As a drummer I can feel isolated with IEMs vs wedges but it enables me to play better for the audience and this is where i find the discussion opens up. My band mates put their enjoyment before the enjoyment of the viewing audience. Their priority is their playing experience and then after that the FOH quality. I am the reverse, I would rather be battling with IEMs and be isolated if it means I can hear every little detail of my playing and how I'm linking in with the band if it produces a better quality and a better performance for the audience. If presented with 2 scenarios; A). where the audience is 100% happy and I have a challenging experience on stage vs B). a 75% happy audience and a carefree happy experience for me on stage, I would always put the burden on myself and feel happy knowing it was worth it as the output is improved. It blows my mind that my bandmates would rather they are happy at the detriment to 100-150 audience members.
I completely agree. When we're playing music onstage, our primary goal is to deliver the best possible experience to the audience. After all, they're the reason we have venues to play in!
The “yeah, you play music, but do you have a real job?” types of comments really seem to apply to your bandmates. They’re having fun, not doing work, and they shouldn’t be surprised when they’re treated like such.
The elephant-in-the-room rarely mentioned for in-ears is when you gig at different places and your band doesn't travel with its own in-ear mixer you are COMPLETELY reliant on the sound man and/or the quality of the personal mixing system at the venue. In my experience wedges are less affected by bad mixes/sound glitches. I also carry sound-reducing plugs in my pocket so I can throw them in between songs in one or both ears when needed.
Looking at the comments, I didn't expect so much pushback against IEM. I've used both and it's true that IEM is hard to get used to and also harder make it nice for the musician (right mix, stereo, ambient mics, etc). That being said, when it's well done, it's great. And just to be clear, musician's confort is very important. When the musician doesn't feel confortable, that really shows in the performance.
My question for iems having immersive sound is why? I feel like from a consumer perspective things like Dolby atmos are real fun and a new way of experiencing soundscapes, but as an instrumentalist i don't see a reason to spend so much computing energy on that when i just need to play my part and hear everyone else. Maybe if it changes the way we make music at its core then it'll make sense
I'm an avid user of IEMs, but unfortunately I run wired into my own mixer (which is sent to a house mix). I wish the wireless transmitter and receiver weren't so expensive. Also wish there had been some discussion on the various types of transmitters regarding the different bands (A vs G, etc).
Outstanding info. Thanks for sharing. Other than cranking the level to reduce available headroom, what else can be done to protect the musician's ears from unintentional feedback, dropped mic, banging a headstock into a stand etc? This is probably the one thing keeping me from jumping on the IEM wagon. I know it's going to happen eventually. Maybe a brickwall limiter strapped across the aux outs? What's regarded as best practice in this regard?
Noway,, for me while playing gigs traditional overear headfones are superior and easy to use than any IEM.. I gave 3 tries in different different gigs and then picked back my headfones.. even in routine life I don’t like inear earphones .. I always use overear headfone.. at maximum 80db on 60% volume..
As a drummer used to play on acoustic jazz setups as well, I can assure you that playing with IEM won't gave us the opportunity to "play the room". I used them for 3 years and switched back to stage monitors. I think when I'm playing with IEMs, I easily end up bashing the drums as I miss that acoustic pressure. Don't get me wrong, with the right music it's fine, but more often I prefer having the possibility to control dynamics on stage myself (vs having the sound engineer cutting most of my mics because I'm too loud). Oh and btw, if you use stage monitors, you don't need them very loud :) just a little bit of what you are missing on stage goes a long way. Nowadays, since I know quite well the music I'm playing with my band, I hardly ask for anything in my stage monitors
Acoustic jazz makes sense to warrant wedges with low volume but IEMs are definitely better for most people who play modern rock, funk, etc. especially with dense mixes with 4 or more musicians. I guess ideally, one needs to be in full control of their IEM mix in order to reap full benefits and feel completely comfortable but with decent mics on the kit and in your ears, there’s no need to bash.
Iv tried singing with custom mold earplugs that attenuate sounds to a degree and let you hear sound fairly clear. But when Iv done that all I really hear is the loud boom of my voice in my body. I wonder if IEMs cause this issue. It’s like sticking your fingers in your ears and then talking, you hear your voice internally . I don’t get how an IEM can be much better other than to blast it to Unhealthy volumes to compensate . My issue is I have hypersensitive ears, so blasting an amp over a drum set with no protection is a no go, even loud bars are too much for me. I’d love for IEMs to work but I’m not trying buy em only to realize It’a chasing the same issue or they have to be unreasonably loud to work properly.
Cool and great advice about approaching stage and venue owners. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍 Also good advice all around. The mono thing is what I was taught back in 1970 but I believe stereo is the only way to fly until I found out how stereo is done , hum, regardless, I personally appreciate all of y'alls advice and input were of great value to those who listen and understand how stage and venue sound mix is done. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍🙊🙉🙈💥🌟😎
Good video, thanks. I play the clarinet, in a "rock" context, and would like to be able to hear my surroundings, and not hear the sound of my clarinet in my head as much as when I use iems (it makes it really uncomfortable). I've been looking for "open back" iems for a while to avoid that, with no success. Would you have any suggestions or recommend trying earbuds instead to have less isolation? Budget is pretty limited.
You really have to use high quality in-ear-monitors (avoid cell phone ear plugs) because you might end up not getting a balanced sound, which might force you to crank up the volume thus possibly damaging your hearing. Also, the system needs to have some type of limiter that prevents crackling or sudden loud sounds that might go into your IEM. So its a balance between a stable sound system, quality IEMs, and a sound engineer to help balancing the sound. If you're in a setting that is really loud, you in-ears can isolate the loudness around you and then you can adjust your instruments/vocals volume and panning on your personal mixer.
What would be the effectiveness of a sort of hybrid situation? I’ve always figured have more precise mixes in the ears and then a general mix on some floor monitors for “feel”
I have mixed feelings about iems. With a great desk feed they work well. But sometimes I feel so disconnected from the room that I have to take one of them out.
@@rafaelunplugged I don't think an audience mic feed would be good. Clarity and crisp timing cues are vital, and an audience mic is typically pretty filled with mush and reverb.
@@donepearceto the point that it would be less clear than using a wedge? I don’t really have experience with audience mics, but my gut feeling is that that loss of clarity, although important, doesn’t make it unusable, and protecting one’s hearing by having both IEMs in at all times feels like would be preferable even if there is an annoying reverb on everything. Again, speaking from my ass here.
advancing technologies in custom iems and how these are getting cheaper to make? Is it always best to send this to local audiologist or diy solution is there a startup in the game?
all these people useing these damm iem are gonna regret it its worse to have all that shit in your ears and you just cant feel the music or respond to it and as a drummer if you cant keep time natuerly then you dont need to be there so let the wedge live plus subs times 4 and as far as foh sounding better well stopSTOp useing 10 in speakers for the purpose that a 12 or 15 should be used trying to put a whole band live through a 10 or 8in speaker for god sake let the music breath 10s or 8s are house music home gear or car gear but this is all my thoughts
I hate to have anything in my ears. I even do not like using headphones. Just like for monitors you need a capable console and a good technician which are rare. I have to admit that I never had a chance to try inears. But I got tinnitus from earbuds.
Oh no, when you have your guitar in a monitor, the second you walk away from it it’s gone from your perspective as far as your ears are concerned. Did you guys ever play on stage before?
to this day only a wall of marshalls produced the kind of music i like. hearing the other musicians is for musicians. i dont like music. i only like the accidents and the war between people who dont really hear what is happening. it is a show. not art. if you want art you must have something wrong in your life and you want to find something perfect to escape. a show is great only when everything is out of control. otherwise it is blunt and boring.
Cool and great advice about approaching stage and venue owners. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍 Also good advice all around. The mono thing is what I was taught back in 1970 but I believe stereo is the only way to fly until I found out how stereo is done , hum, regardless, I appreciate all of y'alls advice and input were of great value to those who listen and understand how stage and venue sound mix is done. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍🙊🙉🙈💥🌟😎😢
I had really struggled with stage wedges before switching to IEMs. No matter the placement or what the mix is like, the former can never quite hit the level of clarity and precision IEMs are capable of, especially with all the overlap and room noise.
So the guy selling IEM is telling us it’s the best way. It’s a perfect way to disconnect the artist from the audience and instead of making musicians deaf with floor monitors we now make the deaf with IEMs. When we give everyone in the audience IEMs, then it will make sense. Now we have a generation of audio guys that don’t have the skills to control the acoustic environment on stage. 😉
If you're able to influence what's used - sure. Most musicians hired to do a job (a pro) take what they're given and deal.
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Iem are great for all the teasons explained, they also have bad sides : the frequency response may not be satisfying in the low end, some drops or interferences may happen with wireless iem systems, and, the worse to my opinion, one can become very disconnected with the audience and the rest of the band !
When trouble arises I prefer it to be not in my ear directly. Feed back, instruments mixed too loud, and wireless issues are reasons I avoid them. 25 years of drumming with live wedges and occasionally using in ear protection, I don't have any noticeable hearing loss. Sudden loudness increases and feedback directly in your ears would definitely hurt. When a wedge on the floor has any issues the sound is not directly in your ear. It has somewhere else to go instead of directly to my ear drum.
I doubt you have “no noticeable hearing loss” after 25 years of drumming with lackluster ear protection. You’re likely just very used to the hearing loss you already have. When was the last time you got your hearing checked?
@@iurigrang more than likely. I've never been in for a hearing test yet. I haven't had a reason to. I'm also a mechanic so you can bet that I'll be losing it someday. Even the people that never worked in loud environments lose their hearing due to old age. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. One nice thing is living in a quiet country side setting. I can tell you that the sound and light pollution of the city is probably worse than anything on earth. I always have trouble sleeping in hotels because of it. It's something I believe City folk are accustomed to. The db of city life is much higher, which I think contributes to hearing loss but alot of it is just nature.
Being a guitar and bass player IEMs will never replace the sound of a fender or ampeg amp pumping onstage. For rehearsal; however, headphones allow you to practice and hear mistakes (yours and others) better. That being said, feedback is the only issue with wedges which is kind of what sounds “good” if you can control it I’ve done setups for other bands besides my own and really it comes down to how educated are the musicians and vocalist. Some understand that they can’t have 100db on stage! The worse the artist the louder they want to be. Geez! So for me I prefer the sound coming off the stage mixed with the FOH. Not the vocals but I do not like a completely silent stage. It sounds clean, sure… but not as musical. It’s as if there’s a hole onstage. Either way, do what you prefer. The cost of IEMs in stereo especially for a large band like mine is just not justifiable.
I say no way. I have a very nice set guitar sounds horrible through them. Your electric guitar has to have a certain volume so it feeds back into the strings causing a strings to ring . Harmonic Resonance. This makes the guitar easier to play and sounds better. I’d you just use iem, first off, you loose tons of sustain and it makes your guitar hard to play. Second thing with them, it does not sound better as anyone dancing on the dance floor in the center of the band won’t hear anything but drums. No vocals. No guitars. It’s like listening to a drummer play to a monitor in which you only get the backside of. Iem are only good for poor soundmen.
I had not thought of the string & resonance issue. Very interesting. I think I've definitely experienced this with my bass and venues with "no-amps-on-stage" rules.
