Birmingham's New £60m Railway Project: A Look At The Camp Hill Line 

Thanks so much! :)

& Bria-lee Hill for Brierley Hill 😊😁👍 Despite the mis-pronunciations, a very interesting & informative video - thank you very much for making it (I'm an ex-Brummie, now living abroad, but always great to see how the old place is progressing).

There is a large selection of tickets and season tickets for multi-modal travel within the West Midlands. All bus operators, all bus plus trams, all bus, trams and trains.

Birmingham New Street is the busiest THROUGH station in Europe. (Yes, busier than Clapham Junction.)

Originally, platforms 1 and 2 were for trains along the West Suburban line to New Street, whilst platforms 3 and 4 were for the Camp Hill line. Over the years it has been normal to route express trains from Derby and the North East to Bristol and the South West via the Camp Hill line and avoid New Street in rush hours and Bank Holidays. The Camp Hill line has never been closed to passengers, only to stopping trains. Since the creation of the Cross-City line, they're changed the track formation, to allow for southbound electric locals to cross over the two middle lines to get into platform 4, and they've locked the doors going down to platforms 2 and 3.

Welcome aboard! Thanks so much! :)

If the service is kept as a Birmingham New St/Moor St to Kings Norton shuttle then yes battery power might not be a bad shout!

Remove the “best railway station” as it’s not

@@BBS7523 Never. It's a living museum and the only station that truly reminds you of a Golden Age of railways.

platform 6 is a tamanus

@@JustMyFish I think you mean 'terminus' but does it have a platform there as I think it's just a track and a wall next to it?

Thanks a lot :)

Except that he goes off on too many tangents. The histories of local areas and which bus services are being run just slow down the documentary, which could have made the same points in a quarter of the length.

@@alanfbrookes9771 nobody is perfect

Maybe there were looks into reopening it in the 1960s (which would surprise me given the general direction rail was going in the 60s!) but this video mostly referred to the more recent suggestions surrounding a reopening of the line

I’ve heard the 4tph frequency would have to remain when the Camp Hill Line terminates at Kings Norton :) Yeah forgot about Andy Street being the mayor of WM rather than Birmingham, to be honest most of what I hear of him is stuff about Birmingham rather than WM in general 😅

I don't think KNN is going to be the terminus of the Camphill line due to the complex north and south junction, not many people requiring the camp hill service and the timetabling is gonna be hell as train pass through the station from every 5 to 15 mins. I think that they should terminate train in like the worstershire area as they are less busy. (I am a Kings Norton local)

@@legoisthebest001SCR it will be - there are internal timetables that exist for the Camp Hill line, though future ambitions include extensions to Longbridge/Redditch (along with electrification). and yes the frequency was retained with the 20 minute gap used for turnaround for Camp Hills.

@@legoisthebest001SCR Yes, he forgets that when the pre-war circular service was run, it bypassed Kings Norton and ran around the Lifford Curve. There are no facilities to reverse trains at Kings Norton. It would make more sense for the trains to continue to Redditch, or along the Midland line to Worcester.

It depends on your dialect and the Brummie accent varies, most Brummie say Moseley only those with a deep accent which not many have now or Black Country people will call it Moserley, I am an actaul Brummie and I have always refered to it as Moseley

@@peterwilliamallen1063 Ditto Bordesley? Never heard "Bordersley".

It’s “moze-lee” and “Bordz-lee”. Great video though.

He makes quite a few mispronunciations of local names, including Bordesley, which should be pronounced Bordsley. I don't think he's a local man.

Had me thinking they were running a train to Nuneaton's Camp Hill 😂

@@charlie7cvMostly got one there because the line will be operated using 196s and they were running Nuneaton to Leamington Spa!

Cheers lol

😁

It is not pronounced " Mowslee" at all mate where did you get that from even in a deep Brummey accent it is pronounced "Moseley" and before you ask I am a Brummie and hve worked arround Moseley.

Not too sure really as I’m obviously not from Birmingham but I wonder whether a park & ride facility (or something of the sort) could ever be established at a station on the line to help minimise the number of people travelling into town by car and instead change onto a train? The 50 is a highly successful route, no question about it. Definitely a route I’ll be covering in the future. The thing is, just because a bus route is successful doesn’t mean train journeys shouldn’t be allowed to replace journeys currently made on those bus routes. A very good example of this I can think of is the 38 from Hackney and Clapton into London, an integrated ticketing system and an improved reliability and frequency on the North London Line makes it far more appealing to change at Highbury & Islington for the tube to reach Central London for anyone travelling from Dalston/Hackney/Balls Pond Road. As a result, (and probably due to the bendybus deconversion) the bus route has seen a drop in passenger numbers, but at least they’ve moved to other methods of faster transportation! :)

It will probably be another abandoned project due to cost 😂

Taking journeys off the bus routes will be a benefit in and of itself for many commuters, as at present the roads between these suburbs and the city centre are extremely tight and frequently congested. A rail option, with decent capacity, that removes the need for even a decent proportion of those journeys to be on the road, will free that route up quite substantially for the shorter distance bus and car journeys that you describe.

Thanks so much! :)

Thanks for that! I’m happy construction is going ahead and I think this will finally be the time for the stations to properly reopen and for a service to resume!

The spotting footage wasn’t actually my own, my good friend Laurence was with me some of that day and so he offered to let me use his footage! Due to time constraints, I didn’t really have much time to gather my own footage of the CrossCityLine and so I massively appreciate him letting me use his! 😁

Yes agreed, I’d argue the construction of the chords are more exciting and impacting than the reopening of the stations themselves!

This is being planned by Andy Street in his Transport for West Midlands Rail Plans for when HS2's Curzon Street Station Opens

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Glad you think so! 🙂

That would be extremely problematic I think when it comes to actually getting the trams onto the Camp Hill Line from street level, plus can the trams even share the same tracks with freight/any diverted XC services? You’d likely have to rebuild all station platforms and then there’s electrification at Kings Norton which would cause problems too, not sure if its worth going to all that effort

That is in the plans :)

I doubt new third rail is going to be built…see Kirkby to Headbolt Lane on Merseyrail. I suspect if electrification isn’t possible the long term goal if it won’t be diesel is battery operation

Moseley resident here. I'm sceptical that there would be a problem electrifying the line through the tunnel. This idea came up in a local forum, which later published images of a works train in the tunnel which suggested to me that there was plenty of clearance. The tunnel is very short and was only built by the Birmingham and Gloucester Railway in 1840 to reduce the impact of noise and smoke on the nearby St Mary's Church. I'm sure many local residents were unaware that a railway existed at this point before the hoardings went up for the station reconstruction. The Midland Railway, which took over the Birmingham and Gloucester, was given permission to remove the tunnel as early as the 1860s. The No 50 bus is certainly very frequent, but it's really not great to use at very busy times. I'm absolutely confident that the Camp Hill reopening will be extremely successful, even with the initial half-hourly service (just memorise the simple timetable and plan journeys to fit). However, it will really come into its own when the Bordesley chords are built. From Moseley it will be about ten minutes to Moor Street, which will be so close to the HS2 terminus that they will effectively be one station. From there, it will be about 45 minutes to Euston (and initially 38 minutes to Old Oak Common for the Elizabeth Line). Because the London media generally have no interest in what happens in Birmingham, the fact that the city (and surrounding region) is undergoing a remarkable rail renaissance passes largely under the national radar. The only downside I see to the Camp Hill reopening is that there is likely to be an increase in street parkng around the stations, as it's a deliberate choice not to provide park-and-ride.

It might make for a slightly easier roll out but it’s not the reason why the project is delayed

It'll eventually terminate at Moor Street which is next door to Curzon Street.

Curzon Street is prelimanarily a High Speed Train Service Station and is on the wrong alighnment to join to Camp Hill, instead of dreming up these silly concockshuns you need to live or visit Birmingham to see how things are, This line will terminate in Moor strett and as Moor Street has through Platforms these trains could even trvel onwards to Kidderminster and Worcester

@@peterwilliamallen1063I think there were suggestions that these could hook onto something else but nothing has really been said about it officially so figured best not to discuss it in the video!

@@somenorthlondoner It may not of been spoken officially nationally, but living in Birmingham we have heard a lot about these plans by Andy Street the West Midlands regional Mayor openly in our local papers and on the local TV news, Andy Street's plans are to when Birmingham Curzon Street opens is cosmeticaly enlarge Birmingham Moor street Station joining it to Birmigham Curzon Street and opening more platforms so turning Curzon Street Station/ Moor Street Station into a rail hub and building a new East Birmingham Rail Chord that would allow trains on the Camp Hill line to come into Moor Street Station, plus local trains from the Derby to Birmingham line to terminate at Moor Street station so freeing up capacity at Birmingham New Street Station. In these plans he not only is opening at least 3 new stations on the Camp Hill Line but is also reopening Castle Bromwich Station on the Birmingham to Derby Line and 2 Stations in the Coventry area, so bsicaly there are big plans for Birmingham Moor Street Station in the near Future

@@peterwilliamallen1063 No need to be so confrontational. I lived in Birmingham for three years. I have seen with my own eyes where the tracks of the Camp Hill line are directly adjacent to where the Curzon Street station is going. I said 'IF' the line terminates at New Street, a connection with Curzon Street would be nice, otherwise connecting passengers face a 10 minute walk from New Street to HS2. The only 'silly concockshun' here is your spelling.

They are a little but pathing is difficult in this instance

I think its safe to say it’ll be diesel given the project is meant to open soon and nothing in the way of battery rolling stock has been ordered! I only want this to come across respectfully but you’ve mostly repeated what other people have been picking me up on in the comments re my pronunciation and a mistake I made in my script, I appreciate the compliments but please know when the same criticism is being repeated it can become very draining to respond to. I’ve said this in all my other responses but I’m re visiting the area soon anyway so I’ll make sure to bear that in mind. Hopefully you still enjoyed the video nonetheless

@@somenorthlondoner Yes, yes, it was a good presentation and a good script, but getting the pronunciation of place names right is called "doing your homework", and it probably irks some locals!! But then we all probably say the odd words differently, so I wouldn't get too hung up on it. (Never heard "aforementioned" with the stress on the first syllable, actually, but there again, that sort of thing helps us all to be individuals!)

@@heckelphon Well I don’t quite know what you expect me to do about it now, quite a lot of people looked past that and nonetheless really enjoyed the video. I think I’ve made enough promises to be more careful with pronunciation.

@@somenorthlondoner I don't expect you to feel you need to do anything in retrospect. That wasn't my intention. You made a very good video with a good script. I was just explaining why some people living in the Birmingham area were critical of your mispronunciations. It might be as though in your neck of the woods someone was to call it "Free-ern Barnet" or "Haring-ee" or "Muzzle Hill". The UK is full of these Shibboleths -- think of Towcester or Bacup or many places in Norfolk. You just carry on and make more good videos for us all to enjoy, but do look in Wikipedia and familiarise yourself with the International Phonetic Alphabet over how to say place names when in doubt, and you'll be just fine! 🙂

@@heckelphon I completely get that, thanks for clarifying!

Dudley ish? 😂

Just below merry hill

@@somenorthlondoner It's pronounced "Briarlee Hill", and Moseley is "Mosley" with only one 'e' pronounced.

@@lloydpenfold486 thanks for that - those pronunciations will be useful for future videos!

@@somenorthlondoner Overall a good video, I'll look at more of yours. Oh, BTW, Kings Norton's platforms 2&3 are an 'Island platform'. 'Bay' platforms are the dead-end ones, like Moor Street's 5&6.

Thank you for this but I’m not from Birmingham as my username suggests! Sorry for the mispronunciation, hope that didn’t put you off the video though!

Not at all, I hope you do another video as it progresses

@@jiml6026 I will be returning soon to discuss another 2 or 3 projects coming soon, probably closer to the summer as days will be longer and so won’t be so confined for time when it comes to filming :)

Not too bad to be honest. The West London Orbital is set to cost around 400 so pretty decent value!

Why are Brits so frugal? £60m is absolutely nothing when it comes to things like this yet everyone clutches their pearls immediately at any figure quoted for infrastructure

@@lordgemini2376 Well said! :)

@@lordgemini2376 Because the Treasury looks at the cost, not the value.

@@lordgemini2376 because central government hates paying for anything (consider the fuss over the repairs to Hammersmith Bridge) and somehow that's catching. £60m is indeed bugger all for an infrastructure project.

Hopefully not, especially now stations are being constructed

Our Metro Mayor ndy Street will not cancell this project as he has had millions f pounds off the Government to upgrade the West Midlands Rail network into a transport Hub

Sorry to disappoint you, but the three new stations are already well on the way to completion.