Bitcoin Q&A: Lightning Network Game Theory

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Can the rules of the Lightning Network be updated easily? How does it use the consensus of Bitcoin? What are other implementations (Lit, Raiden)? What are the options for channel funding & creation? What is the benefit of commitment schemes? What are hashed timelocked contracts (HTLCs)? How does the mutual guarantee against cheating work? What prevents malicious use of the revocation key to steal coins?
CORRECTION: At 3:14, I incorrectly said that Poon-Dryja payment channels were the original specification for payment channels. Spillman (uni-directional) payment channels were proposed three years earlier through mailing list discussions. Poon-Dryja (bi-directional) payment channels are the design currently recommended in the BOLT specification: en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Payment_ch...
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0:00 Can the Lightning Network rules be changed and updated easily, unlike the Bitcoin blockchain, which requires super-majority consensus almost everyone must agree for simultaneous upgrade? Can groups of users use different variations of the channel rules and form a separate sub-network, with or without maintaining compatibility to the entire Lightning Network?
6:49 Why did the developers release the Lightning Network for mainnet before it was completed?
7:32 What would be the purpose of keeping a statement secret, then decrypting and revealing it later? Why hide and then reveal? What is the benefit? Please give us an example
9:51 Can you explain how the revocation key is only revealed if a commitment transaction is broadcast maliciously? What prevents a malicious Lightning node from intentionally dropping off the network, prompting an honest node to publish the last commitment transaction, then coming back online to publish the relocation key, and steal all the coins in the channel?
These questions are from the MOOC 9.6 session, the March and May monthly Patreon Q&A sessions, which took place on March 23rd, March 31st, and May 26th 2018 respectively. Andreas is a teaching fellow with the University of Nicosia. The first course in their Master of Science in Digital Currency degree, DFIN-511: Introduction to Digital Currencies, is offered for free as an open enrollment MOOC course to anyone interested in learning about the fundamental principles.
If you want early-access to talks and a chance to participate in the monthly live Q&As with Andreas, become a patron: / aantonop
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Andreas M. Antonopoulos is a technologist and serial entrepreneur who has become one of the most well-known and respected figures in bitcoin.
Follow on Twitter: @aantonop / aantonop
Website: antonopoulos.com/
He is the author of two books: “Mastering Bitcoin,” published by O’Reilly Media and considered the best technical guide to bitcoin; “The Internet of Money,” a book about why bitcoin matters.
THE INTERNET OF MONEY, v1: www.amazon.co.uk/Internet-Mon...
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3 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 32

@SimonBaxter 6 лет назад

Watched on the Brave browser!

@D100112 6 лет назад

Lightning rules!

@Lukas-kh5gu 6 лет назад

25 seconds in and I am already brain-dead. love it nonetheless.

@ziomanzo 6 лет назад

payment channels, the future of Bitcoin

@goldielocksposition 6 лет назад

Do you think Alice secretly wants to punish bob ?

@Brugllione 6 лет назад

Here is a question that I would love to hear your thoughts on, and hopefully there are more people interested to poke your brain on this one! So if you never read this, hopefully some one wants to post this question to your Q&A on patreon! Question: " If Bitcoin becomes widely adopted in the future, could a debate be started over code changes to introduce inflation? For example: They could convince a lot of people that we need inflation because a lot of coins are hoarded by a small group of people. Other arguments could be made ofcourse, and I fear a lot of people could easily be convinced by this. Do you think it is likely that this will happen eventually, and what do you think the outcome would be? " Sorry if the question is long, but this is something I think about a lot. Perhaps right now we have a fixed supply, but what if the majority of the world gets convinced that we need to change that in the future...

@RTFullPull 6 лет назад

Dude, think again and wright a new question. But start by getting into mining and how it works. you will feel better Best Seb

@Joeheadred 6 лет назад

Ok I got you. But instead of inflation why not just increase the amount? Instead of 21 million make it 100 million. But I don't think these ideas are even plausible. I Think lightening network and other tech improvements will make Bitcoin better. Consensus is key. Cheers.

@tradom5843 6 лет назад

+Brugllione 1 bitcoin is made of 100 million satoshis so that probably wont go too far.

@Skiddla 6 лет назад

i think the idea of inflation to counter hoarding is some flawed idea started by mainstream economists. i guess they think that if there isnt inflation that there wont be enough currency for each person or something? like the amount of people is greater than currency in circulation. well this could happen, but its not a bad thing, or a good thing, really it doesnt matter. if that happens, the value of the currency goes up, temporary deflation, it incentives hoarders to spend their temporarily appreciated currency's value before the other hoarders do, which will then regulate the value back down to whatever value is at equilibrium. ok now lets say that for some reason the hoarders dont spend, like maybe its lost coins/dollars whatever. in that case it also doesnt matter because then the currency is just worth more, and if there isnt enough currency for each person to own 1 of the lowest denomination, then we just create subdivisions of it, in the US dollar we call it the penny. each of these smaller denominations are then worth more. its just deflation. now the good thing with crypto is that these coins can be divided waaaaaay small into "The satoshi is currently the smallest unit of the bitcoin currency recorded on the block chain. It is a one hundred millionth of a single bitcoin (0.00000001 BTC)." so really your question about a debate is a nonfactor. in crypto, inflation isnt such a harsh evil since the generation of new coins isnt absolutely centralised, just dominated by some partys, but in government fiat currency it is extremely dangerous since who controls the creation of currency can steal value from all holders of the currency and even hyper inflate the currency to the point where the economy collapses. personally i cant stand people who are proponents of inflation. anything inflation claims to fix is countered by the damage it causes.

$@internalrefraction$

@internalrefraction 6 лет назад

And this is such an incredible point: the hard fork reality means that BTC can never really be inflated as the original question asker describes!

@dukeofkircaldy 6 лет назад

Otto Mann: "LIGHTING RULES!"

@nion456789 6 лет назад

Smashed the like

@chubitos 6 лет назад

2 questions about the lightning network: 1- is there a risk that the consensus rules of the basic layer changes and the pre signed closing channels transactions are not valid anymore? In that case both parts of the channel would have to agree to sign a new transaction and maybe one of them would ask for part of the funds they are not entitled to 2- how does Alice and Bob change signed transactions simultaneously? How does Alice can't receive Bob's pre signed transaction and refuses to send hers?

@francobridger1710 6 лет назад

Bitcoin investment is getting interesting.

@mencheswest8993 5 лет назад

damn last part was complex. i wish someone could put it on paper

@Tomyb15 6 лет назад

I know barely anything about lightning. Is it possible that, in the example, Alice isn't connected or available at the time Bob wants to cheat amd steal coins so that Alice was never aware of Bob's doings and can't use the time headstart she had om Bob to avoid the cheating? I ask because in bitcoin, you don't need to be online to receive money in a transaction. Does lighting require that?

@jackstarling1895 6 лет назад

Andreas, are you aware digibyte satisfies the need for decentralization and instant , scalable transactions, better than btc , bch or ltc?

@borrisbortrude8676 6 лет назад

Jack Starling what about network security?

@jackstarling1895 6 лет назад

alexjohnward how so? Can you elaborate?

@allnamesalrddyused 6 лет назад

Hey Andreas, With onchain fees hovering around 1sat/byte for months now, wouldn't it be good if wallets switch to sat/tx instead? Or atleast allowing fees of less then 1sat/byte (and round it up or something)? Or wouldn't that possible? I think it is more user friendly in general and let us explore how low onchain fees can go.

@jeffrome4008 6 лет назад

When is bitcoin going to evolve? Or can it really...

@DmSujaEntrepren 6 лет назад

Running a lightening node has a legal side that I'd like to see addresssed

@aantonop 6 лет назад

I addressed that in this video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-c4TjfaLgzj4.html (14m36s)

@gh0sthack3r32 6 лет назад

Sorry but don't believe lightning will solve all things in the universe, old school bitcoiner that want proof of work and secure fast payments.

@kabirali9114 6 лет назад

To help adoption, we have decided to make something that is complicated, even more complicated. Thanks BTC

@christo2690 6 лет назад

its all about the wallets man. the user doesnt have to see the complicated side of LN

@AlanBilsborough 6 лет назад

One of the big advantages of Lightning is that it doesn't affect layer 1 at all, if it doesn't work out Bitcoin is just the same as it was before and no doubt another layer 2 solution will be developed. Bitcoin always has and always will put security first, Lightning is a great example of improving technology without comprising security of your main Bitcoin holdings.