ASOIAF Theories: Who Speaks From The Flames? 

PaladinponyT Indeed. There are puppet masters in this universe.

Zoe Kouf he's important for dany's arc. defeating the mummer's dragon and all that

I thought Young Griff was going to be real important until they skipped him. Makes me think some of the theories about him, aren't true. Some of the characters, more centralized to the current plot, like Moqorro and Lady Stoneheart. I don't see how they're going to continue the story the same way without them. I guess, I'll find out, soon enough.

Casualties of book to screen adaptations.

@@hindsightpov4218, yes they were and I'm not surprised, with a story as complex as this one. That we were going to lose a lot. We seemed to lose more magical characters, than I would have expected. I've always wondered if there was a legitimate reason for it or does D&D have a prejudice twords magic?

jake cruz It could be the case Dan and Dave kept the magic on GoT to a minimum to keep the show from feeling too hokey. So much of the show is grounded in reality so to inject as much magic in it as the books are may have been to much in their eyes.

Post this same thing in a Lucifer means lightbringer video.

flora Oddchild how many died at the wedding? Would those be considered blood sacrifices?

I'm not sure. I think it was more about just binding Daenerys for future use and the Dothraki were just being Dothraki. But of course I could be wrong. What's confusing is that Martin blurs the lines between different mythologies. You cant say with certainty "well in Norse mythos this is what is actually happening" because what you've just read could fit more inline within a Greek or Roman, or Japanese or Native American mythological narrative. But that is also kind of the genius of ASOIAF as well. What I believe is that ASOIAF is a meticulously crafted heavily coded saga that tells three stories at once. You have your at face value story, ned, robert, Daenerys etc. But, you also have this enormously coded story that relies heavily on mythos from across the globe that ends up telling the same tragic tales over and over of rape, bastards, lusty men taking what they please, cruel society casting out wonton and abused women alike, and women becoming vengeful, very very vengeful. But then there's also an extermination campaign of the gods going on. This one I just figured out actually. Black blood, kings blood, maesters sniffing wounds, krasters baby boy factory - it all boils down to Ichor. Ichor is the blood of the gods. Greeks revered it, Roman's found it foul and putrid but also claimed they could smell it and could decide which type of god a person was born from. Melisandre, the brave companions in the riverlands, they're exterminating the offspring of the gods. I have more theories on that I'm not 100% certain about just yet. But I do think Brianne is a Valkyrie. And there's the an example of the problem, you have a Norse Valkyrie getting caught up in the riverlands indirectly fighting over Greek and Roman Ichor.

flora Oddchild you’re clearly ready for _Sandkings,_ a “collection of science fiction short stories by George R. R. Martin” published in 1981. For now, focus on just one of the seven stories: *_In the House of the Worm_* (The Ides of Tomorrow, 1976).

flora Oddchild this is ingenious.

there are gods of some sort, but its still a mystery which ones exactly. The seasons in the world are the way they are through some other force and were not always like that. I personally think the seven gods are the real ones as the baby with the sword is a god in Georges other stories as well.

Whats the problem if he made 10min video?

@@dirhammohamad3890 I think they can put more advertisment in the video if it is over 10 minutes long, so you will often see videos that are 10:01minutes long and at least to me it feels forced and unnatural.

@@dirhammohamad3890 and I think hr likes to keep his videos short. You know, give is a quick explanation, and let us get back to our lives Clear, concise, complete

@@arnekrug939 ooooh, didnt know that, thanks.

@@kristopherbarker3282 yea thats good

Our savior GRRM will defeat the others d&d

Kinda like real gods then...

Tone Riggz I know George prides himself in writing against expectation and turning story telling models on their head, but he has created lots of detail rich mysteries and plots and if he doesn’t eventually answer them then this series will be a long, rambling, nonsensical bunch of garbage.

@mdx haven't all writters done just that? I mean, no one truly creates thinga, but mix experiences, stories they like, myths, archetypes and make a story out of this mixture

@mdx Yeah, and?

I've wondered about this myself. Going by the show (very iffy, I know) why did the Hound have a vision in the flames that led to a catastrophe, the NK getting a dragon and breaking through the Wall. Also, when the priest who rescued the Hound was wondering which of the gods were true "maybe it's all the same damn thing, I don't know."

All I gotta say is they better answer this question in the books and show! Too much talk of it to not pay it off...

Who asks him that? I cant remember LOL

@@lucasnascimentoferreira6048 It is the red priestess Kinvara (a show only character I believe)

Show NEVER answered!!

its the third eye raven

Yeah and it's terrifying. Feels like it's happening over minutes but it's seconds. It's sleep paralysis.. basically your mind wakes up before your body does. The body paralyses certain limbs to stop us hurting ourselves when we are asleep...this fails in sleepwalkers etc. ASP Awareness during Sleep Paralysis

Yes it is terrifying indeed, and I thought it was kind of interesting how Martin sorta vaguely describes it in that flashback about Varys, not being able to speak or move and hearing a voice, very similar to what happens during sleep paralysis. I'm still not completely convinced about it happening during sleep as a way for us to not act out our dreams, though most people assume that is the case since science has prematurely deemed it to be so. I had this happen to me about once to twice a week for a good chunk of time (about a year or so) and was not fun having to pretty much keep it to myself since attempting to tell people about it did not go well at all, and this was back around 1995 and there was no internet to try and reach out for help, I thought I was completely alone being terrorized often at night in various ways, but 20 years later and I find out that it's actually quite common but most people decide not to tell anyone about it happening to them.

Ah my experience was when I was much younger and only happened a few times but, still very memorable. I learned to try not to panic and let it pass. I had terrors the first time tbh, thought something was sitting on my chest!! After that I still fought the panic... but it got much easier. Then I just lay and let it pass...it felt quite surreal. Of course I told EVERYBODY lol Your experience sounds lonely and terrifying. I had an aunt who helped me.

You were wise to try and just let it pass, it took me a bit to figure that out, but when I did it led to out of body experiences which were a whole new crop of baffling stuff to try and explain to people, I thought I was being abducted as I'd often be floating near my ceiling, or even in the sky above my house, and being only 14-15 years old I had nothing to base it all on. Out of body can be great if you know what's going on, super enlightening in fact, but otherwise is just plain weird if ignorant and scared as I was, and entities (or thought forms) are not uncommon at all to make things even more bizarre. When out of body you can travel literally anywhere you want, which I only did once on accident and ended up downtown to some desolate streets, which later made more sense to me since it was around 3 AM. Sorry to go on and on, it still always trips me out to think about, and there's always so much to tell and discuss on this subject.

Oh my. I was going to say that I'm sure I was astral flying!! I didn't want to mention it in case you thought me a weird hippy lol. I went (flew over) back gardens on streets I only new from their front gardens. Years later, I got a look when a friend moved there and it was exactly as I saw it. I must say that I don't remember a direct connection to sleep paralysis... I just found myself there flying almost like a dream until I became "aware". Then I could control where I went. I wish THAT had happened more often...I like flying lol

I don't know if I'd say "technically", since physically speaking they are quite the opposite (you agitate molecules when you heat, you slow them down when you cool)...

RIP use of the word "technically"

with both ice burns and heat burns temperature changes the water in the cells and causes them to rupture

"this battle is fought within each person": funny how pretty much all religions started the same way if you read carefully the texts and teachings of the founders: as some kind of metaphors for what happens inside the human conscience and sub-conscience. And is later promoted to some kind of literal interpretation of powerful gods and entities, losing somewhat the substance and interest of paving a way to wisdom and self-enlightenment...

Ever heard of the chaos lords ??

@@Kyrielsh1 If you bother reading and knowing : Following the collapse of the Roman Empire around the fifth century, Christianity became the dominant force across Europe. Christianity was one of the religions which rose from Zoroastrianism along with Judaism and Islam. It's not clear which rose first but as per records it's Judaism but it's clear that Islam was the latest of them. Christians believed in one all-powerful God, who created humanity, and rules, for the betterment of humanity. The goal now was compliance, not defiance (as opposed to Greek philosophy of defiance and heroism which gave birth to Greek civilization and The Roman empire) which led to a place in the Promised Land on earth and Heaven in the afterlife. Unfortunately, humans kept breaking these rules. The Bible is full of stories of prophets and kings struggling to follow the Commandments laid down by God. There is constant reference to the martyrdom of the faithful who stand up for the faith. 1. This was the belief of Jewish tribes who roamed the deserts around the Levant and Mesopotamia since 2000 BCE. Their holy books, the Tanakh, are full of laws and negotiations of the prophets with God seeking to ensure humans lived the right way. This came to be known as Judaism. 2. This became the belief of Roman slaves, later Roman nobility, and finally the Roman royalty, but with one crucial difference: they believed Jesus to be Christ, the anointed one, the Son of God, who sacrificed himself out of love to save prodigal humanity. This was Christianity. 3. This belief also rose in Arabia in the seventh century where Jesus came to be seen as just one of many prophets, the last being Muhammad who transmitted the word of God through the book known as the Koran. This was Islam. All three of them bears striking resemblance to ancient Zoroastrianism on a structural level philosophically. It is important at this juncture to clarify that from the Indian point of view ( as I am a Hindu) Western thought stretches beyond Europe and America to include the Islamic world, for the quest for objectivity shapes Islam too. Just as Europe was torn between the Greek way and the biblical way and later the Protestant way and the Catholic way, the Islamic world was torn between the Sunni way, with its roots in Arabic tribal egalitarianism and the Shia way, with its roots in ancient Persian dynastic culture. Every denomination is convinced the other is wrong and that they are right. Everyone harbours a worldview that accommodates only one truth. Divinity in the Abrahamic faiths ( all three Christianity, Islam and Judaism) is always articulated as the Word of God and divine laws are always presented in written form (such as the Ten Commandments) that need to be read, indicating the objectivity of these laws. The covenant is valued greatly. The bond with God is not assumed; it has to be ritually enacted through circumcision or baptism and many other rituals. This reveals the deep-rooted need for documentation and written memorandums of understanding which would formalize humans into their community.

Dragons were so considered holy in zorastrianism.

What does Zoroastrianism mean

The book is VERY worth it. Many many clues and the book itself is full of amazing pictures GRRM chose himself. Pick it up!

Right on, thanx for the insight, will get it soon. I'm glad I got into Martin's world when I did, very late but not having to wait nearly as long for the next epic chapter and still able to fully catch up.

You'll wait long enough for the last book, don't worry, you won't be spared ;-)

Nah the timing will be perfect, I have so much to read til then, but then again who doesn't.

Jamie Lee I would not be inclined to speak of good and evil Children in an absolute sense. But it does seem likely that there are different factions, some friendly to humanity, others hostile.

Who are your ancestors?

Brendan Burns. Nope. Valyria had it's own gods. But very little has been revealed about them

Alan Pennie huh well it would make sense that it would be the red god wouldn’t it? If we follow the theory of valerian dragon knowledge coming from “those from the shadow” isn’t the red god religion founded in Ashai? Or was it the church of stary wisdom?

R'hlorr worship may originate in Asshai but it's not certain. Volantis is another possibility.

Valyrians had multiple Gods and named their dragons after them so their names are Urrax, Balerion, Vhagar, Meraxes, Arrax, Terrax, Caraxes, and Tessarion

aboomination fuck off i knew someone would comment this

He doesn't exist in the books

The Long Note by Kevin MacLeod

Yeah, many of these theories logically imply that some people have incredible knowledge of the future. For the moment Blood Raven COULD have that power, though the mechanics in the TV show tend to imply that it is not easy to influence the timeline... People conjectured that the Night King (show) has that power too but I never see any real proof of that.

Jorah was a spy working for Varys. Varys who is a old friend and co-conspirator of Illyrio’s. As for Dany receiving a message and instructions through the fire? No. We have her POV’s and I don’t remember anything suggesting that to be the case.

The fact we know who Jorah was a spy for Varys is what makes him an implausible spy for some undisclosed supernatural power.

TC IronBear I see what you’re getting at now. But, why would some supernatural entity need an physical anthropomorphic spy with Dany in order to spy on her? There are several ways that don’t require a person to physically be there in order to spy on someone, supernaturally. Greenseers use the weirwoods. Wargs use animals. Mages use the glass candles. The Red Priests use their flames. The Wizards drink ‘Shade of the Evening’. And who knows how the Woods Witches do it.

There’s also the Appearance of the Red Comet. 5,000 years ago, a scroll was found in the Library of Asshai, likely left by the Church of Starry Wisdom, that foretold of the Red Comet’s (return) thousands of years down-the-road. The Red Priests, likely turned that into a religious prophecy and added that Azor Ahai would be reborn again at this time in order to keep the tale alive and so, have been waiting for this return ever since. The Red Comet appeared in the sky the night that Dany’s dragons were born from fossilized eggs, meteorites. When the Red Priests saw that, they turned to their flames and asked R’hllor to give them a vision of Azor Ahai and what they must do in order to help them. Conceivably, one of them saw Dany or her Dragons. As for communicating with her during that night? No. Some where likely waiting for her or whoever would show up with the dragons in Qarth though.

What ? Varys was there when Raeghar was, so what Raeghar killed Varys and took his place ? And no one noticed, really... There's no limit to the ASOIAF theories -_-

@@Kyrielsh1 I propose that whoever wore Rheagar's ruby studded armor was glamored, since it's rather convenient both sides instantly stopped fighting to pick up the rubies in the ford, and would not have noticed. Also the Dunk n Egg stories would be an excellent parallel. Tall, dumb, kind and nameless Dunk with a small bald secret Targaryen matched to Tyrion n Varys, short, smart, shrewd and famous Tyrion with a fat bald secret Targaryen. Lots of theories out there, but few are as plausible as mine.

The seven probably

@@sithersproductions The Faith of The Seven is a balanced, sensible religion.

@@Alexpascu2785g6 the boss of the white walkers, the night king

It's very clear that somehow information is being transferred through the flames. This is demonstrated by multiple characters. In Melisandre's POV chapter we see firsthand how she interprets Visions in the flames.

Fair enough. I haven't read the books in like 12 years so . . .