I recently left a church because of this mess going on. So much impulsivity from leadership and encouraging the same in others, but failing to see the consequences. ie total lawlessness, falsely claiming to be the Holy Spirit, trampling faithful servants underfoot. The only way is to leave because they are so far away from getting it
Very thought-provoking. I always felt something was wrong with many of the church planters I knew. I couldn't put my finger on it then, but 'narcissistic' is the word I was looking for.
God of the Gaps and why the algorithm is too powerful or maybe the other way around. The evil televangelist win out the power of God but not the true church? you would think Jesus would at the least take care of this so the word can get around. praying really works for this, doesn't it? Maybe Repent might help but who are you to be called out and who am I to call you out. then Christians Wonder why their church is steadily falling into doubt.
you're doing God and don't use the meaning of evil Narcissist and what it truly means. Your honesty is in the dumps and why can't the power work through algorithms. the church of 13 is very weak. Maybe your church needs to repent.
I'm looking for this, too. I've been de-churched for 8 years. I can't go back to an institution that doesn't welcome differences of opinion. I tried sitting in a sermon this Easter and just couldn't do it. We need more conversations and curiousity, not lectures.
@@mtcstyle..you took the words right out of my mouth. My wife and I are in the process of leaving a church that is showing disturbing signs of pastoral control. I'm done with listening to the same man (they're always men!!) tell me his take on scripture, when so many times, he completely misses the deeper meaning of the text. His youth has a big deal to do with it, but sadly, he will need a few cuts and scrapes before he can truly lead with humility. Unfortunately, I've tried to share my experiences (I'm 65) about things the Lord has taught me (usually through mistakes I've made) but he is a closed book. He talks 'at' you, not with you. He means we'll, but he's caught up in his ego and insecurity. Anyway, sorry for the rant. Take care and God bless.
Ignatious elevated a bishop above the elders in Antioch 107 AD and you have the creation of the specialized professional minister reigning over the rest of the body of Christ. The root of narcissism. Imagine the hubris for John Calvin to take it upon himself to execute a man for disagreeing with his theology. Michael Servetus. Thousands of innocent women were burned at the stake as witches by the reformers as well.
I broke fellowship with the Calvinists I was involved with at one time. Like John MacArthur and his cronies. And it wasn't just Servetus; Calvin took Gruet out of his home and tortured him for a month, then had him beheaded. He put his widow out of her house and burned it down. He killed a total of 58 ppl in his reign of terror.
Interesting how the Church is supposed to produce leaders in traits like "empathy" yet find themselves being governed by types who completely lack it. Here's a thought. How about we repent and take seriously the words from Jesus that say, "those who love their life will LOSE IT!" (John 12). How about we also realize that there's something happening in our churchs today equivalent to what Jesus and Daniel called the "abomination of desolation"!
yes be very careful with our language . . . When we make everyone a narcissist or abuser than we lose its true meaning . . . The biggest problem in many church cultures . . .
Given what my people have been forced into over the past 5 centuries, yes. People of whom chose to classify themselves as white+Christian are a narcissistic collective that makes it a core part of their cult-ure.
2 Corinthians 2 New International Version 2 1 So I made up my mind that I would not make another painful visit to you. 2 For if I grieve you, who is left to make me glad but you whom I have grieved? 3 I wrote as I did, so that when I came I would not be distressed by those who should have made me rejoice. I had confidence in all of you, that you would all share my joy. 4 For I wrote you out of great distress and anguish of heart and with many tears, not to grieve you but to let you know the depth of my love for you. Forgiveness for the Offender 5 If anyone has caused grief, he has not so much grieved me as he has grieved all of you to some extent-not to put it too severely. 6 The punishment inflicted on him by the majority is sufficient. 7 Now instead, you ought to forgive and comfort him, so that he will not be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow. 8 I urge you, therefore, to reaffirm your love for him. 9 Another reason I wrote you was to see if you would stand the test and be obedient in everything. 10 Anyone you forgive, I also forgive. And what I have forgiven-if there was anything to forgive-I have forgiven in the sight of Christ for your sake, 11 in order that Satan might not outwit us. For we are not unaware of his schemes. Ministers of the New Covenant 12 Now when I went to Troas to preach the gospel of Christ and found that the Lord had opened a door for me, 13 I still had no peace of mind, because I did not find my brother Titus there. So I said goodbye to them and went on to Macedonia. 14 But thanks be to God, who always leads us as captives in Christ’s triumphal procession and uses us to spread the aroma of the knowledge of him everywhere. 15 For we are to God the pleasing aroma of Christ among those who are being saved and those who are perishing. 16 To the one we are an aroma that brings death; to the other, an aroma that brings life. And who is equal to such a task? 17 Unlike so many, we do not peddle the word of God for profit. On the contrary, in Christ we speak before God with sincerity, as those sent from God.
10is years ago, I read a small section about mental health in a health journal printed in the 1960’s (?). Egomaniacs and Narcissists appear to be the same thing? We all have our seasons of survival mode.? I've come to learn that when a person has entered the final season of life, their main focus is leaving their "learned" lessons to their loved ones in hopes that it will save their loved ones from suffering the same, but the memories are misunderstood & often unwanted information. So there is no out let & it's best to remain silent. Is this a form of Narcissist behavior? Wishing to pass on wisdom learned, or what you THOUGHT was wisdom learned?
Nothing is more Evil than Narcissism and Christians don't know it. Why would an honest Loving God allow this to slip through your mind? Why do Televangelist win out God on Algorithm but the true church is way too weak for youtube's Algorithm. Why not search, to be Honest and about truth. isn't it of what God thought and not what we think.
Man I just wish you could have pushed back and asked what he meant more about the power convo. Paul or problem with Bishops or even his comment on capitalism. Just seemed like a weird comment for me. Is he coming from the power corrupts absolutely camp or corruption of early church even Paul and Patriarchs. I’m curious, even on his thought of authority of scripture and even tradition!
there is no occurrence in the bible of the word narcissist - the bible talks about fools, boasting etc. SO if you believe the GOOD NEWS [the BIBLE] is to be shared then focus on what the bible says! this is just more of the church following what the world is doing - how is that approach filled with the Holy Spirit? I question that this line of discussion is in any way from the Lord.
