Banana Rumble: Neither Disappointed, nor Surprised 

To be fair, the physics are programmed in a fundamentally different way to the extent where I the acceleration of the analogue stick boundaries won’t compensate for it. Even when tilting the board forward you can tell momentum is handled very differently in Banana Mania, which breaks certain stages. Wish I had the comparison video URLs handy but they do a good job examining the changes.

Yeah the DLC is pretty gross, the fact that a character pack in Monkey Ball costs as much as the entire Booster Course pass for Mario Kart 8 is abhorrent. I didn't even know there was a battle pass, that is both hilarious and sad

@@SodaCrab Yeah, especially because all you're really getting is a skin (and from the fact that characters that aren't the main cast aren't able to be customized, I assume the same is for them too...). I visibly jaw dropped when I saw the battle pass. It's pretty easy to get the points on it but I still hate that it's here. Here's to hoping SEGA doesn't pull a Crash Nitro Fueled tactic and make this pass paid down the line.

@@emme0731 i gotta agree there, idk why they're making the sega stud paid dlc this go around. Or dlc at all when it was unlockable both previous times, save for the actual consoles. Odd choice for sure

the lead is doing Yakuza

Wii Pro Controller should work just fine! Just about anything with a control stick will do the job. I prefer the Gamecube controller but that's mostly just because it's what I'm used to.

@@SodaCrab I heard that the GC controller was better, so wanted to make sure. I was wanting to try the Banana Mania, since is the most convenient, but even the reviews that likethe game say that the control aren't the same. This is what makes Monkey Balls special, so I alweys psuh the game for later. Now i don't even know if it is worthy anymore and will have to rely on emulation to enjoy the game.

I emulate them on my Steam Deck and the controls work great. GameCube has the octagon shape stick so it would be easier to move forward.

Fr, he complains about the spindash being useless but there’s SO MANY times in this video where he could use the spindash to get somewhere quicker but his dumbass thinks there’s no other way to win outside of slowly rolling towards the goal

@@dr_drew_I agree that’s a weird thing to complain about when there’s been a history of complaints about modern monkey ball being gimmicky with their new mechanics such as jumping in banana blitz. I’m glad most levels don’t force you to use the spin dash.

Wait hold on, you're cooking with that idea. How has no one done this yet??

and all i ask is for you to git gud

You got new stages, you got new modes, you got new story, you got new art style, but the deal breaker is the physics??? I agree I miss the old physics but at some point you just need to let that go bc it’s never coming back.

​@@xanander4693 My point is that it's not bad because it's different. Those are all good things you listed about the game, but they're all brought down because the movement system doesn't feel or control as well as before. The only reason it's never coming back is because RGG can't be bothered to put in the effort, and unfortunately people shrug it off as simply a nostalgia issue. On a separate note, I haven't seen a single person ever say they genuinely prefer the new physics. Nobody would complain if they kept that the same.

@@thebigpig2364 I think the movement and physics are fine as is. The levels are built around them and it flows very well (apart from the final stage in world 10). I agree with you that everyone would rather have the old physics and it does make me wonder why a huge gaming company with allegedly talented programmers can’t make a better physics engine. However, Banana Rumble is still amazing regardless and I’m happy the franchise is still getting games.

The problem isn't the engines themselves and more that people once had to write the physics from scratch and that tends to result in making the physics from the ground up to fit the game while a lot of modern developers with lower budgets just don't have the time and use the god awful character controllers in something like Unity because they just simply don't have the time to make something from scratch. Monkey Ball reuses the Banana Blitz framework for all the games so far because the developers are probably completely overworked people that need to get it done in the deadline so they just reuse the physics engine again and use the spin dash as a surprisingly well working alternative. People always blame Unity and Unreal but there are great 3d platformers and physics based games on these platforms. They are tools and you need people who know how to use these tools and the time to polish them and the game industry through constantly firing people for higher profits and tighter deadlines absolutely ruin both.

@@what12388 Whatever's case things has to change, because they won't get my money if the games they release don't even feel right. The controls shouldn't be inferior to 20+ years old games.

The engines actually have almost nothing to do with these issues, the physics and controls are customized/written by the developers. The only physics issue I've seen that actually is affected by the engine is the Unity 50hz problem, which is only caused by a bad default setting and can be easily changed

You’re not as smart as you think you are. The average person isn’t “coddling” companies. Sega made a game, ppl like the game, ppl buy it. It’s how it works. No one would have bought banana rumble if it was bad, I certainly wouldn’t. Just don’t buy the game if you don’t like it.

thats exactly my thoughts.

I know this is exactly why i hate paper mario fans, paper mario the origami king is an amazing game but most fans said its a great first step to just being thousand year door...

@@diddly_dude yeah for what it’s worth I really liked Origami King. I still think the original formula for Paper Mario is better, what with it having more RPG mechanics like levelling and badges, but most complaints I see towards OK are just how it’s not TTYD. Maybe the next true Paper Mario will be a best of both worlds between the modern and classic style, but I think OK will still on its own even if that happens.

Well for a small project with small dev team within RGG 2 years kinda enough full dev started around spring of 2022. Plus the fact it is 51 people within SEGA/RGG worked on this game.

That's what so many people said about Sonic Frontiers, but I've waited far too long since Generations for another 3D game to be a "step in the right direction" when it's not even higher than a 6 at best

@@diddly_dude People aren’t saying that. They’re saying it’s a mediocre game that’s a alright first step in the right direction compared to previous games, but still not good. It’s not an amazing game.

Don’t let game companies scare or shame you into giving them money. They’ll do anything other than make a great game.

That's exactly what I was thinking during the "step in the right direction" talk. Not saying I disagree - Hell, I'm probably gonna wait for a sale before I get the game - but with Sega's history of shelving games and being a gamble when they choose not to, it's easy to think: "Well, if we don't take this, the series is fucked", which I'm pretty sure was the Magic Bullet behind Banana Blitz HD. Of course, seeing as we're still dealing with the same physics engine since 2019, if we do get more games without waiting long, who's to say it'll even be like the old days?

I don't think you have to worry about that with Donkey Kong. Its rare enough for him to get a new game regardless, but they will never shelve their first big IP. The DKC trilogy did great, but the series still went away for awhile because no one seemed interested to make the games, Rare went on to other stuff (including DK64, but that game's reception isn't the reason for few DK games afterwords), and the rest of Nintendo were busy with other things (though there were a few spinoffs here and there). Same thing is happening now, Retro is done with DK after Returns/Tropical Freeze, and no one else at Nintendo seems to be interested in making it so the series is on a break. This is also the reason Metroid had a break until Federation Force/Samus Returns on 3DS. Retro finished their Prime trilogy and wanted to move onto DKC and other things, and Sakamoto was busy with his other series (primarily Wario and Rhythm heaven, but also bringing back Famicom Detective Club). So its not really certain that Other M actually affected the release schedule of Metroid games, when its possible that the series was headed towards hiatus anyways, as it always did in the past, even if Other M was a success. Now Star Fox for sure was shelved, no doubt about that unfortunately, and even Metroid could have been. However; DK, like Mario, will last forever I'm sure.

As a Sonic fan I can empathize by having a very particular gold standard for physics. But I wouldn't wish that curse on anyone, and I'm glad I don't have that for Monkey Ball so I can actually enjoy these games. I had no idea Monkey Ball purists are like Melee fans.

Thank you for leaving such a well thought out comment! I want to clarify a few things: I get that a lot of people don't take issue with the way the game handles the way I do. But my critique of this game's controls and physics isn't "this is different from before, I don't like that", it's "this feels bad, which is bizarre because they had it feeling great 20 years ago". Even in a vacuum, in a world in which Monkey Ball 1 and 2 never existed, this game wouldn't magically feel better in my hands. I play sequels of games I love every day, sequels that feel vastly different from their originals, in a number of different genres. Mario Kart 8, for example, feels extremely different from Mario Kart Double Dash, the one I grew up with. Double Dash feels great, it has aged fantastically , they really nailed it with how racing feels in that game. If I had this arbitrary hatred of change, that would mean Mario Kart 8 feeling different would be a huge issue for me. But it's not, Mario Kart 8 is a beautiful game, both in terms of aesthetic and gameplay. I like it even more than Double Dash, despite my "Gamecube muscle memory" from an entire childhood of playing it over and over. Every Mario Kart feels different, but they still feel great in their own ways. Same with Smash Bros, I grew up playing Brawl alone, with friends, and with family, it was one of the most played games in my childhood, but I vastly prefer Ultimate these days. If change was a bad thing for me, I'd still be playing Brawl. This is true with almost every series I play, Fire Emblem, XCOM, Pikmin, Yakuza, I like the new ones just as much if not more than the old ones despite the myriad changes that completely flip the way the games play and feel on its head. Monkey Ball is the only series where I have this problem. It's not some weird inability to let go of the past, I genuinely just do not like the way the new games feel. It's not like they need to just make more Monkey Ball 2, I can play more Monkey Ball 2 whenever I want, there are dozens of fan made level packs out there. I'm fine with them doing new and different things. The problem is just that the physics feel cheap and unpolished, I don't know how else I can say it. It's not bad because it's not Monkey Ball 1 and 2, it just feels bad by itself, the Monkey Ball 1 and 2 comparison simply exists to point out "they did something great 20 years ago, why can't they make something that feels as good?". "As good" doesn't have to mean "the exact same", it just has to be of the same level of polish and quality, which I believe Banana Rumble is not. Despite me still not liking it much, I like this game a hell of a lot more than Banana Mania, which is a game I went into with high hopes and the belief that it would be great. But I ended up not liking that game at all. I played Yakuza 0, another game by this same studio, for the first time 5 or 6 years ago, and I went into that game expecting to not really care for it. Yet I ended up enjoying the hell out of it and it's one of my favorite games I've ever played. Having expectations going into the game doesn't preclude the game from deviating from them. Banana Rumble just happened to meet my expectations, which makes sense, considering I had 2 games of precedent on the Switch to base my expectations on. I didn't decide to like or dislike Banana Rumble before I played it, I played it and determined I didn't like it, and I really don't understand why this whole "you expected it to be bad" thing is always so prominent in discourse about new games. Obviously there's no way to definitively beat the "you wanted it to be bad" allegations without somehow giving you all a peek inside of my head, but I'm telling you, I didn't go in wanting to dislike this game. As for the Spindash, I don't see how the game is built around it. I really don't. That's my biggest problem with the feature. There are some shortcuts littered throughout, and there are some levels built around it, but a lot of levels are just not conducive to launching yourself off in any direction. I even wrote in my notes while I was playing this game sometime around world 5 "this game barely feels like it was designed with the spindash in mind". I think the fact that I completed most of the game while barely using the spindash is really telling, it should be important, I should be incentivized to want to use it, but most of the time it just felt safer or more efficient to just not touch the B button. When I think of a game that's built around a central new mechanic, I think Mario Sunshine, so let's use that as an example. That game lives and dies by Fludd (yes, people do challenge runs without him, but the whole reason that's a challenge run is because it's outside the scope of what the developers intended and what the game's design heavily encourages.) You're using Fludd constantly without even thinking about it. Hovering becomes second nature early on, before long it feels less like an additional action you have to perform and more like a natural extension of Mario's jump. Spraying water is something you immediately learn to try as a solution to any problem, whether it's graffiti, an object in the environment, or an enemy. When the game takes Fludd away from you for a secret level, his absence is felt in every move you make. The game feels entirely different trying to platform without him. Mario Sunshine is Fludd, and Fludd is Mario Sunshine. The Spindash is nothing like that. 99% of levels are easily completed without it, and tons of levels aren't conducive to its use. Sure, if you get really experienced with Banana Rumble, like a speedrunner would, you could learn to take full advantage of it, but for most people who will play through this game once, twice, a few times, then maybe pick it up again once every 6 months, the spindash is neither intuitive nor widely applicable. Even if I'm wrong and literally every other person who has played this game makes HEAVY use of the spindash, the fact that I was able to beat the game easily and efficiently while not really getting the point of it is telling about its importance as a central mechanic. Imagine if I went from 64 to Sunshine and just went, "huh, I don't really get this whole fludd thing", then beat the game without it. That doesn't scream "the game is designed around it" to me. I didn't go into this game clinging to the past and unwilling to evaluate what the new game provides; the general uselessness and hollowness of the spindash IS my evaluation of this game's new feature. And regarding the level design comment at 9:15, I didn't say that most of the levels are like that. I said a lot of levels fall into either the "waiting" or "path" categories. And there are a lot of these levels. Just off of the top of my head, for levels with tons of waiting involved, there's the elevator level I used on screen during that part of the video, there's the first level of world 10 where you're sitting there waiting for the platforms to rotate in such a way that you can move forward, there's that stage in world 9 where it drops you off at those 2 platforms to press switches and you have to wait for the rotating arms to come pick you back up and take you to the next switch, and more. Those are just off the top of my head, there were a lot more levels that involved lots of waiting around for the level to come pick you up. For the "path" levels, the early game is absolutely loaded with these, just some kind of variation on a straight path with different turns, curves, or trivial obstacles. There are fewer of them as the game goes on (they still pop up from time to time though), but a huge amount of the remaining levels that DON'T fall into one of these two camps are obnoxious or boring gimmicks. Like I'm still stuck on this, what was going on with that Manhole level?? Who thought that was a good idea? Or the binary level in the candy world? Or these weird maze levels like the pyramid, the switch maze with the holes in the floor in world 8, or that level called switch adventure in world 9? So many levels stuck out as bad to me in this game, and a lot of the ones that didn't were very boring and lackluster. I'm not saying every level in this game is trash, I just think the overall level quality hovers around a 5 or 6 out of 10, and the few 9s or 10s sprinkled throughout don't go far enough to make up for that overall boring mix. At the end of the day the level quality subjective, but I definitely wouldn't call my statement a lie, there are a surprising amount of levels that fit into one of those two camps. Sorry for the large wall of text, your comment just encompasses a lot of common complaints I anticipated and have already seen, and it seems what you're saying resonates with a lot of people, so I figured I'd respond. I appreciate your comment and your constructive criticism!

​​@@SodaCrab​While the spin-dash isn't something that's forced to be used, i still think it was a great adition because of the shortcut options it added Even as a casual monkey ball player that has only played 1, banana mania and this game, i was able to use it for shortcuts in almost every stage i played For example, the stage shown in 17:41, with a spin-dash, you're able to fly directly to the goal Or the stage 18:54, with a good time spin-dash + dash panels you can take the top of the rings instead

As someone person who hasn't played SMB2 since the 00s and has only clocked in to monkey ball discourse after banana blitz HD came out, comparing it to competetive melee players and pretty much everyone else that plays the series, is a pretty spot on comparison, looking in from the relative outside. The actual core of the series is still pretty neatly intact and they aren't releasing embarrassments in game dev or anything. It just feels slightly different from some folks fav from 20 years ago, sure, fair thing to be annoyed with. But i feel it gets taken to degrees i can only rationalized as being played up for entertainment reasons in videos

For multiplayer this game does suck lol there’s no turn based or competitive main mode multiplayer . It really lacks as a casual party game. Think the only people who are praising this game so much, only play single player.. why are there no red or green Goals anymore? So much steps backwards

A ghost crew team recreated Monkey Ball's physics in a steam game called Rolled Out! The game is still in beta and nobody knows when or if the game will get a full release, but it's $20 and worth every penny to have a new experience with old school physics and level design. We have all been gaslit.

I would never say that, that is Sinister Shadow Shrimp Crustaceus propaganda

I can understand that point of view, and I can't really disprove your point without somehow giving you a glimpse inside my head, but I mean it when I say that I try to go into every game I play with an open mind and give it a fair shake. I've played plenty of games that I expected to be great and ended up disappointed with, and I've been pleasantly surprised by plenty of games too. Banana Mania is an example of a game I went into with high expectations and was disappointed with. I set my expectations more reasonably for Banana Rumble, and lo and behold it ended up more or less meeting them. Sometimes a game just ends up being exactly what you expect, that doesn't necessarily mean I went in rooting against it. I'm glad you're getting enjoyment out of it though!

@@SodaCrabclassy response

You’re acting like a gun is being held to your head and being forced to buy these games you clearly don’t like

to a certain extent you kinda have to be at least a little grateful. id personally prefer more Monkey ball than no monkey Ball, so i support the choice the devs made it buy voting with my wallet. its the biggest way to incentivize a company I see it more as a two way street, they make the thing and we buy the thing if we want (and or return/refund it if we dont. its the main reason i like physical copies), and if the thing does well and sells enough, they're slightly more incentivized to make something with it again. If Banana Blitz and Mania completely flopped then there would be a much smaller chance for a future game in the series since logic would show that it would be a waste of funding,time,man power, and funding. I appreciate a step in the right direction more than the franchise dying in the water entirely. as much as i'd want another Sonic Mania esque hit, there isn't much i can do other than throw them a bone when the product is decent,playable and fun.

I appreciate the polite response. Personally, I prefer nothing over something underwhelming. When a series has nothing coming out, you can still have the hope of one day getting a game that blows your socks off. But when a series has medicore output, then you’re not only unsatisfied with what’s currently out but it also becomes hard to become excited for the future of the series. I get where you’re coming from though. It’s novel to see a dormant series come back again, regardless of the quality of output. It’s even more exciting if you personally enjoy the content (which hey, more power to you).

@@red7078 Fair enough. I can certainly agree that a Mediocre game is an overall net loss just due to how it lowers the series. Obviously i still hold out hope for Monkey Ball to have more improvement after the aforementioned Babysteps. but ultimately time has to do its thing and theres not much i can do other than hope for the Dev team to improve in the future. Would be pretty insane to see a 'Sonic Mania' esque scenario with this series(AKA fans making a whole ass game), since i've heard/seen good things when it comes to the level packs.

@@Swarming-Languendo sega has a bad habit of making terrible content and then overcorrecting in the wrong direction when the audience doesn't want to put up with it. oh the monkey ball fans didn't like the last few games? then clearly monkey ball is a dead franchise unless we reach a certain profit quota on banana blitz HD. the monkey ball fans didn't want a remake of banana blitz? okay, let's remake the first two games. no we don't need to polish the physics engine, the graphics, the party games, or the story mode. the fans will buy it as long as it has the stages from SMB 1 and 2. it's not quite as bad as the sonic franchise overcorrecting itself, but you can kinda tell it still happens. my point is that i think sega has a hard time understanding that sometimes their ideas are great but we just want them to put more time and effort into them so that they don't turn out half-baked. that's the problem with voting with your wallet. i'll end up buying this game anyway because a decent brand new monkey ball game is basically a dream come true at this point.

I'd never heard of Marble It Up until just now! It looks awesome, I bought it immediately since it's on sale. Thanks for the recommendation! I'll have to make a video comparing different Monkey Ball-likes sometime!

@@SodaCrab You're welcome! Your videos are good content and i am a big fan of Super Monkey Ball too! 🙂

In a lot of ways Rolled Out is the best Monkey Ball ever, but it’s just completely broken

@@SodaCrabthe “monkey ball guy” allegations will never die.

That's what she said

It speaks to the quality of Super Monkey Ball 1 and 2 that people are still praising them so religiously after almost two decades since their original release. That's something most games don't receive the privilege of. I doubt Monkey Ball Banana Rumble will be an exception to this. It's a flavor of the month that people will forget about once the next thing they're excited about comes out. It has no longevity.

and hes right

Noooooooo! I love the style sm. I’m sorry you don’t feel the same 😢

​@@xanander4693I'm sorry you dont prefer the classic look

@@twincherries6698 I like the classic look too!

same! the customization is great

I think these are the best these funny little monkeys have ever looked. I love them so much!

I'm glad you're enjoying it and you're getting what you wanted out of it!

​@SodaCrab I know this is kinda off topic but what are your thoughts on Sonic x shadow generations?

nowhere to dash to when you're just waiting for an elevator, unfortunately

@@SodaCrab I saw multiple parts on the video where you could have used the dash to shortcut. Instead of thinking it is a spin-dash, imagine it's like playing pool.

I remember the old story mode was a days-long adventure as a kid because I was so bad at it. Now it’s 1.5 hours at most. I still replay it all the time.

@@thebigpig2364 SMB2 story mode was a years-long adventure for me, although I got the game when I was like 5 lol. Nowadays I can beat story mode in an afternoon, it’s the challenge mode that keeps me coming back time and time again. Just a shame they chose to shun that core part of the series here, because these relatively solid/good looking levels deserve the chance for the player to form a connection with them

You can, if you haven't played the originals, then you won't be spoiled by the better controls. Banana Rumble is still a fun game, and if it interests you, I'd say go for it.

its a good game and youll probably like it. dont let one person disliking it out of the hundreds of other people who have said they like it discourage you from trying it

@@NigelMelanisticSmith i'd say i was totally spoiled by the better controls/physics, unfortunately. i played the original a ton as a kid lol

@@merideri my bad, I misread and only saw GBA. Up to you then. I'm enjoying the multi-player, and like mentioned in the video, there'll definitely be a price drop at some point to make the decision easier.

@@NigelMelanisticSmith ahh, i see. yeah, i think i might just wait for a price drop.

Yeah I think that's what gets me about it. Having both would make it a net good, but having it replace turn-based makes it come down to preference, which doesn't really seem necessary.

I think someone else said its because they are using Unity Engine (I think it was that one) which is notoriously bad for physics as it can't calculate physics fast enough, which is why the Monkey Ball games now feel slower and you slow down quicker. So its the fact that they are coding on an engine not built for this type of gameplay but trying to force it to work anyways. So yeah, they are working under a lot of limitations unfortunately.

I like them fine (tho I don't get why they gave Aiai overalls), and are handled quite well in the cutscenes, but is it crazy that I actually enjoyed the late 2000's-2010's designs?

Banana Splitz on the PS Vita imo came pretty close to matching the original 2 games but sadly it was stuck on a system not a lot of people cared about

Didn't you hear what Soda Crab said? If he didn't like that game, that's his opinion, and I respect it. However, don't let his opinion be your verdict if you'll like the game or not. Read the comment section here, There are plenty of new users and returning Monkey Ball veterans who enjoy the game. Look into other videos, hear what others are saying, and come to your own conclusion if you think you'll enjoy the game or not.

​@@minimushroom3715 reviews are a good reference point, but at the end of the day there's only so much you can consider "objective". that's why I still hate IGN for making me buy Pokémon Sword because they gave that hateful thing a 9 OUT OF 10 for some reason.

@@squiddu Oh very true. That game from what I heard had potential, but I could tell from even looking at a few images that the game was very rushed. Anyway, if they emulate Monkey Ball 1 and 2 instead for whatever reasons they have, alright then. I bought the game recently, and I'm having a blast speed-running through the levels. But if people conclude they don’t want to play the game at the end of the day, that’s cool with me.

That is incredibly based

About that...(only for a limited time, but still)

:)

It's me, I'm the monkey

Nothing is free ☹️