Annealing brass. Should you? 

When I started reloading 5 years ago I thought I had an unlimited supply of brass because I always picked up my brass for 20 years. Turns out when you reload, you shoot A LOT MORE! The 5,000 or so pieces I had are now going on their third firing so I started annealing them the hard way, one at a time. This video has convinced me that I need an annealer! Thanks for all you do and keep em coming!!

Annealeez is my favorite for saving brass during a time where you can't afford to loose brass to split necks ect. My last batch of lapua 6.5/284 is up nearby $50 per 100. Keep good notes.

JRB is my favorite channel bar none on RU-vid.

I've started annealing after every range session, after cleaning the brass. I've noticed more consistent neck tension when seating projectiles.

Shannon, There is an Australian company that makes an annealing machine comparable to the Annealeez called Kase Annealr, that have made a very good set of tutorials on how to setup their flame annealer. While their tutorials mostly pertain to setting up their machine, I'd like to point out in their flame alignment video, they recommend setting up the flame so that the tip of the inner flame is just touching the neck/shoulder junction. I believe this to be a more consistent way of setting up the flame, and should help you to alleviate the issue of your flame running away from your case. You're machine should be capable of speeding up to compensate for the extra heat being put into the case, so you don't ruin your brass. I'm not saying you need to try this, it is only a suggestion, but it might be worth a try. Good luck with the tinkering.

Whoever made this product had a pretty good sense of humor.

I ABSOLUTELY LOVE my EP integrations 2.0 annealer! Crazy easy to anneal right out of the box & anneals from the smallest of cartridges up to 50BMG without having to add or remove any parts & adjusts from cartridge to cartridge in seconds. I'd check it out.

I have done thousands cases with my Annealeez, works fine. Also your flame is way to short / low. IME with the feather (inner Fame) 1/4 to 3/16 from the brass about 6 seconds is what you will want with that brass.

Hey sir, love your vids! I especially love how I can’t get out of my head the picture of Lt. Jim Dangle from Reno 911 sitting there reloading ammo! You sound exactly like him!

I have an Annealeez Gen 3, so far it's been great. As far as 300BO brass I anneal it after cutting down 5.56 brass before forming to 300BO.

Four years ago, I got this Annealeez for my 75th B. D. and no use any other system to anneal my brass. Back in the late 60's to make my 222 Rem. brass from military 5.56 brass. Now I anneal 5.56 brass to make my 300 BLk OUT brass, 5.56 to make my 25-45 Sharps & 6.5 Grendale to make my 6mm ARC brass. 79 now, & still loading & shooting varmints. You make great video, love them, ..1SG., J J Huro Jr., USA RET.

Wife bought me an AMP machine. Best machine out there.

While my Annealeez 2 doesn't cure split necks in my 6.5 Grendel, the brass lasts longer. All my 5.56 range brass goes thru annealing prior to trimming & reloading. I watched Erik Cortina's videos and came away with "it's not so critical that I need an AMP for my needs". I anneal everything and agree that neck tension is more consistent.

Really enjoyed this. I did exactly the same (in thought process) before I bought the AMP. I too watched the videos on their web site and decided that everything else represented too much compromise. Their research is extensive. Just processed 600.

For my 300 Win Mag I was using the exact Coleman propane/torch setup you showed... And the little Lee case holder doodad, but I chucked it in my lathe and ran it at 120 rpm. But it was a tad slow so I dug around in all my sockets and figured out a 13 mm deep well fit 300WM just about perfect. No more fiddling with locking the case head in the Lee doodad. Not a lot of people have a lathe in their shop. So go to Lowe's or similar and get a socket adaptor for 1/4" impact to 3/8 drive sockets. And buy a cheap Chinesium socket that fits your case... Chuck it in your drill or impact and get to annealing.

I have long hoped you would start annealing all your brass as a part of your reloading process. I feel your SDs will be decreasing in the future, good stuff Shannon!

Great video. I built my own flame annealer last winter and have watched some of the same videos on building an induction annealer. While I like my flame annealer induction is the way I would personally like to go. When I run my flame annealer I run it so that the inner flame is just kissing the point where the neck and shoulder meet and run it till it gets a faint glow and it then drops into my garage sale purchased bread pan. Reese on the Range had some interesting videos on metallurgy when it comes to flame annealing and he makes it super simple to understand. Maybe someday I will have a job that will allow pay me enough for Amp Annealer money but right now I am happy with the flame. Great video thanks Johnny.

I use a my torch, socket and my electric drill bit. I just like doing everything by hand. I find it very pleasing and stress released process.

I assembled the DIY annealer offered on YTube. It worked beautifully, for close to 1000 cases. Went to use it this weekend and was not the same. Seems like the induction device is acting up. It gets hot, not that hot though. After 9-10 seconds, I gave up. Then I remembered I had to return the first one to Amazon. They were great about the exchange, prompt, no questions asked. Maybe the quality is spotty. Maybe some get lucky and get a good one. I got two that did not hold up. I am going to purchase the Ugly Annealer. Looking at several videos I think this may be reasonably affordable and well built. It comes with all you need less torch for under 300.00. Thanks for all you do.

If, like me, you want a nice induction annealer take a look at North East Texas Tactical channel for a $250 induction DIY setup. It isnt fully automated but it sure is simple and consistent and for 1/10th the price it does a great job.

Appreciate the encouragement. I have been thinking about it seriously for a good while. Watching a bunch of you guys. I just did not want to pay for machine. Thank you.

That's a great machine. I just bought one. I run it on 55 to anneal 6.8 SPC brass. The inner blue flame should just touch the case. I used the 750° Tempilaq to get the right timing. Mine is a Gen 3, but I bought the hose at Cabela's.

I bought one only because i have an 8.6 blackout and make my own brass but now i love it and use it all my brass

Add an adjustable regulator with a gauge to your 20# tank , leave torch valve full open and adjust your flame with the regulator. Then record the time and pressure , the digital timer is available on Amozon or Ebay and an easy install.

Easiest way to spin cases I've found is to decap them and put a decapping pin or small diameter drill in the drill. Just put the case on the pin at a moderate spin rate (I use a zip tie to control the drill speed) and put the drill in a vice. 4-5 seconds works for most bottle neck cases.

AGS brass annealer , simple , like the bench source but less expensive , really nice workmanship from Bulgaria with ❤️

I use the lee hand trimmer that hooks to your drill and the shell holder that goes with it to hold the case and a propane torch like you said... I've just started messing with it and it does help tighten things up with your velocity numbers and makes sizing much more consistent. I've been waiting on this video ever since the livestream because I've been looking into annealing for a while and was looking at getting a machine because the way I'm doing it now takes forever. Great video as always keepem coming brother!!!

Temperature is part of the old AMP white papers and also addressed thoroughly by ReeseontheRange a metallurgist

Thank you very much for creating this video! I will be bookmarking this video (I may even download it.) Great video for anyone who wants to take reloading beyond just reloading a couple of their rifle cases from time to time.

It's funny that you posted this yesterday. I was just looking at how to anneal since I was forming a bunch of 338 federal brass

A 1/16 drill bit upside down in a cordless drill in a vice also is a good low-budget move. Fits well in the primer hole. You can use a squeeze clamp to set the drill speed. Old school, but works fine.

I`ve had my annealeeze for about five years. I`ve had good luck with it. I used a batch of 100 5.56/223 mixed cases a few years ago and got eleven reloads or twelve shots out of them before I felt like they were finally worn out. I only lost two of those 100 to split mouths. Elfster has a new annealer he sells that can do brass from 300blk to 50bmg without changing out any parts. It's pretty darn cool and about the same price as an annealeeze.

From what I could see your doing good , I do this after every firing it sure makes the brass easy to trim and by the way I use a drill motor and swap sockets per size of the case

When I cut down 5.56 brass to make 300 blackout I anneal every cut case before I form/size the case. The factory annealed part of the case is cut off. The remaining brass isn't soft enough to rework without stressing it. I get consistent sizing and the brass remains at the length that I cut it down to. All I have to do is hit the case mouth with a tool to bevel the inside and outside case mouth edges. All I do to anneal is line up brass along my stainless kitchen sink rim and heat each case with a torch. When the case begins to show signs of turning red I knock the case into the sink and move to the next one. I can go through 200 cases in a short time with little effort. I found once fired LC 5.56, FC, and CBC brass are able to stay workable through 3 reloads before I need to anneal.

I'm sure of it now! Johnny is also This Old Tony

Good Video, I just ordered one for myself

Got the amp annealer about 3 months ago. Great machine! Fast!

I've used an Annealeeze for several years and switched to a Benchsource annealer. More better, easier to get it right once you play with it a little bit. I set my torches so the two center tongues of fire meet on the neck of the case. I do it about 4 seconds and that seems right but you may need to go a little slower depending on the brass.

Been using my Gen2 Annealezz for about a year now. Works great, I use 55 on the speed and just kiss the brass with the blue flame. It runs about 5-6 seconds before pickup. Worth every cent and my brass is definitely more easy to size and I have almost no case splits.

Thanks to Roger and you for a great video. Very informative indeed.

Lol I use the lee shell holder and map gas. 3.5 seconds and it works great for me. I’ll process 4-500 at a time. Since I started reloading (thanks to you) I haven’t bought any box ammo and only reload. I would rather buy once fired brass by the thousand and process it myself. I get better performance at a better price than buying match ammo. Not to mention my ammo is tuned to my barrel where box ammo isn’t. My groups show the difference. I decap, anneal, tumble wash with pins and then size, length, flash hole ream, swage (if needed), square the primer hole and de burr in and outer case mouth and they are ready to get washed again just to remove any lubricant. From there prime, powder, seat and crimp. If I’m loading for match I’ll pull the ones with the best concentricity (gauged of course) and use those for my heavier grain like 75g or even 68g HPBT. My groups get even smaller. If your group is sub moa at 100 yards, you’ll have an easier time holding 1.5 inch groups at 200 yards. Having the right barrel is key as well.

Shannon - Put a thermo couple on the outside of the where the case gets annealed and then youll have a way to gauge how hot each case gets. It would be a relative reading, but the nice things is that you could then dial in where you wanted it eash session. Just a thought. Great video. Thx!

I'm glad I came back and watched the rest of this. I just did some annealing attempts yesterday for the first time (socket and drill). They came out good but I was starting to worry about the finished color like we tend to do.. Then I got worried I was too far down the case, not enough time on the neck, etc. They came out just fine, just like you showed. Slight dulling of color 1/4-1/3 of the way down the case. I did well enough that I could compare 3-4x fired hornady annealed vs not and 2x fired adg annealed vs not. Major difference in the springback on the hornady, they definitely needed it. I went from about ten thou of variance to .001 variance across ten cases picked randomly from the fired bucket. Hornady is springy and hard to dial in to begin with, I'm going to anneal after fireforming/factory loads from now on. Adg, being nice and soft and thick like lapua, only cut the variance by about 25 percent. From maybe slightly outside my margin of error to possibly inside my margin of error on the pressure/timing of the die press.

I found 6-7seconds in the flame is about the sweet spot for most brass in my experience.

I have the V2 annealeez. I set mine up where I can just run the flame wide open and only adjust the speed for different cases. Makes it super easy to switch from 223 to 308 to 6.5 creedmoor etc. Just aim the torch and set the speed for whatever case I'm running.

I built my own induction annealer for just a little over $200. Works great. You just have to adjust your timing. I’m glad you commented on that system. AMP is a great tool but too expensive for the average Joe.

Have a Fluxeon Annie that’s been a pleasure to use. Perfect anneal every time and easily adjustable

I tried several different variations of flame annealing and the results were universally inconsistent. Flame stability and consistency is just a constant problem. Induction is the only way that yields consistent results. The Annie annealer is what I got. It is just a basic unit with a cooling coil so that the power source is protected during high volume annealing. The small handheld induction units he discussed are fine for very low volumes but will easily overheat and burn up their power source if not allowed to cool frequently.

The person that made it definitely has a sense of humor. Sounds like Analease lol

I used to run an Annealeez. It's a great little machine. I switched to the AMP only because I shoot F-Class and everything is about consistency and doing the best you can on the reloading bench so on the line you know why a flyer occurs.

Induction is the knee's of the bee. Also, induction option is a Fluxeon Little Anne. I built my own induction annealer with a timer that anneals down to .1 second. So its nice and consistent Temps on the tmepilaq, I wouldn't start at less than 750. I put 750 on the body of the case. If you are flame annealing putting tempilaq on the outside just ends up with burnt tempilaq. I use 1150°F on my shoulder junction to set up my machine. It could likely go a bit longer. I'd say a vast majority of people don't anneal long enough. In my experience you kinda want to see that neck and shoulder glow and then turn the heat off.

Good video

Love the annealeez! Absolutely required for some 556 brass for 300 blackout Thanks for all the great content!!

Brass prices alone make it worth it, especially for my grendel brass I would start seeing cracks at 4X brass so I always anneal 6.5 after third firing 👍 Great vid brother !!!

Now I can’t wait to see some videos on the .32-40. That would be sweet.

It’d be sweet to build an induction annealer that goes on the Lee APP. It’d probably be more complicated than it’s worth but it would be freaking cool.

For the people that do it by hand with a tourch use tempilaq 700 degree it's like nail polish you put a little swipe on the inside of the case and when you heat it it will dissolve and your done it is very accurate it basically works like a timmer.

KISS principle works for me: lee trimmer holder, torch, drill and Sound Brenner app to provide 6-7 second timing depending on caliber. Never had a split neck or a case head separation, and all my final loads have single digit SDs.

Don’t worry about it getting bright cherry red and I mean bright! Brass is a single phase alloy so can’t be over annealed. Providing it’s just the neck that glows you’ll be fine. Over annealed= melted. Don’t waste your money on tempilaq! Annealing at 750f needs an hour on the annealing S curve. You actually need around 1050 degrees over a few seconds which is enough to cause the necks to glow brightly but short enough to prevent the lower part annealing.

Good stuff Johnny. I have that exact annealer. Adding an on/off and a volt meter does help. I anneal everything, every pass. The Annealeez is so fast and simple, why not? The real win with annealing is consistency in neck tension. The case life extension is just a good side effect IMHO. I dont feel Tempilaq is worth the money. Its easy to set by eye in the dark as you showed. One thing that Ive found to work well is to run from a 20# gas tank as it makes the torch more consistent. Also I set the torch with the tip of the flame on the shoulder of the case. The AMP folks are correct on the salt annealing. The salt bath just doesnt have enough high temp to raise the neck temp enough to actually anneal anything.

I don't even smoke pot but I could watch that thing spin for hours.

I put a high angle on my v2’s torch head and anneal 300 blackout. Highly recommend it, from initial forming and onward it’s the only way to go

Turn the lights on if you don’t see it glow, it is not too hot, I like to see it glow for little over 1 second under low light not dark.

Coming from the blacksmith world, you want to anneal in a dark(er) room, and when the brass turns a dull red drop it immediately into a tub of water. This may be a touch too soft for cartridge cases though.

I have to agree. It's easy and worth it. In the last couple years I've picked up rifles chambered in cartridges you can't find when times are good. Few things are quite as aggravating as losing cases after one or two firings when you took the time to make impossible to find brass out of hard to find brass. Passed up a 250 Savage a while ago, wish I'd grabbed it as I have tons of 22-250 available to make into 250 Savage.

If I was at my old job I'd have you send a bunch of samples and I could have done metallography on it.

I anneal the 300 BLK OUT after I cut them before I size them. Make a big difference.

There's a YT channel that the guy shows you how to assemble an induction annealer for about $250. He uses a hand held induction heater (the type garages use to remove stuck bolts) with a digital timer (that is controllable to .01 seconds) wired in. He can do 50 cases in about 5 minutes. It's worth taking a look at.

Listened to all pros and cons....for me proof is in the puddin, I load many different kinds of cartridges, black powder and wildcat hand made by forming and very old chamberings ect. I need and want cases to last as long as possible, also want low pressure loads to seal at the case mouth on firing , annealing after 20 years proved to me I need to, in most cases, every reload. Also I could afford an expensive annealer but , never bothered, propane tourch a drill and appropriate size socket work perfectly, 60-80 rpm for 6-7 seconds, tip of the blue flame touching the brass shoulder angled toward the neck. Not rocket science. I think "like everything" over thinking over complicates the process and bottom line. The only real precaution for safety, is dont over heat the bottom third of the case, keep the flame up on the shoulder, if your nervious, Set the case in a pan 1 inch of water. I have done this precaution when annealing very short cases.

Im thankful I have access to an amp

Another great vid “Johnny”

Even with the small wheels, I had very poor results on my Annealeze not burning up the wheels. I gave up on both 300 BO and 6mm ARC. Great for 223 though.

Giraud makes a great flame annealer as well. I'd recommend a regulator for the gas - keep it consistent. Plenty of cylinders will have varied output that a regulator will even out for you.

They make a lacquer that paints onto the neck and turns a certain collar at a certain temperature and they make a range of different temperature lacquers. Tempalaq or similar name. At that point you can set your dwell time on your drum to a certain reference number and be pretty sure it’s annealing properly.

Hard to beat a propane torch mounted in a vice with a 5/8" -3/8" drive deep well socket mounted in a cordless drill with a 3/8" - 1/4" hex adapter spinning. You have a bucket of cold water nearby to dump them in after a second or so of heating.

I use an old turn table with a square of 3/4 plywood to account for the center shaft, a pie tin with water, a welder's glove and a hand torch. Primitive, I know. But it's cheap and works. :P

I do not anneal using the Lee collet die followed by the Redding Body die, resizing 3/1000 every reload. There ie spring back after 3 firings so need to push shoulders back a little more each time to maintain the 3/1000. Because I only Lee neck die size they are not work hardened, so my brass last longer without the need to anneal. I get about 10 firings from each case. My case failures are typically the primer pocket, having only a couple split cases over the years. I have great accuracy and shoot competitively in my league shooting fantastic groups. I have great success as long as I push the back the shoulders 3/1000. This does not work with if push the shoulders back using a full length die or bushing die, poor groups three shootings. It is understandable to me, as the Lee Collet Die works the brass only a fraction of a typical die. Last week with my 6.5 Creedmoor at 1000 yards I shot a 7” and 9” (5 shot) groups on a bipod. I measure each piece of brass many times during the reloading process making sure every piece of brass is exactly the same after sizing. I absolutely hate annealing and have found a reloading process where I do not need to anneal. Problem, just bought a 6.8 Western and Lee does not yet make a collet and Redding does not make a body die. So, I have no choice but to anneal.

Ugly Annealer is an alternative to AnnealEz, all metal parts, very well built, made in New Zealand but you have to order from Amazon in the US market. Ugly Annealer has all metal parts and very well built.. EP2 is a great option as well with a different design, I’d didn’t like guide rod stays hot throughout the brass annealing process, well made and American made.

i love my anneilezz . i got the gen 2 . thought about the salt bath but went with the anneeilezz . many yrs ago when i was shooting bullseye a lot of the old guys would anneal the top 1/4 inch of 38 special cases . they said it helped the groups a lot . i tried it but the only thing i seen was less case mouth splits . but .38 wadcutters crimped over the top of the wadcutter would split cases very fast . great video ! people need to know this ! this will help you a ton when adjusting the torch head to the case neck . get a wingnut and replace the nut on the adjuster with it . no more wrench !

Black sharpie burns off at 800 degrees. That’s what I use. It seems to work well.

After using this machine for a while i figured out a few things: 1: the wheels can get cooked especially if they arent moving. I always start the machine wheels before lighting the torch. 2: the torch flame will appear to shrink as the torch tip gets hot. Makes no difference. 3: i keep a few pieces of "dead" brass with the machine in each cartridge so that i can set up the machine without having to use any of the batch im about to do for setup. 4: i use the machine always with the torch at full and adjust using the timing. That way every batch done at a certain timing setting will always be the same. 5: i always do cleaned, deprimed brass. Dirt or lube getting on the lower wheel can cause the wheel that spins the brass to slip. Clean brass keeps the machine clean.

As a wildcatter it's impossible not to be playing around with some calibres WITHOUT annealing.

Talking about the 900F salt bath. What is the dip time for best annealing of 5.56x45 brass for you. What about the 6.5mm Grendel brass? Did you try Grendel cases in your salt bath annealer. The secret to the AMP New Zealand induction annealer is that they use tons of hardness data using their Vickers Micro-hardness tester. That rig is a few thousand dollars by itself, so they amortize the cost for owning and operating that lab level hardness tester by passing along the cost to their induction annealer price.

I still do the old spin it between my fingers method and I’m ready for some automation.

Nice video. I keep researching annealing. I do think that EC might not be right on the over annealing meaning that I do think that you can overheat the brass and ruin it sooner than his video indicated. I am actually a fan of his. Some people actually ruin a piece of brass and back off which is not so bright. It does not hurt to double anneal. If you re-anneal the brass that is already annealed, it will not over anneal. Providing when you anneal it again it has cooled down. So, one could work their way up to the proper anneal and anything that may have been under annealed could be re-annealed. With a single flame and the right distance from the torch somewhere around 4 seconds should do the job on most brass. Very small calibers maybe less, very large maybe a little more. Reloading is a constant learning process.

Very cool and great video. Great info. Thx!

I just ordered my Gen 3 version of this yesterday.

I am planning to buy a aneelezz. Some of my older 45/70 black powder cases sent the case mouth down rage through my Sharps.

Thank you for a great video again. The marking is not important because as you said would change with gas setup and also changes with brass. I found different cases needs different settings for annealing. I made my own annealer and i use the flame always max setting and if needed I adjust the distance of the torch instead of the size of the flame. But this is easy in my case because I only reload 223 and 308.

I used to stand my brass in a roasting tin with water in the bottom. Heat up the brass with a blow torch once the brass are red knock them over into the water.

Thank you for answering why I cannot get consistent bump on my case shoulders... Now I have to spend more money 😂 Seriously thanks for the Info.

I have been using the candle method for my grendel, but I don’t shoot tons of brass so it goes fast enough for me.

You need the small wheel for 6.5 Grendel, 6 mm arc and I'm pretty sure 224 Valkyrie , I have tried using the medium wheels but just not enough brass hanging out, and the smalls really doesn't like to spin to good and that was with new wheel,, so i found annealing the dirty brass first. it did spin a lot better with the dirty brass then nice clean shiny brass. now 223 on the medium wheels was fine, but i on thinking about switching to EP 2.0 BRASS ANNEALER I anneal after every firing, i get long brass life and i have seen better groups on my worked up loads , which i had a harder time with be for annealing I find that i get the same release tension around the bullet

I would never walk away from a bench with an open flame.

I finally started my annealing my brass because the necks had started work hardening and wouldn't hold a bullet. I never thought i had any accuracy issues that could be fixed with annealing. So, just recently I decided to anneal my 6br brass, until then I could only get about .4's to .6 inch 5 shot groups, which is not nearly as good as a 6BR should be. Once I annealed them my groups are now consistently in the .2's. I also noticed the feel of sizing and seating bullets is a lot more consistent too. Which I'm guessing is part of the reason for the increas in accuracy.

Get some 750 tempilaq. Then you can set time perfectly. I usually do 2 or 3 cases and save one in case I want to check it later to see if everything is still running correctly. I also use the tempilaq inside the case mouth. Then clean, size, trim and clean again only if needed.

Thank you for sharing

Would definitely like to see 32-40 at some point

David Tubbs doesn’t anneal. But he also states that his loads are in the lands, and there is more support when loading in the lands.

I screw a cleaning rod into my Lyman case prep machine and set the brass on it, hit it with a torch, then drop into water