BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER 4X20 REACTION | First Time Watching 

“You’re exactly like Tony Robbins!” That line tickles me far more than it should. 😂

Yeah, Buffy more or less started it, and was pretty petty in LA. In her mind, though, I think Angel started it when he decided to protect Faith / told Buffy to back off. After everything that happened, I think Buffy was pretty emotionally disoriented, and was desperately trying to get the upper hand so that she could feel more in control. That came at Angel's expense in a way that was unfair to him, though. I loved Spike's shit-stirring in the episode. Especially the Tillow stuff: he clocked their relationship instantly (kind of like Faith), and then planted all the right seeds while sounding like he didn't have an accurate understanding of what it was he was "relaying," to deflect suspicion. This chip has certainly brought out Spike's creative side when it comes to doing damage, and I love it.

I'm with you, Buffy was definitely in the wrong and was being purposely hurtful during the Angel episode.

I always love how this one ep shows so well that angels character grew so much after getting his own show. He was always the the stoic or mature one in the relationship and I feel being away, having a group of equals around him allowed for him to relax and b dare I say it silly. ‘He started it’. Buffy would have never had a scene of Angel dancing terribly or singing Mandy😂

As a cis-het guy whose kittens just turned a year old: that kitten thing is not just lesbians lol They can always reset the cuteness scale.

Some interesting bits in this episode, highlights for me are Angel and Riley acting like jilted teenagers in Buffy's room, and the smug smile Angel gives Riley when she says she needs to talk to Angel alone. Also Giles being drunk and telling Buffy 'you'll get your arse kicked'. Buffy really hurts Willow and Xander when she says 'I guess that's why there is now ancient prophecy of the chosen one and her friends' after all they have done for her, and she has done for them. Some excellent work by Spike setting all the friends against each other like a modern day Iago from Othello, there was foreshadowing for this in The Earshot episode when Buffy was reading the students mind re Othello Play. Giles playing a great rendition of Freebird is of course the highlight.

Even though Buffy did start the issue what people forget, throughout the series, is how old Buffy is. She is 19 here and still loves Angel. He is the older party so he should be the more understanding one, which he is.

Buffy: 'he just spun my head a little' You: 'literally, by punching her in the face' Lol i was not prepared for that 😂

Buffy started it for sure

Got into debates over the Buffy and Angel about their Faith fight. With me siding on Angel's side, and other on Buffy's side. I find that interesting considering, in this episode, Buffy admits to being in the wrong about going down there for her vengeance, and how she treated Angel in the process. I do wonder if her realization has anything to do with Riley showing jealousy of Angel because of Xander's explanation. Jealousy Riley never really apologizes for because "I'm so in love with you I can't think straight" is him putting the weight of his jealousy actions on Buffy so he doesn't have to deal with the fact that he accused her of cheating, therefore still has those issues after their talk, not having properly apologize or allowing Buffy to understand his problem. Nothing was actually solved because of this. I like that Buffy gets to have a last word against The Scoobies in this episode. Usually during Scooby fights they make her feel so down and low they end up with the last word while not really having much of a point that doesn't have an easy argument someone could return; especially in _Dead Man's Party_ and _Revelations._ In this episode though, Buffy not only gets a last word, but does so in a way where she tells them they are acting like children and she doesn't understand why. The real issue is that one of S4's main themes has been the failure to keep the high school group together during college. It's a real life problem. In-universe, it's been happening since the first episode of the season; festering and growing ever since then. This episode is it's climax.

Yeah I'm with you on Buffy in LA, I think she had her reasons for going at Faith like that which are fair but the way she went about it all - just barging in, expecting Angel to agree with her just because, throwing Riley in his face just because - put her in the wrong ultimately. Also got to factor in that if Angel ever has a go at Buffy like at the end of the episode about how he feels, he remembers what happened in "I Will Remember You" while she doesn't so there's more pain there.

“They’re already talking about living together?” I believe they’re called U-HAUL lesbians.

1:11 It's only aboard a ship it is the brig. I don't think there's a special term for a military jail on land. Spike really is a master manipulator, he cannot hurt them physically but he can play on their insecurities. No friendships are perfect and Spike makes the little things that can be overcome seem much bigger.

You're not the only one who thought Buffy started it. Faith was gone, out of her hair, and she re-inserted herself back into the situation. And she did hit Angel first and made lots of hurtful comments, so she was completely in the wrong in my book.

I’m surprised Adam killed Forest so easily. Riley, Graham, and Forest are the most juiced up super soldiers they have. So it’s weird that he died so quick.

It's been a while since I watch these shows, and I don't like taking sides in these things because they are born from excessive and uncontrolled emotions where it's always best to simply work things through rather than place blame, but from rewatching it through your channel, Buffy certainly looks like she started it. Looked like she swung first both physically and verbally.

I gotta admit, I love seeing Angel whooping Riley's ass in this episode. I'm not a big Riley fan.

I think they're both right and wrong, not to cop out. On Angel, since it's his show, Buffy seemed more in the wrong. Since this is Buffy's show, Angel is giving her an apology for his part of it.

I'm a straight guy, but I have heard jokes about lesbians showing up with a U-Haul on the third date. Buffy never got over Angel leaving in the first place, so their fights are one big long continuation.

Already commented with my concurring opinion re: Buffy in your Angel reaction. Still avoiding spoils, so that's all you get (well, a thumb as well, I suppose.😁 )

You are so not alone on feeling Buffy was out of hand during and after the Faith meetup. I love these shows, especially the character development. I really like how they give them histories that explain various character traits they have, their secret inner selves that they never discuss but still affect their decision making processes, Buffy's ignored slayer abilities that similarly affect her attitides and reactions. So many things are built into the show that guide their actions and moods. Still, for that episode, I've always felt the writers dropped the ball and pushed her beyond what Buffy would do normally to get more drama out of the scenes to force Angel to similarly do a crossover. I get she would be mad at Faith and even let that anger spill over onto Angel, but it seemed especially vindictive, which just seemed like it was outside Buffy's wheelhouse. Or at least, they didn't direct the scenes to make that lashing out symc with everything else. So, I agree.

So ex boyfriend and current boyfriend are fighting who has a bigger p/nis while Spike is somewhere out there and he doesn't give a damn doing his own business. And I am there with him😄

The way they decided to write the narrative as Willow and Tara already being in a romantic/sexual relationship before ‘New Moon Rising’ and we were finding out at the same time Buffy and Oz was. Revealing to us that they were what we assumed them to be since ‘Who Are You’. Lovers and not just friends. That was a choice. We didn’t get no awkward “are they or aren’t they?” or “do I have feelings, do I not?” phase. We got them as a couple straight away and the only conflict was that the male ex was back basically forcing Willow to confess the truth anyway. And that confession was the first textual confirmation for us that Willow and Tara were in fact in a romantic/sexual relationship. Most shows that want to tell WLW storylines do not do it like that. I mean we usually get a coming out story and not just a coming out confession. We usually get the back and forthness between the characters first. And the decision to begin a romantic/sexual relationship is for us to see. We’re there for the entire story of how and when it happens. But Willow and Tara were not like that. They began their relationship behind-the-scenes and the audience only come to find out for sure at the same time other characters do. So then it has us wondering… when exactly did they begin a romantic/sexual relationship? What episode did they decide it? That’s where fanfiction comes in to fill the gaps. In fanfiction you can make a side storyline a main storyline. You can make a side character a main character. You can shift the perspective to wherever you want it to be in the show and elaborate on it. If you wanted to know more - fanfiction tells you more.

No. No you are not the only one. I was furious when I first saw this episode. I mean... I try not to be one for toxic masculinity... but Buffy was being a real bitch in LA.

Sander a tough guy? 🤣

She was about to smack angel twice lol.

In two episodes you will start the best season of Buffy ever. Can't wait!

You will not be able to predict how the season ends because the entire season was sent completely off the rails when the actress playing Maggie Walsh left the show. She was supposed to be the final villain and it's clear in the final episodes that they were scrambling to come up with anything they could do to finish this season without its primary villain.

A lot of people call out Buffy for behavior in season 1 episode 19. But no one is calling her out for her behavior in this episode. -She sat Riley down and told him that she's telling him the entire thing about Angel. But she intentionally left out crucial details about what turned him. -She then rushed off to see Angel and we know what happened there. -She then refused to even talk about what happened with her Angel visit when she got back. Leading to more suspicions. After all of that, she asks him "Have I given you any reason not to trust me?" Ummm...yeah Buffy. You intentionally chose to mislead him with information. That tends to make people lose trust in you.

“Why all the crazy?” “Because I’m so in love with you I can’t think straight.” Nope. This is not a “romantic” answer. It’s emotional abuse. You cannot use the excuse of your “love” for your partner to absolve yourself from your own destructive behaviour. It’s not your partner’s problem that you’re insecure about the way you believe they feel/don’t feel for you. That’s something you need to address and deal with, Riley. Not Buffy.

“So are they official?” They’ve been official for awhile. You mean are they out? Yes, they’re out.

Posting my BUFFY REWATCH recap for ‘The Yoko Factor’. May contain spoilers. So it's only been one episode since the big reveal and Willow and Tara are now so comfortable with each other that they're able to spend time together without involving magic. Playing with the new kitten that Tara has gotten, of which Willow already considers their pet, affectionately referring to it as 'ours', and Tara agrees. In fact Willow seems to be more invested in the relationship between them than Tara realizes as she proposes they share an off-campus living environment together. Tara automatically thought she'd just want to dorm with Buffy again, but Willow knows she's growing a part from her best friend and getting closer to and much more personal with her girlfriend. She figures sharing a living environment with her is the next step for them. She wants to live with Tara. It's a big step for them but one Willow is already well ready for despite the way Tara feels about it. Tara still thinks Buffy and the Gang is where Willow's head and heart is. But Willow's already in deep with what she feels for Tara. The way she sees it: They're both adults. They go to the same college. They're pretty much with each other every minute of the day anyway. It's more than logical for her to live with her. Miss Kitty Fantastico included. And when we get into the beginning of Season 5, we find out that's exactly what happens. As we follow their journey through the show, we continue to see Willow being far more invested in the relationship than Tara. Sometimes to an uncomfortable degree. She's always been a clinger due to always worrying she's going to lose the ones she loves. This is a huge insecurity for her that we learn more about as the show progresses. As their story develops. It's also in line to the way Riley feels about Buffy going into Season 5. The fact he believes that she does not love him. And he does some very extreme things to be as close to her as possible, to show his affection and commitment to her, fearing their relationship is really only one-sided. He is also a clinger. The way I interpret it: Codependency becomes an issue for both couples, and for Willow in particular, that's a big reason why she starts to abuse magic.

This is honestly the only full out Scooby argument that I can tolerate. Mostly because it’s bloody hilarious. But also because it fits within the narrative of the season with them being estranged from each other. So it feels necessary and organic for them to have a big fight like this. It doesn’t feel like drama for the sake of drama or shock for the sake of shock. But there’s other times where this is not the case and they go to town on Buffy. And it’s not acceptable at all. And the Scoobies are a pile of shit and Buffy would honestly be better off alone.

Did you notice how quickly Willow's face fell when proposing her and Tara apply for an off-campus living environment together and Tara responds with "Oh, I just figured you'd be dorming it up with Buffy again." Like she looked all excited at potentially living with Tara and granted some of the upset was because she knows her and Buffy are distant at the moment but you can tell it bothered her that Tara immediately assumed she'd want to live with Buffy. Almost as if she thought Tara thought she'd only be around until Buffy wanted to spend time with her again. As if Tara perceived it as she wasn't taking the romantic relationship she had with her seriously. I don't know. There's just something in that reaction of Willow's as soon as Tara mentions Buffy that makes me see the interaction they have this way. Like Willow's full steam ahead on the love train but Tara's sort of just expecting to get dropped off at the next stop when Buffy gets picked up. I wouldn't say it's jealousy because I don't think Tara is the jealous type but there's some discomfort there. Or maybe there isn't but from Willow's perspective there is. I don't know if I'm explaining this well. It's as if Tara is doubting that she loves her when Willow clearly is invested in what they have already otherwise she wouldn't be suggesting them moving into their own place together. Tara isn’t confident.

“Witch stuff? What exactly do you mean by WITCH STUFF?!” I love that line. This will be a recurring thing with Willow. She’s gay and she won’t let you think otherwise. Very defensive of her sexuality.

14:00 yeah imo they made a mistake with the crossovers this season in that they made the main character look better on their own show. Better for the interloper to not show their issues without the necessary background to forgive them. Use them as a straight-man observing the main cast’s issues and foibles from the POV of an outsider.

You’re the only reactor I’ve seen so far that’s reacted to that last scene the right way. Or rather, in the way where it actually is. Most reactors interpret that last scene as Riley has either switched sides to join Adam or been a double agent all along. You know, sometimes confirmation bias is a good thing. You knew Riley was a loose canon ready to do the stupid thing. And so you’re just like “knew it”. Absolutely nobody else that I’ve seen has reacted to that scene that way. They instead do a double take and immediately think Riley is the bad guy. I wonder why their mindset is that. 😒 Maybe they want him to be the bad guy. Maybe they’d think he was more interesting if he was just playing Buffy. But nope. Joe ‘cornfed Iowa boy’ Normal just wants to be Mr. Brave and Strong Hero like his girlfriend.