Battle of the Falkland Islands - Von Spee's Last Stand 

In your opinion, what was Admiral Von Spee best option?

Here is one question ,what if due to some unforseen circomstances , the netherlands join the new german state in 1860s How would the german navy have unfolded.

I was reading about the Royal Navy development in the 20th century till the 50s. There were several conclusions made by the writers 1. The Royal Navy was wrong not to scrap or sell the existing carriers and replace them with Malta class. 2. The Royal Navy was wasteful to build the R class. The theory being that they were to win an arms race already won. They should have built more Queen Elizabeth's instead. 3. The pre ww2 modernisation program was badly organised. 4. The King George Vths were a waste of resources and those should have been delayed to modernise existing ships. Do you agree, disagree with any of these? Please don't throw binoculars at me...

The german Amored Cruisers seemed to have lastes pretty long against superior and much more modern Battlecruisers, who expended a lot of their main ammo stock to sink the German cruisers. What was the reason for this? Quality of British shells? Poor Gunnery? Pretty sturdy German ships? A combination of things? And what was the british reaction to the german amored cruisers lasting so long and the need to expend such a wast amount of amunition?

Your battle series are the best. How about one with the Korean admiral that smoked the Japanese in battle after battle?

Awwwwwkwaaaaard!

@@mdiciaccio87 Similarly, after the Battle of the North Cape, Admiral Fraser sent out a message that went like "If any of you finds yourself faced with overwhelming odds, I hope that you conduct yourself as well as the _Scharnhorst_ did today."

Although being relieved to have fought a battle & won is most understandable. It is never a good thing to celebrate the misfortune of your enemies, especially considering that misfortune could just as easily have been your own. And that misfortune can easily come visit you for celebrating such things!!! Also, war is never a good thing. In war all types of people die, good & evil, honorable & maybe not so honorable. But when faced with kill or be killed, it's not like you can get to know that person before you are faced with having to kill them.

Because it's Royal Navy, not Primate Navy

There is a fact that after Coronel, von Spee was toasted with a similar toast versus the English. He said much the same thing.

Not just that but a sail powered vessel coming across a fight between at least two modern steam powered battlecruisers and a pair of modern armoured cruisers both from countries with a reasonably close relationship with no context whatsoever, it must have seemed like the world was ending.

Wonder if they thought it was the flying dutchman

Just remembered they left the baguette oven on back home

Whew,you know they were,"run Forrest,run"!!!

​@@purplefood1 At least a pair?!

Can you imagine how the poor sailors on that ship felt seeing that? They're in this archaic wooden hulk that pretty much goes where the wind tells it to go and they wind up sailing straight towards a battle like that....poor guys would've been scared out of their wits! There's also the issue of figuring out how to get around a battle like that - the wind would only give them noteworthy speed in a fairly narrow arc (generally not bad if there's a decent wind to work with, but much more limited than the steamers whose only wind issue was one of visibility).

@@rashkavar I believe a similar incident occurred during the battlecruiser action at Jutland, with a schooner sailing between the two squadrons.

It's somewhat of a foreshadowing of some of the Russian villages the Germans captured during Operation Barbarossa. No resistance at all, just a bunch of Russian peasants in traditional clothing watching the German tanks. Then the elder timidly approaches a German officer and, through an interpreter, asks if the "Little Father" - the Tsar - was a war with Germany. Shock and denial upon being told that the Tsar and his entire family were dead, executed in Yekaterinburg more than twenty years before.

@@christopherreed4723 did you make up that story, as I'm not sure how that is even possible

@@Alex-cw3rz No. It's out of either Panzer Aces or Infantry Aces by Franz Kurowski, iirc. I have both, but it's been a while since I read them.

Still better than facing down Kongo and Hiei

And he faced it with great courage and dignity.

"A prayer, Mr Saavik, Klingons don't take prisoners. Lights."

In *Star Trek* it was the “Kobayshi Maru” test.

Prequel to other events too. Somebody disturbs hornets nest in South Atlantic and Brits send 9k km range bomber on target 6.3k km away to deal with it.

River Plate too

and the super duper uber mega german ships got a massive brazzers without hitting any RN unit.

We have dispatched His Majesty's Ships Curmudgeonly, Irascible, Quite Cross, Apoplectic, and Right I've Had Enough Of This.

@@stanrogers5613 unfortunately the rest of the I-class - Irritable, Indignant, and Incensed - were on duty elsewhere

Emphasis on "explosive".

Even then, it was more due to the imbecile Beatty’s squadron completely ignoring all ammunition handling safety procedures. Had they done the job properly, would this still even be a conversation?

Agreed - also note that the presence of HMAS Australia in the Indian Ocean may Von Spee move into the Pacific away from the trade routes - which is exactly what a battle cruisers was supposed to do.

Agreed, but a pair of cruisers can do the same job just about as cheaply. Part of the reason the US Navy never completed a battlecruiser.

@@stuartdollar9912 The Alaska-class cruisers basically were battlecruisers in all but name, but yes, pretty much. After HMS Hood was built, the British adopted that philosophy as well (cruisers, cruisers, more cruisers, all the cruisers), although Hood was more like a fast battleship than an actual battlecruiser. A battlecruiser was still an invaluable weapon of war in WW1, mind you, so long as they were used properly. And honestly, it's just as well that the Americans converted the Lexingtons. They made far better fleet carriers than battlecruisers.

Can white sails double for white flags? I like to imagine the crew on the bridge of the respective warships receiving reports of a potential new combatant having a chuckle when it's identified as a sail boat.

Captain: I hope the friendly side wins. First Officer: Which side is that? Captain: I don't know, so lets be elsewhere.

If the French ship left port in July they knew about the assassination of Franz Ferdinand (June 28).

@@stanleyrogouski I guess their reaction then was, "Boy! That escalated quickly!"

@@stanleyrogouski "Gee, that's terrible, but there's no way that will cause a four year long global war that causes over twenty million deaths." What happened next was a four year long global war that caused over twenty million deaths.

At best he could have stopped in Spain to be interned

@@johnlavery3433 I was thinking more of the Caribbean Sea.

As that old line goes; "ours is not to wonder why. Ours is to do or die. "😔

His best chance would have been to skip the Falklands run Gibraltar at night and make it to turkey

@@jakobming4831 There was still one battle cruiser in the Mediterranean, Indomitable, I think, that was standing by the Dardenelles in case of a sortie by Goeben. So possibly if von Spee was able to get past Gibraltar cleanly (unlikely) he would still have to run the whole length of the Mediterranean, with British and French assets, and then face Indomitable. Perhaps a move by Goeben back out into the Agean sea would have occupied Indomitable, but it was around that time that Goeben hit a Russian mine off the Bosphorus and was damaged. The damage was severe enough that the Goeben was thought to be a last forlorn hope in the sea of Marmara if the British & French had succeeded in penetrating the Dardenelles in March 1915. Without assistance from Goeben von Spee would have been driving towards Indomitable with the French and British Mediterranean fleets hard on his tail. After the Goeben fiasco at the start of the war the British would have no doubt as to where von Spee was heading after he was in the Mediterranean. So while a move to Constantinople might have been less suicidal than trying to run the Grand Fleet, I still think it would have failed.

Now, of course, the restored SS Great Britain is in Great Western Dockyard, Bristol, UK.

@@Wombat1916 whichis the dock that she was built. Very worth a visit if you're in the area

Bit like donzit.

Absolutely devastating, kind of like the commanding General for the Japanese in the Russo Japanese War, both his sons died under his command during the war, he and his wife committed Sepuku together three years after the war.

i remember reading about it. Heinrich and otto

Stay strong, Brother. You will get through this................

Not to respond with some bland cliche-ridden coat of false bonhomie; you have company. You may feel horrible now, but the time that passed and led you to feel worse will pass and something better will turn up. And ask for help and bring a new face into your life. El luta continua.

My week has been worse. I was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes on September 29th and I am only 18 years old. But my family and youtube helps me adjust to this new reality of my life.

In my prayers tonight brother .

I'm sorry to hear of your misfortunes, but I'm glad that this channel lightens the gloom a bit for you. Remember the old saying "and this too shall pass". Not even the really bad stuff can last forever.

Thanks for that. You meant, those guns of Lancaster are there still?

They are, they got a spruce-up in 2006 to preserve them for a while longer. These ones are a pair in their mid-ships deck mounts, with a nice big shield around them. Lancaster originally had these moved from their lower positions in the hull because of their susceptibility to general oceanic intrusion.

@@falklandsgamer9156 "Susceptibility to general oceanic intrusion" is a fine Drachism, I reckon. What trolls, you mean?

Gibble your billboy 🤤

Koo Jul

I agree . well spoken.

My personal favourites are the engineering videos. Drach has a really effective method of explaining concepts to the right level without giving you too much or too little

Drach is a machine, don`t you know. The treasure will never end.

Totally agree 👍

Officers chat Stokers die The British picked up the Officers and left the other ranks to die. Let's not pretend the humanity extended through class or rank barriers.

@@brucelownhole Except for the fact that Drach mentioned only a few officers being rescued, with rest being sailors (probably not stokers and rather people working at the upper levels but still) And while the officers were certainly treated better British did pick up regular crew and treated and fed them too. Maybe they got regular rations in the mess hall rather than dine fine food with the officers but British did not just ignore them and let them die because they were of lesser rank.

@@brucelownhole Fabricated rot. The truth is humanity extended both ways & only a dedicated "class warrior" would claim otherwise.

@@brucelownhole Ok commie sure.

I seem to remember reading, that pre-war, when British and German officers met socially, the Germans would propose a toast of "Der Tag", to the day when the fleets would meet in combat.

Not when you realize that this nation elected Hitler who clearly said that casualties in future war wont matter, only the outcome will.

@@Paciat An extremely close-range fight would also have produced a better outcome for the Germans. They could have gotten close enough to penetrate the battlecruisers' and armored cruisers' armor and fire torpedoes at nearly immobile targets. Perhaps he could have even detached the Nurnberg to escape with the Dresden.

@@Paciat whats wrong about that statement ?

Von Spee had his chance for a dramatic victory but failed to rise to the occasion as would have been expected from Commanders Beatty or Nelson. He could have sailed his fleet within gun and torpedo range against a stationary row of ships scrambling to raise steam and get underway. Kent could have been dealt with as it patrolled the outer harbor and then...boom. Point blank gun and torpedo attack.

Yes. And no. Hindsight being a benefit, we must put ourselves in von Spee's shoes. He doesn't now if the narrow is mined. Wether the RN ships have already raised steam or not. He doesn't have an accurate picture of the squadron's composition. Further more, there's enemy fire raining down on him from God knows where. Yes, it's Canopus. Tossing shells like a drunken metal throws beer bottles at punks. But, he's not aware of that. For all he knows, it can be yet another battlecruiser. Why run the gauntlet in a confined space when you can use your expertise in open waters? Of course, we'll never know what was going through his head. Just some random thoughts put together. Cheers.

I really liked that book also particularly the Jutland section on Drac's favorite Beatty

I'm reading castles of steel right now, I just finished the Von Spee section and now I get a Drach video as well.

Excellent book.

Unfortunately, Admiral Spee's descendents (his sons) were serving on board his flagship at the Battle of the Falklands. They went down with their father.

To be fair, the Germans did blow the Invincible to kingdom come at Jutland.

Arthur Rodney Barry Sturdee: will see about that

Wouldn't the Battle of the River Platte be the negation of Fisher's tactics? Three small British cruisers hunt down a German battlecruiser (which was operating as a commerce raider).

@@stanleyrogouski Arguably the Graf Spee wasn't truly a battle cruiser

Ditto from an ex-navy man of the ‘60s 👍👏

Agree, especially as in WW1 (unlike WW2) there was not much to choose between the values and morality of the two sides... ‘just’ two nations sacrificing millions of ordinary people’s lives on the altars of their respective imperial ambitions. Tragic.

When I read the Emden story a while back I thought then when on the China station the relationship between the two Navy's was remarkable and nothing like the daggers drawn attitude that we are sometimes led to believe.

Angry Australian battlecruisers are a lot of trouble

They were also running from the Kongos. Had they somehow survived the Falklands they’d have run into even more battlecruisers.

*"Oh fuck..."*

If I remember correctly, in the book "Battlecruiser Invincible", it stated Sturdee invited the surviving German officers on the Invincible to dine with he and his staff after the battle. It has been over 30 years since I have read that book, but, I remember thinking "This is how it should be done".

"Morning Ralph." "Morning Sam." And of course, the cartoon's ending.... "You don't look so good, Ralph. I'll cover for you tomorrow."

"When they are on the ship they are the enemy. But once they are in the water, they are a fellow mariner in distress" was a quote I once heard from a USN Veteran who served in WW2. The ocean is cruel and unforgiving. In most circumstances, sailors who had only minutes before been trying to kill each other will do what they can to render assistance because the ocean is a common foe encountered by all who sail on it.

Now witness the power of a fully operational royal navy

I should sprinkle some of that inn my work emails!

I should imagine the signals on April 3rd 1982 were of a similarly pressing nature.

The cheque book is mightier than the sword!

Well, that's what happens when somebody decides to go off and shoot an archduke in Serbia. 😒

@@WALTERBROADDUS I thought it was because Archie duke shot an ostrich because he was hungry.

Also ww1 was basically just a massive family feud that the rest of the commoners had to bleed for

@@WALTERBROADDUS the murder itself was in Bosnia, but by a Serb.

@@gokbay3057 correct. 😖 The Lines and people have flipped and flopped on the map & my memory....

Drach has said before that he does not cover modern stuff eg post 1950

I think Drach said that latest ship he would cover was the cancelled USS United States aircraft carrier.

@@JohnSmith-kg2rt I have also said that I would never drink another gin and tonic..... but I have learned to be flexible. He he he. Although Drach has said he would not do modern stuff.... the Falklands Conflict with a Drach approach to the story would be entertaining and I suspect very insightful. PLUS the light cruiser ARA General Belgrano sunk during the conflict was originally USS Phoenix - a Brooklyn class light cruiser that saw service throughout WW2..... so a slight bend to the rules could conceivably be possible?

@@bunyip7343 I doubt it he would however cover it on blidge pumps

Wow, that is an impressive feat, that font is very hard to read.

@@augustosolari7721 It took some practise, but learning about the Geschwader Spee kept me going :)

I would think there must have been some kind of action with the dozens that were at Dardanelles but thats a good question for sure.

@@mikepette4422 the ones in Dardanelles mostly fired on land targets. But, there were naval battles there, Ottoman Navy wasn't much, but it existed. In one action Goeben and Breslau sank some monitors but then ran into mines, where Breslau sank. And an Ottoman Destroyer/Torpedoboat was able to sink a British Pre-dreadnought. So there must have been cases of the Pre-dreadnoughts firing on ships.

Get Yo big Ass in line and wait till the Carrier Series is finished! ;)

He dies at Trafalgar. The end.

@@AdmRose he makes navalcombat a thing.

@@AdmRose If every account of major historical figures was that concise history would take up far less time on the curriculum

He mentioned before that the last part of the Nelson series will come, he's still working on it. Gonna be a damn good day when that drops.