage in the engine industry. But yess its a pretty cool company.
Incredible piece of machinery! Amazing to realize how old this marvelous machine is and the thought that it probably all so outlives the modern cnc machine. Love the display of craftsmanship and living history that shows this old machine.
I have seen this type of rifling machine at a gun show near Los Angeles in the 1970s. Pratt and Whitney company always made very nice machine tools. Thanks Mark for demonstrating this old rifling machine and thank you very much for responding to my notice which, you corrected and I removed. When I was working for John Martz the Luger carbine maker from Lincoln, CA he visited the company that rifled his barrel stock and was allowed to take personal photographs of the rifling machines and the processes. It was amazing. They also had an older rifling machine at work, I think it was around a WWI date of manufacture and the company was able to keep the machine rifling barrels throughout the years that they were in business. I can't remember the name of the company but, I don't believe that they are in business today.
WOW!!! That is a great machine to have! Who wouldn't want a old Winchester or Colt with a bad bore or needing a barrel replaced with a period correct machine like that! You made a wise purchase, and in my opinion a perfect one at the gun show that will fit your needs. So, I think you one uped your wife in her Colts she was able to find at the show. What a neat old piece of history that will still continue to help you around the shop! Thank you for making another fine video.
I wish my dad was still around to see this machine. He was a master gunsmith with High Standard in CT and also had a shop of his own where he customized and accurized target pieces. He was always wanting a rifling machine to make his own barrels.
Very impressive!! As a full time machinist and part time historian, /black powder gunsmith this was a most fascinating video. Truly appreciate the effort you've put in to showing details of operation of the machine. Provides me with some interesting concepts and ideas for buildinKeep up with a good videos.
What a wonderful thing that was to watch! It's quite amazing to envision these machines working away back in the heyday of the 2nd industrial revolution. I was fortunate to grow up on the east coast, notably in New Haven, CT. I can still walk past the old remaining buildings of the Winchester Repeating Arms Company Factory; where my Model 1873 lever-action was made and stamped. One of the original Winchester factory buildings on Munson Street still exists to this day. As a kid my father made it a point to inspect the maker's marks of all of his fine tools and firearms with me. It seemed that more than 90% of them were all born in factories that laid within miles from where we lived. Every now and again I still find myself envisioning the absolute manufacturing powerhouse that it once was over here. Whenever I walk by these old factory buildings I imagine, in awe the bustle of people and whirr of machinery day and night. I now reside a few minutes south of Bridgeport, CT and once again have the opportunity to gaze in awe at the few handful of gargantuan buildings left that you can see the left side of I-95 Southbound as you pass through. I think about my J-head Bridgeport mill being assembled somewhere in there years back.....and again I say: "What a wonderful, prosperous, and imaginative place this country was back then!"
Sadly, I've been waiting for a year for a barrel from them and have heard horror stories of people waiting a lot longer than that or even those who paid for a barrel and never got it from them.
When a person thinks that a company, "done a good job," they cast doubts on the barrel rifling quality. I am old enough (66 years old) to remember the mirror lapped bores from the past; they are a rarity today.
Now that is one cool apparatus! I also love it's history! As a huge Savage\Stevens fan of both their old and new stuff I find it so cool to know that machine was actually in the Stevens factory way back then producing barrels for so many awesome guns that were from that time period! I can't help but wonder if I have a gun with a barrel on it that that exact machine might have made! It is seriously a historical artifact that is still 100% functional and still going strong! Man that thing is just so cool!
incredible machine , the groove cutting tools are great the way they bump up as they hit the stop and it ratchets up ever so slightly , what a great presentation and how nice to see someone aquire this machine to use it , cheers big ears from down under #noCBDC
As a Canadian fairly recent to firearms at a late stage in life, I can really appreciate and wrap my brain around the processes involved in seeing this very cool old rifling machine in action. The other cool thing about that machine, is you could still rifle barrels if everything went to hell in a handbag and modern means no longer worked ! Gunsmithing old school would definitely be an in demand ability !
I couldn’t imagine what that thing costs 🤯🤯 Probably the earliest form of a “wet system” I’ve ever seen You sure are living a dream, Brother GOD BLESS YA
I remember seeing that when the fellow that you probably bought it from showed it at Republic Missouri at the Ozark steam engine show. It's quite a fascinating machine. Interesting to see it's found a new home with you.
I have been to the Single point barrel cutters in the greater Milwaukee area. Their process is Digitized and with new gearing/indexing and similar type of carbide/HSS cutter rods. Pretty cool to see when i picked up my rifled barrel blank. 👍
Wow, I have rebuilt a couple of Pratt & Whitney lathes in years gone by but this is the first P & W rifling machine I have ever seen that was this old. Wish I still had a machine shop myself.
As a firearms enthusiast who worked in a large manufacturing plant as a machinist in my early 20s, I found this video hypnotizing. Thank you for sharing!
Gawd! What an incredible find Mark! I simply love old machinery, and this has to be one of the ultimate designs of the nineteenth century. The genius minds that could conceive such tools from an idea on their minds demands respect today with our computer assistance. Add in the flowing designs of the castings that have the machinery beauty along with purpose. Congratulations on such a beautiful piece of firearm history.
Thanks Karl! One old rifle maker told me it's a work of art as much as it's a piece of machinery. I can't wait to start using it. I'm trying to find the right deep hold drill and reamer so that I can start making barrels from round bar stock. Should be a very interesting learning experience.
@@thecinnabar8442 I bought a few octagon barrels from Dixie Gun works years ago, 13/16ths octagon, smooth bore .31 caliber if I recall right. I then bought their button rifed .22 reliners and made the 24 inch barrels for the replica .22 caliber 1873 Winchester I made for my dad. The barrels were 36 inches long and may be available today from Dixie?
When I first saw that angle bar, my mind went to "they could produce progressively twisted barrels with that machine! What a cool and interesting design.
I believe this might be the same machine I have a video of being demonstrated at the Coolspring Power Museum a few years ago. For that show I think the owner belted a gasoline engine to it for power. Just a fantastic piece of engineering! Hope to see it making barrels for you in future videos.
What a wonderful and elegant machine! That's literally a piece of history. It's wonderful to see it running. It seems a little magical now, imagine how it would have seemed to folks as they were entering the industrial revolution. Thanks so much for sharing.
Mark, I have enjoyed your videos for some time. This one is the best yet. I can't imagine you topping this one. What a wonderful machine, and I think you are the perfect custodian of it. Wouldn't it be fun to now be able to make a replacement barrel for an old rifle that which was here to fore irreplaceable. Perhaps you should ask your audience to send it name suggestions and put a small plate on her.
I really enjoyed this video, thank you. I am kind of in the same boat, I bought out a gunshop that closed in the 40s, got a ton of barrel making stuff but am just trying to figure out what I got and what I need. Will be following you closely and look forward to seeing your gun drill set up. Thanks again!
What an absolutely brilliant piece of history! Truly a spectacular machine and a fascinating glimpse into the golden age of mechanical machining. I was up in San Francisco late last year helping rescue a few machines from the turn of the century at the old Klockars Blacksmith Shop and in the efforts found what I suspect was an old unfinished gun barrel blank. I'm in the process of sending a sample to a friend at a metallurgical plant for testing, and if it comes back as the right alloy I intend to finish it out into a small caliber rifle of some sort. If it's anything you would be interested in collaborating on, running it through the rifling machine is the most fitting thing I can think of for the little bit of history I dug out of the dirt. Cheers and thanks for your passion in this fascinating world!
A very COOL find Mark... and thanks for sharing! I have a nice old GA Gray metal planer (22x22x60) circa 1900 that I'm hoping to put to work profiling some octagon barrels sometime soon. As expected, it too was originally a lineshaft driven machine, but now adapted to use an ac motor for power. Looking forward to seeing more of this in the coming episodes :)
That is really an interesting machine! I have seen video of what I believe was a later machine of the same make but your detailed tour of the machine is great.
I thought you might be interested to know that the Missouri Historical Society has the Hawken rifling machine. A trip to the museum is always interesting.
You say that your shop is this machine's final resting place. I think it will go on to a new home once you have retired and will continue to fascinate people for decades to come. :)
It's thing of beauty, that's for sure. I wonder how many of our current high tech machines will still be working perfectly in 160 years? I have a WWII Lee Enfield .303 made at Long Branch in Canada in 1941. At the time they needed to make them as fast and as as cheaply as they could. They experimented with rifling and accuracy and ended up making two groove barrels instead of the original five groove ones. It still shoots fine.
Thank you Sir for this stroll down history. I shared this Video with my Brother who is a retired Los Angeles Times Pressman. I think Ink still runs through his veins. I hope he enjoys this ad much as i did.😊
That is such a cool machine. I build reproductions of old flintlock rifles. So good of someone to keep this machine out of the scrap yard. I'm sure you will be a great caretaker of this old machine and will someday pass it along to someone else who will give it a good home. It is a shame that so many of the old machines from our past have been melted down and repurposed into something else. Maybe there is a little old rifling machine in my Honda SUV... :)
First time checking out Cinna-bar. Nice work!!. I'll be following you guys on the ranch from now on. Looking forward to many more videos and maybe keep learning something new. Thank you
I have tried to make 45-70 barrels using the button method, I finally got 2 - 26” barrels drilled without breaking the bit off in it about 3/4 way in , Going to try make pull through reamers in a couple weeks when time permits, next time I drill I’m going to try drill half way and turn it around and drill other end ,seen guy on utube doing this ,
...gotta love the racket it makes!!! Used'ta work for Sikorsky Aircraft back when both it and Pratt & Whitney were part of United Technologies...Pratt had the main facility on the property in West Palm Beach, FL...in the early 90s the switch from the old Bridgeports to CNC - they sold the Bridgeports for a buck apiece but the catch was that you had to remove it right then and there
It actually runs very quiet. After the first clip of it running, I shut off the camera and remounted the motor so that the pulleys lined up and stopped the squeaking belt. I couldn't have lived with that racket much longer. 😬
First of all, you had me at Pratt Whitney. My dad was an aircraft mechanic for Nationwide Insurance. He was in charge of the small fleet of executive aircraft. I grew up around the old PW's on a pair of DC-3's that had been customized with plush interiors. I can hear those old radials from miles away. I did get a bit confused one day when i heard some, but they didn't sound quite right. That was because there were 4 of them. B-17 flew over. Oh well, enough of my history. I never knew when Pratt Whitney started. I guess it never crossed my mind. This is an incredible old find. But, it's got me rethinking an old reciprocating saw I bought at an online auction. I figured my saw was probably close to 90-100 years old, but the oil and chip tray looks to be the same design as this rifling machine. Similar mechanism and is very heavy. It even lifts the blade up on the return stroke. The motor on mine is extremely old. The "switch" handle on your machine is identical to the one on my saw. Thank you for sharing and explaining how this advanced the cutters. I've always wondered. The really old barrels were made by hand, and the mandrel had to be removed to put another piece of paper, or whatever they were using as a shim, and reinserted into the old barrels. That's some tedium right there. Just think, the guys that designed this were probably educated from some of the first McGuffy Readers.
True American quality and ingenuity at play here that has lasted over a century! It also nice seeing something not made in China and then assembled in Mexico.
