What a disaster! Watch the full video to find out just what happened and how I managed to still grab second place in my category. It’s time to figure out this problem and hopefully find out why it happened.
As annoying as it is to have such Problems, im just glad you and Paul Aston bring out videos about real problems with bikes, unlike most magazines/websites
Proper good old school race vid vibes! Nothing better than watching you hurtle through the trees and slop at speeds I can only dream of, keep up the class work man 🤌🤌
New to your content Lewis, but loving it. You're a top man and although you were clearly not happy with the issues during the race, you managed to keep your cool much more than I would have done. Well done on the podium 👍
Lewis, fantastic chain less riding! I'm sure someone has said this, but just in case. I am suspicious that your problem is with the setup on the transmission. Since it doesn't have the normal adjustments, the last step of transmission setup requires you to manually set the derailleur cage position. SRAM says changes to the drivetrain, and I'm guessing the shock change, might require you to do this again. When I first installed mine, I encountered dropped chain, and I had to redo the setup, since then it's been flawless. If that is something you want to try, it's pretty straightforward. Best of luck!
Presuming you mean B-axle tension, provided the chain is being tensioned properly to begin with, that shouldn’t cause the issue since once the chain rolls over the cassette the tension is between that and the idler. Or from the chainring to the idler if you were to pedal backwards, either way as long as the chain is tensioned it should stay on. (Unless I’m misunderstanding you)
Hey! Some of the terminology might be going over my head. I know that the Transmission did away with the B Tension screw and adjustment. In the final step of setting up the transmission you have left the derailleur hanger loose, and you pull the derailleur body towards the back of the bike so the chain is tight, and then you torque down the derailleur. In my installation, I hadn’t done this properly and was dropping my chain off the chainring. Once I redid this step properly, I’ve not dropped a chain again.
Appreciate honest reviews 👍 I hope the manufacturer contacts you to resolve this issue. If my £5k bike was damaged through no fault of my own I would be furious.
Not trying to trigger anyone but thats not a standard slash he had put on his own suspension or am I missing something? This could definitely effect the chain?
Well done mate, second place, no bad with those problems you have with that bike🥳 yeah you are absolutely right to tell people the truth about all the bikes🤙🏻
I work in the bike industry along with two of my friends who just got the new slash 9, one of them dropped his chain multiple times throughout the day yesterday, as we work in the local bike shop we have close ties with some folk over at MRP. So hopefully soon there should be a solution to this problem, as we will be sure to express our input. You really would think that Trek would've sorted something that my friend experienced within the first 2 days of riding.
Yeah Ive only seen it come off the lower idler, though I'm sure riding for extended periods without replacing it would cause it to come off the higher one as well. I just wish MRP would've puut a chain guide over that bottom pulley like what they have on their standard chain guides. I understand that it would add extra weight and make it more difficult to work on, but in my opinion that would be a super simple fix to this problem.@@0x0x66
Appreciate this honest vid. So many people spend hard earned money on these expensive bikes these days and it’s a real bummer if they don’t perform. Hopefully you get some answers soon.
Could be the transmission rear mech… I know they need reset sometime after a knock, it’s just a case of loosing the rear axle and letting the mech fall back into place. I’m not 100% sure it is, but it’s worth a check.
Its refreshing to see actual reviews (or not reviews) of these bikes, rather than the "promotional" videos posted elsewhere. Im not a fan of trek bikes anyway, so doesnt really affect my decisions to buy regardless, but this sort of honest reporting is just we actual buyers need. Keep it up, and anyone shouting you down for doing so is just odd!
I've had 3 high pivot bikes going back to 2010. 2 canfield jedi (26" followed by 27.5") and now a norco range. The canfield bikes worked very well minus a few minor naggles not worth mentioning. The range has been a nightmare. I do feel a big difference but it brings both pros and cons. The norco in a size medium has you too forward in the bike imo, chainstay is too long. The balance makes some maneuvering more difficult (like jumps, jibs, popping over obstacles). With the range... I've had (and seen on forums I'm not alone): -Eats an idler every 250-500 miles, can't get new ones for 6mo+ during covid, bike was down 9 months at one point. They are cheap when you can get them, but supply is extremely limited to this day. -convoluted cable routing makes a cable dropper frustrating to adjust saddle height and the spring tension on the rear mech has difficulty overcoming the cable tension - axs solved this problem after 700 miles of adjusting/replacing cables. -tons of cable rattle unless you line the cables that remain with foam wrap -bad geo imo -poorly manufactured/designed - cable grommets are loose, cut outs for cables was wrong in the frame, pinching the cables, frame protection doesn't work (chain slap hits the carbon - wearing it out) -did not like the factory shock/tune at all. ttx22m worked better out of the box (by a landslide) -Norco support has been CRAP. I'm probably forgetting a few things, but it's been a very frustrating ownership experience.
@@LewisBuchanan I'm hoping to get another high pivot in the future, and the slash is/was on my list, but this video was very PTSD inducing (reminiscent of a few bad days I had on the range)... let's see if the slash's problem(s) will be solvable! Looking forward to your next drop :)
Would be interesting to see you test something on the other end of the spectrum and compare. Something super simple, single pivot like a starling twist or murmer.
Dude, I appreciate your take that a bike should work when you buy it. It's a reasonable expectation. These bikes are a damn fortune to buy, they should work out of the box. I'd love to see this content continue. It's great to see real feedback about these frames. I hope you continue to get the resources to do this kind of work.
They do and they do really well. They don’t when you don’t set it up correctly. Still not sure how he managed to get a bike directly from track when they don’t do buyer direct.
@@Jeff-hz7xbagree why does no one mention that the bike is not standard? Different suspension he probably didn’t set it up right can’t blame the bike then.
It was great to see you racing again but the mechanical issues really suck. I was in the market for a Mullet enduro bike and went with a canyon torque, after seeing this I feel like that was a great decision.
Check the clutch on the rear derailleur. I was throwing the chain on rides and found out my clutch was sticking and the spring needed to be tightened and the b-screw adjusted. It is not high-pivot multi pulley system. Lots of moving parts there. Good luck. I'm sure you will figure it out.
I had this issue on a traditional low pivot bike and I was noticing that the underside of the chainstay was absolutely SHREDDED from the chain flapping against it when I was in my highest gears hitting rougher stuff. and I noticed that with the bike in it's lowest gear (biggest gear, and therefore least amount of chain slack in the system), there was a HUGE range of motion left in the derailleur cage, so I took out 2 links out of my chain (which still left about an inch of movement in the cage when in the lowest gear, which seems to me to mean they shipped it with the chain far with too many links), tightened the resistance on my derailleur cage until I could JUST start to tell i added tension through my shift lever feel, and it has completely solved my issue. I'm not sure if the high pivot introduce enough new variables to render my solution moot, but It might be worth a try! it looked like you had basically no tension on you derailleur clutch.
When I encounter these types of advancements in bicycles, my initial reaction is one of interest, but I tend to gravitate towards established, time-tested solutions.
All that drama for a difference you can't even notice.🤣 It might be the answer in DH but its hard to see the benefit anywhere else. Keep up the good work Lewis.👍
Its acting more like your sram transmission derailleur got loose and detentioned the chain. My transmission on a nukeproof giga though and the chain has never come off. Just slaps a lot and starts to shift bad. I had to put the derailleur in the alignment cog then loosen axle, loosen derailleur, pull the derailleur back, retighten derailleur extremely tight, tighten axle. Then shifting mint, no chain slap, no derailleur loosening up again.
I had the exact same problem with my high pivot Norco Shore. It would constantly come off the pulley and get jammed inside by the frame. Ended up buying a different idler pulley that comes on a Forbidden Dreadnaught and it seemed to work better, although it still sometimes slips off. The newer pulley featured the "big tooth small tooth" which I assume made the difference between the OEM Norco one which had standard teeth.
My friend had the same problem with his Shore. Norco provide free of charge a new tighter chain guide to help with this as it is a known problem. He also installed a STFU, which completely solved the issue.
Hey Lewis, My Forbidden Dreadnought has had some interesting issues as well… it’s because B tension and Chainguide tension are independent are hard to setup and leaves room for the chain to come off. I have to reduce chain length.
Good advice. That is what I was thinking... also check to make sure the clutch tension is correct on the rear derailleur. I was throwing the chain on my non-high pivot bike on the back pedal. I fiddled w everything until I finally cleaned and regreased the spring in there. These multi-pulley rigs make the set up even more difficult to get right.
Well done on the race! It could be the rear mech. Try to loosen the rear axel and then pull back on the mech and tighten the mech from the drive side, think it's an 8mm hex. Hope it helps.
@@BasicBodThor Im a trek dealer and have been in the industry for 5 years as a mechanic not all bikes come perfect out the box regardless of manufacturer. Generally most boxed bikes require indexing of gears, check spoke tension and a bit of light assembly.
I would maybe suggest the chain isn’t getting enough tension from the clutch in the mech which lead to the chain coming off over bumps and harsh impacts because the mech isn’t providing the tension the chain needs if that makes sense. I believe with the new sram mechs you can change the tension of the clutch to make it stronger or weaker,
That idler is never going to work when it’s between the main sprocket and the derailleur. If you watch slowmo vids of the chain on a mtb, that section is always bouncing loosely from the derailleur. Other idlers don’t drop their chain because the idler is mounted after the main sprocket and before the cassette, which always stays under tension. That bottom section of chain slaps around like crazy when things get bumpy, and with nothing to retain it on that idler it’s just going to bounce off.
Hey bud, as some one below suggested, my first thought would be to take off 1-2 links, could also adjust the B screw a bit for extra tension. Other then that i can only think of some missalignment. Try som STFU chain guids on the seatstay maybe. But my bet would be with to much chain slack. Sit on her and feel how much slack you get at sag, my bet is to much😅 Hope you can figuer it out ✌️🙏🏻
Sick riding bro, always enjoy ur vids.. Sorry to hear about the troubles on the new bike.. The first thing I think I would try would be to start shorting the chain 2 links at a time and re test.. get it as tight as possible. Could have something to do with the swapping of the suspension. Rear shock working different then stock maybe.. Hard to say.. Also make sure ur clutch on ur dee is working right as well..sometimes those can have issues. U were ripping in the race man, bike looks like it suits u if u can get the bugs worked out... Good luck..
I wonder if as a last resort during a race you could take a few links out of the chain so it has more derailleur tension and then you just couldn't shift into the easiest couple gears. Like purposely make the chain to short? Might not help but might be worth a shot between stages if having problems. Hope you get it sorted!
I would never buy a high pivot bike. Apart from looking 💩The chain constantly coming off or jamming would piss me right off, especially when you fork out that much dough and its not even reliable.. Nothing wrong with the standard way.. If it ain't broke dont fix it. Besides ive always thought trek were overpriced, over rated and under specced for the money they charge.
The problem with that kind of setup is there's nothing tensioning the chain between the upper cassette and the forward chain rings when there's no pedalling putting the chain under load, so there are more chances for the chain to jump off the upper rings with small teeth.
I’m curious to Treks solution. I have a Slash 9 as well, and my theory is the AXS could have been setup wrong or swapping the cassette to a new wheel created a slight adjustment. I faced this issue. The transmission is really finicky on this model likely due to the high pivot chain routing. I think the idler chain guard leaves too much room for the chain to slip off, and they need to redesign it with a few mm tighter tolerance. Also, they should simply replace the current MRP tensioner pulley for one with higher side walls so the chain doesn’t pop over which is likely the much more prevalent issue. Great riding, I hope you end up enjoying the bike once it’s sorted.
The idler looks like normal teeth rather than narrow wide and tall. They look very short and easily come off. Look at Kavenz idler and Forbidden where they are narrow wide and tall enough to prevent from chain falling off and yes the top guide should be very accessible and it doesn't do any great job holding the chain down. My dreadnought have no issues since day 1. Trek should have test a bit more before selling it in public.
Check for a stiff link in chain and a burred high idler or bent tooth? I'm having the same problem with my Commencial supreme DH bike. It was initially fine for the first 3 outings, but the last time I was out, the chain came off the high idler every time right out of the start hut at Fort William, on the straight before the first right hand corner. That section is smooth! I tried a new rear mech on the day as the B-adjustment had oddly sheared the previous ride. I couldn't spot anything obviously wrong. The new rear mech didn't fix it. So I gave up on the day. Since then, I've had a really good inspection. I found the chain had a stiff link. Now, I'm not sure if that's a result of the chain becoming jammed 3 times, it's highly likely. I've replaced the chain and removed a bur on two teeth on the high idler, as a result of the chain jamming. Other than that, everything looks like new. I won't know if this has fixed it until I get back out. My next option is to shim out the gaps around the high idler. Good luck with your issue. Let us know how it goes. Ps great result considering your issues!
I have a Cannondale Jekyll and I’ve never experienced the chain dropping off, in fact excluding drivetrain wear and tear I’ve never had drivetrain issues. Just you can’t run t-type axis but I run Shimano so it’s never bothered me.
My ptrain's idler is a built in aluminium guide, impossible for the chain to come off as everything is super tight. But then that is less than ideal in thick mud so you win some, you lose some
On the lower guide pulley the SRAM T type chain must not interface well because it was designed only to interface with the components on the inside of the chain (the side of the chain with the bumps). I think the only solution would be to get a new drivetrain. But I'm no bike mechanic.
I am year 2 on a Deviate Highlander, live in Ontario, and ride a lot in Quebec and Ontario. I went for the high pivot because of the rock slabs and rocky tech where we ride, Unlike My Mondraker and Whyte not High Pivot it has never dropped the chain. That Slash just doesn't look right but what do I know. Looking at Canyon for my wife so keen to see how you go on that. Great content, just found you while looking for something on Scotland.
Was constantly happening with testing here aswell chain off lower idler through every little jump n knock interesting seeing yours coming off the top chain wheel ours was the bottom all the time My mates away to try the shimano zee derailleur from his DH on it see if makes the chain tension tighter as that is a tight shifter it might work
Chain stretch? Going straight into a race - without giving it a good break in, and then removing a link or two - might have been partly to blame. . I'm sure tensioners can only deal with a certain amount of slack
My first impression on this bike was that it looks like a norco shore but now it seems that it behaves like a norco shore too. Shitty idler pulley system
Super interesting video! I’ve been riding my HB916 since April this year and not dropped a chain yet. Not had any issues with the high pivot/ idler idler setup whatsoever. Would be very interested to see what you think of Hope’s High pivot offering.
Dumb Question but why is it that in down hill races and in this case enduro races the rider leaves before the count down is done, does that mess with the timing?
Awesome pace and great footage. so frustrating having mechanical issues when just out riding, infinately worse when it's a race result affected. Perhaps getting it looked at by a mechanic, see if there's manufacturing fault?
Nice video. Adding more cogs into the drive train has to increase the probability of dropping a chain or a mechanical issue. Going from the standard 4 to 6! SRAM are bad for dropping the lower narrow wide on their mechs too. Old lower chain guide rollers suffered from chain drops when not close to the chainring or without a guide either side to prevent chain drops! Looks like we have reinvented old problems for a little bit of a chainless feel which is a good thing under heavy braking. Not convinced personally that there is a big advantage in high pivot idler bikes, certainly EWS results don't follow that the concept is the big differentiator. Better with good kinematics, setup, geometry on a traditional frame. Best of luck sorting the issue out and hopefully the frame works for you, even though it's already miffed you off.
Chain drops are always going to be the drawback of a high pivot system IMO. The idler wheel teeth need to be the right length along with narrow/wide to keep the chain on. I also think chain growth on a regular system helps with keeping the chain on, since the chain is being pulled onto the chainring.
Trek should be releasing a product that works. That idler wants a fence on either side of it and a proper guide in front of the pulley to feed the chain on. We shouldn’t be the beta testers of their best efforts with the crayons.
So what do You think, its frame design problem or the drivetrain? because somehow i think that is more drivetrain problem,because axs is not that stiff like cable derailleurs,and the chain design for this drivetrain is quite interesting...
Took some patience for you not to lash out dude, not for the race but for the constant issues. Have seen the trials guys like Ali C putting custom tensioners on the Hex and you know they come out of the box probably not needing it yet they still do. Never had a high pivot, going on this I never will going off this. Surely they at least gave this model to one of their competition team to test, going on what you found that's what you were so remember and ask for new gloves with that full kit they send you. The riding, breath taking man, hard to see the line between skill and bravery.
Really odd, must be just a Trek Problem as I’ve used a Jekyll before and had no problems. It could maybe be the drive train, as the new SRAM stuff is a bit different. Just worth fiddling around with stuff tbh.
what a shame... For me it is inexcusable that this happens on a completely new bike. I don't know if Trek have done many tests with that pulley/chainstay, but the facts speak for themselves.
Anyway... Well done getting 2nd place. It's really disturbing and distracting knowing something isn't right on a bike. The high pivot principal seems good but if you say you don't notice much/any difference I'd stick with a conventional set up. Good on you for keeping going 👍
Tracks look amazing..... hope to ride them one day! honestly mate in regards to your chain; I think you should've just adjusted the angle and position of the chain guide before you started racing. You said you'd lost the chain twice the day before which was a good indication that it was set up wrong. I've lost chains before because the chain guide was just set up at the wrong angle..... that's your responsibility to make sure it's in the right place. And then once you've totally removed the chain guide the only thing you can expect is that the chain WILL fall off. Personally, I don't think there's any blame to lay on trek for this one. Would love to hear if this is common issue - but it seems Hattie Harnden made it down some EWS tracks without an issue. Well done on the result..... also I'm commenting half way through watching so maybe you address my comment in the second half anyway! Cheers Lad.
Agreed. If the chainguide is set up right it should be impossible for the chain to come off. Ive used cheap plastic Amazon guides that work fine if positioned properly.
Dude glad I didn’t ask how you were getting on during practice after seeing this 😮, you looked a tad pissed on Saturday as you dropped into the cafe after little pony 🫣
Insane riding bro! Could it have been a problem with the derailleur not tensioning the chain enough, or maybe too many links in the chain? Just thinking of other explanations. Good job on 2nd place despite your struggle!
Great vid mate, hope you get it sorted ,just dont expect that from trek with all the testing they must do. after my 2022 slash was stolen i went to look at this new model ,high pivot just looked like a whole lot of faff and maintenance i didnt need as an avereage rider and after the last one being so awesome couldnt see how they could improve it by much. Decided to get the old model again. Looks like i made the right decision and saved a load of cash with the discounts ,now they're old stock 😁
