Astel and Pakael said that these Vtubers are stronger than them in Apex ǀ Holostars 

I actually thought so as well when he said it on stream lmao

actual 5head

Not that mention i think so too🤣🤣🤣

haha astel miss the good old days of not being counted as 10pt master since it's easier to build a team during those days

Remind me when Selen from Nijisanji join apex tournament, and since she revealed in the past that she is former Predator, she was given a whopping 10pts during RIG LOL.

Yes, I hope Aqua can join tourney one day, I think there is no problem about confidence, she just need one chances to start and I believe that could be Towasama. But the hardest hurdle maybe the schedule. Not to disregard other but if we look from popularity her tight schedule could be worn her out if she join a tournament.

With how much she plays Apex I thought she already joined in one.

Its happening guys, Aqua will play in next V tournament with Suisei and Towasama! Lets goooo!

Oh Towa just tweeted it... NICE!

@@PeterButchens ah I see so you are man of culture as well for knowing rapper goddess Rene. scream and maybe training stream from the 3? it will be fantastic one month till the tournament. not to mention tourney after party festival that will make Aqua play match with other participants randomly. what a treasure will we witness.

All of them are being humble for not to be rude. Only Shibuya Hal's judgement is trusted. Them and Aqua's level on the same level.

But tbh aqua is far better than him, but not yet at gorilla level

Both of them pretty much on equal level mechanically, just astel far more experience in teamplay and Igling

@@AdhytiaRasyid I think Aqua has better movement but Astel has better aim. Neither is far better than the other. Both worth 10 points

We wont know unless they fight each other 3 v 3 with full party but my bet is on Astel since he is far more experienced. But all of us know that they are both monsters.

​@HTT Idk if it's natural skill or the insane work you put in that you can essentially read the game. When Astel first joined Holostars, he never even played a FPS game before. Kira took him under his belt (along with Izuru) and they started playing like crazy. Specially in 2020, when Astel grinded like never before - he even admitted he played so much he can even "play" Apex when he slept. Also lampshaded when he gave a light-hearted joke answer to Shien about how he is so good at Apex: "Be prepare to give up your life." I can understand Astel being humble - after all, go into their first ever Master-lobby match and WIN??? Who in their right minds could pull that off?!?

@@conghuannguyen996 and if i not wrong only 2 person party. since the other one died first

“Even in she underperforms” Im happy to report that wasn’t the case o7

ahh this is a very good take. while astel has decent experience in captaining a team, this makes it that his brain needs to think more thus sacrificing 'physical's. Aqua doesn't have experience in leading a team bcus she's only been joining tourneys recently, and if she isn't the brain of the team, she can use that brain power for extra 'physical' performance.

Aqua scarred the entire lobby, including other masters and coaches

oooof bug big oooof @@IShrimpShark

Same I miss her too ;(

Not as good as gorilla but she's around the same skill level.

Her mechanical skill, as in aim and movement is almost as good as Gorilla. Experience in team match is another matter.

Aim wise they are all great. But Gorilla was a pred forever and that for a reason. Aqua is not his level. Perhaps on the firing range but not in game and especially not a tournament. Bora was the best female Vtuber I've ever seen and she still stands above the others. I hate that almost all of her content from her channel is gone. 😢

@HTT gorillas movement is not that good at all. His aim is good but acting like his movement is top tier is a joke. Selly, Ras, Shibuya Hal, and kamito are all predators with God tier movement. Gorilla doesn't come close to them, but neither does anyone else.

Yeah, I still remember astel crying together with aruran and izuru despite being 5th place. That was really passionate battle. And now astel is more focus on helping others increase their skill to enjoy apex together

There was once a talk stream he did where he read a marshmallow that said “do you even stream anything apart from apex or singing” which first sounded like a small joke (because to be honest, he really doesnt do much apart from those) , but he sounded really sad and guilty and took it to heart and said maybe he wasnt doing enough as a Vtuber. He also confessed that Apex isn’t as fun as before, because of the countless cheaters he is losing the motivation to play ranked. It went on for about 30 mins to an hour reflecting on his past streams, and he felt that marshmallow was a criticism towards him as a streamer/Vtuber. And that was when, even though hes not great at Valorant, he plays more of that now with Izuru. He also tried out many other games to give a good variety. His twitter DMs are open for business/promos, but he confesses that sometimes after an Apex stream, he would get DMs (even english DMs) telling him how much he sucked or played bad. Sometimes even as harsh as telling him to graduate. I feel there are definitely a lot of things going on behind the scenes, but there is no ignoring he is indeed a 10pt worthy Master. Even if he does it for memory now, I hope in an custom match area, he still remembers the fun of playing Apex. Update: he tweeted a few hours ago how much of a blast (figuratively and literally) he’s having playing Mad Maggie. I’m glad he had fun throwing his balls at people (esp Towa lmao), finishing them off at the shibuyahal customs yesterday. He’s having fun now, and hopefully his team for the Vsaikyo in April will be even more hype

Previous people have mentioned reasons as to why he lost his fire, but arguably Astel became a better IGL as of now, but lost some of that mechanics, due to losing passion. He gained something else when he lost something else, them clutches that he would do, and the situational high risk high reward, is being watered down a bit with consideration of his team. If he ever decided to have that fire again, with his experiences as an IGL and others, as well as getting his old mechanics or even getting BETTER, then he'd become more of a monster than he is already...after all, there's as reason Shibuya Hal put so much point in him

Naw astel has been improving his leadership skills more after he won, so its not like hes gotten worse.

@@ysw1439 Mad maggie truly blessing came to him. He enjoy it too much. And currently playing around what meta he can do w mad maggie. Always think his problem is only his motivation and passion. I watched his master climb before mad maggie came he actually never lost his skill, he's even better. He got master in 4 days when ash came out (season 11 split 1/December 2021). leia get annoyed on how good astel is. While he keep trying to convince us he is “gold level player” . I’m happy he got his fire back. Extra excited for vsaikyo.

Yeah, and Pakael himself is a monster. I remember in one tournament where he keep having the most damages and kills.

Pretty good but not on Aqua's level yet

Good but not on the same level of people mentioned by astel

If you said mastiff, gibby main like hanabusa Lisa and Ratna Petit is the most strongest when come to mastiff even their rank is diamond.

sumire is good, but nowhere close to Aqua. Ive watched most of her SoloQ streams and there were more misplays etc, resulting in her failing the challenge despite grinding like 80 hours last season

pfffft haha coming back to this clip I almost forgot what the aqua fans are known for in these tournaments hahahahhahahahahahaha @@Daivd1111

あとパカくんもアステルくんもしっかりと具体的に言葉に出来るぐらい他のプレイヤーを分析出来てるところも強みだと思う よりプレイの安定化にも繋がるし こういった強みがフィジカルが強い人よりもこの2人を買っている理由だと思う まさしく強さと上手さは別だと思う

They're saying they *don't* know how well she would adapt, not that she would be bad at it. Comp still depends on teamwork rather than just comms and Aqua has a really good ability to support, so she might potentially excel in comp. Just look at her first game in Master ranked; she supported her random teammate seamlessly with no voice comms. It then mostly boils down to whether or not she can adapt to the comp style of just camp it out bro.

@@Bludflag I never said that she would be bad at it, or that they said she would be bad at it. Just that she would struggle starting off, as basically everyone does because of how different it is to ranked. Most people have at least a full tournament cycle or two before they find their footing and can play at their usual level. Also I think your not understanding how important comms are in customs. Calls on positioning, damage done, skill cds, inventory needs, when your popping heals. These can make or break a fight and change if your team even fights. It's not constant, but being able to vocalize it is important. Even at a basic level she needs to vocalize how much damage done and to which character. This doesn't mean that she would be bad at it, but she isn't very vocal, and these things are usually said while also fighting which even a vocal person would take time to get used to doing if they don't do it normally. That's also excluding the time it takes to adapt to playing against current/ex-pro's who have monster skills compared to master/pred players. As well as the reaction and response time difference from enemy teams who are all using comms actively unlike many ranked games. Once again, not saying she would be bad or unable to. But it would take time, as it does for everyone. Potentially more time than most for her as she is very vocally reserved.

@@Carreau-sama This is a pretty bad take overall IMO. Firstly, my response was in general to the second paragraph and the line of thought that follows from it. Secondly, this is not addressing what I said adequately, at all. Comp settings usually feature one IGL and maybe a co-IGL. Aqua's expertise in supporting a team would shine if she were not the IGL then, as she has communication issues as you pointed out. Her support can be nonverbal and seamless as her first Master game showed, even in high-level lobbies (and let's not immediately fellatio tournaments here, not every team is made up of current / ex-pros and Apex Predators, Aqua is still in the upper skill bracket in most lobbies). That's my point. I don't think this is exactly rocket science and I'm not sure how to demonstrate a point I find so self-explanatory in other ways. I'm not saying Aqua would immediately win CR Cup or wipe a pro squad or something, but I think the idea she would immediately and immensely struggle in a competitive scene overblown. The final result would then mostly boil down to whether or not Aqua can speak at all in a Discord call (this would be a good tactical multiplier, but not something that can’t be done without¹) and external factors like who would she fight, resources gathered by the teams, etc. ¹ What I mean by this is that hypothetically, the IGL of the team could say something like "focus Gibby!" and then Aqua could just ... beam the Gibby. Communication is important, and good communication even more, but it doesn't necessarily have to come at all times from Aqua specifically. Especially with QOL additions like the kill log now telling you your team broke someone's shield and who that enemy character is and if someone landed near your squad.

@@Bludflag Well let's agree to disagree. Mostly because you don't seem to acknowledge how drastically different customs/competitive are from regular ranked, especially before master/pred only lobbies. Even those lobbies we have a small sample size from Aqua. Secondly, outside one or two teams, the last 3 CR cup has had a predator/pro/ex-pro player on each team, most of whom are extremely individually skilled even among predator players. Lastly because my statements above apply to anyone who is just joining a custom/tournament outside of the specific vocal part for aqua. Which we have seen multiple examples of high level players unable to play up to their normal level despite being master+ for multiple tournaments. But it's apparently a terrible take. Meanwhile, your responses show either bias towards Aqua by giving her the benefit of the doubt often or you don't watch much ALGS, scrims, other tournaments without holo members, or high level pred stacks. Which is fine. But it all still ignores that we have no idea how Aqua would function in a stack of players, especially if she doesn't know them, or how she reponds when the voice chat is full of chatter and loud, or in a position where she has to speak, even if only a couple of times a game. So assuming she would be fine or adapt quickly is just mad disingenuous. Especially when we have so many clips about how overwhelmingly introverted she is even among friends. Even when I talked above, I didn't say she couldn't, just that it would take time, and saying in a tournament or two is already fast to begin with. Also saying Aqua would be in the upper skill bracket in a CR cup, the most common tournament holo's participate in, is a stretch depending on where you draw the line unless your saying she would be better than a few people who hit predator regularly or other masters who have custom/tournament experince. There is no nonverbal and seemless support when your aren't very familar with your teammates and their playstyles and don't need to communicate what to do especially when every other team will be vocally communicating during a custom, unlike regular ranked. There is no, one person simply doesn't talk at all and it works out. To much can change.

Well, if It's "those" Custom then It's very Hard since Aqua was Introvert and Her Opponent have very high Experience in Team Fight also know each other skill, and It isn't like theres only Master in the Custom 🗿🗿 theres also Pred

honorable mention for IGL: daruma and that one time he use astrology to lead himself, noah and vodka to champion

@@chinhthehugger9284 Well, Daruma is not a vtuber and also he's a pred. The reason why I intentionally set Gorilla3 aside is because he's a pred haha.

@@chinhthehugger9284 No man can compare with Daruma's witch craft. Respawn please nerf.

i feel the same way, i was so happy when astel mentioned bora-chan. 😭

@@cxtsune what she's doing now, any updates?

selly and cpt can vouch for bora, they are always amazed on how bora plays

訂正有難うございます (*´ω｀*)

Ngl Astel would take every chance he can to get dropped to 8 ww

there is a better word for it when it comes to gaming, it's mechanics.

@@rayir.1382 I can definitely see that. I didn't feel like mechanics include reaction time. I've always had the impression mechanics is more your understanding of the game and not something outside the game like reaction time, but probably that's just me. In fact, I think the Japanese probably use the word physical as a borrowed word for mechanics.

@@codeotaku8857 Mechanics is actually things that aren't game specific such as reaction time, aim, high apm and such. Meanwhile understanding the game is called game sense, this is more game specific. Examples of game sense in apex are knowing how to rotate, knowing which fights to take and how to take them, how to always have the better positioning and knowing what to do. Anyways, sorry for ranting about gamer lingo, hope you got something useful from this.

Such word use is one of the reasons why the Japanese are bad at English tho imo

A big key point of their team was Towa's experience. She knows when and how to follow up Aqua's attacks, and when to tell Aqua to stop going in. Suisei was the cherry on top because she listens very well, very aware of her surroundings even in the chaotic final rings, and is able to make sound judgements without panicking

Aqua playstyle now is as much (if not more) flashy than astel. She plays very aggressive now + her improvement in movement is just insane to support her aggressive play. Overall, Astel is still better, but I agree with them when talking about pure mechanic skills, Aqua is a bit above Astel.

if u compare to aqua a year ago, Yes, but her playstyle right now getting much better, even her aim like ten times better than she was a year ago.

@@yudan366 coming back here after the recent startend games. Goddamn, Aqua is a different beast now

同じマスター10点クラスにこれ言われるのはやばすぎる、この切り抜き日本版欲しいですよねw

@@user-qy5qq7tr7x 分かります！笑

Relative to Aqua maybe. Aqua has also did 1 vs 3. Those female players they mentioned has done the same I think.

@@prajnadeva yupp I’m sure they did but astel also did say it on his other stream sometimes.. hm i guess he’s rly just underselling himself..

Here have a bonus clip when Kaga Sumire defeat Roberu's team during Vsaikyou, 1 vs 3. Shibuya Hal voice commenting in background. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-TDQK40lQCSE.html In my view, what separate truly good player with average is the ability to clutch 1 vs 3

Well, Astel's main strength is his brain imo. He's so good at being an IGL, calling rotations, making decision on to fight or not to fight, his game sense is where his true strength lies. Of course he's also so good at 'physical', he's done a lot of 1v3 too, he's definitely underselling himself there, but what he said is also true. NoahBora were always famous for their 'physical' and already proven themselves many times that they can win even a 1v1 against pros and clutching a lot of 1v3 too. Although, I would say that those two are definitely not better at being an IGL compared to both Astel or Pakael.

"right now"? But isn't she already graduated? Nahh Just kidding ikwym

There are hundreds of vtuber playing Apex so it will be hard to make that tier list lol. I will just mention predator and master I know. Predator: Virtual Gorilla, Syuusetsu Kohaku, Selen nijiEN, Shibuya Hal Master: Kaminari Qpi, Tachibana Hinano, Astel Leda, Izuru, Utai Meika, Minato Aqua, Shirayuki Reid, Kurumi Noah, Nun Bora, Tochiotome Sayu. Yuuki Chihiro, Natsuiro Matsuri, Qualia Qu

@@prajnadeva Qu is pred

❄️💜

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❄️💜

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Selen is in different level because she's supose to be predator in her private account. Qu Quelia too. They are banned from joining any vtuber tournament or so i heard. If you compare selen to aqua, selen much stronger than her. Have reach predator and know how strong those lobbies, even just ones, are enough too make you strong enough than aqua.

Selen is in different level because she's supose to be predator in her private account. Qu Quelia too. They are banned from joining any vtuber tournament or so i heard. If you compare selen to aqua, selen much stronger than her. Have reach predator and know how strong those lobbies, even just ones, are enough too make you strong enough than aqua.

@@almfranky well she’s doing rank solo currently in her stream. And as far as I can see she’s rusty af, high diamond level (D2-D1) not even master level. I hope she can take her form back idk

@@almfranky They arent banned. Vsaikyou is just mostly JP vtubers participating. Qu had Leona to invite her back when she played but now they cant play together since Qu climbed to Master. Selen could join if someone invited her but even then, you'd have to play in that lobby with like 200-250 ping or smth.

@@almfranky uh sorry bro, but current Selen is definitely weaker than Onion. Sure, she knows game very well, but her aim and movement are not master/pred lvl.

ah Thank you for mention it. He changed it now it fixed

@@ZoroZakiCh Thanks for the fix!

If she wants to join, she should be the one reaching out. Waiting for an invite is just silly if you think about it. She has been in hololive for years and the amount of times she has played with others outside of hololive? I don't watch her much but I can't really think of many or...any at all instances at all. But you expect people from outside looking at this thinking "This person has never(?) played with people outside her company/group for years but I'll try inviting her!" ??????? when they can simply just ask people who they have already gamed with and within the apex tourney circle.

@@HitoribochiSakana Aqua has definitely played with people outside Hololive in the past(don't know about Apex though). There are clips of it.

​@@HitoribochiSakana agree that it would be best for Aqua to be the one to reach out to the others. Of course, she needs to be interested first. She have mentioned a few times that she is comfortable playing by herself. But regarding your second point, the number of collabs she have with others outside Hololive isn't that small as people seem to think. Its just that most of it occurred during the old days of 2018-2020. During 2021, she became very busy her streaming time dropped alot. She used to be quite the streaming monster, and she got hit the hardest by the mass vod privating. For APEX in particular, she played with Debidebi and Ririmu. With Debidebi, Rion, Shiina from Niji and the now graduated Hinako from Animare, they were part of a "LoL group" that played LoL together. She also had quite a few other collabs with Ririmu and Shiina. Ran, Haneru and Patra were also involved in a few collabs with Aqua. Aqua also have a few tournament experience, having participated in a VTuber Shadowverse tournament, as well as 2 VSaikyou during the PUBG era, which was why ShibuHal mentioned having a PUBG image of her. She's not as disconnected as people think. Also keep in mind that there are tons of off-stream interactions we never know of. For example, 96neko once mentioned playing VALO offstream with AquShio, which most people probably aren't aware of as Aqua and Shion have never mentioned it. You mentioned in another comment "how long do you have to wait for Aqua to get to the same level (teamwork)?". Astel was also very shy and inkya during 2020. IIRC, VSaikyou 1 (late 2020) was the first tournament he joined, people are free to correct me. He have grown alot in communication and connections by participating in these APEX tournaments over the past year (2021), there is no reason Aqua won't be able to grow too.

aqua joined shibuya hal's first tournament lol.....pubg tournament

Aqua fans are okey. But Aqua her self would not.

@@almfranky the western side..dont underestimate the 'idol culture' from japanese side ..oh i can smell it already

You got your wish.

@@themarky2714 yeah didn't expect that lol

dayyum...and its aqua who 'invite' to join towa...afterparty match gonna b crazy?

Male

Male lol. His character is male with female voice

and with this, you just activated paka-chan's trap card haha

Male, he even got a clip of where he teaches us how to make a trap voice

Man my dreams and hopes are ruined

There is an upcoming Apex tournament in April called vsaikyo, organized by Shibuya Hal. Points are assigned to the participants based on their rank and abilities (Astel and Pakael are worth 10 points). Each team has a limit of 18 points to make the tournament balanced, so since Astel already takes 10 of the 18 points by himself, he needs to find teammates with points that add up to 8 at most. He's been trying for a while to get Shibuya Hal to lower his points to 9 lol

Upper diamond, lower master. They have their own strength and weakness. For example, Kanae is very good with sniper.

As someone who watch Chihiro a lot, I can tell you she is solo D4 level. She reached master with pred friends and is stuck at 10000 RP even with help. I do like her streaming a lot, but skill level is just not there. Kuzuha and Kanae is better but not by much.

@@Daivd1111 hmm... Agree, I love hard working Chihiro but she is just need a lots more time for improving, but she is slightly better now than when she team up with chronoir

@@Daivd1111 chihiro is done with her pred-mas gameplay. She says she wouldn't aim for predator nor play with them in ranked for some times.

I'd also say that as for Chronoir they are better than most dia players but lower than master, they've branched out to Valo rn and havent been focusing on apex so who knows if that made their aim better or worse, if they were to grind apex then they can probably make it to high master. Also remember Templex saying that Kanae can make pred, although getting to masters is already enough of an achievement and hitting pred just takes so much time.

Qu is not in memory because she seldom join japan players, technical issue with lag. Also she is graduating. Kohaku is... well Astel said "among the well known". He knows there are some vtubers with good skill out there, but relatively unknown. Kohaku is somewhere between current Aqua and Vgorilla.

@@prajnadeva Qu chan is graduating?

@@Daivd1111 yes, sadly she is not in good terms with her company. She would go indie or maybe find other company, with new character and other channel. She would graduate IIRC end of march

@@prajnadeva sad she didn't even collab with laplus. Quchan and kohaku would be perfect for vspo.

@@prajnadeva So sad, her 1 year anniversary was lit but went quiet after that. Hope she can still find success.

かみとさんはvじゃないよ

？？？ なに？

@@西川ありす kamitoさんはLive2Dを使ってるストリーマーだと自分で言ってるしvtuberではないよ だから最協も出ないし

Master