Babylon 5 For the First Time | The Fall of Centauri Prime 05x18

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Two veteran Star Trek podcasters watch Babylon 5 for the first time. Brent Allen and Jeff Akin search for Star Trek like messages in this series, deciding if they should have watched it sooner.
All Hail Emperor Londo the Mollari II!! Jeff and Brent try to figure out how the Keepers and the Drakh do what they do.
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1 июл 2024

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Комментарии : 142

@Nic0maK 3 месяца назад

« It has occured to me recently that I have never chosen anything. I was born into a role that had been prepared for me. I did everything I was asked to do because it never occured to me to do otherwize. And now at the end of my life, I wonder what might have been » Season 2, The Coming of Shadows, Emperor Turhan to Sheridan

@Beowulf8989 3 месяца назад

JMS once said that a way to watch Babylon 5 is to view it as the battle for the soul of Londo. It's not a coincidence that the story opens up with his narration.

@chrism7395 3 месяца назад

For B5's Jeffery Coombs, I think it's going to come down to a monkey-knife-fight-in-the-car-park between Wayne Alexander and Kim Strauss. Kim Strauss appeared about 13 times and played a Drazi ambassador, Markab ambassador, a EA ensign, a Narn pilot and a Minbari captain!

@stuartwald2395 3 месяца назад

In the podcast, when Jeff asked whether Wayne Alexander was the Coombs of this show, Brent responded, "That's a good question." He was making a great meta-reference, and he didn't even realize it! (For those who didn't get the joke, Jeffrey Coombs was the voice of the Question on Justice League Unlimited)

@bluntman1138 3 месяца назад

Technically, since Jeffrey combs appeared in babylon 5....Jeffrey combs is the Jeffrey combs of b5

@chrisharris9643 3 месяца назад

I never got the idea that that earlier alien was an actual Drakh. I thought he said he was an emissary for them . The last scene showing Londo, sitting alone, after Delenn asked , " what have we lost " makes me tear up every time 😢

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

Telepaths WERE important in the shadow war - they showed us how the telepaths worked in the war and then suddenly they could beat the shadow ships. After that we mostly had reports of battles - since we know that a shadow ship was fairly much unbeatable without the telepaths, but now shadow ships were being beaten, I'd say we have direct knowledge that the telepaths were vital.

@popmonika 3 месяца назад

I think they were expecting an X-Men style battle between the telepaths.

@meropetied 3 месяца назад

@@popmonikaexactly. It's absolutely absurd to claim they weren't important in the Shadow War. These guys just got a bit bent out of shape that one vision they had for the show didn't exactly come to pass due to the sped up season 4.

@wanderingthedesert5599 3 месяца назад

It's not that telepaths weren't important, it's that we only really ever hear about human telepaths but outside of Lyta, never see them fight the Shadows (whereas we do see Minbari telepaths being used to jam the Shadow vessels). Lastly, it's only the HUMAN telepaths that seem to have questionable treatment; we don't really know how the alien telepaths are treated, but considering they didn't appeal for a homeworld of their own, I'm assuming they tend to fare a lot better.

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

@@wanderingthedesert5599 Yes, but the point is that they keep saying that "we were told the telepaths were so important and then it was never followed up on." and that is wrong - we were first shown that shadow ships were almost impossible to beat and then we were shown that telepaths could fight the shadow ships, and after that we were shown that they were recruiting telepaths and the reports on the war indicted that shadow ships were being beaten - how much more do we need to show us that telepaths were important to the war. That is also the case in a couple other complaints that they keep saying that we were told something then nothing happened with it - except something did happen and it was important. Generally I say nothing about these things, but the telepath issue is brought up so often and was laid out so clearly in the show, so I reach a point where I say something.

@oenrn 3 месяца назад

Yup, as usual they are incapable of reading between the lines and then complain that this show doesn't do the Star Trek thing of treating the audience like 5 year-olds that need every little thing painfully explained to them.

@cedric13 3 месяца назад

With regards to the keeper and how much control they have, you can see in Lando's flash forward that as G'kar is choking Lando at the beginning he isn't resisting, but as soon as the eye opens up and realizes what is going on, Lando is forced to choke G'kar back and they end up killing each other, or so it seems.

@richardchenoweth2258 3 месяца назад

I never interpreted that awful alien as a drakh, the episode said it was an emissary of the drakh.

@Thraxis 3 месяца назад

My favorite quote: " " like my grandpa used to say "cool""

@FeenixUK 3 месяца назад

These last few episodes saved season five from being a disaster. Glad that you appreciated it and enjoyed it as much as I did. Londo and G'Kar's arc over the five years is SO EPIC and thank god we had two amazing actors to pull it off. No idea why the Drakh abducted Londo previous episode but maybe it was to prepare him, maybe they can’t just throw any old Keeper on any person but have to prepare him. Re the Keeper - yes, it is linked to the Drakh who nurtured it. So it’s personally linked to the Drakh we saw in this episode, and can communicate the Drakh’s thoughts to Londo. Doesn’t control Londo but monitors him, and gives him pain if the Drakh thinks he is disobeying him. No the Keeper does NOT control Londo. It’s up to him how to do what the Keeper tells him what to do. If he fails, the Keeper will inflict incredible pain (and of course, the Drakh can blow up the planet). Well done Jeff on remembering the Keeper on Captain Jack! Why do you two keep saying the telepaths didn’t do anything? The younger races were absolutely powerless against Shadow ships, even the Whitestar struggled. You saw in Shadows Dancing that Sheridan and Delenn’s army only lost two ships for every Shadow vessel destroyed - because Sheridan and Delenn made sure every ship had at least one telepath.

@forgottenonemusic 3 месяца назад

"...and at the last, you must surrender to yourself to your greatest fear, knowing that it will destroy you." Lady Morella

@singingwordwright148 3 месяца назад

I think a better word than "change" is "evolve." People don't necessarily change; who they are is who they are. But people do evolve. As they acquire experience, as they react to the world and experiences around them, what motivates them, what they need or want or believe to be right shifts. What we saw Londo and G'Kar do is evolve. At their core, they're still the same people, but they're the same people in a new context. What they will pursue and value has changed.

@la_scrittice_vita 3 месяца назад

A good distinction. There's a chap upthread who thinks Breaking Bad is unique in having a character arc, so he compares Londo and Walter White. That's extremely simplistic as Walter's arc on BB serves to reveal a sociopath that was there all along. Londo and G'kar evolve into something more than they were. B5 adds, BB subtracts.

@tommcmahan 3 месяца назад

Also thought the Regent's death scene was very touching for a minor character

@hornorsilk2901 3 месяца назад

The Centauri Prime Trilogy does give more insight into the Drakh, but it should not be read until after watching all that is available.

@thekc1701 3 месяца назад

The story of the Centauri, and especially Londo, is a tragedy. The CP trilogy adds so much more context and color that makes it even more tragic, but also provides tremendous development for Vir. It also ties it neatly to other parts of the whole story. It's criminal those were never filmed even as a series of movies.

@darrenbabidge4694 3 месяца назад

The abduction was to prepare him for it, whatever that entails. The Drakh says, 'Yes. He will be sufficient' (or similar) so it was a test to see if Londo was a suitable host.

@martintoggweiler2343 3 месяца назад

Yes, a health check is how I view it. Recall that the Vendrizi had problems merging with people under certain medical conditions, even though good health wasn’t necessarily a requirement.

@alextaylor1705 3 месяца назад

I figure the Drakh abducted Londo to measure his neck size, so they could see whether to use a Medium, Large or XL keeper on him.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

I believe the speech the Regent gave to Mondo before his death, it was amazing.

@Asehpe 3 месяца назад

Ha-ha, I had automatic captions on, so when you guys said 'The Draazi and the Naerns' with that southern accent, it wrote, 'the drowsy and the nerds'. 🤣🤣🤣

@BabylonLurker 3 месяца назад

"B5 is the story of Londo and G'Kar" It can very much be seen like that, and possibly because Andreas and Peter are the best actors of the show ... so many beautiful scenes with them- Absolutely a great episode. Londo at the end of the episode, alone, living the consequences of his actions. 65! and be seeing you!

@lollol35 3 месяца назад

Londo and G'Kar are the only characters that grow in the sense that they would act differently in the end as opposed to the beginning. They transformed, learned and grew. No one else really did. It is their story.

@timamherst-clark2699 3 месяца назад

@@lollol35 Zack? Lyta? Ivanova? (wherever she is?) Dr Franklin? The earth fighter guy in that dreadful episode TKO! (😃) Neroon? What about Vir? He's come a long way since those early episodes.

@Virg73 3 месяца назад

Maybe the whole abduction was a metaphorical dream... showing yhat Londo will be controlled by the Drahk... just a thought...

@Chetverikov 3 месяца назад

"They don't let Centauri Prime Rebuild - It's still just as messed up in the future" : This is something of an assumption. It's not that Centauri Prime was never rebuilt, rather that it has suffered extensive damage in 2278 AND in 2262. We know that there's got to be other things going on such that Delenn and G'Kar end up back on Centauri Prime in 2278...Without going too much into spoilers, this is another thing where the full picture is not contained in B5's 5 season arc.

@DebiNorris-hj7yz 3 месяца назад

The Centauri Trilogy books delve deeply into all that happens between the end of Season 5 and War Without End. An excellent read centered mainly around Vir.

@SSGranor 3 месяца назад

Hell of an episode to be the one that dropped the day the US Supreme Court basically declared that the President is, in effect, an emperor. Also, of _course_ the Drakh don't know who they are. That's the _Vorlon_ question.

@geoffharper8650 3 месяца назад

A very touching ,and not unforseenly devastating concluston to Londos career path .

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

"I didn't quite catch what you heard." I like it 65 different ways.

@lollol35 3 месяца назад

It's an honor and a privilege to watch you gentlemen working your way through Babylon 5. For the first time. :) And it is especially great to see you go from liking Londo the clown, to swearing that you are done with him. To finally forgive him. Perhaps Babylon 5 doesn't hold up a mirror to society. Perhaps it holds up a mirror to you.

@lionofhighpark 3 месяца назад

65. Thanks for sharing with us, Jeff. Good luck on your journey. Many of us have been there.

@lelandtankersley4454 3 месяца назад

My sense on the "scan"/abduction scene for Londo is that the aliens were checking to make sure the Keeper would be compatible with Londo. Like maybe some people have allergic reactions to the Keepers, and they don't want to put him on the throne, Keeper him, and then have him die and have to pivot to some other plan (not to mention letting him off the hook). Presumably if he wasn't compatible with "Keeping" then they would have used other methods to try to keep him under control.

@timamherst-clark2699 3 месяца назад

I assumed that they were taking samples so that they could genetically engineer a Keeper specifically for Londo?

@neilfmoore 3 месяца назад

Such excellent mental health advice from Brent and (especially) from Jeff! Who would have thought, back when this podcast/RU-vid channel started, that we'd be here listening to such meaningful life advice!

@annanamoose9943 3 месяца назад

Centauri hair grows with status, that’s why Emperor Cartagia’s short hair was scandalous

@la_scrittice_vita 3 месяца назад

Right. Height is status, thickness is actual power.

@stevemartegani 3 месяца назад

Considering Jeffrey Combs appeared in Babylon 5... Jeffrey Combs is the Jeffrey Combs of Babylon 5 :P

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

The captain Jack episode, took place when Marcus and Franklin first went to Mars to meet up with the resistance for the first time. And because Captain Jack was controlled by keeper, he switched the IDs that Franklin and Marcus had nearly led them to be killed by number one.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

They were preparing Londo accept a keeper. The keeper itself comes from the Drakh’s body, and has a telepathic link to it and to the subject it is attached. That’s why Londo was leading to the Drakh to no kill Delenn, and the truck merrily tilts his head. He’s speaking telepathically to Londo and the keeper.

@tommcmahan 3 месяца назад

The act of forgiveness is a personal thing..."group forgiveness " can be symbolic, but its not real forgiveness

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

Brent: to quote from Avatar the Last Airbender - Uncle Iroh, "At my age, there is really only one big surprise left, and I think I'd rather leave it as a mystery."

@chrisharris9643 3 месяца назад

Thank you for sharing your struggles with depression. I have struggled with it since i was 12 or 13 , and i understand the empty helplessness and hopelessness that so often accompanies it, despite even pleasant things happening in your life. Counseling and learning new ways to self talk when i feel like that have helped so much. I appreciate your openness and .God bless you both

@Smileybeeblevrox 3 месяца назад

Basically questions about the fallout of the already stated Drakh War and Telepath War is at least glimpsed at in the spin-off Crusade. It also shows how the Interstellar Alliance performs when not weak or just starting out. For any unanswered questions after the fifth season, and the TV movies, I recommend Crusade at least hints at some of them.

@oenrn 3 месяца назад

Please don't talk about future stuff they haven't seen yet.

@berbchiderly6241 3 месяца назад

I think the Drakh have underestimated Londo. He is an experienced politican, and used to having two faces, and using circumstances to his advantage, includung telling the "truths" that his audience needs/wants to hear, to further his own agenda.

@Kilrauko 3 месяца назад

Part of the knowing/not knowing when death happens dialogue with Lennier is also reflected on Londo's thinking all the time. From season 1, his vision of death has been G'kar and Londo strangling each other on a room he as a patriotic centauri knows to be the palace throne room. When their relationship reached the "oh shit I've been a shit person and need to make amends" stage he has also started to avoid the position. Certain part of that has to be the attempt by any means possible to prevent G'kar's destiny. And part of Londo sitting on that throne is him knowing and dreading *when* he will kill his good friend and why. We as viewers saw through Sheridan's viewpoint the explanation, but that's information which has never been available to Londo. In that sense, is Londo better off not knowing when his death comes? Something to ponder the rest of the season and beyond...

@darrenbabidge4694 3 месяца назад

I always took Sheridens silence over it all as either a) he thinks he did change that future or b) he knows something is amiss but how would he convince anyone so let it all play out.

@tommcmahan 3 месяца назад

The G'kar Londo forgiveness scene was my very favorite scene between the two

@hornorsilk2901 3 месяца назад

Season 65 is the surprise season you never knew you wanted.

@alextaylor1705 3 месяца назад

Wheel of Fire is the one where Johnny Cash guest stars as a Pak'Ma'Ra.

@chrisharris9643 3 месяца назад

😅😂

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

Jeff: I think that what G'Kar was saying is the same as you said. G'Kar was saying that in this, the only forgiven is person to person - his people could not forgive Londo's people, but individuals can forgive each other - he could forgive Londo.

@oenrn 3 месяца назад

Exactly. History can't just be wiped clean or brushed off. Events have long lasting impact in the relations between peoples, and that's not going away any time soon. But we as individuals can choose which grudges to hold onto.

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

@@oenrn Growing up in a religious family, I remember that the Bible speaks of the sins of the father being visited on the children to the 7th generation and that sounded nasty to me, but it was explained that this was not a question of God punishing the children for 7 generations but rather the wrongs we do don't just affect us, they affect our children and their children for 7 generations. Interestingly, my wife, who was a survivor of abuse, had a book that talked about the fact that there was scientific evidence that in general, those who go through serious abuse pass on elements of that damage even if they try hard not to and it takes about 6 or 7 generations for that damage to be fully addressed. I guess that means that to achieve world peace, we just have to manage to keep things under control for 7 generations to get all the hate and animosity out of our collective systems - so about 2 centuries? How hard could that be....

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

The final words of Lady Morella were, at the end if all other chances have passed you by, there is one final chance for your redemption. You must that what you most fear that would destroy you. Or words to those effect I don’t have the script in front of me.

@jimcook1161 3 месяца назад

Te 'first appearance ' of The Drakh wasn't even a Drakh. JMS didn't like how it looked and I believe he changed the dialogue in post so the character said Emissary, speak for Drakh. As for the scene from last week, my take is that nothing was done to Londo. They were about to operate on him but the Drakh stopped them. A bit like how in an early episode of The Prisoner no.2 says we need him undamaged and I think a similar thing is going on here.

@TheFireMonkey 3 месяца назад

I think this quote is suitable here: "We have not succeeded in answering all our problems-indeed we sometimes feel we have not completely answered any of them. The answers we have found have only served to raise a whole set of new questions. In some ways we feel that we are as confused as ever, but we think we are confused on a higher level and about more important things." ~ from “The Workshop Way of Learning” published in 1951

@KeithDCanada 3 месяца назад

I would assume that the 'work' that the Drakh are doing is the same stuff they were doing for their masters. The Shadow's big thing was 'Evolution Through Conflict'... and if the Drakh have been servants of The Shadows for enough generations, I would think they have bought into the mission statement. Whether their masters are around or not, they have been given a blueprint as to how 'Things are supposed to work'..... just like, if Sheridan died after being captured by Earthforce, Ivanova said her job was to continue Sheridan's work... one man was not more important than the mission. I think the same concepts apply here. That's what I think anyway. It leads me to even question (and DO NOT answer if anyone knows the actual lore info).... we're the Drakh always like they are now? We know the Vorlons had been adjusting younger races to react to them more 'favorably' and that they had even messed with the developmental biology of some races to develop telepaths as weapons for the next Shadow War.... so had the Shadow's been doing similar things? If the Drakh have been in service to them since the last Shadow War, is the 'Keeper' part of their biology just a biological alteration done by their masters? I would be curious to pick JMS' brain n that topic.

@jondbm 3 месяца назад

Good to have 65 back.

@SuperZero42 3 месяца назад

The "Previously on..." from this one only existed due to the four-month break in between it and MoFaS. Unsure if it was a TNT thing, but one way or another they put it in because they'd never had a proper cliffhanger ahead of the summer break before.

@dianayoder1285 3 месяца назад

I read an interview with Wayne Alexander where they called him the lon Chaney of b5, cause he played 7 different characters on the show and it's movies

@Asehpe 3 месяца назад

I think that first abduction, from G'Kar's cell, was about making sure Londo's body could take a keeper. Maybe they can't just grab whoever they see and merge with them. Maybe the guy needs to be prepped a little before the merging happens. I could be wrong, though. Does anyone else have a better reason for Londo's first probing?

@wanderingthedesert5599 3 месяца назад

Out of curiosity, are you guys going to be watching Crusade? Or reading the books? Some of them going into particular details that are touched on in the series, however I don't want to go into anything particular until at least after B5FTFT, and then maybe wait a little.

@IvarChoiEspedalen 3 месяца назад

65! I have been looking forward to Babylon 5 for the second time for a long time now. 🤩 But i am also looking forward to hear your thoughts of the last episode of this series . Only a few episodes left now....

@Psi105 3 месяца назад

I always assumed the Londo operation was installing some hidden device that triggers a new keeper to regrow if removed. Just my guess though.

@new_mercury5367 3 месяца назад

I've just started the video and Brent is wearing a Rush tee!!

@fatalynn7 3 месяца назад

65. To Brent’s point. This was my b5 for the second time and he is soooooooo right. It hit So much harder this time.

@sarahschenk2428 2 месяца назад

Yeah. Londo Mollari’s arc breaks my heart - every single time.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

JMS hated that version of Drakh. he thought it looked stupid. Therefore, he changed it to an emissary of the Drakh.

@RCanadian 3 месяца назад

Another theory is, "You must save the 'I' that cannot see."

@la_scrittice_vita 3 месяца назад

Followed by Londo saying "I don't understand" !

@Calendyr 3 месяца назад

I liked the finale for Enterprise. It was a clever way to showcase the impact of the crew on the future after the show was cancelled early. People focus on the fact it was a ST:TNG episode but it really wasn't. I was so sad Enterprise was cancelled just after it finaly found it's legs and was getting really good. As for the last 3 episodes of Babylon 5, I simply cannot remember what they are except for the show's final episode, which is my second favorite episode of the show.

@thedeltonian3841 3 месяца назад

They don't want to know the show titles in advance. Maybe edit this to say which episode it was -- like "last episode" "second last episode" or whatever.

@Calendyr 3 месяца назад

@@thedeltonian3841 They spoke about the episode in details. I think they know exactly what it is !

@jamesbell7696 3 месяца назад

"Wheel of Fire" Circus, Shakespeare, close enough for a podcast.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

Ta’lon he actually played by Marshall Teague (from Infection).

@Nikioko 3 месяца назад

The lesson of the Treaty of Versailles is that nothing is more dangerous than an undignified, humiliated nation. That's why it was done different after WWII.

@Asehpe 3 месяца назад

Jeff: "Londo and G'Kar is the story of B5". I wouldn't go that far -- I kinda think the Shadows vs. Vorlons vs. us was a bigger deal, both philosophically and historically. But if you mean that Londo and G'Kar have the most interesting character arc in B5 -- that I can wholeheartedly agree with.

@NathanielMiller 3 месяца назад

Centauri Prime was rebuilt; something...else happens. It's in the novels, a whole triolgy on what happens between this episode and Sheridan's travel forward in War Without End. Wayne Alexander isn't quite the Jeff Combs of B5, but he may be the closest thing they had. He only had 7 roles; Combs had 9. Actually, Vaughn Armstrong had the most roles, I think; 11. You do see the Keeper take control, but not in this episode: you saw it in War Without End. The Keeper is part of the "source" Drakh, there's no real distinction. Yes, New Earth is the Vorlon homeworld, JMS confirmed. I think the "not allowed to drive" thing was Biden, when he was VP. The only place he was allowed to drive his vintage Corvette was on the grounds of Camp David. 65 Personal opinion: we now know the answer to "You must not kill the one who is already dead." It was Morden! If he hadn't blown up the Shadow base and killed Morden, the Drakh wouldn't have come to Centauri Prime.

@robertdendooven7258 3 месяца назад

Love the first album logo Rush shirt, Brent!

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

Yep. The question is, however is Jason Ironheart going to be waiting for earthlings there?

@curtisburns1357 3 месяца назад

Londo is what you call a tragic figure, and I agree I think the story of Babylon 5 is the story of Londo Mollari and G'Kar

@Chetverikov 3 месяца назад

-Save the Eye that does not see: Cartagia TO LONDO about G'Kar's disrespectful look: "I don't like the way he is looking at me, *what do YOU think I should do about it?". Londo evades, saying whatever his majesty decides will be appropriate, and only THEN does Cartagia maim and torture G'Kar. BZZZT. Chance Gone. -Do not kill the one who is already dead: Morden was already dead, and Londo had him killed. Guaranteeing the Drakh would seek out Centauri Prime and Londo in particular. BZZZT. Chance Gone. -"and at the last, you must surrender to yourself to your greatest fear, knowing that it will destroy you. Now if you have failed all the others, that is your final chance at redemption.": Fans are divided on this, but I think this is pretty clearly him getting drunk in 2278 and inviting G'Kar to strangle him to death. Remember that when we FIRST meet Londo in 2258, he's preoccupied with G'Kar as his nemesis because he KNOWS that they will kill each other. "I'm an old man, it's...twenty years from now...". He came to fear that death, eventually wanting to avoid being emperor, wanting to avoid his fate...but it was only in giving into that fate, that fear, that let him get Sheridan and Delenn off of Centauri Prime in 2278... and with his deat, the end of Drakh control over Centauri Prime.

@percysowner 3 месяца назад

I agree on the first 2. I do think surrendering to the Keeper became Londo's greatest fear. He welcomed G'Kar and someone had to get word to G'Kar about Londo's state and someone had to get him into the palace. I agree that Londo's redemption begins here, not when he dies.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

The wheel of fire is the actual name of season five.

@Calendyr 3 месяца назад

MaN... I am so looking forward to the series ending so I can scream what the eye that doesn't see is! ROFL!

@stuartriddell2461 3 месяца назад

The problem I have with the Drakh/Centauri storyline was that it was too short, and felt a little rushed. Thanks for that Byron.

@martintoggweiler2343 3 месяца назад

Byron was filler for S4 needing to be rushed. AFAIK the Centauri-Drakh mini-arc was as thorough as JMS wanted it to be.

@kardy12 3 месяца назад

On the 28:00 mark, Londo has always been big on saying that what he wants is best for his people, but much of the time the actions he took were good for him while he said he did it for the people. Like allying with the shadows, it certainly furthered his interests but was it really in the best interests of the Centauri people? Even here where he does make a sacrifice, but he still gets to be emperor while his people are impoverished and isolated to serve the interests of the Drakh - is it really in their best interests? Don’t get me wrong, Londo is one of my favourite characters and Peter Jurasik is simply awesome as an actor in this role. But what makes the character interesting is precisely this duality between an “old republican” patriot that sees himself doing things for his people but nonetheless keeps doing things that are not necessarily in their interests at all.

@Belbecat 3 месяца назад

Just throwing it out there - I think you guys would really love Arcane and hope to see a reaction to that series one day.

@Matej_Sojka 3 месяца назад

Spoilers for Centauri Trilogy books below. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . In the future when the fires are burning and Sheridan sees it, they are not from this attack. Drakh wanted Londo to kidnap David Sheridan and use him to capture Delenn and John Sheridan and Londo refused, thinking their threats of bombs are a bluff and he called it. Drakh were not bluffing.

@hornorsilk2901 3 месяца назад

The questions do get answered...somewhere...

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

Watch the end of war without end part two again. Specifically the scene where G’Kar is stranglingLondo.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

Sheridan should be asking questions at the time he sees the destruction of centaur prime in the future? I don’t think he was in any shape to ask questions. And Sheridan was blown off his balance by the actions of the Draazi and the Narn. so, I don’t really see where in this episode he could’ve asked questions.

@babybalrog 3 месяца назад

you name dropped the treaty of versailles, well that was signed in 1919, 13 years later, in 1932 a certain Austrian got elected. Sadly similar to the 15 year gap, which we know Centari Prime suffers. I guess It can be related to the interwar period, or the great depression.

@cedric13 3 месяца назад

Or just the US bailing on the League of Nations

@Thraxis 3 месяца назад

I heard Jerry Doyle and company call Wayne Alexander their "Alien for all seasons" on the commentary, on a second watch you guys should try and listen to some of the dvd commentaries

@mountainsofelysium7379 3 месяца назад

I really hope you guys keep going and cover Crusade... Definitely leave "Lost Tales" until after Crusade... I'll say no more on that other than it will work better

@tommcmahan 3 месяца назад

The Drakh in the first episode were deliberately distorting their image, in this one they don't

@kirishima638 3 месяца назад

Some things that bothers me about this arc: - Sheridan has known about the keeper since WWOE and should have recognised Londo’s behaviour. He should also have known about the Keeper on Mars. - The primary players in the Shadow’s downfall was Sheridan and Delenn, not Londo. So the Drakh should have gone after them.

@la_scrittice_vita 3 месяца назад

It's been suggested that his memories of being bounced through time were a little hazy. There's probably a reason Delenn "never really believed" whatever he told her until she lived it.

@tommcmahan 3 месяца назад

Londo was a "Walter White" prototype...a character that changed significantly throughout the series (G'Kar too)

@dewaynejelks9088 3 месяца назад

Cool shirt, Jeff.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

Did Delenn have a similar crush on Dukhat? But had the better sense to not mention it?

@gregshergold 3 месяца назад

I cant wait for the 2nd time.. especially when ( [Spoilerish - call back] . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . we meet Justin and he is talking about "when you go into one of those ships you are really not the same ....[right here]...you donwhat your told" watch that scene again and you can see the keeperish type control.. I cant wait to see if you notice it.. its so obious, yet hidden in plain site..till then Club 65

@timamherst-clark2699 3 месяца назад

613 views but only 86 likes . . . ? I suppose it's better than just 65, but still!

@Matej_Sojka 3 месяца назад

You talk a lot about justice and consequences, yet not once you mentioned the fact that Drazi orchestrated the war for the Alliance to fight Centauri because they could not do it themselves and even when they found out something was wrong and there was shadow tech on Centauri vessels they kept it secret. Drazi had to get White Star Fleet and rest of Alliance on their side to have a chance of facing Centauri and they did not care about all the lives spent to give a black eye to Centauri, which could have ended up in disaster if defense fleet was not misplaced by Regent. And Narns helped. You go on tangents about how Centauri are the bad guys because of Reefa and his followers and to lesser extent Londo... Yet in season 1 it was pointed out that Narn Regime starved three provinces to boost military power... Now after devastated Narn home world the Narns have a space fleet on attack again, where do you think it came from? I pointed many times in these comments that Narns were not innocent victims in what happened to them. Yet you were ready to cry for their predicament. Yet in this episode you have shown no such sympathy for the Centauri people. Just like you had no sympathy for Narns doing war crimes to them during peace time for 50+ years.

@dll_Rhemuth948 3 месяца назад

You are resistant to reading the books, but when all is said and done, you have to read the books. They’re not long, 200 pages and they will answer your questions. That the series won’t.

@hornorsilk2901 3 месяца назад

Remember, not everything is as it seems

@Asehpe 3 месяца назад

I keep thinking of Londo as a guy that would be all right, even good protagonist-like, if he didn't have this whole 'patriotism' thing, this whole 'Make the Centauri Repubic great again!' thing. Think of it: in his late middle age, he had a younger woman who was apparently in love with him (Adira), he had faithful friends ready to die for him (Urza Jaddo), he could do good (as he did to that Centauri couple who wanted love rather than tradition). And he threw all of this away for what he saw as 'his duty' to the Centauri Republic. His is a cautionary tale. A sad one, because he isn't as bad a guy as his life made him. But a deserved life nonetheless. From a moral viewpoint, Londo ended right where he should be. The only other guy who I think had this kind of appropriate ending was Walter White from Breaking Bad. 'Don't be like Londo', B5 seems to whisper...

@AmanChooses 3 месяца назад

Personally, I believe G'kar forgiving Londo does nothing for Londo. We forgive others for our sake not for thier sake.

@martintoggweiler2343 3 месяца назад

I don’t think it’s necessarily that cut and dry. From actual experience or simply deeply contemplating a hypothetical where forgiveness might be forthcoming, can you not imagine feeling something positive for having been genuinely forgiven?

@Calendyr 3 месяца назад

I would go a bit different with you guys. I think season 1 was was bad for the most part. Season 2-4 are the most epic sci-fi ever created. Season 5 was ok. I don't mind Byron. I know people hate him but I feel the same way about him that I feel about Jar Jar Binks in Star Wars, people love pilling on him but he really is not that bad.

@bluntman1138 3 месяца назад

"In my life, I have had 4 wives. I cared for them all deeply...but I LOVED Centauri Prime. Loved every street, every tower, every inch of our world....everything i have done i have done for her"

@ThePotatoeGuru 3 месяца назад

Cannot wait for them to watch that movie. One of my faves.

@vfmacedo 3 месяца назад

Since they haven't seen it yet, could I suggest you edit your post? Let's let them hear it from his mouth the first time ;)

@TheButtonLady 3 месяца назад

Dude? Quoting something they haven't seen yet would be a spoiler, wouldn't you say? C'mon, now.

@bluntman1138 3 месяца назад

@@TheButtonLady it's not like I'm quoting anything plot related at all....besides, don't think its a spoiler when they have already realized it

@martintoggweiler2343 3 месяца назад

@@ThePotatoeGuru A shame that it seems they won’t watch it before the finale.

@pjs1921 3 месяца назад

Club 65!!

@PhilRiveraMedia 3 месяца назад

Spoiler for the one who is already dead....... . . . . . .. . . . . . . Sheridan was what I also thought, but it's actually Morden. Sheridan called Morden a dead man. He's the one that was the emissary of the Shadows and had Londo kept him alive, he could have learned everything about the Shadows and their minions and would have warned Londo about everything that was going on. Saving Morden could have prevented all of this, but he killed him out of anger and revenge. He didn't think about it and it cost him.

@la_scrittice_vita 3 месяца назад

It's not "actually" so much as "alternatively". JMS has said there are multiple interpretations that are valid. G'kar's eye that did not recognize Cartagia's glory and Londo who says "I don't understand" immediately after Lady Morella's line is another pair.

@chrisnielsen9885 3 месяца назад

I still have no idea what ‘boffed’ is supposed to mean. Sounds like the sort of thing an American would think a Brit would say but it’s really not

@chrism7395 3 месяца назад

Me neither, but i can infer from context in the same way i can guess what 'frak' means (they mean the same thing BTW - making the beast with two backs)

@robertdendooven7258 3 месяца назад

Boffed is American slang for having sex.

@chrisnielsen9885 3 месяца назад

@@chrism7395 ⁠I can’t decide if it’s supposed to mean snogged or shagged lol

@kirishima638 3 месяца назад

As a Brit, I’ve never heard this term either. ‘Decked’ would have been more appropriate.

@timamherst-clark2699 3 месяца назад

@@kirishima638 As a Brit, "Decked" surely means punched, hit, knocked to the floor/deck . . . ? That's absolutely NOT what Ivanova is implying here!