Jayne (the Fairy Princess) is my grandfather's second ex-wife! This video is infamous among my family; all of us own an original VHS. The voice she uses in this video is not phony, she really talks like that. The "Gwendolyn" character is a fairly accurate portrayal of her actual personality. Believe it or not, "A Princess Party" was once sold at Target stores across the midwest. I absolutely lost my shit when I saw it on the wheel! This made living in 2020 almost worth it.
My mind is blown! I know Meredith Monk very well. I've known her my whole life. One of my parents worked for her. I spent countless hours being dragged to her performances across the world as a child. This made my day. My favorite thing that ever happened during the time I spent with Meredith is her anger when reading a local paper's review of her work, calling it a meow mix commercial.
@@ManiacalForeigner Well, from what I can remember (after many confusing conversations after being forced to sit through shows of hers) is that it's a deconstruction of sound, music, language and dance. You're not really supposed to understand, I think. When you get to a level of weirdness, or avant garde art (another term for weird) you are supposed to just experience it and stop trying to understand....maybe. Like a form of meditation. To be frank there are people who do this better, in my opinion, like Phillip Glass. Though, yeah, I think it just sounds like people meowing for some tasty meow mix.
Peter Guarino i can totally underline the point of deconstruction. In the 60s many composers tried to go over music or art itself by removing it from its basic structures. Easiest part was by using nonsense-language (see György Ligeti’s Aventures)or metric deductions. With this technique (which was for this time period always the focal point of making avant-garde music) you could create something new and get therefore perhaps beyond the ostensible meaning of art/music itself or see it in a new light.
@@peterguarinonyc It's funny, I'm sure Josh mentioned Phillip Glass in the cut-out bit lol... I couldn't place her sound, but I knew it was familiar... The Fog Of War is one of my favorite docs, and seeing you mention Phillip Glass made me realize that's who it was. Looked them up, and sure enough, same scene back in 80s NYC. I 100% agree, PG nailed the style. Not gonna lie, though - I watched Turtle Dreams start to finish a couple times after this video, lol - it's not dreadful, but I wouldn't call it revolutionary, lmao
The fact that everybody started engaging with the Turtle Dreams amd went into a prolonged, ernest discussion about performance art just to annoy Rich Evans
This may be very vague but does anyone know a piece by a experimental or minimalist composer that used something like a muted piano or playing a regular piano very lightly to get the mechanism of the piano to make noise instead of hearing the notes played? Someone made a RU-vid video talking about it and for a comedy bit they made it into like a Christmas song, just by having someone say "Christmas" during it
Jay says Turtle Dreams reminds him of The interpretive dance scene in The Big Lebowski, well Meredith Monk IS ON THAT SOUNDTRACK for the song in the scene where Maude Lebowski flies overhead flinging paint everywhere!!! Crazy.
His friends have none of those things. The only things he would get from them are diabetes and Tums festival (Rich), pretentious knowledge (Josh), alcohol poisoning and liver damage (Mike), and baldness (Jack).
Presumably, "2-B Moms" were trying to warn about the dangers of toxoplasmosis to pregnant women and just failed to communicate any part of the danger whatsoever.
Keith Shannon it’s because the bacteria in cat excrement is very bad for pregnant women and they even say not to handle it when pregnant. Just an extra warning for pregnant people in general. (They didn’t do a good job)
The ending with Rich Evans inserted into Turtle Dreams is a work of art. Who cannot relate to Rich Evans, thrust into a strange world who's rules he is unaware of and cannot understand, yet expected to conform to? Is he not the everyman?
So i looked up Turtle Dreams and found this on Wikipedia; "AllMusic awarded the album four stars, with Ted Mills calling it "A daring display of vocal gymnastics and a journey back to childhood when all sounds were wondrous".[4] Red Letter Media critically panned it, stating that they were unsure if it was a spoof."
Someone added upon it: Rich Evans stated that he "holds it in utter contempt" UPDATE: Someone added more RLM sauce: The tape did tie for "Best of the Worst", however.
I looked up the full performance on RU-vid. All the comments just say things like “Amazing performance! Truly breathtaking!” But no one is saying WHY it’s an amazing performance... can anyone explain it?
"In 2020, the RU-vid film review channel Red Letter Media found a copy of the WGBH filmed version and featured it on their show Best of the Worst. The group panned it and stated that it was symbolic of the hollow and vapid state of avant garde art. They stated that they were unsure if it was a spoof of performance art, with Rich Evans asserting he “holds it in utter contempt”.[12]" On the turtle dreams Wikipedia page
@@BGNOLAyeah that's, i think, the issue here. It's something that had meaning in the 90s wave of video art, psychedelic revival and discourse. If you watch music videos of the 90s you will find a lot of similar themes : extreme close ups, black and white, repetitive movements ecc. Nowadays it seems weird and outdated and a bit silly.
Someone removed it, but if you think about it - this review is probably the single largest amount of coverage it has ever received, aside from short blurbs from pretentious film journalists. It's weird to think of RLM outside of a bubble, but it legitimately gets more viewership than many traditional outlets
I wonder how many retakes 'Turtles Dreams' did. "Cut! God damn it, Ted. Step right, squeal while stepping left, wave arms. Why would you step right while waving your arms? What would that even mean?"
@a HERO that doesn’t know what protect means The modern dance I've seen loves to use wild, jerky movements. Sort of like rebelling against the complete neurotic "proper" body control of ballet. I'm guessing to dance types, ballet is like classical music, and those flailing arms are a Chuck Berry guitar solo.
@@jongerbergerdecht5579 I am sorry to be "that person" but... Macaulay Culkin is actually a male. - I mean, we all know he's the bottom, but still, he should be referred to as a boyfriend.
As someone who loves weird, obnoxious avant garde art, I really enjoyed the "3 of the guys try to dig into the the meaning of this weird-ass performance art while Rich Evans thinks they're all full of shit" dynamic
There is a part of me that would like an explanation but I feel like it would be an insufferable hour of pretentious madness of white peoples with too much time on their hands.
Wikipedia on Turtle Dreams: "In 2020, the RU-vid movie-review channel Red Letter Media found a copy of the WGBH filmed version and featured it on their show "Best of the Worst". The group panned it, stating that they were unsure if it was a spoof of performance art. Rich Evans asserted that he “holds it in utter contempt." :D
@@cow_tools_ while it was interesting that they actually did go on to discuss it, i'd still say they panned it. they laughed at it consistently and even josh, the one who respects meredith the most, said it was just bad.
Is he himself elderly yet? I feel like his obsession/disgust/hilarity with/at the elderly comes from his absolute fear of the idea of becoming and being elderly.
They mentioned the interpretive dance scene from the Big Lebowski and how similar it is to Turtle Dreams. The movie also features music "Walking Song" by Meredith Monk in the scene that introduces Maude Lebowski. It's mostly just rhythmic throat breathing
That's so funny, I always assumed the music for that part was a *parody* of avant-garde composers. I thought it was supposed to be another of Maude's projects to suggest that maybe she's just a vapid, pretentious dilettante.
@@SammEater sounds like she isn’t, if we’re to believe the commenter who’s known her their whole life and was forced to sit through countless performances and discussions of her works.
Rich is a tradesman. Jay is an artist. In this episode we learn the similarities and differences between these characters based on their thoughts towards Meredith monk.
He loves the elderly so much that the state of Wisconsin had to give him a mandatory restraining order to remain 500 feet away from all assisted living facilities.
I love the part in "Turtle Dreams" where there's hard cuts of people laying on the ground cuz it reminded me of when Mike was at a con and he did the same thing.
@@Lishadra they can survive heavy injuries because they're dreaming that shit every night. They're pain resistant because of uouououo eeeeee uuuuu iiiiiii aeaea aaaaahhhh
RE: Cat Litter Actually, it is a thing; cat droppings can contain a parasite that can cause toxoplasmosis. It's somewhat rare, and *generally* harmless to most people, but if you catch it during pregnancy, it can cause miscarriages or stillbirths. So it is often recommended that women who are pregnant or plan to be pregnant soon should (if possible) have someone else change the litter box, or else be VERY careful, and sure to thoroughly wash their hands immediately after.
To be fair, "have some one else clean your litter box" is really a thing they tell pregnant women and immuno compromised people, they just didn't explain it well.
@@moviebad109 Because people don't wash their DAMN HANDS when they do chores.
Год назад
to the people rewatching the episodes are you guys also finding yourselves more and more enthralled by Turtle Dreams the more times you watch it? I feel like I'm being brainwashed It's hypnotic
This is a true story. One day years ago I came out of the grocery store to find a turtle sitting in a bare dirt area next to where I had parked my bicycle. I waited for a while to see if someone came to claim it, but no one did. So, I took it home. The next day I let it loose in a wetlands area near my house. As soon as I set it down in the grass it sprinted into the water and swam off - happily, I like to think. If nothing else, Turtle Dreams reminded me of my turtle friend. "I went to the ssssstore..." Indeed.
I know it's been a minute since this episode came out but I just wanted to say, I've employed Mike's Turtle Dreams at closing time method multiple times and it has literally always worked, besides in the instances where my coworkers got so frustrated they shut it off before it got the chance to work it's magic. Customers always remark "Sorry for overstaying our welcome" like yeah, I bet after being subjected to this shit you sure fucking are.
The guys are overthinking Turtle Dreams. The artist was inspired while wondering what her pet turtle, Neutron, dreamed of. My interpretation is the turtle sees its owner about all day but cannot comprehend it's owners actions in a meaningful way, so in the turtle's dream humans are just randomly moving around making strange noises. In other parts of the dream, the turtle is moving about random locations.
I'm glad I came across your post. Because I abhor deconstructionist art like Turtle Dreams. But you have suggested a simple interpretation that is much more humble and believable. You describe more plausibly what Meredith Monk could not with her "high-minded", post-modern, ivory tower academic rhetoric. If it is about what a turtle might think of the world around her when she is a person's pet, then there's substance to the art and it provides a simple context for interpretation and, thus, enjoyment and appreciation. This is why I can appreciate paintings from the Romantic era and poetry from Transcendentalism: what would ordinarily be complete crap and worth throwing in a fire is given substance that can be grasped by the mind and, therefore, enjoyed and appreciated. It is given substance by a simple clue about its context-- a title, a short description, and/or other writings/paintings from the artist. Anyway, I'll get off my soapbox. Thank you for your post. You put it simply, which I greatly appreciate.
"Mike you do realize someday, someday VERY SOON, karma is gonna hit you like freight train"... -Next Day- Mike gets bullied and ridiculed by William Shatner on twitter
Turtle Dreams is legit just what Meredith Monk thought a turtle may dream about and how they experience the world, there is no deeper meaning whatsoever. It was largely inspired by her pet turtle Neutron
@@goddepersonno3782 That you don't like another person's personal creativity when it is completely harmless actually says more about you. And if you want society to step in as a moral majority to censor the avant-garde then, hey, I think we all know what that is.
@@tomkrawec it is shit. That is the majority agreement. As a student of music, the fact that you insult my intelligence by calling this art demonstrates how stupid your definition of art is.
First Rich burns down his grandma's house with french fries, now he burns down the RLM studios by smashing up lighting kits. Rich is not cool about fire safety.
I really don't know what's funnier: The fact that RLM actually covered Turtle Dreams by Meredith Monk or the fact that Josh OBVIOUSLY had prior knowledge of Meredith Monk (I know she's not super obscure but still.) Side note: Josh's ability to instinctively namedrop experimental/niche bands is why I love him
I enjoyed Josh going off on the artistic meaning of the audio mixing and production and everyone else zoning/editing it out. What, boys, if it's not visual then the language of production doesn't matter? Let Josh rant about audio mixing for the .1% of us who care!
@@zacharystamler6620 Honestly the look on Rich's face when Josh started to talk about the music itself hit way too close to home for me, I've been in Josh's place too many times 😂
So, when Josh said at the beginning that he knew who Meredith Monk was, it got me thinking that her name sounded so familiar... THEN Jay referenced The Big Lebowski as an example of having a parody of performance art in it, that Turtle Dreams seemed like a parody. That's when it hit me! I know Meredith Monk because SHE IS ON THE BIG LEBOWSKI SOUNDTRACK!!!!!! Her song, "Walking Song," is during the scene where The Dude first meets Maude, where she's above him in that harness flinging paint everywhere. This is blowing my fucking mind!!!!!
It’s funny that they bring up the Big Lebowski landlord scene, because according to Wikipedia, Meredith Monk produced a song for that movie. Mind blown.
That clip of the geriatric foot being rubbed came on just as I bit into a particularly overdone edge-piece of meatloaf, and the combined effect has not only completely sterilized me but also allowed me to see into the 4th dimension whenever I sneeze. I'll be coming after RLM for damages.
So weird factoid about Meredith Monk: they reference the Big Lebowski while covering her video, but her own music was used in that film. Her music was also used in the David Byrne film True Stories that RLM did a Re:View episode. She's actually collaborated with a lot of well known talented artists. If going to art school taught me one thing it's that talented artists often make total and complete garbage, I guess Meredith made Turtle Dreams on an off day :/
It’s the Walking Song! Oh my god that’s crazy. I’ve owned that soundtrack for 20 years and have inadvertently listened to it more then I care to admit - Well dome on making that connection it truly has just blown my mind down. I have so many questions now about Meredith Monk. My immediate dismissal has now grown into immense curiosity. 🐢 💃
Funny you mention David Byrne, because the dancing in Turtle Dreams totally reminded me of David Byrne's dancing in the video for the Talking Heads song "Once in a Lifetime."
Meredith Monk apparently has a Star Trek connection, too. Found this: In 1995, Monk went where no experimental artist had gone before: Star Trek. Albeit a rare, audio-only episode of Star Trek, Monk is listed in the credits as composer along with fellow musician, Theo Bleckmann. “Star Trek: Envoy” follows Captain Sulu in the “Captain Sulu Adventures” series. In the episode, Sulu acts as an envoy to a historic peace settlement between the warring races, the Krikiki and the Den-Kai. Monk and Bleckmann composed music for the Krikiki/Den-Kai Ensemble, although it’s not clear which artist represents the Krikiki race or the Den-Kai. Help, Trekkies?
11:37 When Mike is 70 years old, tottering around his front yard, the gang is going to throw him a princess party and surprise the hell out of him. "But Mike, don't you remember that one time you said that thing?"
rewatchin this, and Mike halfass singing the Turtles song while looking pleadingly to the rest of the group for some inkling of recognition is priceless
See if there's a DVD or tape of that one European art performance. Bunch of half-nude guys and girls on a stage with various things & metal pipes on them. I don't remember the name, but I'm sure someone will figure it out when passing by. Make them watch that. You can thank 2011 RU-vid for making me aware of its existence.
I wish to God that they'll watch more avant-garde arthouse stuff in the future... seeing Rich's dying expression as everyone else passionately debates a work of art's meaning is hilarious.
The scream of terror my brain made when I saw Massaging The Elderly was on the discussion table anyway despite not being picked. I should've known Mike can't resist anything involving the elderly. They did kinda spoil it by showing clips in the beginning as they wouldn't have captured footage without actually watching it.
Wow, I can't believe they didn't mention Felissa Rose is the actress who played Angela Baker in Return to Sleepaway Camp AND Sleepaway Camp IV: The Survivor!
I'm sure that anybody interested in her and Sleepaway Camp already know that, but might have missed the video where she raps as a pregnant lady to young mothers.
Turtle Dreams being specifically for TV in the 80's means there is a high likelihood that someone high as a kite accidentally watched it at 3am and lost their goddamn mind.
@@floydlooney6837 They only used it to test that the station was actually broadcasting. Once they verified that, they turned it off and put it in a meat locker until they needed it again.
Fun Fact! Meredith Monk is actually on the Big Lebowski soundtrack. It's the song with the weird breathing. Another fun fact. The Juiliard minimalist movement of music she inspired by was invented by a blind street performer named Moondog who hung out on sixth avenue in a viking hat.
Jay: "I'll mention Felissa Rose is in the pregnancy video so I won't be bombarded by tweets!" *will get bombarded with tweets that Meredith Monk composed the opening music to True Stories, a film they covered on re:View and one of his favourite films.
Meredith Monk seems like a group that wants to be Talking Heads but doesn't understand that Talking Heads music had melody, talent, and lyrical meaning.
@@esotericVideos Her track 'Road Song' in True Stories is beautiful. She clearly has talent, but BOTW is absolutely the worst spot it could have been showcased in, as well as the funniest thanks to Rich's reaction. Though I think it's unfair to view it from the point of view of people who review obscure b-movie schlock for a living. Obviously they would not like it.
@@esotericVideos The comment doesn't make sense given lead singer/main songwriter of TH, David Byrne co-wrote, starred, and directed True Stories and chose her to contribute to his soundtrack, so she isn't really trying to be Talking Heads when TH (or at least Byrne) already asked her to collaborate with them.
esotericVideos Meredith Monk and Talking Heads are from completely different worlds musically. Talking Heads being a pop group and Monk being a classical composer. In this instance Byrne was actually influenced by Monk and sought her out for the OST
They think they are performing a spell. The Black and White is a witchcraft thing. It means the two extremes of morality and all things in between are just a means to get to one or the other extreme.
Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was
For those of you who would like to learn a little more about Turtle Dreams: In the late 1970s Monk acquired a turtle named Neutron as a pet, and in 2016 said "When I first got her I had a lot of dreams about her, very strange dreams. And then I started thinking, how does a turtle think? What would a turtle mind be, and if she’s sleeping, what would a turtle dream be?"[4]. In a 2010 interview, Monk said she found standard music concerts boring, and said "at that time I started to try to feed in elements to that situation - like one little element of movement. Turtle Dreams is a music piece that has a very simplified movement component. I was working on that music myself, and then I thought ‘wouldn’t it be interesting if the movement had a totally simple counterpoint? So instead of standing there singing, what about if we went from side to side?’ And from there, the piece seemed to make itself."[5]. She also added "When I was working on it I didn’t realise some things that I see now. There’s a certain fascist element to it, and I wasn’t conscious of that at the time. ... There’s a flatness, a surface style to the people, and maybe a kind of narcissism too."
I’m gonna miss the old wheel...but I’m happy to see it return once again...in future I humbly suggest a rule that should the wheel be broken again then they must watch every tape upon its face.
"We're not looking for trouble today. We're just looking for meats that taste delicious!" That' s how you found trouble in the first place, pregnant teenagers!
"Twitter is what separates us from the animals." Uhhhhhh no Mike. The sweet laughter of internet sensation and teen heartthrob Rich Evans is what separates us from the animals.
Her music was used by the Coen brothers in 'The Big Lebowski.' I'm guessing it was the scene where Julianne Moore's trust fund artist character is 'painting.' *Vagina.*
Hi there, support/care worker here! Colon massages are an important part of both aged and especially in disability care for clients with spinal injuries. Buildup of waste in the colon can lead very quickly to body heat issues and organ shutdown, sometimes within hours! Making sure that clients are able to poop regularly is an important part of our job!
Hey, so I sent in turtle dreams. I am genuinely so glad that I could share this with you all. I have watched it so many times without intending to. Shout out to my singing teacher for showing me it in the first place.
What really bothers me about watching "Turtle Dreams" is that Meredith Monk was able to rope three other people into doing this with her. I'm lucky if I get three friends to like my art in Instagram.
That’s because the most important skill for any artist is salesmanship. Art only has as much value as we attribute to it. You have to convince an audience to see value where there may be none. That’s why most (all?) avant-garde performers are unapologetic con artists.
Found this nugget about Turtle Dreams, in case anyone still wonders if it's sincere or satire: "The piece was first performed in 1981, and received the Grand Prize - Performance Video at the first Festival of Video Culture/Canada in Toronto, 1983 (Films)" Let that sink in. Not only were they not kidding, at least some significant proportion of people thought this was not only good, but exceptionally so.
I'm not suggesting that there is necessarily a link here but Canada has the largest population of individuals that have attained higher education in the world.
