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It was neither a "nasty argument" nor a "pissing contest." Appreciate the content, but please refrain from needless dramatization. Serious? You bet, but there's no need for hyperbole.
Tower: "N114FA, I've got a number for you." N114FA: "Frequency change approved, have a good day." Pilot learns how to avoid pilot deviation with this one simple trick.
Sounds like a new pilot just going through the motions of a simulator: request take off, take off , change frequency, fly course but forgetting that in real life you need permission
Besides the gossip session in the middle and end ??? Sounded like some old ladies having coffee, even the touch and go pilot clearly didn't know why he was talking to tower about the other aircraft after the issue was resolved
It did seem to get attention from the ATC tho. Radio troubleshooting checklist: Step 1: Get ATC attention Step 2: Verify it is a radio problem and not a silence on frequency. Step 3: Prepare to write down a number Step 4: ...
This controller was nice and professional and de-escalated. No scolding or yelling at the pilot, told him to get to his destination safe and talk when he's on the ground without using accusatory language and making the pilot more nervous than he already seemed to be.
Woahhhhh small world! I did nearly all of my PPL, including my first solo and my checkride, in N114FA back in 2004. Listening to this gave me a small panic attack even though I haven't flown that tail number in 17 years lol.
This guy sounded like he was pretty new. maybe a student doing his xc solo or just a new pilot? that would make sense if it was still a flight school plane.
great work on part of the controller; especially the 'just get to your destination safely, and we talk about it'; He didn't threaten, in fact, he diffused the situation. Well done.
He just sounded like a Dad having words with a son who’s been up to some no good....well, you’re going to apologise to your mother, but get on your bike, ride safely, and we’ll have a talk about this when you get home...
And i liked his tactics 100% up to that point. Then he needed to gossip with other traffic after the episode. I really want to hear the pilots debrief on the episode about the radio. When he couldnt remember call letters, it told me something may have just shook him a little like ...... losing his radio, he fixes it and gets back in the game.. hmmmmmm maybe we are judging too harshly until we hear the whole story. maybe....
If you are a student pilot, there is no shame announcing "student pilot" on initial contact. I trained at a very busy class C airport. ATC all knew who I was, but in a good way. They were terrific at giving me extra guidance and one time even gave me landing priority to avoid a possible wake turbulence situation.
It's great because it lets them know you might need a little extra care, and all they want is to make sure everyone gets home safe at the end of the day!
That sounds like a student pilot who went into a panic after realizing that he flew into a class B. Hopefully this became a good learning opportunity for him.
@@tech99070 Isn't doing touch and go's a student thing? Maybe they were both students at the same piloting school and he was hoping the other pilot might have some kind of insight?
My home airport!. Controller said West bound. Pilot said Left bound and controller did not catch it. And pilot turned left after takeoff and 1 mile into Class B. Didnt see any big jets
@@truckerhershey7042 Which is why standardized language is so important. "Left bound" is not standard. This pilot is either someone who rarely uses the radio, or perhaps a student.
@@kc6796 If he’s smart he did. It’s always ALWAYS better to call. They’ve got your call sign, they know who you are. If you don’t call you don’t get the chance to share your side of the story. The FAA will be in contact shortly and it won’t be pretty.
Yeah, as a controller, that takeoff call was not super clear. I definitely heard the controller say "Westbound" and the pilot read back "left-bound." A better call might have been "Make a right crosswind departure."
Sounds like his radio was experiencing panic silence after turning “left bound” into the Bravo… The Orlando Exec controller handled that extremely professionally! That had to be a student pilot. Either way hopefully it helped not completely scare that extraordinarily confused pilot out of aviation and he’ll go focus on some radio and navigation training.
Pilot did sound nervous. I agree; he made a mistake but he was fortunate to get an ATC who probably recognized he was dealing with a rookie and took that into account.
i wouldn't be surprised if he switched frequencies and didn't hear half the stuff, then the other freq told him to go back to exec twr and he heard atc talking about him being bad so tried to play it off. i also wouldn't be surprised if that didn't happen.
LOL I thought about the same thing. I might try this next time I'm flying near Disney, "Cleared through the TFR, frequency changed approved, have a great day"
For some a 1000 more cfi hours can’t fix their poor judgement “skills” . Something I’ve never heard a cfi say, “son your simply not meant to be a pilot.” Not saying this guy can’t learn from this and be a good pilot - I hope he can. But I can tell you we all know guys who are a next flight away from an accident.
The instruction was: "...cleared for takeoff, fly west-bound." The pilot heard, and read back: "... fly left-bound." The pilot made the mistake of misunderstanding and not clarifying. The controller did not likely hear the readback, since we could hear "fly left-bound". A couple potential ways this controller could have helped the pilot: 1. He could have recognized the garbled readback, and clarified with 114FA since he didn't even specify the runway in the readback. ("runway approved", should have been "Runway 25 cleared for takeoff" 2. He could have used more appropriate phraseology (though I get it.. handling GA aircraft all day at an exec would be super repetitive.). That phraseology would be: "N114FA, Runway 25 cleared for takeoff, upwind departure to the West approved." That might've helped the pilot. The blame could be placed on both the pilot and the controller in a few different areas. All we can do is learn from these sorts of mistakes, and by doing so - make the skies safer.
@@kontoname Well stated. That was exactly my thought as soon as I heard the read back. Always better to get a degrees heading than a directional heading.
But still mostly the pilot -- because even if the initial problem was a simple miscommunication, why did the plane not respond to repeated calls from the ATC?
@@graysav I'm no expert in aviation at all, but this makes sense to me because you (as the pilot) can't see the call signs they are looking at, so you don't know if another craft in the area has the same truncation until they refer to you that way.
@@graysav 7110.65Z 2−4−9. ABBREVIATED TRANSMISSIONS Transmissions may be abbreviated as follows: a. Use the identification prefix and the last 3 digits or letters of the aircraft identification after communications have been established with a U.S. civil aircraft using the aircraft registration as identification. There shouldn't be anything wrong with abbreviating your callsign after initial contact.
Listening to the tower controller it did sound like he said turn “leftbound” rather than westbound. The pilot’s read back was a little rough but he did repeat leftbound. If the controller had corrected the departure heading, this might have been avoided. Having said that, if the pilot had done any pre-flight planning he would know the published 25 departure is a climb to 700’ and a right turn.
@@NaplesInsider Yes, but the pilot clearly said leftbound and the controller didn't correct. Pilot is clearly new, poorly trained and falling behind the aircraft.
@@Shadow__133 I wouldn’t be surprised if he wasn’t a new pilot. I fly in this area quite frequently and it’s is not rare for VFR pilots to sound completely lost on comms when flying through the bravo. Kudos to ATC!
I can tell you how those call go. They'll have a brief conversation, but the ultimate goal is to collect the name and phone number of the pilot so the tower controller can file a complaint with the FAA for further investigation. The more interesting call happens months later when the local FSDO investigator calls the pilot, but that only happens if the tower controller actually files a complaint after speaking to the pilot on the phone.
"Everything's under control. Situation normal. Uh, we had a slight radio malfunction. But everything's perfectly alright now. We're all fine here now, thank you. How are you?"
so, this could actually be true.... couldnt it? when you relisten to the episode, it seems he lost command of call letters after he gets back to radio contact, almost like he had a bit of a malfunction, fixed it while flying and then got back into communication, almost like what he was saying was absolutely true. Because when he got the dreaded NUMBER, he was very level in his tone as if he felt comfortable with what he needed to account for.. He wasnt perfect, but we dont know his side at this point.
This gave it away to me that this guy should not be fully behind the controls yet, the way he communicated also indicates he can't keep focus and gets disoriented quickly (imagine if there was a real emergency). Someone who shouldn't have gotten his license yet somehow managed to get it.
Even with the misunderstanding on the radio, there was an error that occurred before this flight even started. The pilot knew he was taking off from an airport which lies very close to Bravo airspace. He should have, in preflight planning, known that flying south of the airport above 900 ft was a no-go without getting on the radio with KMCO (Orlando Int'l, the main airport in the area which controls the Bravo airspace). He seemed aware of the 1600 foot restriction in the rest of the airspace at least, but still. Preflight and preplan, or collect phone numbers.
you would think if this is his home airport the first thing they would've taught him is to avoid the Bravo, if it was a solo xc then there are much better choices in the surrounding areas. I learned to fly in a class b shelf and I know what landmark not to overfly before I'm toast
@MkeB I agree totally. It could have been poor preflight, I speculated in another comment that he may have forgotten to set his DG before taking off, or he had a piece of crap DG that spun, and when they gave him a heading, it took him a little while to figure out he was going the wrong way, and it scrambled his brain, or like you said, they started yelling at him that he was busting bravo and he was scrambling with a sectional trying to figure it out in the air under fire instead of back at the FBO. I like your idea a lot. It is at the very least consistent with the idea that the pilot was at least unfamiliar with the airspace he was departing from, no matter what actually happened that caused him to turn the wrong way.
I admire the controller for how he handled the situation...didn't run into any assumptions, and didn't make the pilot feel any worse than he had to. This guy was a top notch controller.
The mistake occurred in the very beginning .... ATC said “cleared for takeoff and turn west bound”... though the direction was garbled and didn’t even show in the text. The pilot repeated back “cleared for takeoff and turn left bound”, which was also garbled and not corrected by ATC. 10 seconds after he took off, he’d already penetrated the Class B, though who knows what went on for the next 5 minutes.
Did all my Private flight training at Orlando Executive and this scenario was always my worst nightmare. B airspace is right above the airport basically and you have to take great care to avoid intersecting it.
I really have a big respect to ATC in USA airspace. They are wise and kind and do the job. Miss those times in Florida during my training years. Clear skies and smooth landings everyone, from an airline captain.
Reminds me of that family guy scene where the driver, without signalling or looking says “OK I TURN NOW, GOOD LUCK EVERYBODY!”, then proceeds to wipe out about 4 lanes of traffic😂
As a student pilot this is my biggest fear. I don't really have a complete understanding of airspace yet and I'm terrified I might violate airspace accidentally.
I’m a student pilot as well and can relate to your fear. I was flying a prog check with another instructor climbing to 3,500’ after takeoff. Normally I would make two left turns after reaching 1,000’ and fly away from the 3,000’ bravo shelf, but ATC told me to fly runway heading for now and they would call my turn and get me on course approved. I’m guessing due to traffic this took longer than I expected, and had it not been for the instructor telling me to stop climbing at 2,500’ I would have flown right into the 3,000’ bravo shelf, probably getting a PPD call. Luckily it was a great learning experience instead with no busted bravo and no phone call to make.
My non-towered airport is directly underneath one of the Houston area class Bravos so we are all used to it. GPS is a huge help, of course. As we depart to our practice area we just know where/when we can bump up our altitude. I just can figure out how anyone kept out of Class bravos BEFORE gps! Like you kind of know where you are, but the flippen lines aren't drawn on the ground lol.
I work ATS as well and I’m really impressed by the professionalism of this controller. Something for us to think about. Pilots and controllers are a team and we both screw up time to time. Gotta keep things moving. No point being salty and adding to a stressful situation. Bravo to this man.
I hope that was a student pilot too ashamed to admit it. That was a frightening loss of situational awareness at a low altitude, just wandering across the extended centerlines for the runways at MCO.
Used to fly a lot with my FIL (RIP). He was hangered at a non-controlled airport, but pilots were (usually) good about saying intentions, following base legs, etc. BUT - there were a couple of supposedly experienced pilots who evidently thought they were the only ones in the air. Trust me, *all* the other pilots in the area knew to watch out for them, and FIL had some harsh (x-rated) words on air with one such idiot. The pilot in this vid has probably now made the grade into untrustworthy and reckless (and not very bright). Bet the other pilots who heard/witnessed this will spread the word. Sadly, there may be an instance in the near future where this idiot augers in, hopefully as the sole occupant.
Here’s an idea: designate a specific transponder code for pilots with less than xxx hours flying experience. This will clue in ATC that they’re dealing with a noob.
Tower Controller was nice, didn’t accuse the pilot, just asked to call to have a chat. Then wished him a safe flight. For once, I’m satisfied with an ending in these!
Lost coms VFR 1. Squawk 7600 2. Continue the flight in VFR and land as soon as practicable. IFR 1. Squawk 7600 2. Remember an acronym from the regs 91.185 AVE K (Assigned, Vectored, Enroute, Known) use this to determine your route. MEA (Minimum Enroute, Expected, Assigned) whichever is highest. 3. Fly from one of those given clearances to your destination. (1 from each acronym) 4. If arriving before your ETA or arriving with an Expected further clearance then hold at your fix or airport. 5. Once the ETA time has been reached or once the EFC time has happened, then land which whichever instrument approach you have selected. If no approaches, you'll have to land under basic VFR weather.
Nicely handled by the controller! We can all learn from this! Awesome professionalism and patience displayed by the controller and not making a bad situation worse!
When he says, "I'm having radio problems I'm trying to fix them." I imagine him up there in his plane with a soldering iron frantically attempting to reattach a wire that worked itself loose. I'd imagine there are very few issues one could fix in the air on an aircraft, including the radio.
The bad part about being an air traffic controller is that you're unable to reach out an smack someone up the side of their head when they truly need to be slapped. Lol!
Thats why youre NOT an ATC. This controller, kept calm and reflected that the situation was not standard, but kept trying to establish comms. When he did, he behaved reasonable, established that the pilot was now ok and competent. Gave a number and the only thing he did wrong a the end was gossip about it with other pilots. I have all confidence you would have failed this process miserably as an ATC.
It seemed like this dude was a noob, both to flying and to using correct phraseology. The first clue of the latter was in his very first phrase, "ready for takeoff"... he also seemed distracted. I'd like to see the followup report -- I have a feeling it's entertaining. Major kudos to the controller, excellent work!
@@MattSalsa "Ready for *departure".* You never use the word "takeoff" unless you are ATC clearing an aircraft for takeoff, or a pilot reading back said clearance.
Follow up = immediate suspension of fly privileges until after remedial training is completed and a another BFR with a instructor not associated with the training.
This actually came from the famous Tenerife 747 disaster. Confusion on the word “takeoff” resulted in 583 deaths in the deadliest aviation accident in history... since then, “takeoff” is a reserved word with explicit meaning during clearance. So yeah, this is a big deal.
and without a radio........ he... couldnt copy..... because..... he was flying.... Then he fixes the radio, gets back in contact, and resumes normal radio communication and flying tactics... hmmmmm do we judge him too quickly?
Ok so, does anyone else think the controller sounds like Hank from King of the Hill 🤣🤣🤣🤣 I'm dying over here!! Somebody get that controllers name..ASAP. I would like to speak to him 💯
It's the equivalent of "License and Registration (but once you've landed, and you might not be able to take off after you land because we may decide to keep your license)"
I fly here and talk to this controller almost every day while doing my PPL training. You can actually see one of my flight schools planes on the radar at one point. This controller is so cool in a situation like this. He’s always really nice, but most importantly, he’s smart. Didn’t panic. 4FA is a training plane at my old flight school, i probably know someone involved in this lol. Looks like the flight was for a VFR Cross Country. Anyways, looks like a big old Instructor rating getting revoked outta there. Lol. Sorry about the monologue, but if anyone wanted additional understanding of the situation, there it is
I've been based at a Class B and Class C airports with a Cherokee. We all know to get out of the airspace ASAP when VFR. Controller was very good except for accepting that takeoff clearance read back. That was the first clue.
