Bad Writing - Why Most Games Tell Bad Stories - Extra Credits 

"Nobody wants to read a huge block of text in a game." *Immediately pauses to read*

11 years later and I still vividly remember all of these videos. I remember in school, spending literal weeks straight watching the playlist of Extra Credits without pausing except to go to the bathroom. The amount of advice and information within these videos enticed my child mind completely and I attribute a lot of my views and practices for game development to Extra Credits. An honest thank you to everyone who worked on these videos to give me invaluable insight for over half a decade. I may have long moved on from this channel's content, but I certainly have not forgotten how great it used to be

We never did get that voice acting episode......

"10 minutes of dialogue in one hour of gameplay" Kojima: hold my movie endings

Been watching this channel for over 8 years. Can’t explain the nostalgia I feel watching this video. Thank you for the years of content you’ve provided.

We're going to start distributing our back catalog of episodes in more places over the next few months. Penny Arcade TV will still have exclusivity on the newest episodes, but you'll start seeing the classic ones on RU-vid, Blip and numerous others. Enjoy!

It's really strange to me that story is a secondary consideration in this industry. My game ideas usually start with some mechanics, but as soon as I start working on characters - usually the second thing I do - I start working out the story too. That way, I'm working on all parts at once, developing them together as one game, not as parts of a whole. I find it really hard to imagine trying to retroactively add a story to a game that's almost finished. That's like making a suit, then trying to find someone who fits in it, instead of making a suit to fit yourself.

Holy Crap- is this the first episode of ExtraCredits?

The guys who developed The Order 1886 ignored that last part of the video.

"Plot contradicts gameplay..." Almost every JRPG. So your character can summon demons and angels, reshape entire landscapes and slice a million objects into a billion pieces... But we can't get out of a fucking jail cell? NOPE.

Is... is this their first video? Have I finally explored every single aspect of this channel? Oh dear god...

I am so glad the channel hasn't deleted these videos! These are just amazing videos that we can only wish were still made today.

Can we address the unnoticed complexity of the laughing scene in FFX? There's actually a reason it's stilted. One other person has mentioned it here, but it happens at a point in the story where the group of adventurers has witnessed the entire destruction of a city and hasn't yet come to terms with it. The entire conversation is indicative of a sub-plot you don't find til later. Yuna asks Tidus to smile on their journey, because forcing that emotion is the only way to move on. She wants to bring happiness to Spira. It isn't til you find that Yuna will sacrifice herself to bring that happiness that Tidus is so upset. That entire moment must have been absurd to everyone else. Tidus was the only one that didn't know what was going to happen. God it drives me crazy when this moment is brought up as a moment of bad voice-acting when its intent was to be hollow. This is definitely one of the better moments of voice acting.

The very best environmental storytelling I have ever seen was in Dark Souls. In Anor Londo, the city of giant god-like beings, there is a cathedral castle thing. Before the entrance lies a staircase. Running in the middle of the staircase is a set of steps for beings about twice the size of humans, while squashed to the sides of the staircase are human-sized stairs. Think about that and all its implications. The devs could have just put Black Iron Tarkus there and made him say "the giants oppressed the humans" but instead they killed Tarkus ( the bastards) and made you examine stairs.

I am not a fan of Final Fantasy X, but the "bad acting" in that particular cut-scene was INTENTIONAL. They were FAKE LAUGHING in the cut-scene and it was SUPPOSED to be terrible. If you watch the remainder of the scene, you see they begin to laugh at their silliness and the voice acting goes back to "bearable". Yeesh.

This video is also known as 'Why Indie Games Have Better Storylines Compared to Most AAA Titles'

2:20 "the ever popular good or evil bar" is a one-dimensional moral choice meter with positive and negative values, not two-dimensional. I imagine someone else said this already but I'm late to the party.

Hidetaka miyazaki once said:"the narrative of your game should not be held captive by it's cutscenes","the greatest tool of narrative is the world you create for it to exist in" also he said:"a well designed world could tell it's story in silence".

I came back here after hearing that Dan was stepping down and I can't believe it's been so long. Hearing Dan's voice every week had become such a reliable part of my schedule that I didn't even notice how much it's changed over the years. Not only did the voice get better, but the pace of the narration and how engaging the show was improved so much. I'm looking forward to our new narrator and wish you guys all the best in your new endeavours. I can't wait for the Extra Frames series to come back!

Put the video on x0,5 speed.

Irks me that the infamous FFX scene is always the example for bad voice acting. They were forcing themselves to laugh ...

They introduced themselves and Alison was new? Good lord this video is old. Still good though.

SPEAKING OF BAD WRITING here we are 7 years later

A very good example where Narrative actually works and is done by a novelist is the first Max Payne game. Yes, it's full of pseudo-philosophy, one liners and "mature" content, but it really fits the action-shooter gameplay and the overall story. And the bits describing "Noir York City" are brillant, as they are scattered through ctuscenes, gameplay, artwork, television news, banter of NPCs, TV shows etc.

2:51 that's exactly the plot of "haiyore! nyaruko-san" o.o

James Taylor is a fantastic va and that scene in ffx as anybody who has actually played the game would know is done purposefully and fits the context of how characters are feeling. Tidus is literally forcing himself to laugh to show Yuna.

"You can't write a movie script the same way you would write a novel..." As someone who writes both stories and scripts for fun, I wish more people would understand this. "Just use the book for the script!!!!1!!" Please, please stop saying this.

Weird. I always thought that It was a rule in Final Fantasy that dying in combat just meant your characters were unconscious as a way to skirt around the disconnect between story and gameplay.

This was Game Theorists Inspiration And i did not know that. Thank you for making this videos

Show, don't tell.

I really do miss these episodes.

when he still had arms

Ace Attorney games could never work without great writing!

I feel like Kid Icarus Uprising and The Last of Us nailed this. The stories alone were fantastic, but the narrative and dialogue made the characters, environments, and mechanics pure gaming gold

"Video games are a fundamentally different medium from all other mass media to date. You can't just write for it using old techniques" Said no Kojima ever.

Imma be honest, I kinda miss when this series was the entire channel

Phoenix down heals unconsciousness. It doesn't revive the dead...

I'm surprised. THIS is Extra Credits Episode 1? Wow, it's just as good as the other ones! It's the first time i saw a show or channel being literally failproof even at the very beginning! Seriously, you guys are something i should have checked earlier.

"You can't write a fluffy game on the context of a gothic horror theme" Stubbs, the zombie? >XD

Thanks for the idea for Cthulu Dating Simulator.

What happened to you guys this is so nostalgic

"We could make an entire video on voice acting, and we probably will." (3:25) ... Soooooo... Where is it?

I'm so happy I found this channel. Great work guys, keep it up! x)

I decided to go back to the first extra credits video since the original three are now gone :(

What an effed-up process to bring in the writers near the very end of the game-creating process. Many people play games for the story. Few people play games only for gameplay, and those that do are usually playing sports or combat/fighting games.

I miss early Extra Credits.

2:50, this man called out Sucker for Love years before it even existed.

And here I was thinking I could go to college as a creative writing major and try and weasel myself into a game's development to help them fix up these terrible endings we've been getting.

Still waiting for a voice acting video... maybe some day.

come on the laughing in FF10 wasn't that bad. okay it was still pretty cringy but you know the point the scene was trying to make.

I love all the pieces of paper that just say 'no' in this video, really speaks to the soul

I've been watching a lot of your videos over time, and I was scrolling through the videos to find history videos for my teacher. I got down to the bottom and wanted to see the difference between this video and your current videos. The improvement as a channel is amazing, I really think you should show some of your beginning and current changes in a video. Perhaps you could ask for suggestions on what people would like to see improved with the channel. Either way, nice job, you guys really fixed it up! :)

What I wish they would do after every episode is give a short list of games that do [insert video topic] exceptionally well. I know they have a few games scattered throughout but I'd really love to see a "Top 3" list or something. Love your stuff guys. I've been on a recent Extra Credits binge, and I'm no where close to a Game Designer.

kinda suprised that this channel was what inspired game theory

i respect your videos so much. so original yet clearly so well executed. excellent writing for this video that is for sure ;)

man, this show has come a LONG way since this keep up the good work guys!

I wish someday you talk about Ludonarrative Dissonance, and how to detect it while we play games and trying to stay on its narrative.

Where it all started. Good luck on your next great adventure, Dan.

I've got a project planned for this summer for making a game, because you know, school is over and stuff. My plan was to write a sort of book before coding the game but this helped me realize that there is so much more than just a good story, the game also has to tell it too using your so called "mechanics". Good video :P

Well, starting my second run of your video playlist. Gonna be another long week. Need things to keep my working and stuff to think about. You guys should put out the audio files for these so I can listen at work.

When you mentioned W40K Dawn of War for conveying narrative, I could only think of one thing... "Rhinos? RHINOS?! Our enemies hide in METALH BAWKSES the cowards! The fools! Ah... we shall take away their METALH BAWKSES!!!" But then again, the Soulstorm expansion is only really known for its narm charm. It's definitely not of the same caliber as the original game and its previous expansions or the sequel and its expansions. (Though even then Dawn of War isn't the best example of narrative in Warhammer 40,000 when you compare it to the tabletop wargame)

the entire Mother (Earthbound) series is built around narrative.

When he said a memo from the marketing department all I could see is tombstone from Spiderman

I've finally made it to the end of the Extra Credits Playlist!!! Woo!!! Amazing, brilliant, informative, entertaining and fantastic series, Subbed and shared! Keep up the incredible work guys, i love it :D

This entire Video unfortunately doesn't explain why Kingdom hearts 3 has one of the worst writing possible, even with all the time and money in the world.

4 years since this has been posted... Still waiting for that voice acting episode...

I find these old episodes much more charming than the more recent ones...I don’t really know why...

I really wanted that next blood rayne game just because the final scene was so cool the concept of being in a bunker with machine guns shooting down hordes of vampire creatures is amazing.

Watching the 1st episode as Dan left in 2018...the nostalgia.

Ah, I gotta say that the Dawn of War games are really great. They do a fantastic job of giving all the units a unique feel. One of my favorite quotes from DOW2... "SHOW ME WHAT PASSES FOR FURY AMONG YOUR MISBEGOTTEN KIND!" that just screams Space Marine to me...

These videos are amazing guys! I hope to break into the industry some day as either a game artist or designer and I have found your knowledge and your questions posed quite valuable. ...but,on a slightly unrelated note can you post where you found the Big Band version of that song played in the ending credits! Thanks,

You know . . . . . . I'm sad 😔

And so. A legend began.

THE LAUGH WAS SUPPOSED TO BE BAD. Come on, Extra Credits!

I've been slowly going through this large catalogue of videos and I've been thoroughly enjoying myself ever since I started.

I've just recently subscribed to the channel and wanted to go back and watch from the beginning. I enjoy hearing games discussed in a different perspective, than being purely from the gamer standpoint. I would love to become a game designer myself - as I'm sure many gamers would. Anyway, enough about my rambling, great video. For a great game, every piece has to build from the narrative, the story that the game wants to tell us and make us a part of. Well said. :)

the humble beginnings

That's my problem with Uncharted 2. The cutscenes show a laid-back funny guy that's in for some exploration and treasure hunting, the gameplay presents a soldier that kills anyone that crosses his way without even thinking about and never showing any sign of remorse. That really threw me off of what could be a fantastic game. I still haven't played Uncharted 4 and I'm pretty sure they fixed that, considering what they did with The Last of Us, but I still can't get over that.

It's great! It's just awesome to know I'm not the only Dane who's watching these videos, they're so awesome. Keep it up :D

Man I'm so glad i re found you guys when you left the escapist I was at a bit of a loss

The pitching on Dan's voice back then is quite jarring when you've become used to how it is now. o_O

The last of us 2...:(

The question now is how? How do you do all these things?

Brilliant. More people should watch this. And understand it! It is true that video game storytelling is still very new, but a lot of the same mistakes are still being made in TV and film writing, because writing is still somehow a wildly underrated skill. Too few people understand that it is the backbone of every fictional experience, without which everything else around it - artwork, music, mechanics - simply collapses.

Ace Attorney and Danganronpa have a good story along with a good gameplay

Man, am I the only one who read all the long text in games, like I have read nigh every book in Skyrim, all the codex entries in Mass Effect and Dragon Age. The text blocks are great for when you need a break.

So sad to see so many games still fail to understand this

I loved Alison Theus' art waaay back in like 2002 so finding out she is the artist here is crazy

What happened to this narrator, miss him

Phoenix downs cure the K.O. status. FF characters don't die in battle.

Now I want to see a light fluffy script written for a game with a gothic horror aesthetic

I love your channel. And your series. Quality content on RU-vid, I've finally found you.

Be-holed the date when a legend was born

miss 2012 memes in videos (no i dont)

Can we please have episodes avaible via itunes? I watch most of your episodes on my phone the first time, and love showing them to co-workers at breaks and lunch - it's a great way to break the monotony at work. the ability to download and have all of them available at a moment's notice would be invaluable when discussing games with my friends at work - and discuss some of the important topics you have covered in the past.

Good episode. I always liked games that tell stories while you are still playing it rather than in cut scenes. Also loved the DoW 2 shout out. Love that game.

Huh... this is actually really weird because a ton of the games I have said in the past have bad stories, actually have a really amazing narrative. and because of this immersion of the areas and the lore of the land... they continue to be my favorite games. because it's still such a blast to be in that world. Take for example a level in the first few spyro games (2 or 3 are easier) and the stories are simple. Spyro the Dragon: Treasure's taken, everyone else is crystalized. get all the things in all the worlds Spyro 2: Ripto's Rage/ Gateway to Glimmer: Spyro tries to go on vacation, has to collect orbs to get home. Spyro: Year of the Dragon: All of the dragon eggs are stolen, find them all. Simplistic stories that can be summed up in a single bound but if you try explaining in detail about what you do in every world, it becomes a sloppy mess. But if you "read" each world as it's own story or chapter, it becomes a huge expansive and lore rich environment that just delivers in much more than the scarce dialog can provide. Part of the reason was because of memory issues and partly because it was a way to show parts of the strange universe that the game takes place in.

Dark souls did this

I’m from the future and it still feels new

Really cool video. My dream is to one day write for the video game industry and this video has made me reevaluate what that is. Still want to do it.