@@RonSpomerOutdoors Hello Ron 8.6BLK cartridge designed by Q that also designed 300BLK. A 12.5" barrel, 1in3 twist, 210 to 300 grain subsonic in a 338 Suppressor could be a nice hunting rifle within 300 yards. Could see this in the new CZ 600 Trail Rifle See this Kudu Hunt in South Africa ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-_C6FKKx1d_8.html
I am a huge fan of the 35 Whelen as it has never failed me here in Alaska for over 50 years. That said the original Alaska big game guide, Hal Waugh, used a 375 H&H that was re-chambered to 375 Weatherby. Hal claimed no bear ever needed a second dose of Big Nan as he called his rifle. Big Nan is the most famous rifle in Alaska history for a reason. I am pretty sure Hal did not do a lot of long range shooting as Big Nan has iron sites on it. Close work was what it was built for.
I own a Ruger m77 in 338 and an A bolt in 375.... I've personally used them both in Alaska... I tend to use the 338 more, but I don't feel a disadvantage with either caliber.... But great comparison.
You have the comforting manner of everyone's favorite uncle Sir. The fact you display encyclopedic knowledge to go along with it keeps us coming back for more. God Bless you!
A little over 30 yrs ago, I bought a mod70 Winlite in 338wm when I moved to the Yukon. For a solo backpack hunter it gives peace of mind at night in a light tent ,or less. Rams, goat, caribou, moose, many mulies and whitetails later...I have no complaints.
Nice comparison video. A comparison between the 270 gr bullet in the 375 H&H with the 250 gr bullet in the 338 Win Mag might have been a better comparison because the velocities would be about the same, as well as the bullet weights. When I was looking for my "Do Everything, Anywhere, Any animal, Any terrain" rifle, I started looking for the 338 win mag but could not find one for a long time. One day during my routine gun shop visits, I spied a Browning A-Bolt in stainless, 26" bbl, open sights, and synthetic stock in 375 H&H, and grabbed it, put a Leupold 2.5 x 7 scope on it and proceeded to knock the stuffing out of anything that got in it's way(Barnes 270 TSX @ 2,800 fps). Never recovered a bullet and never had to track anything. I'm also sure the same would be for the win mag. A 250 gr bullet through the shoulder means the hunts over no matter what critter it is. I think I got a little velocity gain with the 26" tube. If it were 24", I'd be in the same velocity zone as the win mag. The 375 H&H with that load smashes through both elk shoulders effortlessly and pole-axes even the biggest deer. BTW, you never mention what bullets you were using or velocities on those fails. What bullet you're using for what task is a HUGE factor in lethal performance. I don't think there's a wrong answer as to which one is better.
Hi Ron. Very nice video. It puts the different roles and attributes of the 338 Win Mag and the 375H&H into perspective. I live in South Africa, own a 375H&H and have shot some very big dangerous animals where the 375 is the minimum calibre. That is really the difference, the 375H&H is primarily a dangerous game / mega fauna and then a general purpose hunting rifle whereas the 338 Win mag is an outstanding long distance big game rifle (not megafauna) which can do the job of putting incapacitating big aggressive animals under eg., a 1000kg weight class. So definitely for American and most African game it is the superior all round choice. I and other people I have hunted with have found that the 250gr and 270gr Barnes TSX probably make the best all round bullets for general hunting up to the size of blue wildebeest and eland downloaded to about 2300ft/s for the bushveld. I also have a 256gr cast load at 2100 which works really well up to 170m. No need for the extra recoil. For plains game I use a 200gr bullet at 2900ft/s with a suppressor. I have two interchangeable scopes on QD rings so I can switch backwards and forwards, The blue wildebeest has a peculiar anatomy in regard to the shape and position of the spine. Its quite possible your hunting partner just caught the top of the spine and you shot above it.
I agree with you and identify the size animal along with realist range for terrain that’s the key. Big bullets for heavy game with plenty of powder and penetration. Long distance in open areas please don’t shoot huge game animals. Plains game take 338 or 300 mags no problem. I don’t agree with people like to shoot small caliber bullets at high speed ( as is if dealing miles/km per gallon). Again if eating the animal is of importance the heavy bullet doesn’t destroy the edible meat. So for real hunters again the large bullet performs better you just need to get closer to the animal and that’s called hunting😎
Let's not also forget that 375 h&h isn't all that much more powerful than a .338 winchester magnum. Slightly more powerful yes. But like you said .338 win mag is meant for for different purposes and is a longer range rifle. A 338 win mag can shoot out to 1000 yards if need be. A 375 H&H can shoot effectively out to 300 yards. After 300 yards it's energy losses and bullet drop are quite significant compared to the 338 win mag. Let's not also forget the 338 win mag is just simply a shortened 375 H&H cartridge. Where both cartridges can be loaded to a max of 300 grains as well.
No incoming fire from me Ron, a very balanced presentation and the numbers don’t lie. I was surprised that the 338 Win Mag caught up to the 375 in energy after just 125 yards and the 375 was 50 grains heavier! I heard a lot of good things about the 338 Win Mag and you just proved it. Thanks Ron for another great presentation. 👍
With that Barnes’ TTSX’s out of my 270 Winchester I get complete penetration here in Alaska on big bulls… my buddy runs a 25-06 pushing 80 grain TTSX’s with the same results.
Right On.! Speaking of 338, specifically the Win Mag, I really like it’s performance on big game. When I built a 358-WSM on a short action I did so with the goal of meeting or exceeding the 338’s level of performance. …it would push 225 grain SAF’s to 2930 fps and would consistently cluster 5 into the .300’s. It pounded Moose. Then I started running lighter and faster with TTSX’s and found I like that particular tool a lot better.
338 win mag is still a stopping cartridge look it up. It's designers had in mind for it to be a stopping cartridge as it was still designed directly off the 375 h&h.
Mr. Spomer you've moved to the top of my list because of your lack of snobbery, and your good balance between ballistics and actual harvesting of game animals. A couple of years ago I was shopping for another 300 Win Mag, one that would be more weather resistant, online at my favorite supplier. I'd had several Savage rifles to pass through my "arsenal." They were all decently accurate but lacking in other areas, especially triggers. I really liked what I'd learned about the Savage Bear Hunter, and for some reason the .338 in the same rifle was $200 cheaper than any of the other calibers at Bud's. I purchased one and after shooting it a few times I traded away my Model 70 in .375 H&H.
You are a very brave man. Putting on a red flannel shirt and venturing into the RU-vid thicket for this one. "Be very very quiet, I'm hunting trolls." I have both of them and like both of them but I tend to use the .338 more. The barrel of the .375 just reminds me too much of swinging an iron pipe around. The .338 seems like a little bit smaller piece of iron pipe. Anyhow, as always, great video. Thanks for sharing it!
Your the last word on real world cartridge performance Ron. And you dispense your knowledge with modesty and entertaining and informative anecdotes. We all really appreciate your work. No question the .338 win mag is the better performing cartridge in nearly all instances.
Ron, I’m a new gun owner and I just have to tell you that your information is great. Thank you for all of the info you provide. P.S. I went elk hunting in Colorado with my nephew in November and he lung shot a elk with a 338, it got about 15 feet before dropping dead. It was my first hunt and I went as an observer, it was a real adventure.
I've used the 338 win mag and a 375 ruger for hunting and i haven't noticed any difference in "knockdown power" as some people will say. I believe it's all about what you are most comfortable with and what you can shoot the most accurate.
@@s.wvazim6517 338 just seems to puts a lot morel energy on target I like my 300s and 3006s and they work but if I’m picking a fight with a grizzly I’d rather have a 338
Well the 338 win mag out ranges the 375 H&H by a long shot in terms of keeping its energy over long distances. The 338 win mag can shoot to kill out to 1000 yards if need be. The 375 H&H cannot maybe only out to 300 yards them the energy loss and drop is quite huge. I know this because well I've compared the ballistics and I own both rifle cartridges. In a grizzly hunt I'd rather have the 338 win mag In case my bear is 300 yards away or more. If I'm looking at bear defense I'd rather have the 375 H&H. But a .300 win mag would do it too I've been on a few hunts and personally seen a .300 drop a few grizzlies in one shot so. It's all on shot placement.
Love the videos Ron. I can’t wait until we see one on the 8mm Mag. I am lucky enough to have one and hand load for it. It is a beast and I think it can take any game in the world. Very powerful.
Ron is the goat. I think he has some of the best cartridge analysis on RU-vid. Examines physics and combines it with lots of field experience. What a guy
I just love the 338 Win Mag. with proper shot placement it hits like the hammer of Thor and anchors them in place. with this you are not under gunned for any North American big game. As always great review and comparison.
Good stuff (as always). It brings back memories of a friend that hunted a deer around 20 years ago. He had a 375 HH that he wanted to use, so he found some 180 grain pointy plastic tip bullet that just throttled that deer. Wow!
ALL of what you are saying hit me directly (and personally) in 1994, during a trophy whitetail hunt with a friend who is also a veteran (as am I). We were on a large opening lane, mountains to our east and west. About 500-meters apart, during our scouting, we'd chosen our hunting positions, agreed on fields of fire, even agreed on where we'd park at and hike up from (to prevent spooking any 'herds' that might be up in there at that time of year...as traffic seemed quite-heavy). So, opening day, we're on the location, taken our positions...maybe an hour prior to first-light...just to make sure that if any were moving or 'spooked' during our arrival, they had time to calm down. Dawn light started...and at first, I thought I was looking at a small yearling...until he moved his head. A SOLID 12-point, possibly more...I gently flicked the safety off...tracking him in my scope...he's about 100-meters from me, but he's 'spooky', for sure. He's RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME! In fact, he's in a bad position...face on...I don't have a good, clean shot...I'm really hoping he'll turn without walking up on me, or just fleeting out of there at full speed. He's CENTERED in my lane-of-fire...I haven't heard ANYONE else up in this valley-flat...and I know my friend won't infringe on the lane to 'cross-over', trophy, or not...so I'm patient. 10-minutes...15-minutes...that damn deer stood there, eating in one spot, LONGER THAN A COW WILL GRAZE IN A FIELD! He had almost burned up my patience...and then...he turned 90-degrees...and raised his head...PERFECT! I've got my beloved Browning .300-WM...165-grain SPBT custom loads...my friend had his Remington 7400 in .30-06 (his 'everyday' turn-to favorite). I slowly squeeze the trigger on my rifle, and the sound of a 'howitzer' goes off...and where I thought this deer would 'drop in his tracks'...I never see the weeds move! No dust. He's running ALL OUT...AND STRAIGHT AT ME! In fact, he passes me to my left, not 10-foot away...headed up the foothills, through the treeline...so fast, I couldn't work the bolt to even get a follow-up! He crested the hill...and then I heard it...'hmmmmph...' and that 'train crash in the woods' telling me he had dropped dead. My friend walks up, almost screaming...'YOU SHOT AT ME!' I said, 'huh? what? I DID NOT! Where the hell were you at, that I would have done that? Did you move from your position agreed on? He's confused, I'm confused...He said, 'I didn't move ONE INCH until I heard the shot!' I said, 'well, I shot straight into my lane of fire, dead on! So, I didn't shoot at you!' His reply, 'then why in the hell are you looking UP the hill?!' I said, 'because before it died, it ran up there!' He called B.S., I said, 'let's go get the deer, inspect it, and then I'll show you were he was standing when I fired.' I also walked it off...285-yards! From where I retrieved the body, to the very spot where AN EASY QUART of blood was on the ground...that 225-lb standing weight whitetail deer ran that far. My friend, now soothed to see the 'place on the ground where the shot occurred', was amazed...he said 'I don't see the shot entrance'...we searched...and then I found it...BY FEELING FOR IT! If it hadn't broke a rib going in, It might have taken a razor to shave the pelt, just to find it! BUT...the exit side told another story...you could put your fist through the three MISSING ribs! As soon as a began field dressing it, we saw the damage, and the incredulity grew! I cut the abdominal wall open...and it looked like someone poured 2-gallons of port wine EVERYWHERE! There were literally NO ORGANS LEFT! NONE! Maybe 1-2 feet of intestine, between the hind quarters...but no lungs, liver, kidneys...not even a stomach...it wasn't even tissue left...it just poured out on the ground! My friend stood there, and said 'there's no way! you drug that deer up on that hill, just to mess with me!' I told him, 'did you see me dragging the wine bag, when you caught up to me?' I'm not sure if it was bone fragment, bullet hardness, or what...but the deer liquified inside...but other than sheer terror in his eyes, when he passed me going up that hill...you'd never have known it was 'dead-deer-walking' when he did... He and I have told this story many times, because to my knowledge, I've NEVER heard anyone else have such an extreme example of an 'absolute take-down-shot' on an animal...and it make it almost 300-yards. The deer OBVIOUSLY ran out of oxygen to its brain, and is the ONLY THING that stopped him, in the end....470-Nitro or .300-Magnum, I don't think in this case, it would have mattered or changed ANYTHING about what happened that day...some mysteries of 'the hunt' will always remain mysteries...and ballistics will never explain it further.
In my dream bucket list of rifles for my next life is the .300 H and H magnum, the 250-3000 Savage Model 99, and the .257 Roberts in a pre-'64 Model 70. All for hunting at the ranch in central Montana, where we got it done with the Model-70 .30-06 during this lifetime. But the 300 H and H would be perfect for our terrain and I love that long, sloped shoulder for ease of feeding. Great work, Ron, as always.
I have had that happen at least once with every single rifle I own. I have noticed rifles that are 2800 fps. or slower at the muzzle, tend to favor a softer more expansive bullet. The Nosler Partitions seem to be the best of both worlds, I think most if not all of the offerings of a 375 H&H are at 2800 fps. or slower so, I think swift bullets should be saved for buffalo on up., but even then some animals do not wish to die at times. Great Show.
I think the sweet spot for most modern cartridges is 2800fps. I tend to pick a bullet in the weight that gets me around 2800fps for that specific cartridge.
Weather living in Alaska for 35 years and having numerous close encounters some closer than others I have to say I went towards a 375 H&H shot placement sounds great when you’re on a bench rest and haven’t been working your tail off trying to get to where you can get a shot when you’re out of breath shaky and weak it’s nice to have that extra
I've been a "medium" bore enthusiast for around 4 decades. I believe one should be very adept with their choice of weapon therefore "practice". I own a custom 1917 Enfield in .375 Ackley Improved and two .338 Winchester bolt rifles. People always seem a bit shocked at my choice of weapon when they see me hunting/shooting Jack Rabbits, Rock Chucks etc. with those two cartridges. Three favorite bullets I reload (I've never shot factory ammo) for the .338 are the 210 grain Nosler Partition, 250 grain Nosler partition and the 275 Grain Speer Semi Spitzer. The speer is no longer made but it is the most dynamite like killer of all these bullets. I feel that this effect is because of bullet construction. The 275 gr. has a SD of .348 and the jacket is quite thin. When Speer discontinued making this bullet I bought as many as I could. The reason I love it is because the performance at moderate range on elk size animals. I've never had a 275gr exit an elk but every single one I've shot dropped in their tracks. I feel the explosive bullet construction in this case is the bottom line. Both the 210 and 250 gr. Nosler partitions have never stopped in the body cavity of any elk, deer or anything else I've harvested. Both the Noslers are great killers, just not as dramatic as the heavy Speer. One needs to consider likely range, animal construction etc to choose bullets and cartridges. My .375 Ackley Improved is a dramatic cartride also but bullet choice is as important as the .338 Win. In my experience (lots) hunting with my .375 it can be quite "complacent" where game performance is concerned or as above resembling "dynamite". Bullet construction is paramount to the overall effect on different species of game or even rocks. Both the .338 and .375 cartridges have an abundance of bullet weights and constructions which helps both classes of cartridges be so diverse in their respective desired uses. My .375 loaded with a Speer 235gr Semi Spitzer at over 3,000fps is a total explosive bomb. For long range elk, my rifle chronographs 2969 fps with the Nosler 260 gr boat tail Accubond. For tougher game or close range elk the 300gr Nosler boat tail Accubond or the 300 gr Nosler Partition Spitzer. Both the .338 and the .375 can be exactly what one wants if you choose an appropriate projectile. Bullets for the handloader in .338 span from 180gr to 300gr. Bullets for the handloader of the .375 span from 235gr to a massive 350 gr. Rabbits to elephants? Yep...
Comparing equal sectional density of bullets across calibers the .338 Winchester Magnum and 7mm/.284 Remington Magnum penetrated the deepest of all. Bob Hagel claimed using Nosler Partion version's of the above calibers the depth of over three feet was expected. An expanding bullet having that pedigree in Hagel's time was mind bending. Solids in either would drop elephant using frontal brain shots.
Love your vids ron. My favourite part is you don’t glorify and promote match projectiles and always recommend proper hunting projectiles. Too many people don’t understand the importance of projectiles and think BC is all that matters
Great video I always enjoy your cartridge comparisons you reminded me I have a 375 H&H Wayback in my safe I also have a lead 300 gr. mold in these times when it cost so much to shoot I'm going to cast some bullets and enjoy the 375 H&H thank you
Great stuff Ron! Love my .338 win. I'd certainly carry a .338 win with hard bonded, partition, or mono bullets for protection when expecting shots under 100 yards. With the BC craze for longer shots and softer bullets, you need to run the numbers on the .338 win with the 265 ABLR at 2700 fps. Perhaps it'd be a good one for elk, but I was surprised when I plugged them into my ballistics program at the energy numbers the little win mag can deliver with that ABLR. It makes those energy numbers you show in your comparison child's play. Such a versatile round the .338 win mag is.
My 338 win mag with a high BC and a gilding bullet takes big game over 400 yards like a champ while still making me feel very comfortable in rugged grizzly territory.
Great video. Ultimately, the uncertainty resulting from a very small sample size. Calibers that doesn't kill what they are supposed to does not sell for 100 years
You are correct, but I must add the real difference is usually shot placement and bullet construction for the purpose intended. I've shot varmints with a Hornady 110gr spirpoint out of a 300Win at 3700fps and the results were very impressive but would never use that load on edible game. I've seen the 300Sav take down elk and the old 30-30 take moose. Stay within the limits of whatever you choose and use the right bullet and distance for the job.
I'd love to see a video about the 370 sako sometime, the cartridge always interested me. Man I really enjoy listening to Ron talk about cartridges and past hunts and even though I have no use for any rifle over a 30-06 the big rifles of Alaska and Africa are still very interesting to me.
I have wondered about the 8RM but the lack of bullet selection and expense and availability pushed my choices to the 300Win and 338WM which are very available, proven,cheaper and all three will do pretty much the same at reasonable distances with my nod going to the 338WM if I planed on going to Alaska for brown bear or Africa.
My favorite 375 bullet is the Sierra 300 BTSP which has a BC of .475-.480 so it shoots flatter than most pills available for the caliber. It's a tough bullet but will expand decently, but of course is WAY more bullet than is optimal for smaller animals such as deer where you don't need maximum penetration and would be better off with more expansion in a lighter bullet at higher velocity. I think it's all about shot placement and when hunting and you can choose your shot...the smaller calibers w/lighter bullets are the better choice. But in a defensive role you often won't have the option of choosing your shot....it's trying to hurt you so you take what you have which might not be an optimal angle and need maximum penetration to be effective. This type of bullet will of course be compromised on a perfect non-emergency shot so bullet selection is most important depending on what you're wanting to do. The Sierra 300 works very well from all accounts with good expansion yet deep penetration so I'd consider it a good 'all around' bullet. Lighter more fragile options exist and would likely work better on lighter game, but if you only can take one bullet...the Sierra is a good one. Oh...one more thing to mention: it seems that even thought the maximum pressures for 375 are close to the 338....I believe that most ammo companies consider that these very well might be used in Africa in very hot conditions as well as needing to extract perfectly due to the possibility of dangerous game usage so the actual loaded pressures aren't pushed to the redline. The 338's will be a bit hotter in most loadings which narrows the gap and you really can't go wrong with either if you choose the proper projectile for the job at hand.
In my opinion, it's better for the bullet to pass thru both lungs and leave a gaping exit wound. Similar to a soldier's dreaded sucking chest wound. Without differential pressure, the diaphragm can't operate. A gaping hole equalizes pressure and the diaphragm is inoperative. Think of your hands on a bellows to stoke a fire. A bellows can still operate with a small hole in it. With a huge hole, it cannot retain the air it is attempting to draw and push; it's no longer sealed. With all that said, please feel your ribs. How much meat are you actually sacrificing? Good and safe hunting to you and yours.
Lived in AK for 20 years and specialized in Brown Bear hunting. I used a 338 WM...for all game in AK...love the cartridge. My hunting partner used a 375 H&H. Both of us took Brown Bears, but the 338 is a bit more accurate, especially at distance. Thanks for the comparison - love your videos. You are correct that the 338 is extremely positive in AK.
I have fired both and was duly impressed with both. Neither really recoiled as bad as I had been long led to believe. I can't justify owning either, because I just don't hunt any place with game that demand either. I doubt a .30-06 with 180s or 200 grain premium bullets will ever be not enough for me.
Hi Ron , I own both calibers but I have also not been able to drop antelope first time with the .338 Win Mag. I believe it has to do with shot placement , muzzle velocity ,terminal velocity and also the type of bullet one uses for the hunt. I love both these calibers . For longer shots I will prefer to use the 0.338win . The .338 Win can also perform well in the bush ( less than 200 m shots ) using 275 gr swift bullets . I recommend you read the book “African Rifles” by John Taylor who has hunted most African game including the big 5 . This makes very interesting reading as he expresses his view on the .375 H&H after using this rifle on almost all African game including the big 5.
It is shot placement when coming to African game. Their vitals are in slightly different areas when comparing to North American game. The 338 is more than capable of dropping them and Ron has said this himself being to Africa himself and hunting with his 338 wm there as well. The 375 H&H is only very marginally more powerful than a 338 win mag. Not much more powerful. Only 500 ft lbs of energy more tha a 338 win mag. Uses same bullet weights. Recoil wise I honestly find the 338 win mag recoil worse as I own both a 338 wm and a 375 H&H. The 338 win mag can also kill effectively out to 1000 yards if need be. The 375 H&H is good to about 300 yards. After 300 yards the bullet drop and energy loss is significant compared to the 338 win mag which just keeps its energy and keeps going forward.
Can't wait for the 8mm Mag discussion. Too bad it is obscure. I have to handload mine but it really performs (on both ends!) Love the videos Ron, great work.
Im glad that you mentioned the barnes X bullet. It is absolutely the bullet that all of of the other manufacturers are now trying to emulate. It offers the best of both worlds, a hollowpoint for rapid, instantaneous opening and energy transfer, as well as a large mushroom , partition style body ,...that allows for super deep penetration. Absolutely love that bullet!!!
I have a .375 Ruger, my brother has a .338 WM. I was considering getting something in the 33 family for longer range. But looking into it, with Barnes data, the .375 Ruger is lethal to 575 yards (maximum range to keep minimum velocities for the bullets). It still retains over 2,000 FT-Lbs at 500 yards, though my planned maximum is 400 yards for moose, where it's still holding onto almost 2,500 FT-Lbs. I doubt it would bounce off of an elk either. I was honestly looking at the 8mm Rem mag at one point. But the lack of rifles and bullets took care of that.
I made my way through most of the medium bores and kinda always fell back to the 9.3x62 and 35 Whelen. Then again I've never hunted the Dark Continent either
@@Spruce-Bug I know that the long range small bores are all the rage these days but in my humble opinion, nothing plows through big game like heavy medium bores at moderate velocity.
Solar plexus, home to the autonomic nervous system. Those systems that are somewhat automatic. Breathing, heartbeat, a host of others, hit that, it's a disruptive event. Good info Ron, thanks.
Even though I’m more of a long range precision shooter than a hunter I absolutely your channel and discussion on rifle cartridge ballistics. Good job brother.
Another great video Ron! The .338 Win. is plenty of horsepower for big game in the Elk-Bear-Moose range, and adjusting the bullet weight and construction for the game and range makes it very versatile, with less recoil than the .375.
You are correct about the solar plexus. I like to refer to it as an "off switch". Every deer I have shot with my 243 win has dropped on the spot with this shot. Everyone likes heart shots because it pumps the blood out. I've seen deer pump most of the blood out of its body and still run from what I believe is adrenaline. That's why I prefer the high shoulder. I aim just above the shoulder blade and sometimes a little back and it never fails. As Barry from Moss Pawn once said, " It's like blowing out a birthday candle, instant death".
When the 338 RUM came out I was working at a gunshop and had one put together on a Ruger #1 action I had. I've done a lot of load development and shot a 6 point bull with it, but if I had it to do over again I'd done a 336-06 Improved. Comes pretty close to the Win Mag and wouldn't kill on both ends like that RUM.
I like your info Ron. I have always loved the .375 but my buddy took his .338 model 70 to Africa and shot all his plains game with it so I’m a believer in it also!!! Great video!!!
I think Ron was correct in his theory about appropriate bullet selection with the .375. I've come to think the .375 is often paired with inappropriately hard bullets for thin skinned game because people perceive it as being so powerful it couldn't fail (and therefore don't select an appropriate bullet). It reminds me of how the 7mm rem mag got a bad reputation because it would often be paired with bullets that were to soft for its velocity (the opposite of the .375). Although I think the .375 amazing it has built up such a mystic reputation that people have begun to treat it as if it isn't just a regular rifle cartridge, and therefore don't take the same amount care for bullet selection and shot placement as they would with a .300, .338, etc.
I might be treading on thin ice but I think the .375 is best with bullets using older technology. Partitions, Silvertips and Interlocks here in North America for most big game.
Excellent channel. I know the rage today is to shoot game with smaller bullets in small cases with high BCs, but I still have a deep love for the big guns. I don't shoot game at extreme ranges, so the ultra high BC hybrid bullets aren't generally what I would use. For the most part, I prefer controlled expansion bullets. I'm buying boxes of 6.5×284 Norma loaded with 156 grain Oryx bullets by the car load, cause it's such an outstanding hunting bullet. Ditto for the 170 grain 7mm Oryx bullets. But I also have quite a lot of the old school Hornady Interlock bullets for the 270 Win and '06s. I love the .338 caliber for hunting big, heavy game. The 33 cal cartridges are tailor-made for elk hunting. I have a .338 Win Mag that I quite like, and I plan on adding its big cousin, the .340 Weatherby Magnum, to the stable. I also really like the 35, 36, and 37 calibers. I'm probably one of the few hunters in North America who went out and bought a 370 Sako Magnum(9.3×66). I think it's a great cartridge, and I can't wait to take it on safari in Africa. I actually prefer it to the mighty .375 H&H Magnum, as it's a bit more pleasant to shoot. And the sectional density on 9.3mm bullets is impressive.
I really think the bullet more than the cartridge was causing your problems that you talked about. I say this only because as you described the shots weren’t that far and the shot placement was good, so given that the 375 H&H is more than adequate. I do find the comparison very interesting and agree (based on this info) the 338 Win mag is maybe a better choice. At least for North American game. I wouldn’t have thought that before seeing this, so thanks!
I got a Ruger Hawkeye Safari in 338wm and would hate to part with it. Is just a lovely shooting and lovely looking rife. And with a muzzle break, it is very mild on recoil. Great video!
Another great Video Ron,, Thank you for all your videos.. I"m a 7mm Mag man and would hunting anything in North America with total confidence. 175 Gr. Nosler Partition bullet is all that is needed to harvest these animals..
Yeah, many people exaggerate. A 375 H and H mag isn't going to outperform a 50 BMG A max. Here a deer took a shot by the 50 cal with a 750 cal Amax, ran over 80 yards. The bullet literally disemboweled the deer, the intestines where blown out and hanging out a big gaping hole behind the shoulder. So sometimes a smaller caliber to put on target more accurately in good spot usually does the trick.
Hitting us again with some classic cartridges that we all need to know more about. We lose track of some of the greats as we look at the new hyper long distance cartridges and it's unfortunate. 338 Winchester and 375 h&hare still two of the greatest cartridges of all time rocking big dangerous game and also on my bucket list
I prefer it to the .338 Winchester myself. I can't see a difference when the game gets hit. I suppose the magnum may be better if things go wrong, but then nothing bigger or faster may help.
@@eksemos A-Square, Weatherby and Nosler have factory loaded ammunition in the past. I am not sure what is available at the moment. A-Square and Weatherby have chambered factory rifles in the past as well. I think E.R. Shaw will chamber a rifle for it as well.
@@hillbillyscholar8126 I have a Savage 110 with a Shaw barrel. To answer the unasked question the difference to 338wm. I load 185gr tsx bullets and 210gr partitions. The 185gr tsx’s travel around 90-100 fps slower then 338WM with heaps less recoil. Plants white tail sized game extremely well!!
You do a great job showing the true facts based on the ballistics " that are proven to be correct" I have hunted in the past and I shot a 220 pound wild boar with a medium 240 grain bullet at 33 yards with a 44 mag. He did not move after the first shot "broke the shoulder and pierced both lungs . My point of my discourse, you never know" I very much enjoy your expertise on this subject
I love your pod cast's and the amount of information's is fantastic. Now that we are on the topic of sheer thump and shock in the right dosage it occurred to me that for some reason the .416 Rigby just kicks some major tail on both of these cartridges when it come to explosive damage. Just seems to be the right weight and balance :) Off topic I know but well there it is. Thank you so much and I look forward to more. Wishing you the best always, :)
.340 Weatherby - .338-.378 WEARTHBY (which out performs all other .338 cal. cartridges - even the .338 Lapua) there are so many GREAT old cartridges out there, that most of these new super cartridges are NOT enough of a improvement over to warrant the expense of them that I'll stick with the old tried and true & pic my shots & battles, so that I've got more coffee money in my pocket....... ""Ultimate"" - 1 SHOT set up, my HOVER ROUND ELECTRIC chair scooter mounted with the, READY,, .950 JDJ - LoL - - Hahaha.
Excellent video! and I totally agree with you. I have a copy of the original G&A Big Bore Riles, and in it, Craig Boddington and Bob Hagel debated just what you did here. I have owned 2 375's and 2 338's. I eventually switched to the 340 Wby and have never looked back. More power than the 375 in terms of energy at any range and very flat shooting. I'm on my third one so that should tell you how much I like it LOL Too many guys pass it by in favor of another cartridge because the loading manuals and powder sites/companies data show it about equal to the 338. That's because pressure barrels are expensive and relatively few companies have one for the 340. When loaded to full spec with pressure tested data, it will throw 250's at 2980- 3010 fps pretty easily.
I shot several game with 8x57, 3006 and 375. It's all about the bullet and of course if you hit spine or bone. After several years they are all excellent. In 375 I use the game king,in 3006 I used norma oryx but changed it to a copper bullet (barnes). The best shots will make the game run 20-50meters, a pure shot in the lungs with little damage on the meat. You're the best Ron! Greetings from a cold forrest in Sweden with my 375 ruger 1 as companion
Never a popular cartridge since 8mm rem mag did nothing that existing cartridges couldn’t do already with shorter actions and less recoil, not to mention it is not legal for big African game like Buffalo
What a great comparison and it confirms what I have suspected. I have hunted a fair amount of Blue Wildebeest with both 375 H&H and 338 Win Mag and I prefer the 338 Win Mag by far. Both dropped the animals quickly, but the convenience and versatility of the 338 Win Mag just make it a much easier choice for me. When I open the safe, I'd grab the 338 Win Mag in heartbeat over the 375 H&H. I hunt anything from Impala to "bloues" (Blue Wildebeest) with it.
Thanks Ron, very interesting comparison. Yeah, you're on thin ice... . 375h&h is wel known in South Africa, performs very well on big animals like eland, buffalo, giraffe, hippo and even elephant. 338 is not as well known, but should perform equally with the right bullet. A bigger bullet range and modern propellants will put most cartiges in a new league, with propper shot placement. I still love my 375.
The 338 win mag is a much more efficient cartridge with a way higher BC, it has a way better bullet selection, ammo is less expensive and way easier to find, the rifles are generally lighter, it has a short action, less recoil, and is way cheaper to reload. With modern premium bullets there is nothing the 338 can’t do. That said the 375 very marginally out performs the 338 in energy. Who’s on thin ice now?
Your vids are by far my absolute favorites, you make the most educational and entertaining content out here right now! Really great stuff, in addition to your experience you just let the numbers and common sense do the talk and it convinces me every time. I was in a discussion regarding the recoil beetween the 338 Win Mag and the 375 H&H, and to my suprise most people clearly favored what they claimed was the lesser recoil in the 375 H&H. Now I know the numbers tell us that the 338 Win Mag has lesser recoil, so I startet asking about their rifle weights, gunstock design and what kinds of loads they where using. Turns out that almost every single 338-hunter i talked to chose a light rifle and really heavy loads right up there at max to get that extra range, trajectory and energy. I have learned over the years that if recoil is an issue the numbers can only tell that much. The real issue is when people choose a hard-hitter in a light rifle (wich a lot of 338-hunter does), I would rather go for the 416 Rigby in a heavy rifle with a straight stock and thick butt than a light-weighted 338. As always a great video!
You are on to reality, Mr. Spomer. The "stopping power" or "dropping game" is mostly stories. Reality means the game sometimes tries to make an escape.
Ron, Your theory about blood loss and CNS hits is the same as mine. I've shot deer in the heart with a 7Remmie, producing a 3" exit wound, and it ran close to a 100yds before falling. In theory, that deer should've dropped in place but it ran. Game falls due to blood loss unless you hit the CNS.
Interesting comparisons. I have handloads for both these cartridges that each perform very closely with your factory ammo examples. Yes, my .375 energy starts out slightly higher than the.338 but falls below the .338 quickly, due to the lower BC, just as you say. But, plots of both cartridges' trajectory and energy show they perform similar and any animal on the terminal end probably won't tell the difference. Energy comparisons favor velocity due to the v^2 in the equation. On the other hand, the Taylor knockout factor scales with momentum (linearly with v, not squared) and further, bullet diameter also factors in. So, comparing Taylor knockout plots, the .375 is a clear winner at all ranges. The other really important factor in terminal ballistics is bullet design and construction and how that relates to penetration on a really big animal that is charging you - and of course the hunter who needs the cool nerve to ignore recoil under stress and make the first shot accurately.
Love the .338’s. I think the 33 Nosler is the ultimate one gun for NA. This comparison is with a very modest BC as well. There are some very high BC .338 bullets out there that can take down some really big stuff.
Wow, speaking of great books, if anyone has not read "The Man Eaters of Tsavo," then that has GOT to be their next purchase. GREAT adventure novel! And true story too!
375 H&H is a great round but truthfully is way over kill for deer and elk. 338 is a great cartridge both are good for dangerous game. If you talk to PH ‘s they will tell this happens all the time with African game. This mostly happens because African game body structure is very different than North American game. So in truth both are great and shot placement is everything. Lol the 45-70 is still the most sold bear gun in Alaska bar none!! Lived there for 22 years. Most guides I know if not using a 45-70 use a 416 Remington or Rigby. So my story for you is this a guide with his hunter , Hunter shoots a big bear with his 375 H&H bear doesn’t die goes into the willows guide deciding to go in after it to soon runs into the bear shoots the bear 4 more times with his 416 Rigby bear still gets the guide malls him pretty bad but the bear died soon after. So in truth shot placement and proper hunting is the key. Like I said 45-70 is still the most popular gun in Alaska for bears.
I've never understood this idea that African game body structure is very different then N. A. Not that I've even noticed. Except perhaps for giraffe. But all the antelope wear lungs and heart in chest same as whitetails and elk and moose. Liver tight behind diaphragm. Same leg bones, ribs, vertebrae.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors Shot Placement: African vs North American Game African Hunting Experience - Kudu bull with indication of ideal shot placement There is always a debate about shot placement when new hunters arrive at our base here at Royal Karoo Hunting Safaris. One of the main points of debate is the temptation of new ballistics constantly entering the market, resulting in more high-powered rifles. The result for us has been that less emphasis is placed on shot placement and more on firepower. This results in the hunter defaulting to what he knows. And therein lies the rub: North American game’s ideal shot placement is behind the shoulder to hit the vitals. The general rule of thumb for African game is to place your vertical crosshair on the front leg and place the shot a third of the distance from the stomach baseline. So, when the shot is placed behind the shoulder on the African animal and the shot is pulled slightly further back - we have a wounded animal heading for the hills - not to mention a really disappointed hunter… Every problem has a solution - and this problem is easily solved by studying one of the many shot placement books out there. We use “The Perfect Shot” by Kevin Robertson and published by Safari Press.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors this is well known which is why they have the study diagrams and I have watched PH after PH tell their American Hunter where to shoot the animal
Thanks for doing this comparison. I was considering the. 375 h&h but decided against it. Not so much as a result of this video but because i checked the price of ammo! Lol. Great video, thanks.
Heavy Weight Hammer 358 Norma, you can load it down to 338 and all the way up to 375 HH and everything in-between. The most versatile 35 caliber out there hands down. One of my favorites since the sixties.
Thank you, Mr. Spomer for yet another great, and DESIRED video. It reminds me of your comparison video on the 375 H&H and 30-06. It was mainly about the versatility of the ‘06 but I digress. What a great triumvirate of cartridges. And I’m glad you’ve covered them well. I’m looking forward to your video on the 8mm Rem Mag. It’s one I’ve felt interest in since the mid ‘80s. But never enough to really buy one. Hopefully in the that video you’ll cover a bit of the 325 WSM which I very much enjoy owning. Take care and I hope you, the Mrs and Covey are doing well
MY ALASKAN BROWN BEAR GUIDE WHO'S BE GUIDING FOR 30 YEARS CARRIED A .375 WITH 300 GRAIN NOSLER PARTITIONS. SAID HE'D NEVER CARRY ANYTHING OR SHOOT ANYTHING ELSE!!! THAT'S ALL I SHOOT OUT OF MY .338 WIN MAG 250 GRAIN NOSLER PARTITIONS. KILLED AN ELK 275 YARDS STONE COLD DEAD ONE SHOT. THE BULLET YOU USE MAKES A BIG DIFFENCE IN STOPPING POWER WITH GOOD SHOT PLACEMENT.
why are you typing in all caps? Do not type in all caps. It is interpreted as if you are yelling angrily when you type comments in all caps like. jee whiz. also, lol😂
Great video thank you and not trying to cause a bunch of controversy but I would love to see a comparison of the 338 win mag vs 340 weatherby mag “big weatherby fan sorry”
My friend's dad was on a bear hunt and the guy he was with emptied a .357 magnum pistol onto a brown bears head, never penetrating the skull. As it charged closer, his dad shot one shot with the Remington 8mm Magnum and dropped the bear. He has the skull and tanned hide and loves showing the hole right through the skull plate. That thing is thick, so when they use the .338 for them, you know it's a good one as well.
I'd suspect the .357mag was running hollowpoint 125gr or some such bullets. With a 158gr or 180gr hard cast in a 4" or longer barrel, the 357mag will penetrate plenty. Running a Buffalo Bore hard cast, it has done 10.5 inches of pine 2x4 stacked face to face from a 4" barrel.
@@phild9813 Stick some Buffalo Bore loads in a 20" levergun and it picks up near double the energy. In a 158gr load, the round picks up 668 fps up from a 4" barrel.
My favorite round for anything is 338 RUM I’ve shot coyotes to moose and never had an animal run except a 450lb hog that I shot a 625 yards and he ran 20 yards and only because of the shield a big hog has and I shoot my own hand loads that are 250gr sierra at 2950fps.
@@jaxturner7288 no it never went through the hog because the shield was 3 inches thick but I also was just using lead tip ammo not something like a nosler partition but the shield really slowed bullet down and only got single lung
Ron-thanks for this. I’ve not hunted in Alaska but have a number of friends who live there. Their favourite defensive and hunting weapon is a Marlin in .45-70. They would say there are a number of cartridges that will answer the call but they will quickly say that their comfort level is far higher if they’re carrying a .45-70. I’d like to see you do a comparison between Garrett’s Hammerheads and other makes. He guarantees his Hammerheads to penetrate 7 feet of animal.
Neither one of these calibers are readily used in the United States. I’m not saying they are bad, Ron just dedicated an entire program to the 9.3 x 62.
Yes you are right Frank! However, especially the 8.5x55 blaser is very interesting in this context. It is capable to do everything that a 338 win mag can do, but from a short action and a short barrel and with a larger range of bullet weights. That would just be my suggestion for Ron’s next munitions comparison.
@@zoranslavnic5850 - Ron covered the 338 Federal, which is a cartridge developed by Federal and Sako, together in 2006. It’s a necked up .308, but no one noticed it, and it’s almost dead now. I believe it’s a great cartridge, but even Sako/Tikka stop chambering it.
Ron, another great vid. Thanks. You touched on some great points of "hard" v "soft" bullets. Sometimes the old cup n core are best and sometimes the super bullets are the way to go. All depends on the game and range. In Africa the old H&H rules the roost. But remember it gained it's stripes in a time of British elite world travelers and early settlers. Settlers often had 1 rifle. The H&H filled the bill. The .338 is also a great cartridge and does a great job. I would hesitate to take a Cape Buffalo with it. But I've used the old -06 on them (not my first choice). For a one gun African hunt I've often used a .416. All of them work great, mostly I use the .416 Weatherby with 400 gr bullets. Grysbok to Elephants. Ultimately use what you have and what you shoot the best. At the end of the day I've taken lots of large plains game, including Eland, Kudu, Wildebeest, Zebra with a .243, .223, and 22 Hornet. I do NOT recommend that. Pick your shots, keep a calm head. Great work Ron, love your fun/ no nonsense videos. Cheers.
Sorry, ment to say I wouldn't hesitate to use the .338 on Cape Buffalo. Also how about a comparison of the .338 WIN to the. 340 Weatherby. Both great, I enjoy the .340 but I don't think it usually does much the little brother .338 won't do. Mostly just eats $100 bills faster. Cheers, Jeff
Thanks for sharing your experiences. 416 Weatherby for grysbok! Use enough gun! (That's one I haven't hunted yet, though I've seen their tracks in the Port Elizabeth area.)
@@RonSpomerOutdoors that grysbok around PE is a beautiful Lil antelope. Usually darker than the Sharpe's Grysbok up in Zim. Yeah nothing more dangerous than a Grysbok goring. Haha. 416 might be big for a buck the size of a jackrabbit, but a big solid doesn't usually bring the taxidermy man to tears. Cheers, Jeff
When we were young, I inherited a model 99 savage in 250 savage. A hundred years ago they told outrageous stories of what it could do. I'm sure it did a lot of what was claimed. A lot of its success was because of velocity. Shot placement was important. I'm a statistics kind of guy. But statistics, shot placement, all the rest of it never seems to fully explain what a bullet does to a body.
