@@psngrl7677 false. the earliest reports don't say this at all. you're saying centuries after the original sympathetic accounts of the event... they suddenly got new information about her gruesome death? how gullible can you be? then again you probably didn't actually research it to know this.
man's inhumanity to man is always sad. of course Hypatia's death as portrayed in this movie (as well as in Carl Sagan's "Cosmos" as inspired by Edward Gibbon's history) is not an accurate portrayal of the real Hypatia. historyforatheists.com/2020/07/the-great-myths-9-hypatia-of-alexandria/
@@getdrvasu sadly, civil violence has always been with us, even before Christianity. I would quote the words of the Christian historian Socrates Scholasticus, writing within a two decades of the assassination of Hypatia: "And surely nothing can be farther from the spirit of Christianity than the allowance of massacres, fights, and transactions of that sort. "
@@roccobogi154 She lived in Alexandria(founded by Alexander the great) which was ruled by the Ptolemy's and then became part of the Roman empire(by the time of Hypatia the Eastern Roman empire). In other words she was as Greek as the came, the name should clue you in.
Uh, no. Neo-Platonism (which was just one school of philosophy) continued for well over a century after her death. this is just modern hagiography. her death was a tragedy and a shame but it didn't change history. had her writings survived, we would not have colonies on mars right now, sorry.
@@HeroQuestFans Had all the ancient writings survived (only 3% did) we would definitely be on Mars right now. Christianity brought the middle ages. It took us 1300 years to recover from the christian pest....
@@takispapas9887 completely unjustified speculation. we don't know what those other documents were, but we have an idea. copies of other stuff already available elsewhere, and metaphysics.. yes, the stuff you atheists hate and despise, religious speculation, philosophy, and poetry. wow, that stuff really would have gotten us "to Mars" sooner. And as if this singular event (actually three separate events, oops, so much for the grand Christian conspiracy against learning) somehow made it impossible for this knowledge to be replicated elsewhere. as if only the Greeks in this one time period were able to figure things out. the myth of "ancient technology" (ie: Atlantis, Chariots of the Gods) isn't real, sorry. other events are happening all the time that destroy writings. fires, floods and other natural disasters, insects, and stuff falls apart due to simple neglect or mishandling. they didn't have modern preservation techniques, if texts were not copied and stored in separate locations, they likely fell apart (and it gets worse if those texts are used, then they must be copied). were they really trying to preserve the world's knowledge for future generations, they would have carved it all on stone and stored it underground. oh well (the Scientologists are doing just that with their writings, I guess future generations will credit them with getting us to neptune? lol)
Hypatia was caught up in the violence of two factions. this is nothing new, either for Alexandria or for humanity. it wasn't to silence her on some scientific issue, it had nothing to do with her sex or religion either.
@@ranavikramsehdev1130 history doesn't require "religious beliefs." without a time machine we have to go by what the best evidence says. so whether you're Atheist, Christian, Pagan, Jewish, it doesn't matter, you can do historical research. it doesn't mean you can make up whatever you want.
@@HeroQuestFans कहा से आते हो तुम लोग 😂😂 विदू विनोद चोपड़ा की कोई सेक्युलर मूवी तो नहीं देखी। इतिहास भरा पड़ा है।टाइम मशीन बनाने वाले हाथो को इं मूर्ख अंधविश्वासी लोगो ने कही इतिहास में ऐसे ही काटा होगा
We had to watch this movie in our Philosophy class today, and I cried when she died ... the look in her eyes while the guy who loved her suffocated her was so sad )':
@@LG-dr6kc - The same can be Asked of You. Did You Live at the Times? Are You a Historian? I can Read History, Whether a Historia or Not, and the Hypatia Narrative presented here is not supported by the Facts at hand. You just ant to have an Excuse to Bash Christianity as Evil Though.
@@skwills1629 no, I did not live at those times. No, I’m not a historian, which is exactly why I don’t go around claiming what’s true or not. If you have proof that Hypatia’s story isn’t supported by your so called “facts”, please, provide a source to a researcher’s or historian’s study which supports your claims. Otherwise, I’ll continue doubtful of their authenticity. Don’t go assuming what I want. You don’t know me, at all. How could you possibly be aware of what I want? But I’ll tell you: I want history to be presented the way it’s supposed to, no matter how horrific and barbaric it may be. And that applies to how cruel, ignorant and violent religious people used to be regarding their faith and non believers, especially Christians, who were known for this sort of violent extremism during the Middle Ages, for instance. And I speak from the point of view of someone who just so happens to be a Christian as well. No matter what our ancestors did in the past, my faith is still intact, but that doesn’t mean we can simply ignore the atrocities that have been done in the name of God.
@@LG-dr6kc - You don't want History to be Taught Properly if You Refuse to Learn it. What I said is what Historians say. Regardless of their Religious Ideas. It is not difficult to find The Historical Accounts of Hypatia. You can Doubt My Authenticity all You want, but I Won't Lie about History to make Christians Look bad to prove how Honest I am. It is Self Defeating. If You refuse to Learn History, if You do No research of Your own, How then can I be cooberated? But also, Why do You believe the History that depicts Christians in a bad Light is More Accurate or More Truthful? It is just as possible it is a distortion to Attack Christianity as Denial of it is a Whitewash. You say The Middle Ages were Known for violent extremism due to their Religious Faith.What Violent Extremism are You referring to, exactly? And have You looked at the History? why do You Think this? For Me, that is what is relevant, and historical Accuracy. I am not Blindly defending My Religious Faith. I am Speaking Known Facts of History. So Tell e, what exactly is the basis for Your beliefs on History?
Not stoned. "dragging her from her carriage, they took her to the church called Caesareum, where they completely stripped her, and then murdered her with tiles [oyster shells]. After tearing her body in pieces, they took her mangled limbs to a place called Cinaron, and there burnt them. This happened in the month of March during Lent, in the fourth year of Cyril's episcopate, under the tenth consulate of Honorius, and the sixth of Theodosius [AD 415]." Ecclesiastical History (VII.15)
That quote is not actually in The Church History by Eusebius. You can check for Yourself. www.newadvent.org/fathers/2501.htm And www.documentacatholicaomnia.eu/03d/0265-0339,_Eusebius_Caesariensis,_Historia_ecclesiastica_%5BSchaff%5D,_EN.pdf The QWUote You posted is a fake.
Irony: -Hypatia, being a Pagan, which the Christians consider a demon, acts in a much more civilized manner. On the other hand, Cyril and his faction, which the Christians consider respectable, act more like the demons they accuse Hypatia of being.
The scenery of suffocation was a lie, the truth is that they tied her from her hand while she was bare in the streets of Alexandria until her skin was skinned and then they skinned the rest of her skin with handcuffs until she died💔💔
@@mohammedshafiqulislam7334 Some of her skin had been ripped off the street, and the rest of her skin, which had not sloughed off the ground, was slashed with oyster cuffs💔
too bad she thought the earth was the center of the universe. what? yeah, that's right, most people accepted that view and there's no evidence she deviated from the accepted view of her time on that point. obviously her assassination was vile, and nothing could be further from the essence of Christianity, as Socrates Scholasticus (another Christian) wrote in the time after her death. Hypatia was a neo-platonist (they are theists) and had Christian supporters in her lifetime.
XSC 3 check your knowledge idiot. what you said was pure idiocity. I can't blame you ; I mean what can I expect from a parot . lol . hypatia unraveled that the earth wasnt the center of the universe
@@venkatakrishna1157 I read all kinds of things! I KNOW that Christians AND pagans knew the earth was a sphere in the 1st-5th centuries AD (and on). I compare modern day Jesus Mythers and Conflict Thesis believers from the anti-theist community to flat earthers, because they embrace conspiracy theories rather than real history. "Agora" is not historically accurate, and it's based on historically inaccurate, biased ideologies. "Agora" was originally intended as a metaphor, an allegory condemning modern RADICAL ISLAM which opposes Western Progress. whether you agree or disagree with that viewpoint doesn't matter, the historical death of Hypatia was not due to Christian anti-science or Christian misogyny (nor anti-pagan bigotry for that matter). she was the victim in a civil war between two political factions who both happened to be (at least nominally) Christian in a city that had been know for centuries for its violence (even before Christianity came). the destruction of the Library of Alexandria has become a modern myth in the hands of fundy atheist who wish to attack MODERN Christianity, that's the sort of stuff I'm objecting to. the term "flat earther" is a byword for those who stubbornly deny facts and cling to fringe viewpoints. But the Draper-White Thesis is not taken seriously by secular modern mainstream historians. historyforatheists.com God bless
@@NamiduIndunel - Only an Idiot says Jesus never existed,. Its Universally Agreed upon Amongst Historians, and no, Richard Carrier is not Credible nor is He just one of May who disagree, He's an Atheist Activist. The Only Reason You or others Like You deny Jesus existed is to attack Christianity, not because its Logical. As for Hypatia, I never said she didn't exist, but the Version people Love here is a Myth.
@@skwills1629 Do you know even how to read man? I said Most probably. never existed. Do you even know how many 'Jesus' in the history and its almost guaranteed he never existed as the information we think we know about him.
@@skwills1629 I know that the movie isn't fully accurate, but you seem to be wanting to refute everything that does have to do with the history behind it. Unless you really think getting stripped naked while being denounced as a "witch", getting your skin FLAYED with oyster shells, having your limbs pulled apart from your body (all of this happening to you while you're still alive by the way), having your remaining body paraded through the streets, and then having it burned in a mocking of your religion's burial practices is "nOt ReMoteLy thAt bAD oF a rEAl dEaTh hurr hurr". Just please at least try to leave the f*cking 'God's-word-is-the-only-word' agenda, will you?
@@Jester343 - Had it ever Occurred to You that You should Read History Books and Not just Take what You Hear at Face Value from Anti-Christian Sources?
except we don't have proof he ordered the death of Hypatia, so this idea that he "controlled the murderous mob" is just ideological bias. the death of Hypatia was condemned by contemporary Christian writer Socrates Scholasticus. they were Christians on both sides of the conflict in which she was an innocent victim, so to blame it on the Church would be completely ridiculous. "Agora" is not a documentary, it's an allegory condemning modern radical Islam. If you want to blame a religion for violence, then don't throw stones from your glass house. I would instead look to the founders, and the founding teachings... and compare how well the followers follow that lead. Jesus Christ didn't order the mob to kill his enemies.
@@HeroQuestFans read more history please. All the authorities speak in unison about the hostile takeover of Alexandria by the Christians. And you want to imply that such an organised event happened just by fluke, without leadership? Yeah, keep on hiding the dark past of the evil organised religion. They became number one, by exterminating all other religions and cultures.
@@amitabhakassap7339 I'm reading all the history I can. where does it say before Christianity came to Alexandria, that it was a peaceful city without a reputation for street violence and civil unrest? even the authorities you would cite all "credit" pagans, Jews AND Christians for all engaging in acts of violence in this period. the civil strife that resulted in Hypatia's murder was the result of a battle between two factions of nominally Christian parties. Agora is an inaccurate depiction of history, but even the movie goes to some length to show it wasn't some one-sided affair that was the fault of the Church. so where is the idea that somehow, Christian doctrine was to blame for her death? And please let's not start to play the oppression olympics, because then I will bring up the oppression of religious populations by state atheism, the worst oppressor in history (and much more recent than these atrocities). the "dark ages" are a myth, as is the conflict (draper-white) thesis. Agora may be a symbolic morality play rather than a documentary, but it is actually anti-Islam, because there you actually do have a religion whose founder preached (and practiced) conversion by conquest and violence against non-believers and still continues to be a force for that today (moderate westernized Muslims excluded). historyforatheists.com
Was doing my research on Hypatia for my presentation and found about this movie. just learned about her death and it is not depicted as cruel it was actually but I appreciate the efforts. it made me so sad that she and other women of those times had to go thru that. it's such a shame.
Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies. To teach superstitions as truths is a most terrible thing. The child mind accepts and believes them, and only through great pain and perhaps tragedy can he be in after years relieved of them. ~ Hypatia (as mentioned in the Biography authored by Elbert Hubbard, 1908)
@jaie. the real Hypatia never uttered these words. the quote about "fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths..." according to Wikipedia's page is a "Made-up quote attributed to Hypatia in Elbert Hubbard's 1908 fictional biography of her, along with several other similarly spurious quotations" from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypatia (citing Cohen, Martin (2008), Philosophical Tales: Being an Alternative History Revealing the Characters, the Plots, and the Hidden Scenes that Make Up the True Story of Philosophy, New York City and London: Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-1405140379)
Except the fact that the Christians of that time were grown adults, they werent born Christian, they became Christians in their adult years. Religion is psychologically imbued into the human mind, even if all the religions on earth dissappeared today, tomorrow you'll find just as many new religions as there were yesterday
@@oceanapps3994 if they really make a better society than our species, if their existence really makes a difference in this vaste expanding universe, if their purpose is much higher than us; So shall we fade away with time, and they may indeed replace us!
We need more movies about the evils of religion, depicting how religion prevented human progress and flourishing. Not just Christianity, but also how Islam destroyed the world.
I suppose you can build a case using scripture to justify it? Because if you want to blame any particular religion you need to demonstrate how the religion calls for that. Also, if you are going to blame Christianity for this, then I am going to blame atheism for everyone killed by Joseph Stalin, Chairman Mao, communism in general, the current death camps in China, abortion, and also for the Eugenics movements.
@@Procopius464 Christians made a stark difference between believers and non believers. The non believers were tagged as heathens, devil worshippers. That is what whipped up their hatred . The earlier pagan civilizations fought for land ,money but not for religion. For example Alexander did not seek to convert the world to some Greek " religion ".
@Kujtim Baraliu. Hypatia was not a martyr for science. her brutal assassination had nothing to do with any of her ideas, her religion (yes, religion, unlike the film she was not an atheist) nor her sex. it had everything to do with the fact that she was on one side of a conflict between two warring factions in a city known for its violent riots and civil strife. one side thought that she was preventing the reconciliation between the factions and so some on that side took it upon themselves to kill her, in retaliation for one of theirs that had been killed by the others. Socrates Scholasticus (also a Christian) rightly condemned the bloodshed soon after. the film would have you believe that all of the Christians were violent and loyal to their own above reason (and somehow this incident started the "dark ages" a term no longer used by serious historians btw, even though the Christian Empire in the east continued another thousand years), but this is simply not the case in the actual history. don't get your history from "cosmos" or drama films, get it from.... history.
This is so sad, religion can be dangerous it really can be. It can go so far across the line like it did back then. This movie is so amazing, and it really catches you. It's a story the world most never forget and Hypatia died in a horrible way.
@@MrChileno13 The death of the Jewish people were just plain barbaric not experiments! and if you are talking about the bombings of Hiroshima it is because the Japanese empire would not stop coming against innocent American people.and.the Japanese people fought like Islam does.. meaning that they we're suicide bombers, and that's exactly what the Japanese did at Pearl Harbor and what the Muslims did on 9-11 and when someone wants to start a war with you,your duty is to protect your country and it's citizens. "A time to love,and a time to hate,a time of war,and a time of peace. Ecclesiastes 3-8'.
If you want to preserve your knowledge, philosophy, reliogion or anything dear to you. Then you need power. Imagine hapatia having a machine gun. Would she still be this helpless?
Maybe it's from me watching too much Doctor Who, but if I could pull people from time just before their moment of death and show them the future, Hypatia is definitely on the list, along side Anne Frank and Galileo.
It was the end of a great great civilization...Being an indian im Thankful that 1000 of civilization came and gone but we are still what we were thousands & thousand years back
I'm sure they would do worst if it was real. IT IS DISGUSTING! But unfortunately it is real. Today, in countries such as Pakistan, Egypt, Iran and Arabia women are still tortured in the streets on the accusation of a man...
But you'd probably know by now that they real death of Hypatia according History, was ×1000 worst, they flayed her alive, till, chopped her body and burned, that's how Christianity took care of business for the next 1800 years
I tell every Christian fundamentalist I know to watch this movie, and every single time I hype them up for this movie about Christian history, I tell them Oscar Isaac is in it ("I know who that is! I saw him in STAR WARS!"), I tell them "it's about times when there was religious persecution in the Roman Empire," and of course they assume I mean persecution of Christians. I wish I could see their reactions when they get to this scene. I've pulled a similar prank with Kingdom of Heaven.
"Religious persecution" when it was really religious clashes. At the time no religion was a dominant power in the Roman Empire, even though Christianity is on its way up, pagan beliefs were still strong and around, along with sectarian clashes within Christianity. More so both movies are practically biased "historiography" made through the lens of modern point of view, Agora even tried to depict the Parabolis as Talibans lol.
Despite this being a wonderful movie, and absolutely tear jerking, I must say… everyone MUST remember that it was created for entertainment purposes. Both of the directors of this movie and many others (like “gladiator” for example) the director’s take full liberty to create freely: tweaking and embellishing the storyline as they choose. It’s not a documentary that represents what actually happened in history.
The movie is actually quite accurate and mostly takes liberties with the slave boy character and Hypethia's discoveries but it has a point to show, how religious radicalism stopped humans advancement by 200 years
To me, it's also unthinkable that Cyril of Alexandria is a saint... he was a devil. Hypatia is a real saint, a female Christ. Not crucified but killed because she dared to question the established authority and she tried to unravel the mysteries of the cosmos, of the creation, to find the truth by rejecting the dogma.A true thinker fucks the dogma and goes beyond it.Hypatia is a true heroine.
@menkrep1337 bot so ?! That's also a dark side of Christianity that they prohibited education for women ,and killing someone like this just because she wants to learn is inhuman , how is that not a dark side ??
Hypatia was brutally killed, yes, but the motive was not "Because she was an read woman" or "because she was pagan", the hystorical accounts point towards a political motivation triggered by slander. Socrates Scholasticus said on his account that " she had frequent interviews with Orestes, it was calumniously reported among the Christian populace, that it was she who prevented Orestes from being reconciled to the bishop".
After the British invading our Greek homes and land in Cyprus Greece 1950s they murdered most of my family and most of my family were only children. The Savagery of the British war crimes is hideous and the UK military is still occupying Cyprus, Greece. So for me, it's disturbing and anger's me to see British characters portraying my Greek ancestors, without even having any Hellenistic characteristics whatsoever, it really sickens me to my core, indeed. I know that these British actress's & actor's and other British people had nothing to do with the war, but there is still some semblance of hate within me towards them. There is an intelligent Movie to be made in English about Hypatia and the Alexandria culture, and Agora - (2009) this isn't it, indeed. In Rome the Greek doctors were the best. University and library had writers from doctors around the world from India, China, Egypt, and even Mesopotamia. A time when Romans thought of war. Greeks thought of philosophy in Alexandria, they thought of thought itself. Too bad, so sad. They couldn't put that in the Movie.
So many things done in the name of Jesus/God...to think that killing a living being regardless of gender/race/creed is a 'holy' act, when all life is precious, is the highest form of ignorance.
@@MrChileno13 science isn’t a god, it’s no religious entity. Yes, it was used to develop weapons of mass destruction and machinery for warfare, and many many innocent people died to “advance” it and “push the boundaries”, but we can’t simply say we would be better off without it. Hell, without science, you and I would never even be able to speak to one another right now. Killing for religion and science are vastly different things.
+JJ Sanchez Zealous Christens! dude monk zealous monk christens killed her your little region and turned it around and made us the bad guys so just stop! your own kind fucking did that
Victoria Aguayo look here, the early christians vs the christians of hypatia day were way different. these guys we're under the spell of the Catholic Church which bent the gospel in many ways. the 95% early christians were killed off by the pagans and the cathplic church. true christianity is still alive. And this is not an action of true and pure Christianity but of the Catholic Church!
***** Which does not excuse anything, now does it? As someone of both Scot and Irish descent I know full well the pleasures of sectarian violence. I'm also quite aware of some of the things that the Christians of today are doing as well. It's a little bit less than "christ-like". So also so many other of the Abrahamics... Organized religion rather that spirituality has become the greatest curse on this planet.
In ancient and mediveal india there were many debates on science, religion , ancient Indian universities basics is debate and learn more. But here If some say anything" he/she is devil worshipper"
Hypatia represented the holistic cyclical perspective of time while Christian liturgy is linear. The Church would consider all those who practiced astrology as heretics, thereby sending the Greek science underground until Ficino resurrected their holistic religion with his translation of Pluto, thereby catalyzing the Italian Renaissance.
Love this movie so much. Some Christians now a days use the word of God in order to control people's mind especially Catholics and Islam. -sigh- It's like a wolf pretending as a herding or sheepdog while guiding those sheep and eats them gradually. #justsaying
SavageSwan25. Jesus has no where taught to kill anybody for any reason. Instead that He has taught to love and forgive even the enemies and that is what we can expect from a good Christian. Just as today in that era also there existed people who pretended to be Christians but were totaly not so in reality. The false Christians. So it is pointless of accusing Christians for this type of things because true Christians would not commit such crimes. If anybody does something which Jesus has condemned and not taught then its better to think that how far is it fair to call such person a CHRISTIAN !
This is why I became an Atheist and support secularism. Religion has and continues to cause problems in the world. My family thinks I've gone insane and am weird because I don't believe in God :-(
Under the banner of "secularism" more people have died in the past century than all so-called "religious wars" or persecution in all of human history. That's not a defense of religious-tinged violence, it's just a statement of fact.
Today's most infamous Secularist missionary is America, threatening and imposing death on nations world wide to either secularize or face their sword (sanctions, bombing campaigns, military coups). Ever since the United States Army massacred 300 Lakotas in 1890, American forces have spread Secularism by force elsewhere around the globe 100 times. Indeed the United States has sent troops abroad or militarily struck other countries' territory 216 times. Since World War II, the United States actually dropped bombs on 23 countries. These include: China 1945-46, Korea 1950-53, China 1950-53, Guatemala 1954, Indonesia 1958, Cuba 1959-60, Guatemala 1960, Congo 1964, Peru 1965, Laos 1964-73, Vietnam 1961-73, Cambodia 1969-70, Guatemala 1967-69, Grenada 1983, Lebanon 1984, Libya 1986, El Salvador 1980s, Nicaragua 1980s, Panama 1989, Iraq 1991-1999, Sudan 1998, Afghanistan 1998, and Yugoslavia 1999. Post World War II, the United States has also assisted in over 20 different coups throughout the world, and the CIA was responsible for half a dozen assassinations of non-Secularist political heads of state. The following is a comprehensive summary of the Secularization strategy of the United States over the span of the past century: Argentina - 1890 - Troops sent to Buenos Aires to protect Secular interests. Chile - 1891 - Marines sent to Chile and clashed with nationalist rebels. Haiti - 1891 - American troops suppress a revolt by Black workers on United States-claimed Navassa Island. Hawaii - 1893 - Navy sent to Hawaii to overthrow the independent kingdom - Hawaii annexed by the United States. Nicaragua - 1894 - Troops occupied Bluefields, a city on the Caribbean Sea, for a month. China - 1894-95 - Navy, Army, and Marines landed during the Sino-Japanese War. Korea - 1894-96 - Troops kept in Seoul during the war. Panama - 1895 - Army, Navy, and Marines landed in the port city of Corinto. China - 1894-1900 - Troops occupied China during the Boxer Rebellion. Philippines - 1898-1910 - Navy and Army troops landed after the Philippines fell during the Spanish-American War; 600,000 Filipinos were killed. Cuba - 1898-1902 - Troops seized Cuba in the Spanish-American War; the United States still maintains troops at Guantanamo Bay today. Puerto Rico - 1898 - present - Troops seized Puerto Rico in the Spanish-American War and still occupy Puerto Rico today. Nicaragua - 1898 - Marines landed at the port of San Juan del Sur. Samoa - 1899 - Troops landed as a result over the battle for succession to the throne. Panama - 1901-14 - Navy supported the revolution when Panama claimed independence from Colombia. American troops have occupied the Canal Zone since 1901 when construction for the canal began. Honduras - 1903 - Marines landed to intervene during a revolution. Dominican Rep 1903-04 - Troops landed to protect American interests during a revolution. Korea - 1904-05 - Marines landed during the Russo-Japanese War. Cuba - 1906-09 - Troops landed during an election. Nicaragua - 1907 - Troops landed and a protectorate was set up. Honduras - 1907 - Marines landed during Honduras' war with Nicaragua. Panama - 1908 - Marines sent in during Panama's election. Nicaragua - 1910 - Marines landed for a second time in Bluefields and Corinto. Honduras - 1911 - Troops sent in to protect American interests during Honduras' civil war. China - 1911-41 - Navy and troops sent to China during continuous flare-ups. Cuba - 1912 - Troops sent in to protect American interests in Havana. Panama - 1912 - Marines landed during Panama's election. Honduras - 1912 - Troops sent in to protect American interests. Nicaragua - 1912-33 - Troops occupied Nicaragua and fought guerrillas during its 20-year civil war. Mexico - 1913 - Navy evacuated Americans during revolution. Dominican Rep 1914 - Navy fought with rebels over Santo Domingo. Mexico - 1914-18 - Navy and troops sent in to intervene against nationalists. Haiti - 1914-34 - Troops occupied Haiti after a revolution and occupied Haiti for 19 years. Dominican Rep 1916-24 - Marines occupied the Dominican Republic for eight years. Cuba - 1917-33 - Troops landed and occupied Cuba for 16 years; Cuba became an economic protectorate. World War I - 1917-18 - Navy and Army sent to Europe to fight the Axis powers. Russia - 1918-22 - Navy and troops sent to eastern Russia after the Bolshevik Revolution; Army made five landings. Honduras - 1919 - Marines sent during Honduras' national elections. Guatemala - 1920 - Troops occupied Guatemala for two weeks during a union strike. Turkey - 1922 - Troops fought nationalists in Smyrna. China - 1922-27 - Navy and Army troops deployed during a nationalist revolt. Honduras - 1924-25 - Troops landed twice during a national election. Panama - 1925 - Troops sent in to put down a general strike. China - 1927-34 - Marines sent in and stationed for seven years throughout China. El Salvador - 1932 - Naval warships deployed during the FMLN revolt under Marti. World War II - 1941-45 - Military fought the Axis powers: Japan, Germany, and Italy. Yugoslavia - 1946 - Navy deployed off the coast of Yugoslavia in response to the downing of an American plane. Uruguay - 1947 - Bombers deployed as a show of military force. Greece - 1947-49 - United States operations insured a victory for the far right in national "elections." Germany - 1948 - Military deployed in response to the Berlin blockade; the Berlin airlift lasts 444 days. Philippines - 1948-54 - The CIA directed a civil war against the Filipino Huk revolt. Puerto Rico - 1950 - Military helped crush an independence rebellion in Ponce. Korean War - 1951-53 - Military sent in during the war. Iran - 1953 - The CIA orchestrated the overthrow of democratically elected Mossadegh and restored the Shah to power. Vietnam - 1954 - The United States offered weapons to the French in the battle against Ho Chi Minh and the Viet Minh. Guatemala - 1954 - The CIA overthrew the democratically elected Arbenz and placed Colonel Armas in power. Egypt - 1956 - Marines deployed to evacuate foreigners after Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal. Lebanon - 1958 - Navy supported an Army occupation of Lebanon during its civil war. Panama - 1958 - Troops landed after Panamanians demonstrations threatened the Canal Zone. Vietnam - 1950s-75 - Vietnam War. Cuba - 1961 - The CIA-directed Bay of Pigs invasions failed to overthrow the Castro government. Cuba - 1962 - The Navy quarantines Cuba during the Cuban Missile Crisis. Laos - 1962 - Military occupied Laos during its civil war against the Pathet Lao guerrillas. Panama - 1964 - Troops sent in and Panamanians shot while protesting the United States presence in the Canal Zone. Indonesia - 1965 - The CIA orchestrated a military coup. Dominican Rep- 1965-66 - Troops deployed during a national election. Guatemala - 1966-67 - Green Berets sent in. Cambodia - 1969-75 - Military sent in after the Vietnam War expanded into Cambodia. Oman - 1970 - Marines landed to direct a possible invasion into Iran. Laos - 1971-75 - Americans carpet-bomb the countryside during Laos' civil war. Chile - 1973 - The CIA orchestrated a coup, killing President Allende who had been popularly elected. The CIA helped to establish a military regime under General Pinochet. Cambodia - 1975 - Twenty-eight Americans killed in an effort to retrieve the crew of the Mayaquez, which had been seized. Angola - 1976-92 - The CIA backed South African rebels fighting against Marxist Angola. Libya - 1981 - American fighters shoot down two Libyan fighters. El Salvador - 1981-92 - The CIA, troops, and advisers aid in El Salvador's war against the FMLN. Nicaragua - 1981-90 - The CIA and NSC directed the Contra War against the Sandinistas. Lebanon - 1982-84 - Marines occupied Beirut during Lebanon's civil war; 241 were killed in the American barracks and Reagan "redeployed" the troops to the Mediterranean. Honduras - 1983-89 - Troops sent in to build bases near the Honduran border. Grenada - 1983-84 - American invasion overthrew the Maurice Bishop government. Iran - 1984 - American fighters shot down two Iranian planes over the Persian Gulf. Libya - 1986 - American fighters hit targets in and around the capital city of Tripoli. Bolivia - 1986 - The Army assisted government troops on raids of cocaine areas. Iran - 1987-88 - The United States intervened on the side of Iraq during the Iran-Iraq War. Libya - 1989 - Navy shot down two more Libyan jets. Virgin Islands - 1989 - Troops landed during unrest among Virgin Island peoples. Philippines - 1989 - Air Force provided air cover for government during coup. Panama - 1989-90 - 27,000 Americans landed in overthrow of President Noriega; over 2,000 Panama civilians were killed. Liberia - 1990 - Troops entered Liberia to evacuate foreigners during civil war. Saudi Arabia - 1990-91 - American troops sent to Saudi Arabia, which was a staging area in the war against Iraq. Kuwait - 1991 - Troops sent into Kuwait to turn back Saddam Hussein. Somalia - 1992-94 - Troops occupied Somalia during civil war. Bosnia - 1993-95 - Air Force jets bombed "no-fly zone" during civil war in Yugoslavia. Haiti - 1994-96 - American troops and Navy provided a blockade against Haiti's military government. The CIA restored Aristide to power. Zaire - 1996-97 - Marines sent into Rwanda Hutus' refugee camps in the area where the Congo revolution began. Albania - 1997 - Troops deployed during evacuation of foreigners. Sudan - 1998 - American missiles destroyed a pharmaceutical complex where alleged nerve gas components were manufactured. Afghanistan - 1998 - Missiles launched towards alleged Afghan terrorist training camps. Yugoslavia - 1999 - Bombings and missile attacks carried out by the United States in conjunction with NATO in the 11 week war against Milosevic. Iraq - 1998-2001 - Missiles launched into Baghdad and other large Iraq cities for four days. American jets enforced "no-fly zone" and continued to hit Iraqi targets since December 1998. In conclusion, the Secularist's intolerance towards other belief systems and cultures have terrorized the entire world and left carnage and corruption from it's efforts to convert the world. Peace
SPQRCincinnatus uh no it's not. secularism =/= atheism =/= communism =/= nazism. it's frustrating to read what you said because it is not only obviously wrong, but it is an even more extreme, skewed stretch of a misinterpretation than the way this whole "HITLER WAS AN ATHEISM KILZ HAR HAR" dumbass view is usually stated. Come on.
It's not religion that causes problems, but people. Basic intolerance. You setting yourself apart for instance and trying to pretend you are better than anyone else. I don't know if you are weird or insane, but your life is far more empty without God in your life.
Actually,Hypatia wasn't killed by ALL the christians in Alexandria,just a few of them.And,we shouldn't accuse ALL the Christians for the mistakes of the leaders.......
blaming "Christianity" for the murder of the historical Hypatia after watching "Agora" is like blaming the murder of the historical Jesus on "the Jews" after watching "the Passion of the Christ." and then some weirdo will respond "but weren't they?" or "but Jesus didn't exist." c'mon you guys need to be smarter than this... stop getting your history and politics from movies: historyforatheists.com/
"Surely nothing can be farther from the spirit of Christianity than the allowance of massacres, fights, and transactions of that sort." - Socrates of Constantinople. I wish the director would have emphasized the departure from the essence of Christianity into the fanaticism we see in the movie. But anti-theists - who aren't known for their regard to history - would eat this (pseudo-historical) stuff up and act like Hypatia was some free-thinking atheist martyr (despite being a pagan, and whom sober-minded Christians saw as rather virtuous), unaware that her death was result of her being blamed for a political dispute between two influential figures who had a falling out, nothing to do with accusations of "witchcraft" or being a woman teacher. A decent movie overall and brilliantly shot, but nonetheless sends the wrong message (for those who aren't cultured enough to appreciate such things, anyway).
You seem to either forget or ignore the scene where Davus the slave, performs "miracles" by giving food to the poor, (and didn't even have the scene where he is punished for that), that is the scene that clearly depicts the good side of Christianity right there. From that to the stoning the Jews in the former library because they believe Jesus was a man, and not a god, that to killing all the Jews for revenge is the transition you're talking about. The movie didn't spend more screen time on that because it's a movie about Hypatia and her time in Alexandria, not about the religions. The director did make it clear that Cyril was twisting what is written and the mass blindly listen to whatever he says, with fanatical behaviours as well. Not only that, the movie didn't make any attack, or criticise the religion, it was clearly attacking the fanatics (of at least 3 religions, btw, not just Christians). In other words, the movie doesn't send any "wrong message", you are perceiving its message wrong, or to be exact, you perceive its message wrong on purpose because it depicts people who follow your beliefs did horrible things in the name of your god. Furthermore, in contrary to what you said, It was made unnecessarily clear that Hypatia in this movie was murdered because the fanatics want to hit Orestes where it hurts the most, and not because she was accused of witchcraft, which serves only as the excuse to murder her, while in recorded history, she was murdered because the fanatics believed that she is a witch, and that she was mind controlling Orestes with her witchcraft. if anything, this movie was trying to help Christianity, while telling the story about the brilliant Hypatia, and i believe that any unbiased averagely intelligent person would be able to see that. Also, what the hell is an atheist martyr? Mustn't you have at least a religion to be a martyr?
Thanh Do Huu I must have misworded (I just made that word up) what I was trying to say. But whatever, you get the distinction, even if you don't believe. Who's "butthurt"?
Damn, that was fast reply. I made a few further edits, excuse my rude language , i have just watched the movie and was indeed "buttburt" when reading your comments, but i believe that my points are valid.
People say that Muslims are barbaric with the way they murder innocent people who don't comply with their faith... but this is just as barbaric! And I'm a Christian but I think that this portrays all Christian's in the wrong light.. Not all Christian's are like this and I think that you have some people who call themselves Christian but are they really? And like I said I am a Christian also, but I could never bring myself to murder another person like that. These people were just playing God, and I think that God doesn't want us to falsely judge,or try to be Him..I mean calling Hypatia a whore,a witch,and a slut? That's terrible! And the movie depicted her as an astronomer, and an excellent teacher, philosopher, and mathematician... okay so what's wrong with that? And maybe she was or maybe she wasn't a Christian only God really knows her heart,but is this just an excuse for her being so barbarically killed? by people who claimed to be Christian's? No that's just a cop out by cowards!.and it makes all good Christian's look in a bad light. Which is a shame, because we as Christian's should be better then that. "Let your light so shine before men, that they may glorify your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven. Matthew 5-16".
"You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor’ and ‘Hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you." (Matthew 5:43-44) It is so sad that these "Christians" did not understand the teachings of Jesus Christ. Their hatred to the pagan Roman Empire is not yet erased in their minds and they persecute the non-believers as retribution. Christianity is not a religion of vengeance but love. Jesus forbids violence but instead he teaches us how to love one another. Hypatia maybe a pagan but surely she will be with the Lord because of her good heart. And those blind followers will end up on the fires of hell because their zeal to Christianity is sinful thus they don't truly accept Jesus.
This film is not historically correct. Hypatia knew God's existence. She was not agnostic. All these atheists, who take this film as support for their idea that religion is bad, make pity. And like always, they confound God and religion.
No evidence? she was a neo-platonist. which means she's believed in the "one" , the supreme being from which all things owe their existence to, neoplatonists believed that all good things come from the one, they believed this world is a shadow of the real spiritual world and by studying the sciences they can liberate themselves from the world and enjoy immortality in the spiritual world. she was definitely was not a Atheist if she believed in this philosophy.
Well, the problem of humanity since we achieved logic has always been the same: "your/their" and "my/our" God/ team/ country/etc.... You are falling in the same trap....
@Alexander Gerofotis. atheists group together and consider that their team. tribalism affects us all, not just "religions." also, "logic" was discovered by religious people, btw. ;)
गुरु जी सत्य का शक्तिशाली जलता हुआ दीपक हैं जो विश्व मानव समाज की रक्षा करने के लिए ही आए हैं और देवियों की सुरक्षा करने के लिए ही आए हैं क्योंकि वही सृष्टि का कारक है और आदि शक्ति की शक्तियां हैं जिन्होंने संसार को जन्म दिया है।
You probably did not get it.He didnt kill her for being a Christian but to safe her from much more cruel death of other fanatical Christians.It was an act of mercy from him for someone he actually loved deeply but could not safe by no means.
ajamit007 And apparently you are still failing to get it.Nobody said anything about any excuse(except you...) only that he offered her much more merciful death than she would otherwise recieved from those other Christians who eventually skinned her body(in real history while she was alive!).And if you didnt noticed it(and you evidently fail to notice much),she accepted his offer.He was not doing it against her will.But it seems you would prefer to let her being skinned alive,what a great "humanist" you are.
@Blasthood (sic): "For starters we'd give you what you wanted to begin with." You aren't in a position to dictate what people decide or are given; right or not. Hypatia said: "Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to think at all." Everyone knows what their rights are without you telling them what they are ALLOWED to do! You need to look up 'coherence' before you use it, Blaster. One of its adjective properties is rationality.
"The library may in truth have suffered several fires over many years. Possible occasions for the partial or complete destruction of the Library of Alexandria include a fire set by the army of Julius Caesar in 48 BC and an attack by Aurelian in the 270s AD. After the main library was destroyed, scholars used a "daughter library" in a temple known as the Serapeum, located in another part of the city. According to Socrates of Constantinople, Coptic Pope Theophilus destroyed the Serapeum in AD 391, although it is not certain what it contained or if it contained any significant fraction of the documents that were in the main library. The library may have finally been destroyed during the Muslim conquest of Egypt in (or after) AD 642."en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_of_Alexandria
the earliest historical account of Hyptia's death was by a sympathetic Christian contemporary. he basically said it was a terrible thing that reflected badly upon Christians and was against what they stood for. he pointed out it was a political assassination, pure and simple. all of the upset comes because several centuries later, without evidence, various writers added their own details to the story, having it grow in the telling, to the point where basically it was "the Passion of the Christ" and suddenly Hypatia is an atheist martyr for feminism and science. it's legendary myth and hagiography at that point. most atheists praising this movie have never actually read the contemporary records of Hypatia, they've only heard about her from recaps of "Cosmos" and other popular media presentations by non-historians. great story in terms of being a parable with propaganda value, but not what actually happened according to the best evidence.
Oh yeah really Christans never converted people without any violence in the history? How many people killed in the name of witchcraft? Can I tell you here in India they bribe poor people to get convert
@@Mulmulmist typical fundy atheist tactic, shift the goalposts from (erroneously reported) supposed historical crime of Christianity into "so you're saying your religion never did anything wrong... EVER?" So please explain to me how the (unsourced) claim of modern people being bribed in India to convert, somehow proves that Hypatia's murder was the fault of Christian doctrine, and somehow was connected to deliberate destruction of the Library of Alexandria to wipe out learning and somehow responsible for the "dark ages" (all beliefs promoted by fundy atheists in this thread and others devoted to the movie"Agora"). There is ZERO evidence Hypatia was ever accused of withcraft and so this could have had nothing to do with her death. Hence, saying "well other people were killed for witchcraft" proves it is a credible claim is idiotic. People were also targeted with blood libel at various times simply for being part of a Jewish minority. Does that mean its credible to believe that Hypatia was a Jew and she was killed for blood libel? This logic is faulty and this tactic won't work. Next please.
@@Mulmulmist Hypatia was never accused of witchcraft. Her death was simply retaliation by one violent (and nominally Christian) faction for the killing of one of their own by a member of the other (nominally Christian) faction. yes, there was a rumor that she had prevented the two sides from making peace, but nothing at all about any sexual daliances, nothing against her being a woman, or any "science" she was into, and certainly nothing about witchcraft. that two centuries later somebody made up a claim (without evidence) of that is about as credible as the fact that Washington Irving wrote fictional stories about Christopher Columbus or Voltaire wrote satirically about the Council of Nicea. anybody can invent fiction about the past. if you don't have evidence connecting it to the contemporary sources, it's immediately suspect.
@@Mulmulmist and atheists never tried to suppress religion by force either, right? such examples don't actually prove universals. Christianity was not enforced on people for the first three centuries of its existence (at least). so one can't claim that because later some people did try that, this somehow is the fault of the religion itself, that its own ideas are rotten. take as contrast the ideas of Islam or the ideas of Marxism, where the instruction to enforce the ideas on people are built into the founders own teaching and were quickly implemented in actual fact (Muhammad obviously much more quickly than Marx, but still).
@WING YAN AUDREY WONG another voice of reason in a sea of ridiculousness! of course her death had NOTHING TO DO WITH RELIGION (the two factions, including the one she was on, were both ostensibly Christian). it was a civil struggle, not over doctrine.
it was this belief of god/religion that killed her, these religions have set as back we could have been so advance... people use religion to justify killings and death, she is dead that's sll there is to it, she's not going to heaven nor hell.. dn't say "oh may your soul rest in heaven" dn't use the idea heaven to justify her sad death.. she died in a bad way and it's really sad and we should learn from that.
"...they had it coming." Your Christian charity is admirable. Contemporary records make no mention of cruelty or black magic; those spurious assertions were made 200 YEARS after her death, promulgated, of course, by a CHRISTIAN bishop in Egypt, a bishop, by the way, that was removed from his office for punishing a monk so severely that he died from his injuries.
People just can not understand why Catholicism is valuable it is not the church, it is not the priests, nor the pope. It is the story of making man kind better through sharing and compassion and the knowledge that each people have the right to a home. It guided western civilization through its darkest hours and is probably going to continue to do so.
@@MrChileno13 Dude, you typed this comment thanks to scientists. Most of scientists were good people, and the science made lives of people much better overall. I can't say the same about christians or muslims.
@@KnightOfEternity13 Look at ancient times, Christianity was pushed from the people, not the ruler class because it was a better system of belive's for them. Again, your point?, you had all these things because you live in a society with christian pillars of morality, i dont see this advances in other places around the world. And only thinking in your profits it doesn't make that the people who were sacrificed by science (Because they were of a determinated race or anything else) a good thing.
religion had always been equal to business... am I wrong? let me hear. P.S.- I won't say I am proud not to be a Christian..... given the fact that my religion still exists after a few thousand years & after watching this movie I believe no religion has worked toward the forward movement of knowledge & reasoning
+Souvik Sinha Religion needs money to hand out books. Money to build churches. Money to build and spread the word so no, you're not wrong. Religion is a business but way back when it was the largest and most singular idea to bring people together, so it was either hijacked or created (religion) to control the masses. I am not proud that before I could even think or walk on my own that I was touched and "blessed" by someone that most likely doesn't practice what they preach. I want a choice to what religion to worship if any.
+Souvik Sinha Curious. You're right, alas our brains cannot hold many entire books in them. Extending our thoughts onto paper is the same as extending our arms to build from the sand. The author doesn't care where the paper comes from. Which is also an issue. I would argue that the investment is not the books, but the memories of the words written on them? Is that what you're driving at there?
@gariadara: As far as I know the library had been partially destroyed and the books moved and scattered several times so there is no real date when it got completely destroyed. There is controversy about how much of a library was still remaining in the building when it was destroyed (which apparently did happen like the movie showed). As for her beliefs.. what kind of god usually doesn't matter to christians, all that matters is it's not theirs. ;)
Socrates Scholasticus gives the most unbiased account and also the most detailed. Apparently, Hypatia was dragged from her carriage on her way home by the mob. She was taken to the local church and stripped naked (mind you...for a noble lady, you couldn't be more disgraced by this). Then, the mob picked up shards of pottery and skinned her alive. As if that's not enough, they literally tore her limb from limb and burned her remains on a pyre. Talk about overkill. As Scholasticus says, "Surely nothing can be farther from the spirit of Christianity than the allowance of massacres, fights, and transactions of that sort".
Kamikazu08 I think they have romanticised the idea of her death now. Horrific as it is, but they didn't shy away from how horribly Jesus Christ died or Joan or Arc or other martys/saints, so why her? It has ruined the whole concept of the film. It could have been done better, but toned down.
I noticed that everyone is talking about Hypatia, nobody mentions something about the slave boy. Funny part is how everyone is saying that she is very enlightened bla bla. Yet she totally belittled her slave every time she had the oppurtunity. It shows how arrogant she is that even in her last moment she doesnt want to talk to her ex-slave, she doesnt see him as her equal. This was the initial reason the boy became christian and tried to take revenge. You can also see his unconditional love towards her, he only wanted to be acknowledged by her. This last scene is very powerful in my opinion. I saw this movie many years, the ending scene was very powerful. There could also be a metaphoric meaning in this scene, i.e., how she is the sun and the slave is the earth maybe.
@Trampadoo I think Synesius was also supposed to be a very close friend of Hypatia's, which the movie did portray but i'm not sure he was ever her "student," (have to check up on that), I recall reading about a letter from him expressing his deep grief of her death.....and he was also a neoplatonist. And to my undestanding the most unbiased reason for the "Christian" mob to have killed her was more political than purely religious.
in actual fact this was not a war between Pagans and Christians in which an atheist was caught in the crossfire. it was a civil war (waged by mobs) between two Christian factions in a city (Alexandria) known for centuries (before and after) of being a hotbed of not just intellectual vigor but also civil unrest and mob violence. Hypatia was a Neo-Platonist but all of her friends, patrons and supporters were Christians. it's not quite the same but you might consider all of the great art or intellectual things that come from places like Chicago or New York, yet there's also heavy crime and political corruption there as well (not actual civil strife, thank God, but still). you begin to see what I mean, hopefully.
Yes, but you can also blame the holy books for commanding believers to reject other philosophies without fixing the violence issue. Only reason and science eventually stopped Christian fundamentalism in the Modern Age, not the Bible's teachings. that's what I call a flawed religion.
🫡 This happened because Christianity was not tolerated in Rome Don't get me wrong, we love your culture and your History because unlike the Romans you tolerated us but if you're so Masochist that you want to take the same route then go forward China did the same and it won't take much time for them to fall R.I.P. to the Last Civilizations on Earth Cause of Death: Coming in front of a Moving Train
Theses people are not followers of christ but are disobeying him!! for it was Christ that said "love your neighbour as yourself" so just become someone claims to be a follower of Christ or calls them self a Christian does not mean it is true!, you must look at their actions.. for that is what makes the man. Christ would not have approved of this but rather would condemned it !
