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A Universe of Triangles - Computerphile 

Computerphile
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We see objects all the time and our brains decode the 3D shapes, but how do computers model these shapes and why break it all down to triangles?
Graphics series with John Chapman:
1/ Universe of Triangles : • A Universe of Triangle...
2/ Power of the Matrix : • The True Power of the ...
3/ Triangles to Pixels : • Triangles to Pixels - ...
4/ Visibility Problem : • The Visibility Problem...
5/ Light and Shade in Computer Graphics: Coming Soon
John Chapman is a graphics programmer who blogs here: www.john-chapman.net
/ computerphile
/ computer_phile
This video was filmed and edited by Sean Riley.
Computerphile is a sister project to Brady Haran's Numberphile. See the full list of Brady's video projects at: bit.ly/bradychannels

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28 ноя 2013

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Комментарии : 512   
@Torguish
@Torguish 9 лет назад
This dude would make a badass villain in some sort of Sherlock Holme-ish type movie/series. :D
@ashwith
@ashwith 10 лет назад
Kudos to whoever does the animations for Computerphile. They are always very helpful.
@jasonlaw2595
@jasonlaw2595 9 лет назад
I am at 00:34 nd have decided already this guy can be leader of my village.
@yrnteao
@yrnteao 10 лет назад
It sounds like james bond is giving me a lesson on co-ordinates, it's awesome.
@OwenPrescott
@OwenPrescott 9 лет назад
As a designer I'm never going to be able to use a triangle without being accused of being Illuminati.
@earloe.9383
@earloe.9383 10 лет назад
Can we have more of this dude in future?
@phultroo
@phultroo Год назад
I am very bad at maths, geometry and stuff but this dude's explanation is just crazy. I wish i had a teacher like him.
@Josematube
@Josematube 8 лет назад
One of the best explanations I ever see! Thanks a lot.
@Validole
@Validole 9 лет назад
This dude reminds me of the Tenth Doctor. Also, of caffeine.
@arsenelupin123
@arsenelupin123 10 лет назад
1:48 Your coordinate system isn't right-handed. It's good usage to make it right-handed, usually.
@HassanSelim0
@HassanSelim0 10 лет назад
I agree, it's one thing to switch the Y with the Z (which I got used to and accept), and another thing to make it left-handed, this one drives me crazy :S If you have X right and Y up, then Z has to be towards you damn it! don't make it more confusing to me when rendering stuff :S
@VGToolbox
@VGToolbox 10 лет назад
That's a lot of triangles for the side of a cylinder! I'm sure you could get away with 2 per side ;)
@steppenhenge
@steppenhenge 10 лет назад
I wonder if they were sitting on a three legged stool when they figured to model with triangles... interesting that the same reasoning for why to use triangles is the same reason why 3 leg stools are better than 4 legged ones - no wobble.
@unvergebeneid
@unvergebeneid 10 лет назад
Quaternion tie-in with Numberphile. Do it! Do it! :)
@Dayanto
@Dayanto 10 лет назад
This would be amazing! I've read a bit about them, but I just can't wrap my head around the concept.
@HiAdrian
@HiAdrian 10 лет назад
Would love that too mayne.
@HassanSelim0
@HassanSelim0 10 лет назад
***** same here, I get what the 4 components stand for and it seems like a reasonable idea, but I don't get how you can deal with them, like how can you apply two rotations to the same object one after the other if you're using quaternions? how can I make first-person camera rotations using them? I also don't understand any of their advantages, how does it really avoid a "gimbal lock"?
@DDranks
@DDranks 10 лет назад
Yeah, totally agreed, I can't wrap my head around them yet. Btw. here's a great presentation about them. acko.net/blog/animate-your-way-to-glory-pt2/
@veggiet2009
@veggiet2009 10 лет назад
While triangles are easiest for rendering, displaying a mesh. Quads are more convenient for modelling, creating a mesh
@Arm4g3dd0nX
@Arm4g3dd0nX 10 лет назад
Can I borrow John Chapman to go to a restaurant with me and my friends so he can explicitly and careful describe everything about the food I ordered from the menu and how I plan to consume it and drive all my friends nuts? :)
@Arm4g3dd0nX
@Arm4g3dd0nX 10 лет назад
P.S.: If you think I was trolling him, that wasn't my intention. He has such a detailed way of saying things and a Sean Connery-esk voice I think it'd be awesome for him to describe something mundane. :)
@sixthSigmaSnowball
@sixthSigmaSnowball 10 лет назад
Ultimate wingman...
@papa515
@papa515 10 лет назад
Looking forward to the next video about moving them about in 3D space.
@squidcaps4308
@squidcaps4308 10 лет назад
Have to once again thank you for these videos. it's just so easy to link a playlist instead of spending hours explaining it.
@tomhearn5886
@tomhearn5886 10 лет назад
This man is the richard hammond of triangles
@yushatak
@yushatak 10 лет назад
Would have saved me so much time if this video existed a few months ago when I learned this all the hard way.
@tabularasa0606
@tabularasa0606 10 лет назад
There is a hard way?
@yushatak
@yushatak 10 лет назад
Brute force learning of how vertices map to create models by hand..
@cril1001001
@cril1001001 10 лет назад
I'm happy to see comments about the animations. They are a fantastic touch to these videos. Keep doing that :)
@husticik
@husticik 10 лет назад
This is just awesome ! Watch the whole series.
@Berserkism
@Berserkism 10 лет назад
Love this series, I am actually getting a basic and more clear understanding than I ever had. Clear and concise explanation. Much appreciated.
@ThomasGiles
@ThomasGiles 9 лет назад
A great summary of how polygons are used and drawn by a computer. Good job!
@swedenlifebyadnan
@swedenlifebyadnan 5 месяцев назад
This is the worlds best video on a particular topic where a topic is explained so clearly and easily that i am beyond impressed and writing the comment in the middle of watching the video
@casualcadaver
@casualcadaver 8 лет назад
I wish i was this fluent in math and geometry.
@dt28469
@dt28469 9 лет назад
Ive noticed in some older video games though that both sides of the triangles are rendered. If you walk too close into a corner in some 3rd person games you could see the inside of the characters body, and its coloured the same way as the outside.
@NickiRusin
@NickiRusin 10 лет назад
What a lovely video. Thank you!
@DFX2KX
@DFX2KX 10 лет назад
This was fun to watch. Reminds me of my GameMaker days (the 3d engine in GM is quite simple, and you had to do a lot of the rendering manually)
@SyntekkTeam
@SyntekkTeam 10 лет назад
Really cool stuff, I never learned about it in this way and I think it might come in handy in some of my projects
@Ubeogesh
@Ubeogesh 10 лет назад
Thank you! More 3D graphics videos please!
@Mivalys
@Mivalys 10 лет назад
I really enjoyed this one! Loved hearing about those geometry problems. Thank you.
@NeilRoy
@NeilRoy 9 лет назад
Very well done videos, thanks. I already understood these concepts, but this was perfect to share with friends.
@Rider0fLightning
@Rider0fLightning 10 лет назад
Now I know what models are made of. The more you know. :D Thanks Computerphile!
@bsqrd
@bsqrd 10 лет назад
This is very interesting, looking forward to the next computer graphics video! I always learn new stuff with Computerphile videos, so, thanks a lot, and keep it up ;) !
@bluecpp2059
@bluecpp2059 8 месяцев назад
Amazing presentation! Very well done. Thank you.
@evildude109
@evildude109 10 лет назад
Oh, it hurts so much seeing a left handed coordinate system.
@OblivionCalling
@OblivionCalling 10 лет назад
I was typing a whole pile of stuff on how triangles are coplanar and how that makes rendering the triangles so much nicer. I failed to notice how long this video is. Thankfully it was mentioned before I finished typing :P
@sergheiadrian
@sergheiadrian 10 лет назад
That was a very good video. Thanks Brady.
@DarkadeTV
@DarkadeTV 10 лет назад
By far my favorite ***** video yet
@fogglee
@fogglee 10 лет назад
Wow great timing! I've actually been working on a 3D renderer myself for the past 2 weeks. It's far past this but still great video.
@BubbaYoga
@BubbaYoga 10 лет назад
Excellent as always!
@maersklandro
@maersklandro 9 лет назад
I knew everything this dude is talking about (and much more) a long time ago. Plus actual mathematics of 3 rotation, projection, translation and texturing.
@hadhad129
@hadhad129 10 лет назад
This reminds me of FEM (Finite Element Method) which uses triangles (most of the time) to approximate surfaces in 3D, like he said. It is used to approximate solutions to differential equations.
@TheBigBigBlues
@TheBigBigBlues 9 лет назад
I think maybe the rectangular piece of paper should have been folded out of the plane (with the fold line intersecting the two opposite vertices), instead of it being bent to create a curve. As you could obviously curve the triangle into a new plane also, but you could not fold the triangle into a new plane.
@davidnagli
@davidnagli 9 лет назад
How do you divide a sphere into triangles??
@kingswordisbodoubleS
@kingswordisbodoubleS 10 лет назад
Wow, you can be a great teacher. This was awesome.
@arkanglegeibriel
@arkanglegeibriel 10 лет назад
I'd love to see a computerphile - quaternion video ^_^
@VjKammi
@VjKammi 10 лет назад
Ahhh that makes total sense! Great video thank you :D
@arnauarnauarnau
@arnauarnauarnau 10 лет назад
very cool episode!
@DjinneticTV
@DjinneticTV 10 лет назад
This video is awesome thanks!
@flidrl
@flidrl 10 лет назад
I never knew how do they distinguish inwards and outwards facing polygons. Cool
@MindLessWiz
@MindLessWiz 10 лет назад
This was really cool!
@georgef.9109
@georgef.9109 10 лет назад
You just made my day
@tbear1395
@tbear1395 10 лет назад
Very good explanation
@DevSolution
@DevSolution 10 лет назад
Great explainatory video guys :D
@white_shadow_123
@white_shadow_123 10 лет назад
this explains so much.. thank you!
@MetalSilvan
@MetalSilvan 10 лет назад
Quite a nice topic! More on tessellation and maybe game rendering!
@yarbles_
@yarbles_ 10 лет назад
P.s. I have enjoyed every single Computerphile vid! My only complaint is that they don't come often enough. :)
@paulamsden8420
@paulamsden8420 10 лет назад
Doesn't his coordinate system violate the right-hand rule? I think +z should be out of the paper, not into the paper.
@CelticSaint
@CelticSaint 10 лет назад
Interesting stuff! Thanks.
@EdMcF1
@EdMcF1 7 лет назад
The opening comments of this excellent video remind me of the Red Dwarf episode Waxworld and Pythagorus.
@willlewis77
@willlewis77 10 лет назад
As someone who works a lot with FEA, this was terrific.
@roshchodesh1
@roshchodesh1 10 лет назад
hope this is going to be a playlist soon... :D
@cra0kalo
@cra0kalo 10 лет назад
Best description ever thank you so much know I finally get it
@bioturok439
@bioturok439 10 лет назад
The way the z axis is defined is not wrong, but it is not the most conventional one. This might be confusing. According to the right hand rule, +z would point "out" of the plane (towards the viewer) and -z in the opposite direction (just like with the triangle winding). Still, great video!
@Gunchulis
@Gunchulis 10 лет назад
Very well explained! :)
@puncheex2
@puncheex2 10 лет назад
The important thing about triangles is that they are uniquely and completely determined by the coordinates of their three vertices. Squares are ambiguous; four coordinates may define a square, or they may define a "squaroid" which won't lie in a plane. 3D software will often render a squaroid by jumping back and firth between it's possible renderings randomly, based on floating point rounding errors and such.
@DSMikeNW
@DSMikeNW 10 лет назад
This video would have been really useful to me 2 weeks ago xD, very good video.
@MrTStat
@MrTStat 10 лет назад
I'm studying this right now, video was really useful thanks :)
@bitchslapper12
@bitchslapper12 10 лет назад
So what you mean by the face of a triangle is basically the side with visible texture?
@GreatLange
@GreatLange 10 лет назад
And that is why triangles are my... MARVELS OF THE SCIENCE
@ColtaineCrows
@ColtaineCrows 10 лет назад
Here's a drinking game for you, a beer and a shot of tequila every time the word "verticies" is used, and no, I'm not responsible for your alcohol poisoning.
@HassanSelim0
@HassanSelim0 10 лет назад
Gammel Prutte I had so much trouble trying to spell "vertices" right when writing my Bachelor Thesis, and I think I still got it wrong :D
@ColtaineCrows
@ColtaineCrows 10 лет назад
Hassan Selim I'm not even sure I've heard the word before I saw this video. English isn't exactly my first language.
@KetoMelange
@KetoMelange 10 лет назад
Stopped after three, and now I feel really stupid.
@goshisanniichi
@goshisanniichi 10 лет назад
Yay. Upcoming video about Linear Transformations... Brady should do a Linear Algebra Numberphile video to go with it.
@Anirban456Mandal
@Anirban456Mandal 10 лет назад
Maan, this is some real maths-video I have seen in a few days
@marsCubed
@marsCubed 10 лет назад
There are actually many systems for representing 3d objects (meshes), it depends on the "rendering engine" (software that reads the data and presents it to the video card). The most common are.. A list of individual triangles, triangle strips (where each new vertex is assumed to be part of the next triangle in the mesh), meshes (as in the video, where a point list describes how to connect a vertex list), quads & quad strips (similar to triangle and triangle lists, but they use 4 verts), polygons and primitives.. nurbs, (like using a cage of points around a mesh to imply where the surface is). although these all get converted down to triangles by software &/or graphics card at render time. Also, there are terrain maps and bump maps.. which are like a list of numbers (think grey-scale image, with each pixel in the image being a height) that tell a rendering engine how high a point is from a particular plane or distance from the centre of a pre defined primitive. There are undoubtedly other ways to represent 3d objects too. ie, could use angles and distance from a point. Graphics cards themselves are usually what limits what people do (rendering speed etc).. & often have cool features that allow programmers nifty ways to represent model data.
@SprocketWatchclock
@SprocketWatchclock 10 лет назад
In the case of particles, it's actually easier both to render and to control them if they're rendered as projected raycasted rectangular images rather than a set of 2 triangles because they render much nicer and don't get as distorted or have the sorts of orientation glitches you get when you introduce multiple cameras. Fun fact: the Sega Saturn used strictly tetrahedral based rendering, making it's textures signifigantly less distorted, but also, due to their low-resultution, less smooth and more jaggy. Also, it made developing for the Saturn a nightmare for multiplats since all of the in-game geometry had to be converted to tetragons from the triangular polygonal mesh data of the Playstation, N64, 3DO and PC verisons. Also, he forgot to mention anti-aliasing, which is a post-processing filter applied to polygonal renders that helps eliminate the jaggies and better approximate curved surfaces. It's standard practice in modern video games and part of why modern games don't look as polygonal as their past counterparts. You can disable this filter in most modern PC games and you can see the difference.
@ivanaslamov
@ivanaslamov 10 лет назад
Nice video! I have a question. Obviously our brain can create 3D scenes from memories, and the scenes we see in our dreams. So the question is: Do we know how our brain stores such 3D information? I presume it must be done in some very efficient manner. Does it has some correlation with the technique you described in the video.
@csmaster65
@csmaster65 10 лет назад
nice grapichs on the coordinates like it very much
@Slarti
@Slarti 10 лет назад
Origami very much works from this principle of triangles using folds and inverse folds - I would recommend all developers take up origami to help physically visualise vectors.
@stijnbegeman306
@stijnbegeman306 10 лет назад
Interesting stuff!
@ultravidz
@ultravidz 10 лет назад
great one
@nicolavetrini
@nicolavetrini 5 лет назад
Nice explanation for newcomers or those who want a brief recap
@DeviousMalcontent2
@DeviousMalcontent2 10 лет назад
More from dis guy pls.
@ady1904
@ady1904 6 лет назад
great informative video...but I have a question for you... Can any single vertex of a triangle can also be on another plane and still be a valid triangle like you explained for other higher polygons e.g., rectangle?
@4grammaton
@4grammaton 10 лет назад
I think I know now why there are so many games with crystals as a central plot element. They're so easy to render with triangles.
@Lion_McLionhead
@Lion_McLionhead 10 лет назад
It's quite elegant, the way the 3D coordinates are converted to 2D coordinates for rendering on the screen by matrix multiplication. It's all math from the 1980's.
@tedtech5340
@tedtech5340 8 лет назад
He kinda sounds like Shaun Connery lol
@bigsteamfan
@bigsteamfan 10 лет назад
That's one charismatic programmer! I like his style... He's so suave... Like he's about to take you on a dinner, just when he explains about graphics triangles.. lol
@Lttlemoi
@Lttlemoi 10 лет назад
@ LucAs Bune: There is a big difference if you use flat shading or Catmull-Clark subdivision.
@aethelsteadtheunsteady450
@aethelsteadtheunsteady450 3 года назад
00:36 Half way into '3D geometry & chill' and he gives you this look.
@rusca8
@rusca8 9 лет назад
Weird leftie axis system. I'd have put the +z the other way. :/
@p1nn3rT
@p1nn3rT 10 лет назад
cool vid. are you going to be doing videos on rasterization and other render methods such as ray tracing?
@nadirkhalili855
@nadirkhalili855 9 лет назад
Whats interesting is that if you consider the possibility of our existence being that of a computer simulation then you would end up trying put together how the three dimensional objects such as spheres in our universe and/or the concept of a circle aren't plotted in terms of small triangles, and so if you truly believed this was the case, you would be conflicted in coming up with a better way in creating computer models without the use of triangles. i.e, in mathematics we have pi a continuous number that illustrates the circumference of a circle, and so we haven't really fully come up with a definitive way to fit our understanding of round surfaces let alone implement it into a computer simulation.
@MedEighty
@MedEighty 10 лет назад
Triangles are to shapes what sine waves are to periodic signals. You only need the former, in different sizes and at different angles/phases, to construct a representation of the latter.
@iainclarkemusic
@iainclarkemusic 10 лет назад
Blew my mind!
@CjqNslXUcM
@CjqNslXUcM 10 лет назад
i like this guy
@inthefade
@inthefade 8 лет назад
Moiré effect on the shirt... What is the math of the moiré effect?
@yannickbernaerts2325
@yannickbernaerts2325 10 лет назад
An interesting sequel would be explaining how voxels work and their advantages (and disadvantages)
@gesh92
@gesh92 10 лет назад
Less frequently, but rectangular meshes are also used. You can still restrict the points to be coplanar. Of course, creating the mesh is more difficult.
@DjChronokun
@DjChronokun 10 лет назад
given how much tessellation is used now and given that modeling is typically done using quads, n-gons or curves I wonder how long triangles will last before we just switch to rendering bezier patches or whatever directly since it doesn't really make much sense to draw a triangle that's smaller than a pixel
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