That spear 3+5 combo really does work amazingly well. Small, cheap missile depleting defences, only for the supersonic big boi to finish the job. Could you test out that strat against the Americans?
@@grimreapers you are very bias again china navy : a/ in reality J-35 can carry 4x PL-15 and 2x PL-10 , you alway giving J-35 only 2x PL-15 every single time . b/ because longer range china can armed 2 or even 4 type 052D/055 with all anti-ship missile hyper/super sonic to drown entire enemy fleet then return to base . c/ DCS lack time on target setting > china get heavy nerf here . last : china only have one single type 003 as strongest CV so they never gonna send just 2x 055 and 4x 052d equal as US or UK . they will send atleast 4x 055 and 8x 052d or even more . > you also refuse and never let that happen
@@HoangNgocThanh-qy8cq Cap always gives both sides 1 carrier and 6 escort ships for a fair fight, and even if China does get their 4x 055 and 8x 052d escorts, US should get 2 carriers and 12 Arleigh Burke Flight III to equal the numbers out. And of course, China can load their ships with only anti-ship missiles, but the same strategy can be used by the US. US ships can also fire nothing but only long-range Tomahawk Block V missiles and overwhelm the Chinese defense. And don't forget, the Tomahawks even outrange the YJ21. All ships on both sides are going to be lost.
@@grimreapers you are very bias again china navy : a/ in reality J-35 can carry 4x PL-15 and 2x PL-10 , you alway giving J-35 only 2x PL-15 every single time . b/ because longer range china can armed 2 or even 4 type 052D/055 with all anti-ship missile hyper/super sonic to drown entire enemy fleet then return to base . c/ DCS lack time on target setting > china get heavy nerf here . last : china only have one single type 003 as strongest CV so they never gonna send just 2x 055 and 4x 052d equal as US or UK . they will send atleast 4x 055 and 8x 052d or even more . > you also refuse and never let that happen
@@HoangNgocThanh-qy8cqif we use your logic, then we nerf chinese pilot skill, assume only half gen 5 aircraft are operational and UK and US get all their carriers, not just one.
TBF that all really depends on where the battle happens. Realistically i dont think these navies are likely to clash like this considering the UK fleet is Atlantic and the Chinese fleet is Pacific.
Apart from the tongue ties... I think we found the next Dan Kelly [one the all time great game announcers]. Please take that as a complement. It is a shame that you had to compensate for computer logic. But it was a VERY good sim. Enjoyed much! Thank you!
Great video once again! (SPOLIERS BELOW) IRL, however, I'm certain it would be an even bigger victory for the UK for the following reasons: 1. In relative terms, China's development of military technology is a recent endeavour. I'm skeptical that their military tech can rival that of Western nations, which have spent decades, if not centuries, perfecting their systems. 2. Over the past 80 years, China has had limited engagement in armed conflicts, whereas the UK possesses centuries of extensive wartime experience, having been almost continually involved in various military operations against a wide number of opponents. 3. There is no way the RN would be firing a 4-1 ratio against incoming missiles. Current procedure is 2-1. 4. The F-35s would never target missiles, only other aircraft. 5. Since all of China's missiles have been depleted, the RN would close the distance and use NSM which would have sunk at least another one or two of the Chinese vessels. 6. The Royal Navy also has Wildcat + Martlet. These missiles have a small AAM/SAM capability which I'm sure would have helped against the incoming Chinese missiles. I'd love to see a British, French, and Italian carrier group go up against a Russian and Chinese one FYI.
As long as the British are happy, China has fifty destroyers. 39 Aegis ships. The ratio between Chinese and British destroyers is 50:6. And the 055 can be equipped with 472 missiles.
@Cap I would not call it a draw, the CV survived, so re-arm and re-attack. The NSM also didnt get fired due to range, and with the Chinese out of sams essentially it becomes a turkey shoot since the enemy carrier went down they cant re-arm and attack again. So it would be a clear win for UK.
if this were modelled more strategically the chinese would never close to get fired at by spear 5s and just launch their AShM volley and sail the other way. The british would never catch up to return fire.
@@hughmungus2760but also the UK wouldn’t be firing 4-5 SAMs at each anti ship missile. The amount they were firing was ridiculous. I could maybe see them doing it against the hypersonics since they are such a huge threat, but all the other missiles are what Aster and sea ceptor were designed to fight and are extremely good against. They wouldn’t be spamming the same way. Also the F-35s would be targeting the chinese jets rather than the AshMs
@@joshuasenior4370 a/ in reality J-35 can carry 4x PL-15 and 2x PL-10 , this channel alway bias giving J-35 only 2x PL-15 every single time . b/ china can armed 2 or even 4 type 052D/055 with all anti-ship missile hyper/super sonic . c/ DCS lack time on target setting > china get heavy nerf here . last : china only have one single type 003 as strongest CV so they never gonna send just 2x 055 and 4x 052d equal as US or UK . they will send atleast 4x 055 and 8x 052d or even more . > this channel host also refuse to let that happen
Couple of things: Outstanding battle, these new carrier battle series are fab. Would love a one including Japan and it's "new" carriers. Also would consider that a 3-3 Type 45 -- Type 26 would be a little more suited to this fight. It seemed Britain could've used a little more Sea Ceptors and less Aster 30s Also remember, the British Type 45s still have their NSMs, which would probably do even more damage. I'd also say some of those British anti-shippers could've been made into CAP. 1 squadron of CAP feels too few, simply because they don't have as many SAMs as the Chinese do
100% a UK Victory considering with the Chinese carrier gone, all those aircraft are now ditching in the sea. Whereas the British still have two full squadrons that can now take out the rest of the Chinese ships at their Leisure with their choice of weapons pretty much. Considering that the Chinese have no Sam's left😂
The Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carrier has no AWACS and electronic warfare aircraft. In fact, this situation is impossible. And the interception rate of subsonic missiles is the same as that of hypersonic missiles? There is another mistake in your simulation. You used a lot of "future weapons", but the Chinese side is static. Moreover, the F35B has insufficient range, far less than the J35. If it is in actual combat, the Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier has no chance
@@user-uc7kg4wp7c On the QE, networking F-35 would act as AWACS and EW aircraft. Not necessarily as good as dedicated platforms, but they do enjoy unparalleled technology. Fuel and combat range were simulated. Even the F-35B has plenty of range for the scenario in this simulation. Yes, the choice of futuristic weapons was wonky, but not too much. And the Chinese already have ballistic and supersonic weapons, so any near-future development won't have a big impact. The only real unfairness is that the Chinese could field a much larger fleet to escort the carrier.
@@jorehir There is something wrong with what you said. The F35B can indeed play a mini A WACS online, but its detection range may not be comparable to that of a professional early warning aircraft. If this thing is so easy to use, the US Navy will not continue to purchase the E2D. In addition, after the F35B turns on the radar, it means that it is also a radiation source, which will sacrifice stealth. However, the Chinese J35 does not need to turn on the radar, and can launch PL15 in the dark to attack the F35B, and even the J15T can launch PL17...
@@LEH-fl8ws In fact, the Royal Navy is not equipped with BMD interceptor missiles, and is actually helpless against the YJ21, which has a range of more than 1,000 miles.
Please!🙏 Long awaited 3rd rematch(from back in the day when ships would actually get close;) U.S. Carrier Fleet VS Russian Carrier Fleet! Kuznetsov Class Carrier, Air-Air MIG-29KR's with R-77M's, Anti-Ship SU-33M's with Kinzhal's, 5 Gorshkov's, 1 Kirov, and 1 Slava! VS Ford Class Carrier, Air-Air F/A-18F's with AIM-260's, F-35C's with Mako's, 2 Arleigh Burke's, 2 Constellation's, and 2 Ticonderoga's!👍
I really wonder what dogfights will look like when planes that are capable of firing missiles backwards and sideways will be actually able to do that. Also, with the advent of missiles having multiple RCS style thrusters for added agility, could those be perhaps used differently, almost like those in the Expanse space battles? Of course there's atmosphere to content with, but a still. Theoretically, a missile could be dropped by a pursued fighter, turned around by rcs, then fire main thrusters to fly head-on at the pursuing aircraft without needing to bend.
I kind of expect to see a drone aircraft carrier. A humanless flattop that just looks like one of those cliff faces full of birds nests but in this case it's quad-copter drones with missiles/guns/lasers to screen against missiles/surface drones.
Do the CIWS turrets on the Type 26 and QE not work? You seemed pretty certain that the CV would have been sunk if the missiles had targeted her (one more reason why QE needs her own short range missile system).
Additional idea if you need a pocket idea. Chinese vs Russian premise china decided that it wants to absorb outer Manchuria and a large swath of Siberia(the reclaim the extended siberia scenario)
Well, Argentina did cough up a few of super etendards... A veritable zoo of planes it will make for UA, a logistics and training nightmare "Here, take our old stuff we don't need anymore"
There are no retired tornados. The fleet was torn apart for spares until there were none to keep the fleet going. Tornado is dead. Scrapped. There’s no reviving it or making them air worthy for Ukraine. The last flight hours were used on ISIS
You'd see antique shops in Dorset being turned upside down for spare parts. I was in one last week, they had parts of tornados bent into fancy office furniture
would love to see a full american carrier fleet vs a full chinese/russia/uk carrier fleet. like 11 carrier groups vs 3/1/2 (6) carrier groups with their respective fleet size and configuration.
also, a generational fleet fight, would be great to see ww2,1970/80/90, modern, 2030/40 versions of america/china/russia/britain all fighting it out, can do 48 videos on that if my maths is right (probably not)
I'm commenting before the battle is even over, in an effort to show less bias. Yes, you're correct Cap, DCS is firing far too many UK SAMs for some reason. In one of the smaller YJ waves, I saw 6 incoming missiles and at minimum, 18 UK SAMs were fired all before the fire SAM engaged. I believe even the conservative SAM systems in modern militaries will only engage with two SAMs per incoming threat until seeing what the first intercept result is. That's just such a massive factor, as realistically you're guaranteeing between 100 to 150% of wasted SAMs per what appears to be an average PK of 1.5 missiles rather than 3.
Also, maybe I can try to do some research, but it feels like the near-future UK offensive options are really lacking. The overall UK force feels like it was designed to merely supplement allied forces rather than ever operate on its own. I guess this may be realistic, but I'm hoping it's not the truth.
@@jamison884SPEAR 5 is expected to be able to be air-launched as well so we might even see SPEAR 5 launched from F-35Bs. That would greatly improve the lethality of British F-35s.
It's so funny, it's just a game. The Chinese will launch the YJ-18 first and then the YJ21 and they will arrive at the same time. Only a fool would fire in order
tbh honnest it feels more like a chinese victory because at the end they would have take the CV and as you said UK wasnt able to defend themselves anymore . so the result would have been 1 CV loose for the chinese but the UK would have lost 2 fregate and 1 CV . so we can say more point for china this time .
It's impossible for military leadership to be so daft as to waste their best offense against the opponents best defense. But it happened again in this game, just so UK can win.
I know nothing about this game, but enjoyed watching. However I have one question, given that the Anti-Ship F-35B were also carrying 2 Anti-Air missiles and most likely Guns, is it possible to code the Sim to switch role for these aircraft after firing their Anti-Ship missiles to Anti-Air to harass the enemy's Anti-Ship Aircraft?
So basically If the ai was more reserved in firing the asters and sea ceptors the British wouldn’t have lost any ships? Because sometimes we see like 10 missiles going for only two
I don't know what countries are available in DCS for aircraft carriers. The USA, China, Italy, India, UK, France, Russia, Albania, Algeres, and Angola all have aircraft carriers. Angola has 10 but I am not sure about that number. I do know they have one light Harrier carrier.I haven't researched it yet.
very big difference between a amphibious assault ship and a super carrier. the brits dont even have a real carrier. The only countries that have real carriers are the us and maybe china (TBD if its done testing?). The russians aircraft carrier is too small to be considered one (they call it a light aircraft carrying cruiser because of tariffs and it does not have the ability to launch planes unless it has headwind) and is always being towed. Same with india and chinas old carriers because they are the same thing as the russian one but with diffrent names. All the other ones are called amphibious assault ships and require VTOL or STOVL planes. The US has 31 of those and 11 super carriers.
May not call it a UK decisive victory but is a UK tactical victory since the CCP Carrier was sunk while UK lost two escort ships. Aircraft loss is 2:1 favoring UK. UK win.
The Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carrier has no AWACS and electronic warfare aircraft. In fact, this situation is impossible. And the interception rate of subsonic missiles is the same as that of hypersonic missiles? There is another mistake in your simulation. You used a lot of "future weapons", but the Chinese side is static. Moreover, the F35B has insufficient range, far less than the J35. If it is in actual combat, the Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier has no chance
There is no comparison at all. The Royal Navy aircraft carrier "Queen Elizabeth" found a serious fault in the coupling on the starboard propeller shaft during a routine inspection before going to sea, which made it impossible to set sail and stay in the port. There is no need for the Fujian to take action, the coupling of the British aircraft carrier will break by itself🤣
I'd be shocked if China can field FC-31s by 2027. Also they've decided not to use baked-in RCS reduction and are relying only on coatings. No way it'll be stealth like the F-35 is.
21:01 what happens in this scenario? The game counts the plane permanently non combat? Also what and how would this happen IRL? Why would the pilot “give up” even being one of the first in his attack group? A communist pilot giving up
Its a shame we cant simulate the munition failure rates, 35% of those chinese missiles would either just drop back down from launch, missfire, explode in the tube or just fail to track or their engines/flight elements fall apart
@@Dirge419 If you say so, the Type 45 has a very high failure rate, which is a joke. In fact, it may be difficult for the UK to organize a fleet to go out on patrol hahahaha🤣
There is no comparison at all. The Royal Navy aircraft carrier "Queen Elizabeth" found a serious fault in the coupling on the starboard propeller shaft during a routine inspection before going to sea, which made it impossible to set sail and stay in the port. There is no need for the Fujian to take action, the coupling of the British aircraft carrier will break by itself🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@Dirge419 The Royal Navy aircraft carrier "Queen Elizabeth" was found to have a serious fault in the coupling on the starboard propeller shaft during a routine inspection before going to sea, which made it unable to set sail and stay in the port. It had to withdraw from the NATO military exercise. There was no need for the Fujian to take action, the coupling of the British aircraft carrier would break by itself🤣😂😂
Well, there’s a concept that is gaining a degree of traction called an arsenal ship. It’s basically a massive VLS with a hull around it, few dozen crew at most and not much else. Targeting information would be supplied by other vessels. The idea being that it would carry hundreds of missiles to defeat missile attacks and overwhelm enemy missile defences. The downside of the ship is that it is basically incapable of doing anything else.
@@alexcrawford6162 Alex Hollings made a video on this concept, would recommend watching it. The concept falls short when you consider the risk of having hundreds of millions of dollars worth of VLS stored missiles on a ship that lacks the support elements onboard to support itself.
@@alexcrawford6162arsenal ships periodically pop up in these conversations and have done since the 80s. They have never been built for good reason. They are a good idea only on paper.
The US has those. Four Ohio-class subs with the nuclear missile tubes replaced with 157 VLS tubes, usually filled with Tomahawks. These are to be replaced with ten Block V Virginia-class subs with 40 each as they retire the Ohios. And recall that the newest Tomahawk has anti-ship capabilities.
Abso-bloomin-lutely CLASSIC, EPIC, FROTHING Cap commentary, must be the best ever. The sports / war commentary equivalent of Donald O'Connor doing Make 'Em Laugh in one take in Singing In The Rain. Most enjoyable, and v good to hear Cap running back on 200% power
Cap, your German and French exclamations are priceless. As well as sports-commenter-style acceleration+volume increase in tense moments. I watch everything at 1.75 to save time, and it is particularly hilarious when you do that :)
Fun commentary. The f35s could land, refuel and rearm then carry out a second anti-shipping attack unless the chinese fleet could move to SAM cover.... not sure it's a draw?
I think that the failure of those last few anti-ship missiles from China could be attributed to missile guidance failure, so was probably fairly realistic?
No I would not count this as a draw, as you say it's not scripted, and it's not your fault Chinese crap does what it does* lol The UK just barely wins!👍 Btw I believe the anti climactic batch was going for a dead ship ;)
no, not a draw as Britian were firing extreme numbers of Sea Ceptors at very few YJ-12s towards the end. I think Britiain would certainly have had enough Sea Ceptors to defeat the YJ-12
When setting the damage for missiles, it seems a bit flat based on size/explosive power, however you can do far more damage with the modern smaller missiles because they target specific locations on ships to maximize effect, we used to do this with laser pointers on the ground to bust bunkers/mmls/sams, so a smaller munition hitting a weak point was more likely to destroy the target than a huge explosive hitting randomly. Is there a way to convince DCS that just because a munition is small it doesn't mean reduce the damage as if it's a random hit. Oh and if you haven't seen it because "Russia Bad", the latest report on the J-35, is they can detect them at over twice the range China previously claimed.
To be fair. DCS have a hard time handeling modern electronics like EW and multi guided missiles. I would say anything after year 2005 or there abouts DCS is at best a very rought estimation of real system. Of cause, this is not the devs fault a lot of those systems is higly clasified and hence really hard to make a model for.
Carefully read all the comments. 100% agree it was a draw ... *'cept British still won. If that sounds contradictory to you, no worries -- my brain just works better! 😂
@@grimreapers Well EW is the corner of the RN's defence supposedly. Everything kinetic is last ditch and just in case. And that scares the willies out of me.
@grimreapers Cap the British absolutely won this battle. Because with the Chinese carrier gone, those aircraft are all gone also. Whereas the British still have two squadrons of aircraft that could land rearm and take out the remaining Chinese ships at their leisure
you've also forgotton about 1 thing. We only have 3 T45s available at one time.... You could sub in a couple extra T23s as they have some AA capability too. But this goes to show how ill equipped we are VS china. However, I totally realise that we would also be boosted by the USA and japan and S Korea too, so our own lack of AA isnt as bad but even so. why we can't have more dakka is beyond me. More money spent short term = more money saved long term, still a lesson the MOD refuses to learn
One limitation of your scenarios is the “single sortie” factor. In reality planes would be cycling for refueling and rearming constantly. Shooting down incoming missiles would be a priority for both sides’ aircraft, you don’t just assume air defense will keep your runway afloat and keeping the carrier afloat is the single most critical thing.
