Well, that's how thing progress. Somebody tries to improve things by a small margin. Then the next guy improves that, and two or three improvements later, some guy 'makes a breakthrough', by consolidating the improvements. And thus progress is made.
True. I really dislike that they could have used this episode to show why talented people should be forced to move up the chain of command instead of asked because this ship's Captain was obviously not the first choice and she only got the job because no one else was willing to. Mariner could have been the captiain of this ship and she would 't have gotten its crew killed...
I mean, she did ended up dying in space right? A few episodes further ahead, holy fuck that death scene…… should’ve chosen another career if you didn’t wanted to die in space!
“BOIM US OUTTA HERE!” Lol it wouldn’t be Star Trek with out a shot of somebody racing down a hallway in a desperate last-second attempt to save the day.
I really relate Mariner in this, in the air force I didn't want to promote because I liked being an responsible for only me and being able to help people the on ground. When I promoted to staff sergeant, I was behind put behind a desk and had to enforce rules I didn't like. Also, high ranks never speak their mind cause they have so much to lose. Which is why I think Mariner is so outspoken, she isnt trying to impress anyone cause she is only an ensign
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I love it how the Vulcan when there in phase mode how she stands there playing with her hands like she’s never seen them before or like someone who is just comeing out of anasthetic, I love the Vulcans even more the female Vulcan is so adorable.
I think she was wiping dust off her clothes. With the other ship being destroyed, they probably got a lot of dust on their clothing and some of it may have been transported with them. Alternatively, she might've been straightening out her clothes (like getting rid of some creases and/or folds).
@@happy_amoeba doesn't look like that to me. I think she was basically testing her body's current state to see if there's any cause for actual alarm, other than being translucent, luminous and making an ear grating sound.
Well, one of the Data/Lore/Borg incident happened in 2370 and the show is set in 2380, so Mariner could've served in the Dominion War, which was 2373-2375
@@thedelta4258 ye that alone would explain a lot of why she doesn't want to deal with promotions. Honestly I never knew the timeline of this show until now XD
ShadowWriter45: What more do you want? She was a complete Mary Sue; but she was SO smart that she realized how STUPID everyone ELSE is, since she wasn't the supreme ruler of everything; and so she just got tired of how stupid everyone else is.
Sidenote: Amina was channeling the ghost of Dr. "Bones" McCoy here pretty hard with her response to Lt. Durga's Vulcan Grasp of the Obvious. "Oh, YA THINK!?"
Dayton and Mariner are the reason why Starfleet is a bad organization. Because talented people like Mariner choose to be postpone their talented leadership and Dayton who aren't ready choose to take the promotion without being ready. And Starfleet allows this kind of waste of potential.
What if the Cerritos had a "Trials and Tribble-ations" episode? Aka. The Cerritos time travel to an episode of a previous Star Trek show. You know what I think could be perfect? They time travel to Star Trek TAS, replicating the original Filmation "animation" of the 70's.
You know the whole thing with Mariner wanting to be top shelf member of the lower decks reminds me of the Turians and how once someone finds a good place where they do good work in the military that's celebrated.
Not everyone feels the need or want to advance so far in such a competitive career, I suppose. Finding the spot where you fit best among the gears is something worth celebrating, even if that spot is not the top.
@@Timeward76 it just sucks whenever a system gives less compensation than you can live off of for a full time job, just because it isn't management. Starfleet at least is utopic enough the ensigns still live pretty well
“Come on baby, give Rutherford the juice!” Is I think my favorite line from this sequence, which is saying something since there are so many good lines.
I am very aware that at this point Bridges have a massive window for a viewscreen purely out of spite for the people who hated it in the in the Kelvin movies. And I'm ok with that. Double down, Kurtzman. Own that shit, man.
Bridges having actual windows for viewscreen isn't even a bad idea, tactical-wise. If the viewscreen fails entirely, it means you can still see outside and have at least one thing to still be able to navigate by. Even in modern day, ship bridges are exposed instead of buried deep in the hull's armor because situational awareness is worth more than anything else. Can you imagine the nebula battle in Wrath of Khan if they could actually just look out through the inactive viewscreen to see?
@@Timeward76 The combat information center (CIC) of many Navy warships is located below the main deck and is not located in the main bridge. That might change if modern radars can be defeated by new technology, but that's where they track threats, targets, and issue commands to fire weapons. It's kinda like a starship bridge split in two, one for the helm, the other for tactical.
@@MMuraseofSandvich I think it is not entirely correct to compare a federation starship to any warship. They dont make warships after all :P But the bigger starships in starfleet do in fact have a secondary bridge, or "battle bridge" as is sometimes called. Theyre just not commonly used because the normal bridge is often good enough for most things, and starfleet is rarely anticipating battle. When they DO anticipate battle, the battle bridge does come in handy. But given that the main bridge is usually the one used for most things, having an actual window I'd still a tactical trade off.
You know I just realised, isn't it weird that Mariner actually went to the Academy at all? She seems like the enlist straightaway to get in space as fast as possible type.
I'm sure her parents insisted that she go to the Academy Besides, whether enlisted even exist in Star Trek is pretty unclear (the best explanation is that enlisted are only accepted in wartime and are sent home or to the Academy when the war ends).
@@billymanners9629 Actually starfleet always has enlisted personnel, Chief O'Brien is at the highest ranked enlisted officer rank for example. But you're definitely right about her parents.
A core problem with any organisation is promoting people beyond their competence. Ego notwithstanding, it's better to promote around the different sections of a level of responsibility, broadening experience and knowledge. Promotion should never be a popularity contest, or based upon people being impressed. That's how we get all these psychoes and liars in politics.
I dont want to say it was a continuity error but pulling a phaser moments before you suffocate or get blown into space is really telling about the character.
@@DavidBDavis-lz7bt Like the "But I got a Phaser!"-moment in episode 3? The episode where Boimler excels at his tasks when everybody else cannot cope with the workload? And then is the one that actually talks the captain out of that timing-nonsense?
upon rewatching this action sequence captain Ramsey sounds like her voiceactor has a cold or something. like everytime she raises her voice a little its about to break
How old is Mariner? Her classmate made captain; are they old or young? Captains in the US Navy are usually in their 40's before getting the call. Although the Abrams reboot had cadet Kirk being given the Flag Ship Enterprise, passing over every other captain and commander in Star Flight. I enjoy Lower Decks. I enjoyed the reboot eventhough the cadet to captain bit was totally improbable.
Mariner has been demoted. And this is post dominion war and post Wolf 359. So lots of new ship, not a lot of senior bridge crew. So competent people get promoted quickly. I think Mariner had a burnout episode, and now just doesn't want the responsibility to be in charge anymore. Her personality is still to take charge but she doesn't want the responsibility.
Evidence seems to point to Mariner being in her early to mid-30s. My guesses to everyone's age are: Freeman: 55-60, Ransom: 35-40, Shaxs: 55-60, Billups: 35-40, T'ana: Not enough clues yet, acts like a burnt-out 45-year-old trauma doc though; Mariner: 30-35; Rutherford: 26-30; Boimler: 23-24; Tendi: 22-23.
In TOS, Kirk was only in his early-30's. Granted, he was acknowledged as being young for a captain, especially of what was at the time a top-of-the-line starship. But Starfleet does seem to reward talent and accomplishments without getting too hung up over age. Mariner acts like a college student, but she's obviously much older considering the long list of adventures she can rattle off. I'd guess that she's at least 30.
@@redactedrider7606 Boimler made a wrong assumption and she didn't bother to correct him until now (he may not have voiced it until now). The youngest captain in Starfleet history (Tryla Scott) was 28 when she took command of the USS Renegade. So that is a hard lower limit on Mariner's age. She's at LEAST five to six years older than Boimler and more likely 10 years older.
@@katherineberger6329 nog from ds9 was around 22 years old when he made Lieutenant junior grade at the end of ds9 mariner must have entered Starfleet academy at around 16/17 years of age due to her being a military brat for lack of better term
During the Dominion War? Yeaaah. Definitely. Especially front-line vessels (and they were pretty much ALL Front-line vessels, especially after the Breen orbital-struck Earth that one time). This is post-Nemesis though, and Starfleet has shown a (marginal) return to a pre-war status. The padded grey/black uniforms are out, in favour of the less-agressive more colourful fair, and people are joining back up to Explore, not to Defend/Fight-the-Dominion. Also, the Cerritos isn't a front-line ship by design or mission. The California-class starships are support vessels in function and the Cerritos is outfitted as a second-contact vessel...so lots of diplomatic and technical-uplift/support duty with a side of good ol'sciencing and mapping, as it picks up the slack and left-overs made by the battlecruiser/explorers like the Galaxy or the Sovereign or even Nebula, Akira, and the handful of venerable centenarian Excelsiors that managed to survive through the big DW and Borg attacks. The Cerritos herself is probably getting a bit into her years of design relevance, as the California class seems to have a mostly TNG-era Galaxy-stylized features...Akira-esq, at the latest, based on the nacelles. Design wise, the California-class has details that could point to it being a protodesign for the Steamrunner, with the raised wedge on after Saucer section and the compact stardrive/main-deflector section between the nacelles....just cut off a chunk of the saucer's forward parts and chuck the pylons in favour of integrating the front half of the nacelles and bussard collectors into what's left...and viola. Steamrunner.
I forget how this episode worked. Wouldn't it just have been faster to just transport them all rather than waiting for Rutherford to run all the way to the transporter room?
@@monsterhunter66 since the Enterprise D galaxy class in Startrek the next generation in like 1987 and Starfleet isn’t strictly military it’s more like NASA and the navy
Well, as much as Starfleet likes to pretend that it's a meritocracy, we've seen many times that it's still a bureaucracy. A Sci-Fi bureaucracy, but still one nonetheless. There's still corruption, favoritism, nepotism, and all the usual problems that plague military and government organizations. The Captain of the Rubidoux must have been good at playing politics or knew the right people.
There have been plenty of captains in real life who were good enough during the everyday tasks and did well enough in exercises but turned out to be completely unsuited in an extreme situation. Most airline-pilots never have to make an actual crash-landing so we don't know if they can do it outside a simulator.
To be fair, you’re talking about the someone being the captain of one of these California-class ships. Aside from the general Star Fleet danger of space work, they don’t appear to see a lot of important action or roles. So it would not be the first time in history that someone was just competent enough (with enough time in service) to obtain the rank but placed in a situation where they couldn’t cause too much trouble.
*@Oldtaku_DD ~* In a broad sense, you are correct. *;)* 1. Yes, Ensigns Bradward Boimler and Beckett Mariner are the same age (according to Boimler), and therefore are also the same age as Captain Amina Ramsey (voiced by the lovely Toks Olagundoye). 2. The difference between Mariner and Boimler is that Mariner was *_born into_* Starfleet, similar to Wesley Crusher; unlike Boimler who (probably) enlisted at whatever age-minimum there is. Unlike Wesley, however, Beckett was raised with Starfleet from an early age (how early has not been specified yet); as opposed to Wesley starting in his late teens. This *_early_* start (rather than a "head" start), combined with her natural talent(s) for Starfleet work, is why Mariner is so proficient in many fields, and also why Mariner has far more field-experience than Boimler. Think of Mariner like Jack Reacher. Reacher was born into the military, raised in the military, trained in a wide-array of military skills since childhood, and (field-)experienced military life as his father (Captain Stan Reacher) moved from posting to posting, all long before Reacher was of-age to be formally enlisted. Thus why Reacher as a character is a _plausible_ badass, especially when it comes to dealing with the military. Unlike Reacher, who left the military, Mariner _remains_ in Starfleet despite her frustrations with some of the rules, protocols, politicking, and even her parents; because Starfleet-life is all Mariner has known, and cannot imagine being anywhere else (also in addition to Mariner still believing in Starfleet's nobler ideals). The positive-strength of Mariner's character is that she is working to find her own way and place in Starfleet, at her own pace, not letting anyone/anything dictate her path. Hope this helps clarify. *:)*
Some are specualting Boimler could have been a later in life member of Starfleet. Like a non-trad in college. This is why he's focused and sure he's doing what he's supposed to. My buddy said the air force would take him till he was 38... so there is real life precedent.
Just because he thinks it doesn't make it true. I'm going to presume an age gap unless I see on screen proof. Based on her parent's appearances alone she's at least early 30's, which syncs up with a few other things seen so far.
@@Vipre- ~ Not sure if your Reply meant me or *@patsfreak,* but just to (friendly) cover bases... *:)* 1. *_'On-screen'_** ~* Boimler remarks how he and Mariner are the same age during [1x02; "Envoys"], unable to understand how Mariner has so much more field-experience than him (thus the "according to Boimler" part in my earlier Reply-comment). The exact point, I do not recall off-handedly. _{I >think< it was when they were wandering through the bazaar looking for their wayward Klingon general escort? Right now I am too weary to look it up at the moment (coming off a Graveyard Shift of work); if I feel/remember the urge to do so, I may Edit-update this Reply later.}_ 2. Captain Ramsey and Mariner are of the same Starfleet class-generation; so, obviously, they are the same age as well; which is the central point of Ramsey's character for this episode's [1x07] story. Ramsey's story-role in this episode is for character-contrast, to show *_"What Could Have Been",_* had Mariner followed the Path of Ambition/Promotions after Starfleet Academy, as everyone expected Mariner to do. ("We all thought you'd be the first captain from our class.") 3. I think 30's age-bracket may be too far. The Lower Decks crew are meant to be the thematic opposite(s) of the Senior Officers, so they are probably much more youthful (especially Tendi, who is the _"Kid"_ [character theme] of the Lower Decks cast), probably in the _"Young Adult"_ range (whatever that may be in the ST:TNG era). Hope this helps clarify. *:)*
I read a few commentaries here that speak about unwillingness to take on responsibilities and command. Humility is admirable but consider that you might be talented and that people want to promote you on merit not dumping more work on you. Also consider that maybe the next person who is in line for that promotion is just willing to gain the fame or the benefits of the promotion, but they have no experience leading people. Are you willing to let your fellow crewmates die following the orders of someone who was less capable than you? The ship's captain is the basic example, you can tell that she was not ready for that responsability yet she got it because people like Mariner didn't want the responsability. As a result she get her ship and crew members killed and Mariner got to sleep in and do her Robin hood. The series could have said something about lack of willingness to take command and the consequences of those actions but it choose to just turn Boimler blue and a weird Dog Thing parody... Sometimes this show had some great ideas that it has to scrap for the sake of jokes... and it's sad.
There is such a thing as finding a level you're comfortable at. Sure, you might have the capacity and skills required to rise through the ranks, but you might also find you really enjoy the dynamic and responsibilities of a rank somewhere in the middle or bottom.
Was certain I wasn't going to enjoy this show from all the negativity around it. But then I watched it and yeah, it's got some rough edges and some underhanded themes of misandry, etc but compared with STD and Picard, this isn't half bad. I'm into it.
Not as much misandry as some easily-triggered people claim. For example, in "Temporal Edict", Ransom was shown to be every bit as much of a badass as he acts like. As opposed to being a bumbling meathead who's all talk.
@@alphanerd7221 Nowhere that I'm aware of. Might be as idiotic as Mariner being Mariner, just at a male of some sort, regardless of context. There's a hate machine running around the internet these days, and they seize on anything they can to hate on something.
She's not perfect and they show it. It's likely that watching a shape-changing Alien murder her friend and other incidents have really messed with her head.
That's the problem. Mariner likes the kinds of adventures that she can have in Starfleet because she's an adrenaline junkie. But she hates responsibility and rules, so she tries to stay an ensign. Which wouldn't be a problem if she didn't also demand the kind of respect that senior officers get. She wants the perks, but not the job itself.
@@hemaccabe4292 fair, i really am enjoying, i think its a very impressive feat to make a comedy trek that works, im glad they kept the trek feel in the same way disco and picard did, and to be honest, its the better version of rick and morty
@@airrider-jk9ik Then I wish you the best. Sometime, when you want something to read, maybe Lost Destiny will work for you, look it up. If it doesn't work for you, well, it didn't cost you any more than clicking on a link, www.fanfiction.net/s/13312963/1/Star-Trek-Lost-Destiny-Book-I-Race-of-Death
Wait, what's going on in this episode? Do we get us a SECOND Mariner... with a British accent at that?? Like one wasn't enough; and wasn't annoying enough?
*@Leonid Andreev...* 1. Captain Amina Ramsey is voiced by the lovely *Toks Olagundoye* (Nigerian actress, British educated), who has played many _"strong female"_ roles (live and voiced). Her current notable (voice) role is that of the formidable Mrs. Beakley, for the rebooted DuckTales (2017 series). 2. Captain Ramsey's presence/role in this episode [1x07] is meant to be for *character-contrasts...* - a.) Captain Ramsey, being the same age, high-skilled competence, & Starfleet Academy class-generation as Mariner, is meant to show *_'What Could Have Been',_* had Mariner followed the path to promotions and Officer-ship (-hood?) after graduating from Starfleet Academy, as everyone (Mariner's friends, classmates, & parents) had expected Mariner to do. - b.) As Captain Ramsey admits, she *_deliberately_* took the boring assignment to "babysit" the USS Cerritos, with the ulterior motive to try to recruit Mariner over to the USS Oakland and make Mariner her XO (Executive Officer) there. However, Ramsey's hidden agenda was done with *_good_* intentions, stemming from her close Friendship with Mariner. From her perspective, Ramsey was unable to comprehend Mariner's inexplicable loss of career-motivation and -ambition after graduating with top-marks at Starfleet Academy; of which, Mariner also helped Ramsey to excel at Starfleet Academy (despite the duo being mischief makers), which led to Ramsey's own (early) Captaincy. Simply put, Ramsey was trying to help her friend Mariner, *_"get back on track."_* Hope this helps clarify. *:)*
@@pendrake40 I figured it was something along these lines. But thank you for a detailed and serious reply. (I feel like they went a little overboard with the fact that she's already a captain. Making her a lt. commander would have been enough to make a point, of how much of an overachiever she is - and just how bad of a screwup ensign Mariner is, by contrast...)
@@leonidandreev1171 ... 3. *_>Captain< Ramsey_** ~* Nah, Ramsey 'had' to be a Captain for this episode [1x07]. - a.) What was understated (and therefore easy to miss) was that Ramsey only made Captain very recently. This was a secondary factor to why Ramsey was attempting to recruit Mariner to be her XO (Ramsey still needed one), in addition to her ulterior (but well-meant) motives. - b.) Ramsey also needed to be a Captain in order to have the authority to 'poach' Mariner from the USS Cerritos to the USS Oakland. Not because Captain Freeman would resist the transfer (probably the opposite, given the current mother-daughter conflicts between Freeman vs. Mariner), but because Mariner would not be able to (legally) oppose it; even if Mariner were desperate enough to appeal to Captain Freeman to countermand such. 4. *_Mariner vs. Ramsey_** ~* Mariner is _NOT_ a screw-up, very much the opposite. The 'trick' is that Mariner _KNEW_ (or more accurately, figured it out very early-on) that Ramsey was there to try to make Mariner her XO (a job Mariner did not want); however, Mariner also knew Ramsey's ulterior motives/agenda was earnestly well-intentioned. So Mariner was *_>acting
Well that's stupid. She fails often, has personality flaws, and a background that shows why she is a badass, and when her male boss trash talks her, and physically assaults her, not only does he deliver on his promise to be physically dominant, she wants to have sex with him over it.
You are aware, surely, that EVERY MAJOR CHARACTER in Star Trek is a Mary Sue at some point. Every last one. That's just how they wrote the show back in the day. Only recently have writers allowed the idea that our heroes have character flaws. That's a recent thing, ok?
@@ClickBeetleTV yeah keep eating shit and calling it spaghetti. Your why star trek sucks so much they are out to please the lowest common denominator and that is you...
Soooooo that's the other half of Beckett's back story she was near tricked into getting a bum job due too her best friend who talks like Minnie driver by which I mean 🇬🇧 yes ok thank u n judging by the others impersonating ghost 2:42 I🤔☺ assume this is the same ep that started wit boliemer
