Hello all! Here are some answers to the (very!) frequently asked questions and frequently offered suggestions:- 1. I stand to be corrected (!!!) but I'm not convinced yet that the inverter will get too hot as it will only ever run for about 10 minutes at a time (warming some soup or boiling some rice etc) and it is very cool down on the floor where I hope it might go. 2. Yes, I will buy 90-degree lugs and see if I can get the inverter in the same cabinet as the battery, as I initially considered then dismissed. 3. There is not enough room to put the inverter above the battery. 4. I need to have a look under the passenger seat to see if there's space there, yes 5. The bedding does fill its section (I had removed two duvets while filming!) 6. It's only a cold tap (I know it looks like a mixer but isn't!) Cheers and thanks for all the lovely tips! David
At the end of the day, it's YOUR VAN, and you're the one that has to live with whatever you do! I enjoy watching you faffing about and yelling at the screen every time regardless! ENJOY! 💜💜💜😻
It looks as though from the comments you have taken quite a beating on this particular subject. I am sorry this has turned into more modifications to your existing electrics housing than expected but, since you are trying to increase your power output by 5 times, extensive reworking is not uncommon. It's is hard to get a precise approximation of how long the induction cooktop will be running since it takes a lot of power to bring water to a boil. I am just erring on the side of extra design margin in regards to heating of the electrics since, excessive heat in that area will shorten the inverter, as well as the battery life.
Bill, I wouldn't say a beating - all good advice and suggestions - just a lot of repeats so I'm trying to save people the effort if their suggestion has already been made!
MY 2000 Watt pure sinewave inverter lives in a similar space to yours (under an enclosed seat), and it never heats up. The internal fan sees to that, along with the sufficient air space in the enclosure-- which is unvented.
I'm glad you added this as I was just typing up a reply to suggest some of the same. Believe it or not, these "not very fun" videos are the best to me, as the interest in coming up with clever engineering solutions and tinkering are the main reason I'm here. Well, that and the puns. Appreciate the videos as always, David! Cheers from rainy California!
David, STOP! A 2kW inverter is about 90% efficient, meaning at full load about 200W will be dissipated as heat. This means one important thing: AIRFLOW! if you enclose it the way you seem to have decided it will easily overheat, causing it to turn off to protect itself, and even if you could live with that it will most likely shorten the lifetime of the unit drastically! YOU MUST ENSURE A GOOD AIRFLOW! My recommendation would be to redo the panel on the left side of the cabinet holding the 230V connectors, freeing up space for mounting the inverter along the front of the compartment holding the battery, making a large ventilation hole towards the side door as well as on the other side of the cabinet (next to the fan grills), facing towards the rear doors. Place the main cutoff switch where the upper 230V connector currently is located and find somewhere else for placing the 230V connectors - maybe above the inverter, facing towards the rear door. I get your reasoning for having two 230V connectors, but I would probably put the two connectors in parallel and use a switch to select between shore power and power from the inverter... Ventilation would also be a good thing for the smaller electrics cabinet, although the solar charger and DC/DC charger are not as powerful as the inverter. It's still likely to get toasty there... I do automotive electronics development for a living and can only stress the importance of ensuring good cooling!
Two items, David. First, that inverter needs decent airflow to keep it cool during use. You might want to put some ventilation holes into an adjoining compartment to increase airflow. Second, look into using some plastic conduit to run the wires through to keep things neat. Fittings allow you to bolt a connector through a plywood wall, and then just cut the conduit to fit between connectors. Then you just run the wires through the conduit.
Hi David, I get the impression that the details of this installation are causing a bit of anxiety. I have done several similar installations so, hopefully my suggestions will be of some help. First off, determine how much of the existing cabinet space is available for the new installation. The highest priority by far is the cable length between the battery and inverter. I estimate you will need 10.1 mm (80 mm sq) copper diameter cables to carry the 200 amps and I would strive to keep the cable length to no more than 250 mm if possible. Use welder's cable or similar fine stranded wire, which is more flexible. Given your available space, I suggest mounting the battery on the van floor so it can't move around when the van is in motion. Directly above the battery, place a shelf to mount the inverter on with both battery and inverter terminals as close as possible to each other. Any component in the electrical system that generates heat must have some type of ventilation and there should be least 25 mm of clearance between the component body and cabinet to allow air flow. The rest of the electrical components can be mounted wherever it is convenient simply because they are not carrying that much current. Switches and fuses should be easily accessible but, especially the master switch. So, fit your largest components first in proposed layouts and group the smaller components nearby where practical.
That inverter needs a supply of cool air and an exit for warm air.. .. they can get hot. You can't really mount it in an enclosed space with no airflow.. You would need to vent the area.
If you plan on running the induction cooker, the inverter will generate quite a bit of heat. Ventilation would be required in the compartment. It would be advantageous to mount the inverter in the same compartment as the battery in cold weather to heat the battery, but disadvantages in hot weather.
Remove the small panel behind the sockets. Move the back wall out to make room for the battery. Mount the inverter on its side to back wall you just moved. You can get angled connectors. You can take the cover plates of the inverter sockets and wire directly to the external sockets on the outside panel. The consumer unit should be on its back wall and all the fusing in the space just vacated.
Electrics take up so much space (and aren't light). Just remember the inverter will likely have a hum while running, so right under your head while sleeping might be less than pleasant. Ok, if you don't need any AC power overnight and can just turn it off. If you use false bottoms, hinge them in so they are easy to open. Lay it out with wires in place. Sometimes the bends you have to make with thick wires take up more room than you would think. Great choice on keeping the stove top mobile. It can be lovely to cook outside, especially if it is something with strong smells, or if you don't want to have to go inside just to make a cup of tea.
No matter where the inverter goes, it will need ventilation. It can't be blocked in or covered up. I hope you got it sorted out. I feel your frustration. Move 1 thing and you end up moving 5 things. I call that game "Solar Tetris". ( Charge controller, breaker box, inverter, fuse, shut off switch..... AC breakers, DC fuses.....)
New battery where the old battery is, false floor on top of it, inverter on top, leaving loads of airflow, possibly vents cut in, then it's all contained together, the cables will easily flex to and from the battery below
My suggestion is that whatever you do, keep the DC cables from the battery to the inverter short as possible. 2000W at 12 VDC is ~170 A, while at 240 VAC is ~8 A. You want minimal voltage drop from the battery to the inverter.
Oh dear David , you lost me a quarter of the way in, but I agree with you about wanting things neat and tidy, I’m like that when decorating for Christmas with all the lights wiring. Anyway good luck, I’ll tune back in when it’s done. 😂
I think that you need to read the cooling requirements of the inverter. In my experience putting one in a confined space is an error, and especially one fitted with two cooling fans. However I do see that this system is not going to get very heavy use - but I would still read the tech specs to gain a better understanding. I might also add that you are adding weight to the right hand side of the vehicle (the driver's side) and you appear to do most of your trips alone. This will lead to increased wear on the suspension and potentially a noticeable 'lean' to the vehicle when you are driving it - but it is a good thing that the battery will be positioned on the centre line. Interesting project, very much enjoying the voyage. Well done you.
I see many commentors with good ideas. I will just second making sure there is airflow for the inverter; even using spacers to get it off the floor an inch or so will help with circulation and then you can put a perforated cover (false floor) on top and use for storage of anything other than linens. Definitely should use a vent into the living area near the inverter.
I agree with your last suggestion of position things, however bare in mind not to box the inverter in too much, otherwise you may compromise on the cooling of it via the fans and the ability to switch it off and on. Good luck in not blowing yourself up!
@21:10 you begin to explain my thinking, and I thank you for that. If you drill some holes into the woodwork, forming the starboard side of the clothes+inverter compartment, it would give a channel of cooler air, which will healthily be used by the inverter. Also, you can poke some holes into the loo-compartment likewise, to provide access to yet another box of breeze.
You seem to be thinking about the mechanical positioning of each item, and then the wiring of it. I would suggest deciding on the mechanical placement of each item based on the minimum wire length between the battery terminals and the inverter input. The best place for the main isolator is mounted on the battery terminal with integral fuse / breaker. Remember batteries are always live and have the power to vapourise spanners so insulate the tools. I used to train engineers who maintained battery systems.
I’d turn your battery 90 degrees, then get the inverter in next to it, yes you lose somewhere to put your spare water, but in terms of overall loss I reckon that would be the least
Sir, The LiFePo4 battery you selected can be positioned in any orientation you wish . This means it can be positioned on it's side, end, or upside down if that suits your needs. If it won't fit in the compartment sitting on it's bottom, perhaps sitting on it's end or side will work.
David, I'm glad you finally got all your plumbing problems sorted out. I like the idea of making the cooktop portable, versus built in to the counter top.
I now have the mother of all headaches after watching this video. Some of your technical videos should come with a warning label, like: "Caution, micromanaging brain dump in progress, wear appropriate protection". Can't wait to see the finished product.
Hey David! The "invisible" sounding board (I myself do it without a camera - so yeah: I talk to myself and sometimes that is good conversation actually and does solve problems, if you go through pros and cons of something etc.) is a tried and tested method of problem solving! As for your van: It does drive a lesson I learned recently (well: OK over a year ago by now!) home, too - You can never have too many cable-ducts! If you want to ad something later to anything (be it a house, an apartment, a boat, a camper-van etc.), it's best if you installed cable-ducts while constructing the thing. Sadly: Cable-ducts were not a thing in the 60s, when my grandfather built this house! So yeah, I had to add my own on top of the wall (doing the old thing with a mallet and chisel is just too time-consuming and frankly too messy, too!), drill large holes in the walls and still ended up not getting everything 100% as I want it...but it's good enough for now having 2 LAN-Sockets in each room (except the bathroom!) ps: No, WLAN is not "good enough" - I love a reliable connection and there's a lot of WLAN-Networks around, I am living in a (small) town after all, so they tend to not be reliable really!
Hi David, you could put the inverter where you currently store the water container, in front of the battery. This would mean shorter cable runs and a neater installation. It would also allow for batter ventilation, as the inverter will need adequate airflow to avoid overheating.
If you were removing the dividers, etc where the water bottle was sitting, you could fit the battery & inverter in that box with the terminals for the inverter ( mounted on its side) poking through drilled holes in the fuse/electrics cupboard
Would you need to have vents in whatever storage space you use for the inverter ? Because if the inverter is in a kind of sealed box would it have enough cooling air ?
Whatever you end up doing I am sure it will be great, lots of good ideas here. I would try fitting the battery first, preferably with the terminals toward the door. Then see if you have enough space to build a shelf above the battery for the inverter. Negative cable from battery direct to the buss bar on the other side of the partition, positive through a fuse like a SamlexPower DC-FA-200 bolted directly to the terminal and then on to the battery disconnect switch. From there I would install a positive buss after the disconnect and run from the busses to the inverter, and from the busses to the 12v fuse block for your circuits. I would also cut holes in the partition between the battery and the solar charge to allow the inverter fans to function properly and cut some vent holes in the bottom front of the battery cabinet to promote good air circulation through the cabinet and around the inverter. Looking forward to seeing your solution. Thanks for all the great videos.
If those main battery cables are aluminum, throw them away and get real copper cables. The copper will handle that much power without a problem. Never use aluminum cables. They're garbage and cause problems, including fires. I would just put the battery and the inverter in your existing battery compartment with the terminals facing the electrical compartment ( towards the door). That would keep everything in a smaller area with shorter cables. The partitions would have to go, but no major loss.
Just make a false floor in all 3 of the storage spaces. This will allow space for all electronic boxes and cable runs. Just, as others noted, be sure that the entire electronic space(s) have good through flow ventilation, possibly by adding ventilation grids or holes near floor of each space. Good luck!
That inverter should probably be able to breath a bit. But Honestly, I think you are better off just using the battery and inverter compartments you have and modifying those to fit everything. I think it is silly and even potentially hazardous to have the inverter farthest away and wiring all that stuff around when your plugs are right next to the old inverter. It is hard to give you a solid plan because I am not there in person, so I can't actually see the sizes you are working with, but if you can make it happen, reworking those compartments(tearing out some of those walls), I think you will be a lot safer and happier in the long term. Also make sure you use the 2 wires together like you said, or get a new one custom size and gauge for that 2000W output. That stove will NEED it. It is best to keep the wires from the inverter to battery as short as possible too, but not a big deal if you don't. Maybe get a ~175 amp fuse between the battery and inverter. Good luck with your choice! And keep that inverter way from anything potentially flammable like linens.
Hi David, Prioritize: There are three bulky items here and the least critical by far is the water container, it can go literally anywhere. I'd prefer the battery and inverter to be in that area together, even if you have to shrink the size of your bedding storage area slightly to allow easy fitment of the cabling. Good luck and thanks for the vlog.
Perhaps there are batteries and inverters with the performance you need as well as more favourable dimensions. Something to consider in the future, a great deal of painful research during the shopping phase can save one from future headaches. Of course if you got a great deal on that battery and inverter, that's understandable!
Could you put the new inverter where the water can stands now (I know, you talked about that, but hear me out!) in such a way that the inverter's two plugs replace the two plugs that are now at the outer wall of that cupboard towars the door. That might mean the cables from the inverter might have enough bending space on the other side. Then you'd just have to find a place for the water canister. But yes, you'd lose your safety-shore power plug. ... Well, it's another idea to consider. Looking at all your possibilities, I think your last version is probably the best! That false floor thing saves you the most space and I think cooling and all that will be better. You know, it is sometimes fun to break my head for someone else's problems. Apart from that, it is good mental exercise. BTW: glad you solved your leak-problem! Just installed an new dishwasher in the house and I'm so happy that everything worked on the first try! (ok, they make it easy but still, you never know)
I would suggest as others have done to start again. Prioritise and design your electrical system (including items you may fit at a later date) over everything else because this is more important. Bedding and other miscellaneous things will sort themselves out. I know you will probably balk at the idea and not do it but you would have peace of mind with a job well done. All the best with whatever you come up with.
You can get 90 deg terminal lugs to help with your cable routing for the Inverter. Definatly consider cooling vents for the inverter if you plan to run the induction hob for extended cooking times. possibly computer fans to help there! keep your cable runs as short as you can and the positive and negative lenght should be equal or as close as you can.
To my understanding the 'barbed' saw-tooth moulding on the pipe adapters is to stop the pipes slipping off. Also, with the pipe being made of flexible plastic/rubber, using a jubilee clip would force the saw-toothed into the pipe thus creating a water tight seal... it is also more easily removeable should there be a problem at the other end of the pipe 😉 Glad you got it all sorted out though. p.s. Did you ever put any foam strip around the top of the cabinets for the worktop to sit on? This will stop the worktop from creaking and the bolt fasteners from noisily rattling loose while the van is being driven. p.p.s. I can't believe it took YT 7 days to notify me about this video 😒
Inverter AND battery into the corner storage cupboard. Inverter on side attached to studs facing out (near side wall) so wires can go around the corner through the bedding cupboard and can be boxed in. If you put inverter on the outside wall then the wires will have further to go to get to rest of electronics and will impose on then bedding storage more. Hope that helps 😊
Just my two pennies' worth, I would be rearranging the electric cupboard and wiring so that inverter has the optimum position for cooling and connection to the battery. "Sometimes the longest route is the shortest" glad you got the tap fixed though 👍
if wiring's not an issue, i would look at mounting the inverter under the passenger seat. if it fits, you'll keep demolition to a minimum and lose less storage space (also allow proper ventilation for the inverter)
Time to go shopping for new terminal connectors. They make 90 degree terminals for cables that would allow that inverter to fit in the water bottle storage spot. Search for 90 degree ring terminal. You will also need to cut some holes for vents in the front but that's easy.
I know nothing of how such things are installed, and I enjoyed this video! However, I was asking myself about ventilation with every choice. Like the idea of false bottoms so the storage space can still be used.
Elastictrikkery is always fun to install. My only advice is make sure it's all easy to get at when/if things go wrong. Only you will be happy with your installation as you know your van intimacy. Cheers from old George
David I would suggest that anytime wires of any thickens goes through a partition that you get yourself some vinyl or rubber grommets. They would help to protect the wires. Most substantial work stations have them these days. You could also get you a rolled up holder for your wrenches. AWG= American Wire Gauge.
Put the battery where your current one is, and the inverter next to it where the extra water jug is, but rotate the battery and inverter so the big chunky terminals for both are next to the electrical cabinet. The 240v wires from the inverter will be pointing away from the electric cabinet, but the 240v wires will be much smaller and more flexible, and less susceptible to voltage loss due to wire length. Make sure you have plenty of ventilation for the inverter. You might need a class T fuse for the lithium battery, although I'm not sure with it being 12v. Well done sir, it'll be great in the end.
I would put the inverter above the battery separated buy the shelf. You can get right angled terminal connectors. Yes you would need to widen that bit but the panel between battery is the only bit that needs modifying, making the bedding compartment an bit of an L shape. The brace across the top can stay in place. This would keep high amp cables short, provide able space around for cooling and minimise space lost in my opinion. what ever you decide, good luck!
Why not clear the space out, including the wood framing bits, and come up with a rationalized design for the power system. THEN look at the space that is left with an eye toward bedding and tool stores?
CC I was watching and the obvious answer kept coming to me. Why don't you remove the centre wooden divide in the existing battery box and put the new battery in there facing down the van ( if you get my drift) so that the contacts are near the front corner where you want to put the master switch. You can then put the inverter beside it and if necessary move the side wall so both fit together and you still have a reasonable size storage box for the bedding. 🤔🤔
Just to put a spanner in the works lol.. put the inverter plug side next to the two sockets where the jerry can is.. then you can get 90 degree cable lugs, you can get left, right and pointing up lugs.. fix the inverter to the wall opposite the Battery
Keep the battery where it is ... remove the partition in the battery box. Add a shelf/false floor above the battery and put the inverter on top.... fuse box and master switches can still fit in the battery space ...
I’d rotate the battery and inverter 180 degrees, so their connections/cables are at the electrical cupboard end - shorter wires to the master switch and more room under the mains sockets to fit the higher current wiring to the inverter. No reason why a crimp connector (and at that current, ~200A, you will need to use crimp connectors under the inverter terminal screws) can’t come vertically off those inverter connections either, but is there sufficient room at the ends for ventilation - you will probably need to provided additional ventilation to the space containing the inverter, as it’s going to get hot running the kettle and induction cooker. It is a big game of Tetris, but I’m sure you will find a solution - I will keep my fingers crossed for you 🤞🤞🤞
Your bedding bundle is rectangular. Turn It 90 degrees. It will creep into the larger storage area, but will allow you some room to the drivers side of the battery. Mount the Inverter to the front of a new panel to redefine the battery compartment, and put a divider between the inverter feed cables and the bedding bundle.
Move the battery rearwards (where you currently have your spare water container) and mount the inverter where the battery is but with the connectors towards your electrical compartment. You can then route any bends through the electrical compartment.
Just turn the battery so that the poles facing to the electrics compartment, move the dividing wall forward and mount the inverter to it...shortest run of cables on 12V and 230V side...all other compartments still useable like they were before... 😉👍👍
David with reference to the jubilee clip requirement I am just glad you don't work on bottled gas connections or hoses with water pressure constantly on! Take care and all the best with the electrics
What are the specs of the inverter? How much space should be left around it? I can imagine quite a big heat generation on full 2kW... What about pushing the front wall of the battery compartment up to the new battery and install the inverter on the outside of the compartment? That way it would ventillate really well. Oh, wait then it will suck dirt and filth into itself. Bummer... 😅
I think you have things pretty much to spec, with a couple of possibilities.... As Rick mentions below, be careful about the heat created by the inverter, and you may need to vent that area (some duct and one or two quiet computer fans should suffice) as at full chat, that's going to get hot! If you space the inverter away from the floor you can plug the outlets without any further chopping about, and ventilation would be more efficient. Putting the inverter and battery together (the bedding will have anew home) would be most efficient and cabling could run under other things to the fusebox and cabling area. Carry on, there's a lot to think about, and you can cherry-pick from our collective suggestions.
David, your config at ~ 24:00 timestamp looks best with a caveat: pay special attention to the inverter manufacturer's specifications for clearances for dumping heat. All of your other arrangements thumbs up, IMHO. Cheers.
Hello David. I am not an expert but a few thoughts for you to digest. Identify the clearance requirements for the devices - thermal cooling space. Then maybe draw out a scale ' floor plan', scale cutouts of your devices, and then place them on your floor plan and see what works best.. There is software for this as well. All I have. You have very interesting projects and I enjoy wish you well...
I would say putting it flat on the bottom and covering it with a little step is the best idea. Carry the step through to the next compartment and the wires will be underneath all the covers.
So many suggestions make it confusing when you can't see the whole set up. Just make sure you leave enough space for air to circulate around all that electrical stuff to keep it cool.
The difference is that GFCIs tend to operate at 3-5mA, most RCDs are in the 30mA range (as we often used to use them to control multiple circuits, so leakage added up)
I recommend to create an air flow to and from the inverter. At 2000W it can become quite hot. Also, is your battery capable of delivering 200A over a long period of time?
I work with computers and small servers. That inverter is going to need a lot of space around it with unobstructed airflow. There is a reason why it has two fans. How about mounting it on the ceiling of the van or maybe under one of the two front seats? Provided of course there is airflow under the seats. Or the opposite side on the van wall? Just trying to think outside the box so to speak, something you do very well. Really enjoying this series of videos. Should be a cracking camper when you get her finished. Keep at it, will be worth it in the end.
Cheers. I'm not convinced (yet!) that it will get too hot as it will only ever run for about 10 minutes at a time (warming some soup or boiling some rice etc) and it is very cool down on the floor where I hope it might go.
Have you considered placing the new long inverter diagonally in the pillow space? It would give much more room for the fans and the wires would be shorter and bend less. Then you could cover it with a board and still have room for the bedding to fit. I hope you read this in time. Good luck.
