This entire video is amazing, especially if you are a dota nerd and like to think the game. It entails CEB [former pos3] of team OG, after being eliminated from ti10, goes to panel to discuss Secret vs Lgd Gaming upper bracket finals drafting phase. Ceb explains deeply how both teams understand the game, and how drafting is what determines the true game. Drafting phase is another game all by itself [this includes counters to counters to counters... a huge mind game. Feel free to watch entire video if you wish to learn a bit, and learn about Dota 2, and its beauty... However: here's a timer for you: go to 1:57 where Ceeb says LGD invented the TINY strat [ he says "they are the BEST team to enable it"] 6:10 Why first pick vs 2nd pick in drafting matters. 10:00 how drafting let's you dictate PACE of the game... 12:00 Ceb explains why TINY lycan so dangerous and why LGD play it the way they do. 13:00 Ceb says LGD "scales better" they are going 100% with their strat... 14:00 Ceb says why LGD draft is better. and why they broke dota at ti10
And people say og disrespected ts by not banning magnus. Its not always the draft, og surely expected it and thought they could beat it. But its not always the draft that wins you games, and og was just outclassed.
Ceb on the grand final draft panel was brilliant too. Drafting is the biggest mystery to the audience. Even the panelists are usually clueless about it yet it is literally %50 of the game. It was cool to see ceb and notail predict both the picks and outcomes and explain the whole reasoning behind those picks.
OMG ceb is just adressing everything that actually happened in the game afterwards. One the best draft analysis done in the dota official content durong this TI.
Yeah I know it was a 3 man panel but Avo+ made the right call by just saying nothing lmfao. His analysis is good but holy shit CEB and Aui are just on that level of insight you can only get from being at the top
The beauty of dota is that when a major patch occurs some teams really do struggle on the meta. For instance the alliance before mastered the art of rat doto, when the meta shifted, that team falls apart. Same like for EG in their 4 protect 1 strat back then. Teams who could execute different type of playstyle to the highest level separates them to other teams. That is why im always rooting for og secret lgd and ig. Then a wild Team spirit appears. Sorry for my english it is not my first language.
Ceb is such a gem of a Dota personality, his understanding of drafts & interpreting them is on another level, compared to that of any other analysts at this moment. That's talks about the reason why he came from being a coach to a player and grab 2x TIs. Now, imagine Ceb & Puppey in a team - Drafts will be God Level!
no, having two heads as a 'drafter' would not be good for a team. We have seen it with kuro and puppey back in team secret, they better have their own team so they can maximize how they draft.
@@thesphyrth If you have watched the TI True Sights, which I'm sure you did, you can clearly see that Ceb is an extremely positive and highly motivated guy. He certainly is toxic no doubt, and I'm not defending it. So yeah you can love and hate him, you got the reasons for both xD
dota 1 days? just before dota 2 spec/es/cm trilane was a staple played every time you could, with WR on suicide lane xd thd and zeus werent even picked that much iirc
@@winstonz but West vs East on doto happened while pendragon developer doto, thats as early as it gets o.O before that i dont think there were even any tourneys
Merlini Zeus was sick, he was ahead of the competition. Those games between KS and MYM were sick. Going all the way into the final era of MYM vs NAVI. Good times
Of Course there the best .. they Played the game in the highest level and they are the brains of there teams and lastly both of them are former Champions of TI ... ceb and aui broke the analysis so hard the host just listen and watched.
You know what, ceb was right. If Secret just focused on one thing, they could have won. OG was preparing for LGD but they did not prepare adequately for the other teams.
@@sammyd5098 Yeah, I don't understand why they did not. May be because they wanted to beat Spirit at their best like they did with Tundra and their WW mid.
people keep wonderiing why they didnt ban magnus. It's actually because magnus is so high priority they know its going to be picked. So its better to counter it than forcing Team Spirit to pull out a new strat which would be unknown and then they would have to think of a new counter draft. Its better to fight a known plan than unknown plan
Gotta say, maybe the reason they are so good at drafting and such is because they have Faith_bian and 'y, who where on that Wings team that won TI6 with really good drafting. Add that Ame is one of the best carry players currently... strong team
Xiao8 the coach won TI4, Faith_bian and 'y won the TI6... they do have a better understanding of the game overall maybe, but it's more so because of their patient play. OG had 3 players who won two TIs as well, that didn't win them a single game against Secret this TI because OG's playstyle is usually more early to mid game centric, they like to run at people, take racks 20 minutes in. But this patch things have slowed down a lot, so that just results in them losing games.
@@xavierazad bro OG playstyle is famous for turtling. 4-1 strat, they could have done so much this Ti since Sumail could play carry like ana. However, Topson this Ti not really good so OG lose so much from early to mid.
@@thanhlu3965 you're right. but their current lineup doesn't really fit the turtle strat since all their players atm have a pretty aggressive in your face playstyle
The way Ceb and Notail complement each other in their analysis in the grand final was really good too. Really helps common folks (like me) to really understand what the greatest mind of dota is thinking. Edit: don't discount Aui2000, he's holding his own well.
Atleast Ceb already gets the call of his lifetime reached the peak of Dota before his retirement, still a legendary icon to be remembered by the following Generations
That Ceb and NoTail joined made all the casters better because it meant that the casters was actually looking for what Ceb was talking about, in a way they wouldn't otherwise. So it was suuuuper important for the final game casting.
Ceb once said he'd love to share his own insight about his dota philosophy but at the same time since he's still played competitively, he can't because then it will reveal too much about OG game plan.
I think Ceb still drafts. Having a coach for most EU teams isn't like China where the coach drafts, it's more for morale or mental games that come before and after the game.
i wish the organizers would get notail or ceb for grand finals draft analysis. they both dont shy away from revealing what they know of the other teams. they dont care whether they reveal a glimpse of their strats to everyone as long as they give the audience good analysis on the drafts.
I feel like that 208,300 extra money of the 18 million the Winner gets should be taken and given to the panels, analysts and casters evenly. They make the game soo soo much better.
@@JS_246 weird comparison, and yet teachers are responsible for imparting knowledge to the next generation. Its not that the job is worse, it's just undervalued.
@@JS_246 Look at his left eye. It's all messed up from whatever surgery he had from a retinal detachment. He probably can't look at a computer screen 60+ hours a week anymore to train for big tournaments.
Yeah, LGD looked like they broke the drafting up until game 5 of the finals when Spirit gave them Lycan/Tiny then proceeded to make it look like a 3k cheese strat lol. I think if anything teams gave LGD too much respect in the draft and were trying to find clever counters rather than picking a team that would crush all three lanes and have confidence in the players to do so.
LGD broke dota from a draft perspective. TS broke dota by realizing exactly what teams wanted to do in game and countering it. Watching them avoid ganks that they had no vision of time and time again was amazing. I think the whole competitive community will evolve from this. Just like when liquid were the only ones being super efficient with farming and stacking now all teams can do it.Teams will spend time analyzing this and replicate it. I just hope that if every team gets really good at predicting what the other team will draft or do in game that it doesn't make the game stale. Honestly the one thing to do when everyone can predict each other is to do the unpredictable. To roll the dice and take a chance. Great generals do this all the time when faced with no better option or when the odds are not in their favor.
this is the reason why they should hire ex-pro dota 2 players as analyst and casters not just some guy who can talk fast and translate what is happening throughout the game. some casters are just too annoying
Well dota is only a game but drafting actually requires brain power. Thats the reason teams in moba games hire coaches coz they're good at drafting even if they are not good in game.
LGD ember ban then pick puck, allows their team fight and denys secret from void spirit/mag on Nisha, there aren't any good mag heroes to go mid vs the puck so they have to last pick ...DK lmao, brilliant draft by LGD they just went balls deep on the tiny/lycan strat.
Who are dota and NBA fans here? Ceb is like Gilbert Arenas, you can listen to them all day talking about their knowledge of the game.. dropping gems!!!
Quiet weird saying something about Team Secret.I remember ceb saying he doesn't respect Team Secret as a team and that they are just too arrogant to think they can best OG after what's been done.(winning TI8 and TI9). Not tryin to start some argument or something ,it just feels weird
