Can Diamonds Made In A Lab Replace Natural Ones? | Rise And Fall 

Diamonds are not rare, but Diamonds with color and clarity are insanely rare, close to 95%+ Diamonds which seems to be of Good color and clarity fail the test, and diamonds are not like oil or gold to be concentrated in particular area where you could setup huge rigs to mine, Earth Depths where these are found - Gold 1Km-4Km, Oil 1Km-6Km, Diamonds 150Kms-200Kms

What happened to the black boy in his 21 karat diamond?

I know somebody still have that diamond in their family

we have diamond factory ,i want to say one thing that making diamond jewelary is harder than gold , i can say process is very complicated ,diamond gone from various stages to look elated. and 35%of rough diamond are being wasted in making process. 8 to 10 stages are complied with diamond and they are interconnected. @pitervain6644 can you tell me price of 1 carate diamond in US market? not big ones , small diamonds per carat price?

Debeers had to be greedy and cosign on having children mine them. I'm fine w/ lab grown

Well explained

I use the cultured pearl analogy. Mikimoto built an empire on pearl manufacturing. The pearl divers of his time were calling his pearls fakes all the way to the unemployment line. A pearl is a pearl. A diamond is a diamond.

Same with a tree or plant that was grown in the wild vs one that was grown in a nursery. It’s the exact same thing, they were just grown in different ways.

It's just not the same thing. Chemically, yes. Mechanically, yes. But the process of growth and the rarity of the gems make natural diamonds more precious, and therefore more valuable.

@@baguazhang2 The only rare diamonds are very large like 4+ carat, nearly colorless, perfect cut and virtually no inclusions. The typical diamond that the general public would purchase are a dime a dozen. The only thing that makes them so expensive is a great marketing scheme,it is part of the culture to buy your wife a diamond ring, women are conditioned to expect it, it’s a scam.

If it gets cheaper it wouldn't be as precious and desirable

@@vishwanathasharma1409 people interested in Moissanite tend to value high sparkle at more affordable prices in their jewellery. Not whether it's precious or desirable.

@@user-kpkxgtj very few care about the actual looks of the jewelry, it's all about how much it costs or at least seems to cost to others. It's often subconscious, but essentially people want to wear and show off a pricetag. Manmade diamonds will eventually kill off the diamond mining industry, but not because people will prefer them, but because of them it'll be impossible to tell at a glance how much is on someone's finger, diamonds will stop being status symbols and if they are not that then what good are they for at all? People will find some other bling to show off.

I completely disagree relative to cost when you are looking at a high quality diamond especially when the carrots get larger you can buy junk diamonds for the same money as good quality man made diamonds but if you want good quality mine diamonds you're gonna pay big money

@@aleksandersuur9475 from this comment section it would seem natural diamonds are here to stay - people have a very strong emotional connection to the idea of natural diamonds and consider the lab grown ones to be fake. I'm actually shocked De Beers and Co haven't started a campaign that goes like "the only real diamonds are the mined kind and if it didn't cost half a year's salary it's not worth it". I agree, lots of people want to wear a huge price tag. I'm quite confident the players in the diamond trade will find a way to use that fact to keep business booming for a long time (calling natural diamonds an "investment" is already a popular strategy). As lab grown stones get cheaper (but with De Beers in the lab grown business who knows whether the prices will really go down significantly?) and Moissanite quality gets better, those who only want sparkle at the most cost-effective price are in for a treat.

I'm with you Sarah

Although i agree with you, most gems come from the global south, and therefore are probably mined in the same way diamonds are.

For me it's the physical properties. The hardest material... It always amazed me. But I would absolutely go for lab grown diamonds.

I agree. That’s why I picked a blue sapphire. I absolutely love it 🥰

Diamond goes well with any outfit and looks timeless. Colored stones are hard to pair. Pearls are occasional too.

why do africans put up with it?

south africans actually like working in piss poor conditions, otherwise they wouldnt do it

@@anarchyorslavery1616 no they dont theyre either forced to work or have no choice but to work in those conditions

@@anarchyorslavery1616 "poor people actually like being poor, otherwise they'd be rich"

@@JusdoinstuF are you being sarcastic or....

So you did it for price right? Because they just said lab grown diamonds still start from a small regular diamond

@@trentrockwell6598 Part of it was price, yes. The other part was because we wanted something that had no ethical problems.

@@epreston3245 but they start off from a regular diamond so it’s kind of a game of chance I don’t think there is a lot of things that don’t affect something else when you buy it on earth

@@trentrockwell6598 listen it again...the seeds can be from LAB GROWN or mined naturally she says just around 6:36..

You’ve been lied about accessibility of diamonds. We have a surplus of diamonds to the point that it’s value can literally be worthless mining company like da beers. Creates artificial scarcity to keep the price high. It’s all profit

What about other gemstones? Are their prizes justified?

send ur mail id

Environmentally, humanitarianly and even aesthetically, lab-grown diamonds are clearly superior. It’s unfortunate that due to the historically outstanding PR of the diamond trade, it’s so difficult to turn the tide of public perception. I hope we eventually make the transition as a society.

@@DocBree13 For luxury products it's all about marketing and perceived status gains. It's the same reason "hand made" and other signs of authenticity and scarcity that do not necessarily affect the quality of the emd product still demands a premium. People pay more because the fact that they can afford it and others cannot is a large part of the appeal.

i have heard that lab grown diamonds generally have fewer flaws than diamonds from nature. as with most status symbols, the difference between marketing and scams is a matter of perception. gold, silver and other gems are in the same category as diamonds. even "organic" food can be considered a marketing scam, as there is no clear definition and natural pathogens in food sometimes kill.

Then I need your help to review some of the stones I have

@@BlueMileWaves you can send them to international gemological institute and they will identify what your stones. There are in NYC

@@scratch945 How do I send it to them when I am in Nigeria?

I heard the natural one might be less pure?

@@Liquid-Lithium yes they have been able to make them high clarity but that not all ways the case. A high clarity natural stone is way more money then a high clarity lab grown

You were just way ahead of your times.

Gotta tell you the colored stone industry is full of corruption, drugs and death. Emeralds are the worst. The info about colored stones is well hidden from consumers..

My Grandma gave me the diamond out of her old engagement ring. It is real and my fiancée loves it. Personally I don’t see the appeal either. I’m just glad I got a free one because they’re way overpriced

@@clamier she is not just ahead but also waay backward because colored gemstones are used for engagement for centuries

You're not alone my friend. I told a jeweler that I wanted an opal ring and she gave me this very long spiel about how diamonds are better because they last forever, don't break, don't have to be replaced, blah blah blah. The problem is, they still fall out of their settings and you do have to sometimes replace them. So what's the difference between replacing a pricey small diamond and an affordable opal?

But its a one time investment for a ring that lasts decades and for generations. Versus clothing that you buy that gets replaced every other month or the thousands of cows that you eat through your life time or the amount of animals you slaughter for the leather in your car seats. Its all about perspective

@@sew_gal7340 Not if it is a symbol of centuries of abuse and oppression. You've got human blood on your hands now and you want to pass it to the next generation? How could you?

@@sew_gal7340 I think I failed in communicating my central point: having a diamond indeed could last for many many generations, and provide lifetime meaning to the recipient. No question. But what is so valuable about a natural diamond which, in practice means it has at least some flaw in it, versus a perfect stone made by science and engineering? And requiring such a huge premium, which in turn causes misery to a huge part of the world. By all means buy the diamond, but make it a synthesized diamond with no money flowing through companies like De Beers. And like the relationship a bride and groom dream of, it is perfect!

@@marcmckenzie5110 I enjoyed reading your response, thanks for being so reasonable and you actually convinced me to rethink my position! Thanks!

@@syrupybrandy2788 I agree with your first part, i was just saying there is no difference between a "blood" diamond, and that H&M shirt that you bought and continue to buy consistently throughout the years. The only difference is that with the diamond you've only exploited once, with the clothing industry you continue to exploit poor and underpaid children. I'm not saying youre wrong, i'm just saying it seems hypocritical of these documentaries to make it seem like diamonds are so evil when the fast fashion industry is 100x worse with not only abuse of the poor but of the environment as well.

Like what? What are some key points we should be aware of, or avoid?

Blood diamond perhaps

He is talking 99% are fake diamond You purchase

Why not make youtube videos to educate?

Marvin Kwidzinski I'm curious...and ready to learn! Teach!

Neither is true of art galleries and new artist painters. But it's one of the main arteries of money laundering, so...

Cause they need to buy all the diamond mines they can. Their company is built using a monopoly structure with advertising to make people think they are rare. Their brainwashing of the population and the rarity of diamonds is slowly being worn down. But will still be long time before it's gone if ever.

i think red diamonds in particular are in oz and those are the most valuable of all diamonds just due to scarcity.

Did you tell her where her smartphone comes from?

You know you didn’t have to get her a conflict diamond, right?

@@jamesbizs Lol, you talk like it's something you can guarantee. Conflict diamonds are constantly smuggled across the border and mixed in with other diamonds to hide their origins.

@@jamesbizs Tanzanites are conflict free

@@jamesbizs There aren't any diamonds on the ring

He did very well same make up!

That's awesome!

Oof

I’m sorry for your loss 😞

She may have changed her mind. I certainly have. I feel a lot different about diamonds now than how I did years ago!

Hopefully she's enjoying a beautiful diamond.

And one of the longest running shams. I think because of the internet, many shams are being exposed....because it's easier to piece things together. And easy...with a few clicks...so people delve.

Gold and sliver are better investments

🤣🤣🤣😭 25k for a ring. That's absolutely delusional.

I also bought lab engagement ring 1.38ct for $1k 18k white gold

And once worn even that $4500 ring is now only worth a couple of $100 at best. Diamonds are massively marked up, it's silly.

@Plague Doctor "Not all" doesn't mean it's a precisely favourable ratio. 'Not all' southern slaveowners mistreated their slaves. 'Not all' age of sail pirates brutally killed every crewmember in a boarded ship. 'Not all' zebra steak comes from illegal poaching. See how bloody stupid your argument sounds?

No one forces you to buy a conflict diamond. And if you’re going to buy a lab grown diamond, you might as well buy some other stone. Diamonds are special because they aren’t lab grown. Otherwise they are just pieces of “glass”

Tell that to the Indian guy working for $50 a month making them. Where you think the majority of Lab diamonds come from? Defenitly not 1st world nations for profitable reasons.

@@jamesbizs Lmao, a diamond is a diamond. Unless you're a collector or obsessed with which mine the diamond is from, then it doesn't matter if it's lab grown or not.

@@user-ft3jq5vi2l well, they are the Plague Doctor. so it's unsurprising that their argument is in favor of death

interesting

This has nothing to do with what's beautiful but how you can control an industry. For example, 75% of pearls sold aren't natural, they are cultured.

That's not true. Moissanite lasts longer than diamonds. Diamonds are not that, though and they chip and crack pretty easily. Moissanite is thougher than diamonds, it is more beautiful than diamonds and for a fraction of the cost.

@@jadmsaber1 to be correct diamond has a hardness 10 grade and moissanite is 9.25 on the scale. so it isn't tougher. But i would still buy a moissanite or maybe just maybe when i ever would buy one I'd buy a grown diamond

@@NaziemSaki To correct you back, a material's durability consists of hardness, toughness and stability. First, Hardness is how much a material can resist scratches and wear, and it is ranked on the Mohs scale from 1 to 10. Diamonds are 10 the hardest and moissanite 9.25 the second hardest on the earth. Second, thoughness is a material ability to withstand pressure and force applied to it before it cracks. Moissanite is remarkably tougher than diamonds, as it can survive direct hits without breaking or shipping. In contrast, diamonds are brittle and can easily crack because they have a weak direction of cleavage. Third, stability is a material ability to resist chemicals, dust, oils etc. Moissanite is not affected by most household chemicals and repels dust and oils, while diamonds can be damaged by multiple household chemicals and attract dust and oils. So, in summary, when it comes to durability, moissanite outranks diamonds in the two most essential parts toughness and stability.

@@NaziemSaki to summarize for the guy above: just because you read the brochure doesn’t mean you understand anything about gems

@@jadmsaber1 thank you for the concise explanation! I had no idea about moissanite and think I'll have to look into it 💖 I love some lapis, chevron amethyst, ruby in fuchite, bismuth, rainbow moonstone, blue fire labradorite, opal, alexandrite! I've always been a rock nerd lool 🤓

Rubies, sapphires and emerald of quality are far more expensive per carat than diamonds.

Emeralds and rubies are the elite of the stones..diamonds don't come anywhere near it.

@@reneepypiak5427 for a premium quality of those big three they are more expensive than diamond. Medium and decent quality ones (color not that amazing but still beautiful) are cheaper than flawless diamond

When the standard African family has 8 kid's each it is the diamonds that are keeping the population down which is exactly what we need to do

i would say they should still cost more than other gemstones because they are scratch resistant and sparkle more.

There's a chemical difference of 1 element. Im no pro but saw on google that the natural one is the prefered for the beauty category. It's allure. I had bought some in the day, now im just after gold. bitcoin is a porn scarce. i dont invest on spun.

Not only more beautiful and sparkly than diamonnds, Moissanite is also thougher than diamonds. It actually outperforms diamonds or any other similar gemstones in every aspect.

The optical properties of moissanite are just flat out better than diamond, unless you prefer less color and brilliance.

I agree, Moissanite is a great substitute for diamonds.

When my partner told me he was planning on giving me an engagement ring, I asked him not to give diamonds. After carefully considering other gems, I decided to go for a classy one, a 0.5ct moissanite. Only a fraction of the price of a lab grown diamond. No family or friends know that it is not a real diamond. Besides, no one really cares anyway.

I’d rather a lab grown diamond over moissanite, if i were looking for alternatives i’d get a lab grown sapphire

That's the right way to look at it. Society needs to look at all things we purchase that way. Ethical purchasing.

if u paid more than $300/ct for it u got raped

@Alyssa Taylor, hmm now i feel like exchanging my diamond for a lab grown one🤔. About to propose soon so i have to decide quickly😂

please send ur email we are manufacturer

@@pravjayaexports1759 I'm sorry, but I work for a corporation. I would not be able to be a customer for you.

Sounds great! Do you have the stable supplier of Lab Grown Diamonds? 😁

@@howyoudoin2733 Cool as Ice.

@Plague Doctor fair enough lmao

Yeah like corona pandemic

Google why corn flakes were made and the ad campaign behind it

Like MAINSTREAM media

Yes! I don’t understand why people are so against lab grown. You are right that they are chemically the same, so why all the hate? The only difference is where they come from!!! People need to get over it and stop knocking labs. Have fun with your overpriced blood diamond, I’ll stick with a non-conflict one that experts can’t even tell isn’t mined💁🏻‍♀️

Lab growns are better in most ways. But I'm biased as a chemist.

More brilliant, sparkly, more fire.

But you have no resale value for lab diamonds

@@LordBagdanoff who gives a rats ass, don't overpay, don't overpay

Your much better off taking the savings from the first lab diamond, investing it in financial instruments and then by the time you want to upgrade your can get whatever you want. Diamonds are not investments

Yes, the price depends on the market!😁

Scientific use diamonds are cheap

FYI, not all opals are ethically sourced either, so please do your research before purchasing one. They're also very soft compared to diamonds and other stones like rubies, so they may become scratched and dull overtime

My ring is diamond but I didn't want some huge rock on my finger.. I have a nice beautiful cut smaller stone.. Think it was $300, didn't want a big wedding either 🤣

Why do you guys need stones to symbolize your love?

@@taureansun1501 why not?

@@MsLouie76 cus its unnecessary expensive and almost always sourced from child labour. If you need a rock to rock as a symbol of proof of love from a man, to me that's kinda sad. Also aren't rings enough? Why must it have a diamond or precious stone? But I guess that's just me.

That's kinda unsettling honestly.

but real diamond does not hold their value anyway. not in the same level as gold. but gold is not as expensive. so buying real diamond is not worth it.

There’s no way to predict the color or quality. Also, cremation jewelry ends up in thrift stores eventually when people die and whoever cleans out their home doesn’t know what it is. I’d rather have my loved one’s ashes scattered or interred.

I'd love to see the look on that thief's face when he tries to sell that diamond !!! You got the last laugh....

Not when the bottom falls out of the natural diamond market. Rich people want diamonds because they *"hold their value"...used to. I'm no expert, but aren't we seeing a continued slide in the value of natural diamonds? As more people become aware of lab-grown diamonds and of the conspiracy to prop up the diamond market, the public will buy more lab-grown diamonds. Afterall, costs less and more fire and about the same hardness.

Apparently there is currently no test that can distinguish between natural and lab grown. Rich people will stop buying "new" diamonds, and stick to stones that have a well documented provenance.

@@PLuMUK54Moissanite has far more fire so that should be easy enough to see.

Natural diamond and from lab dificult to see difference

@@bennyirawan5086 Shine a flashlight on the two and the lab-grown will project more spectrum around it, more fire by a lot.

Millions suffer to make one man rich

They also hold no resale value. Very few want a used diamond.

there are such things are rare rocks. but diamonds aren't one of them

Uhm diamonds are not rocks. They are gemstones made up of strictly carbon. Rocks are made up of multiple minerals.

@@billyyank5807 ok, Bill Nye. They still aren’t rare.

Yes, lab-grown diamond is cheaper and greener!👍 I make customized accessories! Would you like to make a technique gift to yourself, lover, parents or friends? Such as a 1CT, E(color), VS1(clarity), 3EX(Cut), only costs $740! I also can provide you GIA or IGI certificate, which totally costs $850~980. And I have pink, blue, and yellow diamonds! Besides the round shape, I also have oval, pear, princess, marquise shapes. If you want to make a customized earrings, bracelet, necklace, or ring, you can call me! For the first customized item, I can give you a 20% discount of the labor costs. And it only takes 15 days to complete the production. If you only have some ideas about the gift, never mind! I can provide you the free design! Looking forward to your kind reply!

Nonsense. you couldnt even get the I3 in 2ct for near that price, even if it was stolen.

Truth! There’s no resale value with a diamond - they always go down in price. That’s why you can get a great deal at pawn shops or second hand stores.

Because that wasn’t the point of the video

@@somerandy3062 Even lab made diamonds don't go that cheap in 2ct sizes

Actually, it may have been 1 carat that she got looking back at it now, my bad. The design was from the nineties and while she loves it some people in our family called it "dated" so that possibly got her that good of a deal as well.

👍

Your still paying thousands for lab made diamonds might as well go for cz

No scope for illicit activities lab made diamonds ? In your wettest dreams. Just think about the post-manufacturing possibilities of selling them under the tax radar. Small and therefore easy to smuggle. The possibilities are endless.

@@DavidM2002 you think on my wavelength my friend lol

lab grown diamonds are cheaper and greener! A nice choice! I make customized accessories with Lab Grown Diamonds! Would you like to make a technique gift to yourself, lover or parents? Such as a 1CT, E(color), VS1(clarity), 3EX(Cut), only costs $740! I also can provide you GIA or IGI certificate, which totally costs $850~980. And I have pink, blue, and yellow diamonds! Besides the round shape, I also have oval, pear, princess, marquise shapes. If you want to make a customized earrings, bracelet, necklace, or ring, you can call me! For the first customized item, I can give you a 20% discount of the labor costs. And it only takes 15 days to complete the production. If you only have some ideas about the gift, never mind! I can provide you the free design! Please follow us! Looking forward to your kind reply!

you accepted the fake?

@@xpengfangirl7942 lmao do you think lab diamonds are fake? Fruit might as well be fake too because all of the engineering we have done to them

@@graceross4888 thanks Grace, this kind of research is important to china, we will now just copy everything, then say it is the same, thank you

@@xpengfangirl7942 glad I could serve our Chinese overlords ;)

But there’s no resale value

Exactly, she apparently did no price checks before making this video. They started at even more expensive when they first came out.

Not true, lab diamonds presently much less expensive than the same quality natural mined diamond. Has been for a few years. And the lab prices are expected to continue to drop and it gets less and less expensive to manufacture them and the market gets more saturated.

@@juliaballaron2684 Same quality? That isn’t a equal comparison. That’s like saying a gold nugget you found when mining isn’t as pretty as a gold bar. Well of course a gold nugget from the earth isn’t going to look like a forged gold bar.

@@TankTheSpank I've also observed no significant price differences between natural and lab grown diamonds so I wonder where people are getting all these dirt cheap lab diamonds 🤔

I want to find one of the "worthless" used lab grown diamonds. Please - where are they?

Exactly

Highly underrated comment 💯 👏

I get compliments on my $20 fake 3ct purple quartz looking ring all the time too. It’s all about showing off like you spent $ 80,000. If you live a lifestyle where you can get people to believe it could be real, I guess. Otherwise people who know about diamond prices just guess it’s fake. You can get a natural diamond for $3500.

Sounds great! Spent less money but got the same effect!👍 I make customized accessories! Would you like to make a technique gift to yourself or parents also? Such as a 1CT, E(color), VS1(clarity), 3EX(Cut), only costs $740! I also can provide you GIA or IGI certificate, which totally costs $850~980. And I have pink, blue, and yellow diamonds! Besides the round shape, I also have oval, pear, princess, marquise shapes. If you want to make a customized earrings, bracelet, necklace, or ring, you can call me! For the first customized item, I can give you a 20% discount of the labor costs. And it only takes 15 days to complete the production. If you only have some ideas about the gift, never mind! I can provide you the free design! Please follow us! Looking forward to your kind reply!😁

Diamonds belong in saw's not rings. There are way cooler gems that are better and cheaper, people seem to fall for anything they made brown diamonds the cheapest type "chocolate" and sold them at stupidly high costs.

You say women but the early marketing actually targeted only men, saying “it’s not an engagement ring without a diamond”, creating the “two months salary” norm to prove men’s wealth or success. Early marketing towards women actually failed, because the buyers were mostly only men gifting women diamond jewelry (especially rings).

@@gundamator4709 EXACTLY ... ONLY USELESS WHEN SOMEONE WEARS THEM ..

Yeah diamonds are not that rare

Not just women. Men too. Women weren't the ones buying them. But I agree with you they are total scams

Not true, since the pandemic our sales have gold and diamonds have dramatically increased to record numbers.

Nope. The demand just moved to asia 😁

Fire Opal is the one true gem for me

Black opal and crystal opal are both amazing in their own ways too.

Yes and I like blue color

Opals are beautiful just like diamonds i like them both 💎💎💎✨

And it comes in multiple colours too 🤩

Just like any and everything else in white history, the bloodshed of black/brown people is a footnote when speaking on the greater scheme of things (greed, power, control). Basically, im surprised it was given the few sentences it did🤷🏿💯

Unfortunately.. there will also be a market where the value of the diamond will be higher as the number of hands it costed goes up. Such is human nature.

@@bruthabrandon2966 ​ wow twisting my comment. If you want to look at the history of greed and bloodshed, be my guest. But miss me with this racial hyping stuff. Human history is steeped in blood from devaluing human life. We're only experiencing one slice of it atm. The whole dynamic needs to stop.

Excellent idea!👍 I make customized accessories with Lab Grown Diamonds! Would you like to make a technique gift to yourself, lover or parents? Such as a 1CT, E(color), VS1(clarity), 3EX(Cut), only costs $740! I also can provide you GIA or IGI certificate, which totally costs $850~980. And I have pink, blue, and yellow diamonds! Besides the round shape, I also have oval, pear, princess, marquise shapes. If you want to make a customized earrings, bracelet, necklace, or ring, you can call me! For the first customized item, I can give you a 20% discount of the labor costs. And it only takes 15 days to complete the production. If you only have some ideas about the gift, never mind! I can provide you the free design! Please follow us! Looking forward to your kind reply!

Yes, dear! But the Lab Grown Diamonds are green! How's your idea?😁

Diamonds are stones

For real my sista what!!??? I’m headed to the website now! Good looking out! 🙌🏾💍

Diamonds are white, the color that represents purity(although it's also an easier color to dirty, whatever that means.) There's a reason it caught on. All the same, I think other colors would be cool. Diamonds are a bit boring.

And the white wedding gown never existed until Queen Victoria wore one to be easily seen, because she was very short. Brides are pitching fits, making demands, and people are going into debt over “traditions” that aren’t even traditions.

It's easy when you are blinded by it's beauty.

No way will lab diamonds be more in the future. They are mass-producing in at an extraordinary rate, also manufacturing processes have become cheaper to make . No jeweller will buy a lab diamond from a customer

THIS. Where in the actual F are these decent jobs?! This is over $30 hr, and we have a minimum wage outcry? Doesn't add up.

so far, wait few years

I'll give you $15 for it

I mean, real diamonds also have next to no resale value

If you buy jewellery or outright stones as an investment you're dumb. They have almost always had a terrible resale value. So much so that companies discourge people by telling them their cheap if they try to and should keep them forever.

@@mateuszcielas3362 There is no "few years". It's a man made commodity now and it's supply is no longer monopolised by the few mines around the world. It's price is only going to continue to drop.