18:01 Toc! Toc! Coming from the future here... the 2019 ND's engine will be upgraded to a 181-184 HP with a 7500 rpm redline indeed ;) can't wait to see how much fun it is!
Great review. I'm 66 and my sports car history goes like this: starting in 1972 I bought a 1970 Mustang Mach 1 (Cleveland engine), '73 Corvette (POS), '90 Toyota Supra, '95 Nissan 300ZX, 2001 Miata SE (British racing green), '03 S2000, '04 S2000, '06 S2000, '02 S2000 and now I own an '08 Miata GT PRHT. I am currently looking at buying either an '07 S2000 with 45k miles for $23,500 or a leftover '17 Miata GT soft top, 6spd., fully loaded. MSRP: $31,540 that I can buy from the dealer for $26,000 plus tax. At my age and 6' 200lb. frame I find the NC much easier to live with. Although I miss the VTEC terribly after owning 4 S2Ks I am finding the Miata is more fun to drive because you can drive it at its limits more often. It is always in its happy place no matter how fast you are going. The S2K's happy place is when it's into the VTEC and you are way past legal speeds. Although it's chassis is more rigid and stout than the Miata's it's not nearly as tossible. The S2K's seats are also getting a little too tight for my aging body. But I look forward to driving both it and the ND Miata and who knows...the siren song of the VTEC may win me over...again...and I'll be owning my 5th S2000...or my 3rd Miata should common sense prevail. Either way they are both great cars.
I love my miata. The s2000 is a great car. The miata is just such a great car for the money. I am always amazed that I paid 2k for such a great driving experience.
Dan Wells - I just purchased a 2008 Miata GT with PRHT with an automatic for $10k. It had 78k miles and was in excellent shape so I got it even though I would have preferred a manual. Meanwhile I’m driving it every day! I used to own an AP1. I totally agree that this Miata is fantastic. It’s also more practical then the ND. Larger car with glove compartment and more useful water bottle holders etc. I love the way it drives and the PRHT is incredible. I prefer this car to my 2012 Boxster which I just sold. The AP 2 is a great idea but it’s very hard edged and although fun it’s too much money. The same year AP2 would be about $20 or more. Parts are getting rare and these cars are just not as much fun not as nimble etc etc. or as useable as daily drivers.
its crazy that 10 years later the S2000 is still compared to the modern day roadster. which tells you a lot about the car.. Honda built a great car that still holds its own to this day. hoping the new 2000 will have the same effect :]
I'll keep my 20 year old Z3 3.0L, the wide power band, the rewarding torque, and the sound of an inline six over a four banger. The number one benefit of the S2000, my number one complaint, is the high revving engine, or in other words, no power until VTEC kicks in. Watch Doug Demuro's face trying to hide disappointment when he reviewed the 2000.
I've got both cars, for road driving Honda s2000 feels like more expensive car and gives me more pride but on track I prefer MX5 with little tunning MX5 easily handles s2000 and all kinds of M cars or Carreras in tight corners and it's fully predictable and never snaps on you unlike the S2000 which is very difficult past certain point. the cost of tracking mX5 is also much lower, i love both cars though that's why I needed to have both of them.
I had a 2003 S2000. It was THE BEST car I have ever owned. It was my daily driver and every time I got in it, it was like taking a mini vacation. All the troubles of the day and problems of life just melted away. It cornered like it was on rails and that VTEC engine is a masterpiece. I just loved that 9000 RPM top end. I so miss that car.........
Ap2 and NA Miata owner here.. Miata's are a much better daily driver. However, the S will always be more special than a Miata. In a perfect world, you have both.
Joeyd Santos miata is a easier car to control and more forgiving and the S2000 is unforgiving and punishes the driver when the driver makes a mistake at the corner. Miata is a beginner sports car and comfortable and S2000 is more of a Race Car.
My last car choice was down to a 2006 AP2 and a 2016 ND. The S2000 was more magical to drive, but the Miata was much more practical for many reasons. Better mpg, less oil consumption, better warranty, better parts availability, safer, more modern amenities, lighter, smaller footprint, etc. As a 7/10th driver (max), the ND was my obvious choice.
I love my ND Miata and couldn't be happier. I have driven E92, E46 M3, 2016 Camaro SS but this is my favorite (ok, maybe E46 too). It's so much fun and in any road and any speed that's why it's so rewarding. You can have fun without going to redline or high speed. it's just so playful. But I admire S2000 too.
Oh yeah oh yeah. Been waiting for this one, and love your perspective. I think it's hard to make an argument for the Miata if it's a second car, but if it's a primary car and daily driver, then the Miata as the newer car makes more sense. Another reason to buy a Miata over a S2000 which you didn't touch on is, ever since the ND miata came out, it has been dominating STR class in autocross -- it's tough to find a S2000 on the podium these days... That said, I'm buying a 50K mile S2000 tomorrow morning!
Yep, the ND took the top 3 spots at Nationals this past year: dk1xgl0d43mu1.cloudfront.net/user_files/scca/downloads/000/037/986/2017_Tire_Rack_SCCA_Solo_Nationals_Results.pdf?1510244002
I like your comment. It's quite realistic but I will think about depreciation too. I wouldn't pay for a less powerful car with less character that will cost half when I want to sell it...meanwhile the s2000 would hold its value. It's just a legend. it's a car from 20 years ago and we're still comparing it with the newer ones...and they struggle to put it behind. S2000 is just so good....
Never driven an S2000. But have owned an ND Miata. I have also owned a Cayman, R34 Skyline and a few hot hatches. Suspension on all of those have been too hard for Australian roads and get tiring as a daily driver. S2000 seems like an excellent second car. But the ND is an amazing daily and weekend drivers car.
S2000 for the win. The fact that we are comparing a car that was designed in 2004 to a modern roadster speaks volumes. There is no comparison really. The s2000 is in another league.
I have an ND and my Dad owns an AP2. The S2000 is awesome but I wouldn't trade my ND for one. I'm sure the S2K would be great on the track. I think the ND is more fun to drive on the street. It's set up a lot softer from the factory than the S2K but that's easy to change if you want to (I did). You definitely feel the extra weight of the S2K. And of course you have all the benefits of it being a much newer car. You're right that the S2K feels like the more "hardcore" car out of the box, but I think you're selling the ND short by saying its easy and for beginners. I also agree that the engine is really the defining difference. Though I'm not a huge fan of the power delivery, the S2K engine does feel more special. I personally really like the meaty midrange of the ND. You use it a lot more on the street and it feels great pulling out of corners. Supposedly a tune can wake up the top end a little more if thats what you're missing.
@Mr Cabot I find the plastics to be adequate all around, no unnecessary cheaping out where it shouldn't. I love mine, 2004 w/ 46100 miles & I spoil her rotten in maintenance and in the curves.
@Mr Cabot The front & rear ends look more dated and the F20C tends to burn oil during VTEC, which is why some owners utilize AP2 valve seats, or so I've heard from guys in our regional S2000 FB club. Most agree that while the F20C is a screamer, the lack of torque is definitely noticeable on wide open roads and the chassis is just slightly unbearable & unpredictable at the limit (snap oversteer), and that the AP2 is simply a better car.
I sold my S2k because of transmission problems. Would pop out of and grind into second. Plus it was hard to shift in reverse. These issues didn't start to pop up until after I bought it. That's also the other problem with the S2k. They may look great, but you may be buying a car with problems depending on how it was previously driven. So I sold the S2K and bought an ND club with BBS.Brembo and it's great. The complaints everyone has about the Miata have been the same complaints since the 90s. They will never change it so I feel like people should just stop complaining about it. They leave the body roll in for a reason. They give it a basic engine for a reason. Even with those issues, it is a great sports car.
Bad motor mounts / bad trans mount. S2000 mounts are fluid filled and have a tendency to leak after awhile. And the shifter popping out and difficulty getting in gear is a common symptom. Easy and cheap fix. You wasted your time with the miata.
I know that by the time the AP2 came out in 2004, all the transmission problems were corrected. BUT I think they were already fixed by the 2002 model year. Double check that though.
@@amandanguyen9579 I love the S2000 but you fan girls are so annoying, the new Miatas are just easier to live with, more comfortable, more steering feel, more usable power band, cheaper to run, it's a great car that people love to hate for whatever reason
Been here a while and you’ve become one of the best car reviewers around. Well done, sir. Great owner too. S2k for all the reasons you said but ND is fantastic in its own right.
12:40 I agree about the engine in the Miata. I think we should keep in mind that in 2000 the S2000 new was $32,000, which translates to $53,000 today. Base of ND today is about $28,000. That’s a difference of about $25,000. That difference in price can easily be attributed to having an engine purpose built for the car in the s2000’s case, or the Miata’s taken from a Mazda 3. That said, I do agree with you. I really think with the Miata, the edelbrock supercharger would be a must for me. Can give you that extra kick. From what I can tell, it only adds about 60-70lbs to the car, once you factor in the kit’s weight, the coolant water, and the parts you remove during installation.
Although i think objectively (as an enthusiast) the S2000 is a better car both financially and looking at dynamics. I can think of two very big reasons to pick the miata over it if you can only have one car. Modern tech/safety and a warrenty
Had a 2000 AP1 for 17 years and broke it. Test drove a ND club and couldn't warm up to the rolly-polly handling, overboosted steering or the lack of any trunk (for my daily driver). Also the engine lacked any sort of magic , Not a big fan of the dash screen either. Some of that could be fixed with aftermarket stuff but some not. Ended up getting a low mile 04 AP2 and I'm a happy camper again.
Thanks for your great comparison review. A slight difference in my opinion may be due to my experience with AP1 S2000 and not AP2. I have a 2002 S2000 with less than 15,000 miles and a 2016 MX-5 Club with less than 5,000 miles. There is a big difference in throttle response of the engines. In double-clutch rev-matched downshifts, the engine response of S2000 is immediate but with MX-5 I need to wait for the engine speed to increase before downshifting. With regard to sound and smoothness of the engines, the Miata engine feels like a diesel engine in comparison to S2000. Because of flat torque curve I use the MX-5 for running errands. But for pure enjoyment of driving, S2000 is my choice.
Excellent review. I have a '16 ND Club w/ Brembos and have dropped some coin on it (tune/header/muffler good for 160whp and 7400rpm, coilovers, 17x9 wheels, etc) and think they are very comparable cars if you are willing to buy a 10 year old car at a similar price. A friend with an AP1 S2000 (has a header) was surprised at the ND's power. Then again, the ~5 year veteran with an AP1 S2000 at the autocross (STR, like me) puts the mad whoopin on me, running ~5 seconds quicker, although 2017 was my 1st year to autocross.
My wife and I have a 2007 S2000 and have just bought a 2016 MX-5 Grand Touring. I'm installing Eibach springs and Bilstein shocks on the MX-5 before the summer driving season begins for us. I know I'm biased toward the S2000 but it will be fun chasing my wife in the MX-5.
A lot of Honda fans will argue and whine but the truth is the S2k was direct competition against the MX5. Being faster at the time, it was great despite its weak engine design (2.5k rpm of usable torque). The fact is the S2k was slated for an Ap3 release that got canned along with it's current ap2 model because sales folded each year. Another hard fact for Honda fanboys is the S series still exists in japan: the S600.
I used to shit on Miatas but I rented one when I went on a trip to Cali and it was crazy fun / comfortable. I can only imagine how much fun an s2000 would be. I would get an ND but I know I would rather an ap1 or ap2.
Idk if this was a club because it didnt have the big brakes and bbs wheels and summer tires but I did get a chance to drive a miata that did over the summer. Words can not describe the confidence and enjoyment I got out of the car. I felt like I tracked the car for 5 years in 5 minutes and was pushing through highway ramps harder than any other car with zero fear. I even started sawing at the wheel mid ramp to mess with the car and it just played with me. Still I never was scared. Words couldn't describe the experience for me and I could only imagine what it would be like with the new higher redline and power. Great review I look foward to you driving a 2019
I appreciate this review. It isn't forcing the exact same crap that every other single person says. I personally own an NA Mazda miata and I am trying to decide between an NB Miata or an AP1 S2000. Great review
I owned the first Miata for 13 years. Drove it winter (yes snow) and summer. Enjoyed every moment. I replaced it with a 2003 S2000. I have been driving it for 16 years now - winter and summer. Best cars to drive and enjoy.
Out of all the roadsters that existed...which one has never stopped production? Which one has it's own race series? Which manufacture sold 1 million? Which one is the most raced car in the world? Who still sticks to their lightweight roots in 2018? Who has made the most technological advancements to the combustion engine to keep it alive? Mazda or Honda? Those are all feats only Mazda can claim. The real legend and bench mark. The true affordable drivers car. While Honda fans can only reminisce about the past. Mazda fans can still see a future.
The S2000 has one advantage in that if you buy one with low miles and in good condition, then depreciation will be minimal, if it depreciates at all. The MX5 is so common that this will not happen in quite the same way.
Hey Zygrene I love your vids, been watching for a while. I'm a fellow S2000 owner (2003 AP1) and as much as I love my s2000 I have to say that it isn't the "best shifter in the world", you have to drive a 911 GT3 (hard to get your hands on I know...) or even the recent GTS models have an amazing shifter too. As far as best shifter in the world I've heard time and time again that old school Ferrari gated shifters are king, never driven one myself but would love to some day. Cheers and keep making awesome content :P
+Eric Walsh Late reply, but I've heard the 997 GT3 shifter is one of the best in the world! I will hopefully be reviewing a modified example soon. Btw, I sat in a Cayman GT4 recently and immediately fell in love with the shifter.
Awesome review, probably the most honest and accurate one I've seen between the two cars. I've driven my friend's slightly modded S2000 for a week before buying my ND Miata GS (Canadian version of the Miata Club). Both cars are amazing, but minor differences exist, as you point out. The S2000 is a planted, heavier sports car with a motorcycle engine and exacto-knife handling. The ND Miata is a daily fling-able go-kart with great mid-range power that's extremely easy to kick out its rear end, but is also extremely easy to control. My choice is the Miata but I'd be equally happy with the S2000.
I had an ND for about a year, and put 23k miles on it, 90% of which was spent on canyons. I put some RE-71Rs on it, and I absolutely loved the way the car handled on tighter canyons. The reason I sold it? As you said, engine character! I bought a 981 Boxster S to replace it with its glorious flat-6, and the Porsche is pretty much a better car in nearly every way, but honestly I still miss that MX-5. The Miata is just so much fun, and the more time you spend with it the more you grow attached to it.
Great review, my reaction to the Miata motor was the same, it feels like a not-modified-enough econo-car motor. I owned a '91 and loved it, BTW. I hope the updated motor in the '19 addresses that. But it will be at new car pricing. Maybe the answer is a used S2000 for now (it won't lose much value), and think about a '19 Miata once they hit the used market in a couple years if the engine pans out. Time for a test drive. And maybe a rematch/update video in the future!
I've owned a couple of lightweight Japanese sports cars, both convertible and coupe form. My brother had a 99 miata so I got to experience that. The miata to me felt too small. My arm literally was hanging over to the passenger seat lol. And I'm a big guy so driving a miata was like driving an old Toyota pickup truck as far as power goes lol. Even with my size I don't feel like the S2k looses much acceleration. I also had an FRS which I felt was better than the miata. It fit me perfectly, comfortably and with a UEL header and tune, it feels so much better in the mid range than my S2k stock. It also lacked topend acceleration which bothered me some. Coming out of the corner it was missing that pull up top and the engine just felt rough partly due to that boxer design. The miata definitely feels much torquier than the S2k because it was tuned to the midrange and has less weight to carry. But lets be honest, 2 liters under 160 hp is underwhelming. I don't understand why mazda won't give everyone the +200hp it needs. At least with the S2k, Honda went all out with that F20/22 engine. You definitely feel like it's a special box and exclusive. You won't find an NA car with that much HP per liter. With that being said, I choose the S2k over miata because it meets my needs and more while making me feel that much more satisfied. And if you're really looking for special, you won't regret it with the s2k. You won't ever see another car like it again.
Zygrene - a NEW ND can be purchased for around $25k - most people who are going to the track will be upgrading the brakes and coils so the Miata Sport is by FAR a best buy. I own a 16 Club Brembos and love it but if I was 20 years younger and wanted a good car to build on the ND Sport is unbeatable.
I owned both (Currently own 2016 Miata Grand Touring), and i pretty much agree with your conclusions, except for the interior comparison. The Miata has amazing electronics: great seat warmers, speakers in the headrest, good bluetooth audio capabilites, a truely excellent stereo, automatic highbeams that dim for oncoming traffic, great headlights that turn to light up the corners. Really, the Miata's headlights are an East Coast secret weapon : they excel at finding deer. And driving with high beams on down a backroad and not worrying about turning them off for oncoming traffic .. that feature is priceless. The S2000 does have that neat leather dash (mine was blue leather) but other than that, its interior was ... not the best place to be. I do **badly** miss the 9000 RPM motor and the racecar like handling.
I was a F body fan back when I sold cars... until I drove the S2000. It was so much fun that I told my buddies it was just like driving my go kart when I was little. I’ve wanted to see a comparison between to ND and the S2k. Now the new ND2 has a higher redline and more hp.
Great comparison. You guys really tried to get your point across objectively and descriptively for the viewer. Love the 08-09 for the stocks alone. Very lucky to have a Grand Prix White + Red. Probably my favorite combo next to Berlina Black + Red. Never was a Miata guy but this new ND is really handsome imo. Still planning to get an S2K when the money and the deal is right.
Thank you for making this video possible! POV clip of the MX5 looks like its sped up haha (i'm sure it actually isn't). I'm curious to see someone getting some decent coilovers like KWs for the ND and comparing the handling with the S2k. UK MX5 specialist BBR offer a 'Super 200' package - intake, exhaust manifold, camshafts, valvesprings, exhaust, ECU remap upgrades that enable engine to produce 214hp & 183lb ft, with raised redline. Flyin' Miata is the U.S. distributor for BBR's ND MX5 turbo kit but i've seen no details of the Super 200 kit for the U.S. But maybe it's better to do a F20c+transmission swap for a ND MX-5.
One of the best review about any cars the I saw! Very professional . I' m an ex owner of a 2003 S2000 (sold it in 2008 with 19,000m ) BIG MISTAKE....Because of your review i thinking of buying a 2019 MX5. ( don't want to tell you guys the car that replace my S2000 ,you will laugh until tomorrow....)
Way to hit the nail on the head. They literally made the 2019s 2 liter 181 hp Rev to 7500 rpms. Mazda engines being as mod friendly as it is will reach 200 whp with bolt on and a tune on 2350 lbs and will be the perfect car.
I like the ND's engine. Good power from 2000 to 5500 rpm stock. The MX5 is faster than the AP1 S2k in 90% of driver situations. For $500 you can get an open flash tune that will give you an 7500 rpm redline and 10% more torque and hp across the power band with far more top end.
These guys should team with DeMuro and provide useful driving experience info. They are articulate and have really helped me understand what it's like to drive these two cars in a useful way.
AS an ND owner who test drove a brand new S2000 around 2007, I personally love the flat torque of the ND, and dislike the utter lack of guts the S2000 showed. Kind of like a sport cruiser bike (ND) versus a ninja rice rocket (S2000). But to each his own. And the 500lb extra pork is not cool at all. Engine wise, I think the ND sounds better, the S2000 sounds too whiny, to me. Good review though.
But .., You feel like you're hitting warp speed ... VTEEEEEEEEC LOL I've owned an s2(6 years before selling it for an "s2XL", c6z) and have driven an all stock ND club trim level(was looking into one about a year ago to go racing with since my s2 replacement and was thinking about returning to basics of racing low hp cars) and I don't know if I agree with you. To me, the s2 of the two cars feels like there's more going on. Its like the car has more soul the way those rpms wind out. The power band was just mundane in the ND. ND handles good, though. Not as fun as an s2. IMO
Good review. I have a 2005 S2K and test drove an MX5 (as the Miata is here in the UK) as a possible replacement. For 90% of the time you spend behind the wheel, the MX5 is great, and maybe even the better car. For the 10% when you get some open road and a chance to test its limits, the S2K is in a different league, and that was enough for me to stay with the S2K. If Mazda comes out with a proper hard-core version I may reconsider, but they're not there yet.
Great review. My only minor nitpick is you should have driven a miata with aftermarket exhaust. Sounds like you’ll be getting your wish for a ND miata with more horsepower and higher redline. Can’t wait to see how the new engine is.
Had a ap2 s2000 it was a good car but like u said it goes from 7 to 8, 9, 10 quickly and its really tail happy even when trying to dial out with suspension mods. Which is why i traded it in for a s2 exige S. However i miss the s2k but also intrested in the nd club. As the power is more linear and can be much more forgiving. I am in the market for both the s2k and nd club.
Both are good cars in their category. Miata is a light weight car with a great chasis but a poor engine. S2000 is the next step. Great chasis and suspension with a racing engine for the road. Most people who drive s2000 first time don't know it's needs to be between 6k and 9k rpm to get the real power. Invidia exhaust has a dirty sound really. Toda Racing exhaust is the best sound note for the s2000 IMO.
18:09 you're pretty mich exactly describing the new engine of the MX5 coming later this year. 184HP @ around 7000rpm, which means it revs a little higher than that.
I had a 2005 S2000 and a 1995 NA Miata. I enjoyed the NA Miata more, even though the S2000 looked the best. Both were fun but I enjoyed the Miata the most.
Great vid, S2k owner here too so a little biased, but I'd say just on value you'd have to go s2k, because if you keep it nice you won't see much or any depreciation, and as you mentioned...possibly an appreciation of value. That being said, I'd I had to buy a newer car for a toy, it'd be the ND all day, I had a 1992 NA, and loved it, and with it being 500 lbs less, any power adders are going to be very noticeable.
Good review. Two great cars. I really like the looks of the MX-5. Too bad I can't fit in one. Plenty of leg room but my head sticks out the top. Yet I still go back to the dealership each year to sit in one, as if something might change. I need to drive an S2K to see what all the hype is about. BTW, those are some great roads. I need to get out there.
@Bruce Wayne Well at I have found a couple with “only soft top problems” around my area at least but I probably will the same time I find a na miata that hasn’t been stanced or swapped in my area 👌🏼
My 01 S has almost 100k nd still feels Nd looks new ☝️🤣☝️ i wouldn't hesitate for a second on choosing the s2000 as the better car. Then again, im a honda fan boy
Different cars really. Miata for the everyday. S2k for the track. Miata for the twistier left right left right canyons, S2k for long sweeping gentle canyons. Miata to drive solo. S2k if you’re taking a guy. More joy in all aspects of driving in the Miata whereas as the S2k must be driven at 8/10+ for any feeling. Miata is a drivers car that plays well with public roads and law enforcement. S2k is that 8/10+ thrills game you play with the cops while pawning your license for some cheap thrills. Miata for autocross. S2k for track. Another case of dressing differently for different occasions that’s all.
The S2000 is my favorite 4 cylinder sound next to the 4A-GE. The Miata is a better car for the person that wants an easy to drive sports car. The S2000 is for someone willing to explore the limits of a roadster. In stock tune, the S2000 loves to be revved past 7K whereas the Miata won’t penalize you for short shifting. S2000 for the better driver. Miata for the enthusiast.
Excellent comparison video. But since I'm looking for a second car and have to stay below $10K, I have to go BOTH old AND Miata. I'm going to try to pick up a used NC for $8K. I loved my old 2004 S2000 and I regret giving it up in 2009.
I own an AP1 and an nd rf. I know which is the better everyday car the mazda but the s2k is more rewarding to drive and has a better gearchange. Everyone raves about mazda gearchange they've never tried an s2k. And the way the s2k makes its power is again more exciting even though no faster than the rf. Which is easier to drive as evéything happens at lower speeds. When you try to push it gets out of shape quite easily whereas the Honda begs you to try a bit harder.
Omg.. :D are you kidding??? 1st that's a cone/slalom contest what you're speaking about... So Saying this is pretty khm... S2k have better weight / hp ration. Have better cornering speed, and have more power. Even by default have more wide tires.... So what you sad is just irrelevant.
I'd *disagree on "they don't make cars like this anymore"* Porsche made them up until recently, 718 stopped the streak. Porsche Cayman and boxsters were NA (naturally aspirated) cars just a year ago that you can throttle steer, with an absolutely insane soundtrack due to a high(er) pitch engine, light weight, and better in every respect (at least I liked the drive better than s2000, but I can see how some people may prefer some splashes of rice, like u said we might all need some in our lives). Of course it is in a different price category, but a 987 Cayman can be had for around this price. They are as reliable as the cars in this video can be if not more (unless you completely ignore mechanical care..)
I think the biggest incentive for me when it comes to S2000 is the aluminum engine. For that price tag for that kind of engine strength, its pretty worth it (altho 987 has an aluminum engine as well i suppose, but maintenance cost still greater). wait for the 981 caymans to drop in price (altho they might hold their value pretty hard...). i've been told. by many cayman enthusiasts that 987s are not nearly as good as the 981s. I currently have driven every Porsche model (except GT3 and GT4) starting from 2014 or later. I can guarantee that 981S and 981GTS completely kill any incentive for a car enthusiast to get a base 911.1 or even a 991.1S (unless you really want doggy back seats and more comfort). While i don't like the 991.2 with the turbos, i can actually see an incentive for people to get that car especially now that 718 is a flat 4. And the 991.1 felt sluggish (altho already nimble for sports cars these days), in comparison to a cayman. the 991.2s extra power eliminates a lot of that sluggy feeling. THe caymans felt more fun and progressive despite the lower power during the 981 and 991.1 generations.
Dallas Diy thanks for the reply! And I hear ya man. I love NA too, sad they are dying. I'm driving a 981GTS, u can check my channel. ALSO 981 are NA!!! They are not turbo and only produced for two short years 2014-2016. After 2016 or starting 2017 , it became the 718 which is a turbo flat 4. 981 is definitely (currently) the best Cayman and boxsters. Still had the howling flat 6, strong balance, and good Porsche design DNA. The 718 look very similar to 981 as it is technically considered an extremely heavy mid cycle refresh, but doesn't sound good at all (drove one for a month. Hated it, but it performs as hard as a previous gen super car. Just one with no emotions). The 918 GTS and 981 GT4 are the very last models of NA before Porsche went full turbo (excluding GT3). You should try to drive a 981 they are superb, really felt like there wasn't any incentive for an 911 during those 2 short years. Chris Harris absolutely loved it along with many outlets claiming it as the best sounding and handling car of its price. A low option 981 Cayman S is a lot of value for a car
This. Just bought a 986 Boxster S with 39k miles on it. If anyone wants to buy my S2000, it is on craigslist. I aboslutely love that car and will miss it. Better than the Porsche in some ways.
Got the choice to get a Mr2 spyder with a 2zz engine or a S2K. Drove both and even tho the Mr2 with the 2zz was a F16 on wheels, I didn't go for it. Reliability issues were the main reason I turned it down. Went with the S2K and still rolling with it.
Stock, the S2k is a more performance oriented car for sure. Now, in about 5 years when the ND is cheaper, do good suspension and put a blower on it, and you've got yourself a recipe for light weight fun. In the meantime, I'll do the same thing for < 10k on an NB because I'm a cheap bastard ;)
I've been waiting for a review like this since the ND came out. The conclusion was pretty much as I expected but it was nice to see you compare the two side by side. P.S. The s2000's owner's waifu is shit.
I am an NA miata person. But I'll admit that the S2k is a formidable car. My NA will eat it's lunch (Trackspeed turbo) but the 2k is still a good looking and fast car (with awful torque curve). I think the mazda engineers got the ND right mechanically, but the stylists really messed up. The ND has great proportions but the styling (surface design) is a twisted sphincter. This becomes so obvious next to the S2k. The 2k is all "form follows function". It's beauty comes from clarity of purpose. No nonsense. No crap surfacing. The ND is all ridiculous styling, it has irrelevant creases and superfluous shapes. ND is aesthetically a flamboyant drag queen. It actually makes an NA miata look masculine.
Great review. I have the 2016 ND Club.. same color. I agree with most everything you've said. It's my second car and the first thing I did was throw a Flying Miata Race exhaust on the car to ad engine note character. Only disagreement is with engine... accelerating at 2500 rpm feels totally different than 4500rpm. It has variable timing and I can tell you it's more spirited. Yeah the engine is not totally special. It's an economy engine. Is Honda producing the S2000 again? My daily car is a Manual EX coupe accord.... honda seems to be moving away from large displacement manual transmissions.... sadly. They would RUIN an S2000 with a 1.6 L turbo.....lag lag.
Miata, no contest. It is a personal preference. Either one will reward its owner. 500 lbs is a LOOOT of weight and that makes the lighter Miata more nimble and much easier in day to day traffic, especially LA.
Hard to match? The rx8 has electric power steering assist same as s2k, has same power, similar redlines, better track times and lower price tag,. But downside is higher maintenance, more expensive to upgrade and harder to find parts for
Hey man great video on both of the cars. I own a 2005 S2k i really love it and like you said it more of a drivers car and more raw then the miata. I just love the look more of the S2k over the miata and of course the awesome engine of the S2K. where are you located i love the road you guys where on wow beautiful.
Thank you for review! I love this 2 cars and I hope one day I will buy one)) But I don't understand why Honda many-many years don't make cool cars (S2000 included). I thing that the best time for next generation S2000 was 2016-2018. For what the Honda marketing mens and CEOs take a money? Maybe they are working for BMW and Porsche?...
From a lifetime Miata lover I can easily say I love the S2000 also. That said the only true Miata to me is the NA version which is the original Miata. 1990-1997 The NA Miata should be tested side by side the S2000. That said they both are built with two different philosophies. The original Miata is rev happy all the way to 7,300 rpms. The 1.6 Miata 90-93 engine is silky smooth and built to be a turbo charged engine from the Mazda GTX I beleive. Going 1.6 and turbocharging it you have an almost perfect setup. The 1.8 Miatas engine 1994-1997 is not as smooth running but has a little more torque. It was an afterthought for Americans wanting more torque. The 5 spd in the NA Miata is hard to beat, many say it's better than the S2000 I say they are about the same. Because they are just about the same mechanically. If I had my choice Id have one of each. Both purpose built with a little different result from each however both glorious to drive. Don't get me started on the ND Miata however (I'm sorry MX-5) If you had a brand new NA Miata and compared the handling, drive, fun factor I think it's an easy win for the original Miata against the ND. Classic good looks which will always look amazing 10 years or 100 years from now. The NA engine has higher redline and loves to be driven hard!! You cannot kill an NA BPY engine. The ND does feel good off the line but the lower redline takes away from the experience.
