Hi everyone, thank you ALL for the brilliant comments, sorry I can’t answer them individually, so many! But such great reading, Cheers guys! Motoeuro. 👍
I test rode one at the ABR Festival on the Thursday and loved it, I managed to buy one on the Monday by pure luck and collected it 10 days later. It is without doubt a brilliant bike, on road and off, the weight is low down, the ability to get both feet on the floor makes it more reassuring off-road, and on road it is an absolute hoot, even the stock tyres are good, I changed the front sprocket from 14t to 15t, it makes the bike much better on the road and it has so much low down torque it can handle the change. I feel like I am back it the 90s with the price, Right I am off to Blockbusters for a movie.😀
Was it alot easier to lift the front end up after switching from 14T to 15T? I test rode a stock one and it felt awesome but it was more wide ratioed kinda feel. Super smooth with almost zero vibrations. I am truly impressed.
@@FuelledByMuffins I don't think changing the front sprocket makes it any easier or harder to get the front up, it is no CRF300, I think if I was spending my days riding muddy single tracks I would buy a CRF or Voge, the 450MT is capable of doing single track, but not as well as lighter bikes for pretty obvious reasons, where the 450MT shines is getting you too and from those tracks.
Hi mate, Sam in Australia. I test rode a CFM450 last weekend and I own a crf300 rally. The CFMoto450 was ok, but I don't know what happened to the extra horsepower, it was barely noticeable on road, maybe the extra weight of the CFMoto soaked up most of the extra power, the power felt so close to my standard Honda! The service intervals are so short on the CFMoto too. I find the 300 rally is great off-road, I love the light weight on the trails and the long-range fuel tank, the 12000 km servicing is terrific. It's such a cheap bike to own. Pick it up off the ground a few times and you'll really appreciate the lightness of it. So, for me the Honda is the superior bike to own.
Well said Sam, from a fellow countryman. Look, I ride a 650 VStrom, I think it is 214 kg wet. Which brings me to my first point. Perhaps we should state a wet weight that will get you 200km of range. Because if I am carful I can squeeze 500km out of my girl. Say 450 riding normally. Enough fuel for 200km and I am about 10kg lighter. Point 2, I do an awful lot of light bike fanaticising ❤😅. My wee, with its road focused rubber, is dry track only. And not too bad at that either. No point is 50:50 or better because if I tip it over good and proper it’s just too heavy to deal with. So my riding is limited, and I love the riding I do. Reliability issues aside, I am very keen on the 2025 ktm 390 adventure. The approximate weight of 170kg is about the sweet spot for me. I will weight a while however. My bike is very new. Lots of time to have fun with it just yet.
@@Jonathan-L Thanks for the kind remarks. I've been thinking of qualifying my remarks and your comment has spurred me to action. I really like the CRF300 FOR THE PUPOSE I USE IT. I use it for stony, rocky, muddy off-road tracks and the less than one hour rides to and from the tracks I use. I don't think it's really suitable for long adventure rides (although, there are many who DO use it for that). For me it feels too light and not stable enough for long range rides. I'm planning on doing longer rides farther from my base, and this was my reason for testing the CFM450, as this is a heavier bike and might have been better for longer ADV rides. Unfortunately, I find the CFM450 is a bit too heavy (for the rough trail rides) and not quite enough power for what I am looking for, although it is pretty close!
Those are Chinese horses and false advertising is like a second language for them. Would be interesting to get it on a dyno and see what it's actually got under the hood.
Hello from Norway. I have the 250 Rally. 71000 kms, no issues. The only disadvantage is keeping up with traffic uphill 😅. Croatia, France, the Autobahn, TET Scandinavia. Cheers :)
Hello there! As a owner of the 450mt I can say it checks all the boxes! But, there is few “buts”. First of all I’m in China, dealership and parts is no problem, pretty much cost nothing to service and repair. Secondly there is no second choice like crf300rally, closets competition is klx 230. We do a lots of mid-range on&off road trips, it’s like 100km highway from where we at, then off-road crossing for another 80km, then go back to highway and 100km home. So for this kind of trip the 450mt is nearly perfect, we wish it could be 15kg lighter, but for now there is no better bike for us. For super long distance road trips the 450 is not the best, the fuel economy went crazy when cruising at 120kph, best cruising speed is about 100kph. Let me know if you have more questions.
I haven´t tried the CF450MT, but I just sold my Honda 250 Rally to get a new Honda CRF 300 Rally, which I upgraded the suspension with Ohlins rear shock, and Andreani cartdrige on the front, so the bike is a monster for off roading. I did the change to the 300, although I loved the 250 so much, the gear ratio makes the bike feel like it has 10 horse power more, it really do that! The 450 is beautiful, stunning, but I stay with the (as you pointed) bullet proof japanese, as the weight is, for me, the most important thing when it comes to off roading. Keep doing this stuff, i really enjoy your channel and the way you explain things.
I owned the T7 and now got the cfmoto 450mt and I would say they nearly the same but mt feels much much lighter even though it's only about 9kg different. The T7 weight is high up so it feels very heavy. Sound is almost the same and don't really miss the power difference as you don't notice off road. Very happy with my cfmoto and have £2500 in my pocket from the sale of the T7
Bingo, the felt weight is completely different story I wish there was standard way to measure it, like hanging scale from handlebar when bike is at 40* or something; That's why u cna never go by specs only u need to ride the stuff
I own a BMW r1200 GSA, a Moto Guzzi V7 and from tomorrow a CFMOTO 450MT. The CRF 300 rally was on the shortlist, but the 40 hp and twin cylinder won me over. I will take it on an 30.000km+ adventure.
25 hp is enough for me. Weight is the most important thing for me. I prefer crf300 even it is more expensive. BUT if ı can find a bike who has twin cylinder and lighter than 160 kg wet…. I will buy it immediately without looking at the price
I bought a second hand CRF450L with aftermarket exhaust, ECU upgrade and a few other bits and bobs. It's epic. Weights about 127kg, between 46-49hp. It's like a bloody rocket. Standard suspension is simply amazing. Only negative I can think of is the oil change every1000km. In reality it takes 6-8 mins with a quick change tool as it's only roughly 1litre of oil and I've honestly got so used to it I use the time to do a general quick check service at the same time. It's a very underrated option IMHO. Totally love it.
My mate has one of those, but we live in Australia and that 1000km service interval is like a 2/3 days riding. So in perspective to ride it across Australia would be 4 oil changes. Not that you would ride it across Australia. It wouldn't even be 1 oil change on my DRZ400.
I wish the 450L was well priced, but it was over £9,000 in the UK. Sadly, its not available in Europe any more due to emissions - I took one out and LOVED it! So light it was untrue!
Expensive is the right word for new ones - which is why I bought 2nd hand 😀. Fortunately it had been very well looked after and very low mileage so I got a real bargain. I'm about to buy a set of Super Moto rims and tyres for road riding to save my off road tyres and have more ,'fun' on the road. Then for my bigger planned off road rides in Europe will simply swap back to the off road set up. Gives me the best of both worlds and allows me to use the bike more. Doesn't take more than 20 mins to swap over the tyres so quite convenient to have the duel option I think. It really is turning out to be my 'unicorn' bike to be honest. Plan to keep it for many years yet.
I decided to go down the lighter bike route for more focused off-road riding, so have a KTM 690 Enduro. I did look at the Honda and others before making a decision. But the KTM is 6kg lighter than the CRF 300 Rally with an additional 47bhp. I bought it used and so got it for a good price. Whilst I accept you don't need all that power off-road it definitely makes it a more appealing proposition when riding to trails and/or covering distance on it. There is no real 'unicorn' bike but the KTM is pretty close.
I've had a 701e since 2016. You can't beat it's power to weight ratio. It handles great and the maintenance intervals aren't nearly as bad as the 350 or 500. Biggest downside for most is the seat height. I'm 6'3" and it's a little ridiculous.
I think the 450 MT is nothing more than a lower budget travel bike (compared to middle weight segment!) capable of carrying luggage up a rocky / gravel Alpine pass. Sure some guys on social media are drifting and jumping but for the average rider it is simply NOT a bike for technical riding. In reality, 80% of "offroading" in Europe is done on doubletracks, wide gravel roads and the odd sandy track. I'm sure it's very capable of that. I'm also sure it has just about enough power to be fun on the gravel, and okay on the road. I'm very sure saving 5000 quid (compared to a T7) goes a long way towards fuel and accomodation for 5 nice long holidays on said bike. Great bike to shake up the market!
I reckon you can say that about most ADV bikes. Unless you have the skills of say Llwellyn from Brake magazine, Adam Reimann, Chris Birch or Pol Tarrés, you are primarily going to use it for gravel road touring. That is not bad thing, it is just is what it is. If you are going to ride the harder trails and some of the fire roads like we have in Australia, then a dual sport may be a better choice, but with the compromise that riding hundreds to thousands of kilometres on dirt/black top roads will not be as comfortable. I think this comes close to a unicorn bike, but I would be more inclined to use it for dirt touring and only the one or two technical bits you may come across.
@@the_explorerist 100% agree. If anything I think the 450 MT is a more honest option than a middle weight ADV bike for most riders. Don't pay double for horsepower you don't need (or can't use!) and spend the savings on fuel, accomodation, and most importantly, memories.
It actually Carrie’s the weight very well, doesn’t even feel as heavy as it is and picking up was easy with no luggage on it. Had mine for 2 months and I love it
I bought the CRF Rally, not for its weight, but economy, service intervals, reliability and simplicity. Initial cost are greater and it did need a suspension upgrade for my fat ass! Ive looked at other bikes that trump it on power, looks, weight, off road ability, on road ability but none of them hit the so called unicorn status so I'm sticking with it for a while yet as Ive got used to the lack of overtaking power. The MT450 does look good, I wonder how well it drops, my rally is pretty battered but still works and looks ok
A Great video, as always. But I have one thing. Comparing a 2 cylinder in weight with a single cylinder isn’t far. A 2 cilinder engine weighs at least 20 kg more than a single cylinder. But a 2 cylinder engine has other benefits like comfort and stability. The comparison with the Yamaha Tenere is spot on. (I’m Dutch, so my English is understandable but probably not great 🤓)
I was close to pulling the trigger on a 450mt as a dealer has one available but in the end I’m staying with my Rally as it’s reliability is essential when I’m travelling to the places in Asia that I go. It’s also dead easy to work on and mod. I’ve put a rally raid shock , crash bars, handguards and a USB charger on mine and with soft luggage it can take me anywhere. It’s easy to pick up and cheap to run.
You're right about 1 thing, the weight on paper is 1 thing, how it rides/feels/handles is another. But like listening to a politician or someone trying to convince you about something, you need to listen to what they are 'not' saying. I loved my 2013 Triumph Trophy SE but it was so so top heavy compared to a Harley tourer, which actually weighed more. So let's talk about that aspect when it comes to weight. The 450MT, on paper, weighs close to the T7 but everyone knows the T7 is relatively tall and top-heavy, but the 450MT on the other hand carries its weight quite low because it is not top heavy at all - and that's the thing that makes a significant difference - it doesn't 'feel' heavy.
@airadaimagery692 I also have a KLX230, yes it's easier on gnarly single tracks but that's a very small %age of my offroad riding time. But all I would need to do improve my offload skills and then the extra weight won't even figure.
@41933 It's hard to say anything negative about this 450 MT, not even looking at the price. But hey if you want a proven 100% reliable bike (don't we all), good look with that. Especially when the bike is new in your part of the world.
CRF 300 rally has more than 20 HP mate , and you can pick 153 kg fully fuelled Honda up off the deck . The CF 450 is 195kg wet . Lot of weight to pick up . I too sold my rally due to finances , but am buying another one to compliment my too heavy for trails Honda Transalp. Here in Australia you can be 50 km from a house or phone reception very easily , what you gonna do on your Chinese Giant Panda when you drop it on a muddy or rocky hill? If you rely on riding with mates ok no issue …please Johnny help me pick me bike up😮. Adventure riders , need to be able to pick up their own machines . Truth is most riders aren’t good enough to max out the power of the 300 rally on narrow double track or single track dirt. You can feather the clutch on the rally out of corners off road , the bike then feels like a 350. If you drop the rally just pick it up .
I think you need to lay both the 450MT and the T7 over with the bars on a scale and see how much the weight is. Because let's face it, you're not picking the whole bike off of the ground! Then you tell us, which you would prefer to pick up.
as a t7 owner i can say that the 450 mt feels much lighter than 195 kg , it has a low centre of gravity and it feels so much lighter , first time i hoped on 450 i could no belive how light weight it felt (all fluids full ) , in some way it convinced me to sell my t7 and buy an 450 mt but alsi in my country are all sold and some will arrive soon and those are all sold so i will stick to my t7 and continue our bounding :)))
@@twowheeledadventuresuk2739 the 450 mt feels like you have a mini tenere, for a 450 cc is a lively machine, its like a horse ready to race, i did not feel lack of power for my taste, i thibk they nailed it in the power departament, like you put the tenere in the washing machine on high temeperature and you get it out a size smaller, 450 fells like a tenere, sound like a tenere, handle like a tenere (maby a bit better the wheel base is a little bit shorter), in my opinion is more manageble than a t7 for shirt riders, new or intermediate riders, im also an intermediate rider and i felt more confident on 450 even if a own t7 for 2 years and went some crazy offroad trails for my experience and manage to not fall i think that 450 is a good bike for 450 cc category, 195 kg but feels light, i can flat foot with both feet and also have a lowering kit already on it so if you want it lower you dont need to buy ather links, but as motoeuro say there are some problems with logistics and supplys, hope cfmoto will solve those soon
@@twowheeledadventuresuk2739 I recently sold a T7 World Raid, and a few weeks later bought a 450MT unexpectedly after a fantastic test ride at the ABR Festival, the figures indicate that the 450 has 60% of the T7 power, but in reality it is more like 80%.
To me CRF300 is overweight for 300 cc. Compare to WR450F: 117 kg wet and 450 cc! Add blinkers, mirrors, a stop signal, DOT-approved tires, register as a road bike - and you'll get a beast offroad as well as on highways. If you're toll enough :) I am not, so I had to swap my converted WR450 for DR650, which is just 10(ish) kg heavier than CRF300 but way more suitable for highway sections. However, still dreaming/waiting for a lightweight adv bike with a parallel twin 600-700cc and a wet weight 165-170kg. Speaking about CFMoto, take a look at 800X Rally: 185 kg wet and 94 hp KTM engine.
Ik heb een wr 426f. 45hp, 130 kg met aanpassingen 20l acerbis tank. 3000 euro 2e hands. Instelbare veering etc. Om de 4000 km olie, bougie, Luchtfilter en olie filter vervangen. Rij haar nu 12 jaar. 6000km per jaar. Extra kosten eenmaal een koppeling kabel vervangen. Ik ben geen super coureur maar wij nooit achteraan.
If you've got the skills then weight isn't an issue really, and in some ways it's your friend , especially so on the road. I think the modern phenomenon, or maybe its been around for years, who knows, is people just keep hopping from bike to bike, finding excuses to get the next big thing, and hope it solves their own riding inadequacies - which is fair enough, if you aren't Pol Tarres then maybe you would be better off on a lighter bike. Personally I buy what makes me drool in the showroom and stirs the loins on the trail, specs may be important for some but for me it's definitely more about feeling and connection. I'd also add in the big scheme of things the 300 rally is heavy, my CRF450L with a bigger tank and all by bags on for a multi-day trip weighs less than the rally - some of the trips I've done on my 450L would have been exhausting on anything totalling over 145kg, having to keep opening gates and riding very technical sections that require a fair bit of man-handling. As ever with these things, individual needs and preferences will determine what's best 👍
CFMoto motorcycles are popular primarily because of their effective marketing, rather than their technical quality. For instance, KTM 790-890 cfmoto egeines. often haveing cam wear issues, which can lead to significant problems. would u buy that risk? In contrast, my 1993 Honda Transalp 600 is a solid machine. It weighs 190 kg, has a V-twin engine that produces 50 horsepower, and exemplifies how motorcycle engineering was once more focused on reliability and performance. but it 31 years old. In my opinion, the motorcycle industry has regressed rather than progressed. Nowadays, there is a greater emphasis on adding gadgets like ABS and fancy digital dashboards, while basic features are sometimes overlooked. My Transalp, for example, doesn't even have a fuel gauge. I bought my Transalp for riding the Trans Euro Trail (TET) and as my primary means of transportation. It’s a testament to a time when motorcycles were designed for genuine riding experiences rather than just flashy features. and build to be look after buy the owner not the dlearship.
Couldn't agree with you more! I have been riding 650 Transalps for the last 23 years and wonder what all the fuss is about with these modern adventure bikes. Wouldn't swap my old girl for any of them.
My wife and i are riding TET Italy on 2 PD10 Transalps right now. Very satisfied with them. 2 years ago i gave up on TET Italy on my 1150GS. Now returned on our Transalps and we are more than happy!
@@podunkman2709 I agree. Reason Morden bikes r rubbish. People just want to be cheapest. I think lot advisement and marketing brainwashed people to buy adventure bikes for the street thay r horrible. Tall and top heavy. 90% don't go off-roading.
This is the reason I will never sell my XT-350, year model 1997, air cooled. I own the Transalp 750 and KOVE 800XPro, but the XT-350 always shines when it comes to practicality, weight and agility.
That is kind of an easy question to answer. Easier than formulating the answer anyway. It has to be totally dependent on what the majority of the use of the bike is intended for. As much as I like to think I ride a lot off road, the majority of my riding is on the road. Even when I’m going off-road I still have to ride several hours on a paved surface. For me personally I can live with the extra weight right up to the point where I have to pick the bike up half a dozen times in the day. I am sold on a twin cylinder motorcycle. With a twin you have to accept the extra weight. In the real world how I use the bike, the weight becomes less important. Just saying:-))
I personally ride a heavily modded XR 650 R on the TET, because i love a light and capable bike, that i can ride hard and that is light, but not fragile. But im missing an electric start and fuel injection. The carb caused me to be stranded in france for 2 days a couple of weeks ago and im thinking about switching bikes again soon. The CRF 300 L/Rally could be the right bike for me with a couple of mods, but i was thinking about the CF Moto, Royal Enfield Himalayan, as well as a BMW G 650 Xchallange. For the first time in my life, i dont know, which bike i want to buy next. But to answer your question: In off road bikes, light is definitely always right
@@PetterIvarsson yes, but they aren't as reliable as OEM electric start bikes, they are expensive, hard to come by and require a fair amount of work. And then the bike still has a carb and requires an oil change every 600 miles
I had a ride with MT and quality is better than my CRF 300 L but is an adventure Bike for me. I would never ride IT on Traila road. MT is a CB500x with KTM DNA. And honestly is a very well put together bike than KTM790 made in same fabrik in China. All is Good about IT , lower centre gravity, Light Clutch, Good brakes, Good engine( a Little bit short 6th Gear for highway, same RPM as 300L,6000Rpm at 100kmh). Looking for quality I am sure I could buy one without any problem but is still a 200kgs bike. Nobody ever Talks about CCM GP 450. That is the unknown Unicorn Bike.
Bought the CRF300L as my first bike for my 40th bday. Not sure how reliable or durable the CFMoto will end up being, time will tell. My 300L has been bomb proof! I've done tons of slow speed drops on tech terrain and haven't broke anything on it! Not sure I would be confident taking the heavier adv bike on the terrain I ride my Honda on.
WHICH ONE TO CHOSE FROM CRF300 RALLY OR CRF300L? Rally has bigger tank and around 10 kgs more weight but looks practicle. Seat height is slightly lower than L? (as per Honda site) "L" stands for What ?
'L' means Legal - The competition and MX CRF's are not road legal. Rally has a screen and mount bar for phone / GPX, IMHO it's the better option as the STD CRF300L doesnt even have a bash plate. Cheers
When will people learn, two cylinders is too much. There will never be a "light" twin. In terms of adv dirt riding my rejection point is 150kg dry, which makes for a tiny field of contenders. I went the DIY option and converted a KTM 500 excf into my ideal machine.
Then Ur not into adv riding. Your doing enduro. Cuz enduro are totally useless for adv use. It's really annoying how everyone is complaining that adv bikes are not good enduro bikes..... Learn to ride adv or stay on your vibrating toy bikes and don't complain about adv....
450mt looks and sounds great but that weight concerns me, I'm getting older and at times struggle picking up my 250 Rally. About time someone did a video picking up both bikes multiple times.
I have a CRF300 Rally and am considering changing up to the T7 or the CF 450MT but like you I think I will miss my Rally too much. I keep telling myself more power is better but then I ride the Rally on some gravel roads and realise that this is a tremendous motorbike. Money is not a problem but I think if I had a T7 or the 450MT I wonder when I will use them. CRF300 Rally the perfect TET bike ❤❤
I just can’t take a Chinese bike seriously until there is more dealer network and more proven reliability. I don’t want to wait a month for parts to ship from China. Maybe in 10 years they will be worth the money but I’d rather buy a used Japanese bike than a brand new Chinese bike
Months? When did that happen? Even 6 yrs ago, under warranty CFMOTO had replaced an engine in my bosses atv, within the week. Engine sent from Australia to NZ.I also have one. Apart from the power steering, also repaired quickly, nothing else gone wrong. Unless you have a definite issue, stop shitting on a company.
Light is right. I have a DR650 and have been riding it in the trails for the past 3 years. I have NEVER seen one of them big bikes in the trails. Its mostly all for show. AT least in my neck of the woods.
I agree lighter is right for rough dirt roads. Took my T7 with my friend on a BDR and he was on a DR 650. I was wore out at the end of day and he was still fresh , we’re the same age . But his bike was probably a 100 lbs lighter.
I've always been a larger displacement sportbike/roadbike guy although I did a bit of motocross in my teens. 2 years ago I bought a used Crf250l rally as a toy/2nd bike... I've put 4 times as many miles on the CRF as I have on my sportbike hahah. I love it and I love riding it offroad, that reliability factor is a huge confidence booster specifically when going deep into the bush solo. Cheap and easy to work on, the soggy suspension is easy to sort, can't see selling it. Honestly i'm thinking the roadbike is gonna go bye bye for a t7 or a transalp, just for those longer journey's with more road miles involved. Cheers!
I've been touring South America alone on a Yamaha YB125 since 2018 so I'm able to pick it up fully loaded without much problem even though I'm now a flimsy 62 year old. Granted, I have to occasionally dismount to run alongside to get up some of the Andean slopes but I'm glad It's not heavier. My luggage is probably half the kerb weight of the bike but I basically live on it with all the camping gear 4 seasons so it's hard to shed stuff. Solo: Light is right Group: Fill your boots
I am?at the moment riding the TET in Bosnia Montenegro and Albania. Had a CRF 300 rally and am now doing it in the Kove 450. I love it, same weight, but 20 hp more, but higher maintenance and nobody know the real reliability. I also own a T7, but for my abilities it is to heavy. So the Kove is close to perfection, for me.
Im riding a 123kg 40 year old XL250S. I do not fear taking it anywhere, but a bike 50kg heavier would have me thinking twice. The only time the light weight is a disadvantage is on highways when its windy and big trucks, and i try to avoid those when possible. 90 mpg. Why are new bikes, even with 20hp, all so heavy?
With some of the Frankenbike builds I’ve done, I really can’t help thinking a CRF450Rally with a CB500X engine in it is the way to go. In terms of capacity…practically the same. The frame will handle the weight and power easy. Looks like I’ll be visiting the wreckers with my tape measure again. I can’t understand why Honda just doesn’t build a parts bin special. I’ve been doing it with Hondas and Suzukis for decades.
That's very hot concept. Though their 500 engine is very boring and sounds like crap. I'd take something like tuareg but made by honda. High strung 80hp~ 600-700cc p twin is sweet spot imo for power/weight compromise , in 200kg~ total package with GOOD suspension Is the unicorn recipe ; Everyone wanting a 150kg twin is just not realistic, most singles weight more, 200kg~ is perfect weight, it just need to be well distributed, like on 890 or tuareg
I am in Aus and put an order in for an MT. Test rode the bike and loved it, and you dont feel the weight up high. It is very well balanced. However I am not a big fella and do like to ride solo. Whether it hides its weight well or not is immaterial when you have to lift it or if you are stuck under it.I bought a CRF300l Rally as I am much more comfortable with the weight.
Most interesting subject and thanks for bringing it up. My experience, got 2006 bmw f650 Dakar, lovely bike, sorted suspension, higher seat,madstad screen,booster plug rides a treat. Factory says 192 kg wet. Has factory engine bars, centre stand and touratech bare pannier frame. Weighed it 226kg what! I dropped it on a trail and struggled to lift from almost upside down. Mmmmmm I then found out in 2017 about G650x country and x challenge. Bought x country with 1800 miles , immaculate. Full tank and standard enormous silencer just on 165kg, on same scales that’s 60kg difference. I can walk it up ramp into garage, I’m 66 yrs. I wonder what real weight of Yamaha T7 with full tank and real life bits n bobs is. Will anyone actually weigh one? Interestingly,,other bike for taking Mrs on, k1300gt bmw says 285kg in book wet and with nearly full tank was 285kg? I’m with you on the weight thing, especially as getting older you lose strength. Interested in any comments.
Sold my F650gs Dakar (192kg wet without crash bars) for a new Voge 300Rally 165 kg wet with stock crash bars).asphalt or trail adventure riding.I still cruise on major asphalt roads on 110-120 with no stress(absolutely sweet on minor country roads).BUT Loving the lightness in trail riding, less than half the fatigue for the rider. No regrets.
Did you ever consider a BMW X Challenge? Wet weight of 156kg and 53 Hp and a very reliable engine of Rotax. Low mileage bikes can be found at about €4000. For me one of the best offroad/travel bikes ever made. And there are still nice accessoires available too like an extra fuel tank by Hotrod Welding, extra strong suspension by Hyperpro. At this very moment I am travelling with my X Challenge through Spain - covering about 8000km. 😊
Hi interesting article. But in my opinion they are two bikes which, although not very different, satisfy two different needs. CF is a dual with a decent off-road aptitude. Honda is an enduro with a decent propensity for travel. I would compare the Honda CRF 300 to the Voge Valico 300: very similar characteristics, with an excellent price for Voge.
Lots of variables but at age 60 (in good shape) my next bike will be a big scooter with two front wheels. My Vstrom is great but too tough to lift. When I go of road it will be on my ttr-230. This should work until I'm 80. It's nice to have so many options 🎉
Sold my Rally 250, did over 40k on it got a NX500 with street tires Road 6 and aluminium boxes and its ideal for road touring small smooth and powerful [enough]---now i want a second bike for trails and gravel road riding and i am split between these two bikes but likely i will get a Rally again. Lots around used, last forever very fun and i never modded my suspension and and found it fine... i think i will wait a few years and see how the CF450 does reliability wise but there s a reason i avoided the KTM500 and it was not the price
It's 2 totally diggerent bikes being compared CRF as dual sport and MT450 as adventure bike. I'm all for Honda because I won one....however having rode MT450 for over 2,000 k's, it's a totally different category. There are a number of so called middle wileight bikes (T7, VStrom 800DE, Transalp...etc) and trying to compare those bikes to CRF??... It's a different bike altogether. Each has their own strong points, and as for small middleweights, it's nice to have the 450MT, Himalayan 450 enter the market. For us consumers variety is key and "NOT" restricted by major manufacturers products to dictate where the market should go!! Hats off to CF MOTO, RE, KOVE and the likes 😊
It´s heavy, but what is far worse are the service intervals. Every 6 months or 5k kms. KTM service is expensive, so what you saved on the bike, you are going to invest for cost of ownership. That is a nogo for an adv bike. Somebody claimed, that CFMoto revised the 6 months rule, but I checked the manual and it still needs an oil change every 6 months/5k kms. Service is done by CF moto or KTM dealers. Annual service for a 390 KTM here in Germany is around 300/350 €. That would be aroung 700 € at least every year and those are the small services, without adjusting the valves... good luck with that. I´ll take my 300 Rally over the MT every single day.
CF Moto UK have now confirmed in writing the service interval is every 3000 miles or every 12 months, my KTM dealer charges £110.00 for the oil and filter change service, so not so expensive really.
I just came back from three days of TET riding in Poland on my new (to me) CRF250L Yes it's lacking power on the road but it's still able to swimm along in traffic. But off-road in the mud and ruts it's the best bike I've ever owned. I was riding some of the TET sections I had to skip on my trip to the north cape this June where I was riding my old 1100GS because it was simply to heavy. The CRF made the sections look easy where I was cursing on my GS. Weight is King! With nearly 200kg the CF Moto is to heavy for serious terrain. But most of all, the Honda is a Honda! This means it will run. Always. You really wanna bet on a cheap chinese bike when you are in the middle of nowhere? I don't.
Depends where u ride basically. Im in Poland , typical European enviro, singles dont make mucb sense here for adv traveling. Its not Australia to have offroad almost non stop. There are mostly gravel roads, forest tracks. My Africa twin is perfect for that stuff. Other than suspension whic is the biggest problem of that bike, not weight
Light is right, IMO. I dropped my CB500X (440 lbs) in the dirt recently, and ended up with a severe ankle sprain. That bike is great for the street, but dirt - not so much. I have my heart set on a CRF300L Rally now, which weighs about 100 pounds less. I just wish there were were more of them available on the used market in the US. ✌🤙
Yes you have to ride to decide. The 450MT feels lighter than its claimed weight. It feels a lot lighter than the top heavy T700. Keep in mind CFMOTO owns 51% of KTM and now manufactures bikes for Yamaha. Also I might add the 450MT was NOT built to be an enduro weapon! MT (Multi Terrain) or (Mini Tenere) Thanks for the video!
Fortunately, MCN just did a four way shoot out and two of the competitors was the 450 MT and the CRF 300 Rally. On the timed off road test the Rally was faster than the MT, but the rider liked MT better. The MT was the overall winner, but the Rally was a close 2nd if I remember correctly. The other 2 competitors was the KTM 390 and Himalayan 450. Like you I like the Honda, but dang that 450MT checks almost every single box. Weight being the box that didn’t get checked, but I hear it carries its weight low. You could get a CRF300 Rally now, and buy the 450MT in the spring. Then proceed to make comparative content on both!
Great stuff this is the first realistic honest review I have watched having owned a T7and a CRF Rally 300 70% road use 30%forestry tracks the rally is the most fun.I will wait and hope Honda up the horses but keep the kerb weight on a new Rally🤞Rally very soon
One of the most important thing for me is ease of maintenance and service intervals. I'm a diy servicer simply because I can't afford to let the shop do it. What are the service intervals on the 450? The Crf300 is 8000 miles, 16000 for the valves. The valves are relatively simple compared to the 450. Not sure the 450 is a DIY job for me a little out of my comfort zone, I have done bucket and shims on twin cams, can't say I want to be doing them on a regular basis.
I am riding the BMW G310GS from Norway to Africa and have to say the weight was a definite prerequisite for the choice of bike. Now loaded with gear I can not fathom having an additional 50 to 70 kilos of added bike weight. Smaller displacement and the lower weight saves fuel and gets longer on the liter. If BMW updates the G310GS with a 450cc or 500cc, I will definitely be one of those interested and maybe first in line to get one. So far the G310GS is purrrfect 👌 (spelling error intended).
If you're riding trails only, the lighter CRF is more appealing. But the 450MT offers something that the CRF will never be able to - travelling comfort on faster roads. The CRF will shake your teeth out if you ride ir at 70mph all day. Weight is comfort that dual purpouse bikes need to even be dual purpouse. I guess it comes down to where the bike will be used most?
Have a CRF 300 rally with upgraded suspension. Having always ridden sports bikes, wanted something small and light to begin off road riding. Absolutely love it! Bit tall as I am only 5’3” but have gotten used to her. Yes she has been dropped but only at low speed due to my little legs 😂
I'm waiting for the new KTM 390. It should be light, with more grunt and better suspensions of the Honda. I cross my fingers that Ktm will not delay further this model. In the meanwhile, the Voge 300 Rally is a better option to the Honda, IMO.
In Europe one needs to cover a lot of asphalt before getting to the dirt. Getting to good places often means traversing countries. So I take the weight for more power, speed and road rideability over an overpriced Honda that needs an expensive suspension upgrade right out of the box. 450MT for the win.
A lot of great comments here from a lot of folks speaking from hard earned experience. I think I need the 450MT for getting to the dirt and the not so hard trails...plus one of those Voge 300's for the hard/challenging bits that would cause the bike to demand nap time.....
It is a perfect bike. Just choose what you are able to handle. My wife is very happy with the MT. The weight is always less on the trails, i think people riding off road never fill up complete. So for everyone out there.. enjoy your ride😊
Hello mate, I’d love to take you out on French TET. For me, it’s a no brainer. While the 450 MT is appealing, weight is ruining it (suspension travel too…). But if you’re on budget and sort of want the best of two worlds, it’s probably a good option. If you’re not, nothing beats the KTM 890 in the 200kg segments but let’s not forget the upcoming Kove 800 who can literally change the game. I’ve bought myself a CRF 300 Rally, tuned it with better suspensions and a 1.5 stage with 550 performance for more poneys. Now it’s a perfection. Light, powerful, and insanely effective off-road. The prep reaches 10k but with that price you get a very accomplished bike. And if I want more power I can still do a stage 3… :D.
@@giuliobuccini208 Do you know what are you talking about?!? Hondas engine is 100x better then voge's one...and other parts. Just change the suspension and go!!!
It really depends how many bikes were sold, not that they’re sold out. Also the fulling is not supposed to be the best. I’d rather take the 450MT than the T7 (which I had for 3 years) But for adventuring on my own, I’d take the 300L
Light isn't always right, unless we talk about difficult technical off road terrain, then yeah, lightness is better than more HP at the cost of more weight. Most people who complain about power to weight ratio on this bike (The CFMoto) rarely ever do hard off road, they complain it's too heavy, but the point of comparison is pretty much against dual sport bikes, and this isn't a dual sport, then they will say "Uh well, the T7 is a little heavier but way more powerful, also the Tuareg is a better option" but they're still talking about heavier bikes than the 450 MT, how are you gonna complain about off road characteristics if your "better" bike is twice the price and a little bit heavier? Loose dirt and mud can't take much torque and power. Also, lightness is terribly bad when you start cruising on the highway and there are violent gusts of wind coming and going sideways, it is really unnerving when the wind blows strongly from the side (my experience is with a Versys x300, which is about 182kg with the add-ons that it has) I can't imagine how bad it's going to feel cruising on the road at 130 km/h if you use the alleged "unicorn bike" that weighs under 150kg and has 75 HP.
Nice, thanks. Weight is definitely the first criteria to be considered if going off the main road, specially if you go alone as I often do, so, if money is available, the Honda would be my choice. But I also reached the same conclusion when wondering if I should buy a 450 MT or keep my Voge 300 Rally (the Chinese version of the Honda CRF300). Both cost the about same... and I am leaning towards keeping my Voge... the weight and the clearance (similar to the Honda)... is kind of slow in the freeway but reliable in bad roads, and this is what I want it for
I had a 2017 250 rally and loved it but no bike is perfect. There will be compromises with any decision. The best you can do is try to find a bike that “checks the most boxes” in terms of your needs. Personally, I value lightness over all else to the point that I’m considering going even smaller. Maybe a Honda XR150L or a Kawasaki KLX 230 SM (dealer has one for $3500 USD). Light weight, light on the pocket book, and light on maintenance, in that order.
Yeah, I kinda stayed away from alternatives like the 690 or Husky 701, PR7 as they're all around £10,000 - MT and Rally almost same ballpark, cheers for the comment :D
I’ve had many crf race bikes over the years, 250 and 450, also raced a cbr1000 super bike. Decided to get into the recreation side of motorcycling and got the crf450L when it came out, then got an Africa twin, then a crf300rally, so am definetly a Honda man. Now have a cf moto 450 MT and would gladly buy another one over the 3 Honda adventure bikes I have owned:
I find it odd that many people are so focused on the MT450 & yet are overlooking other bikes that (for them) maybe a better choice. Sure, the MT is a good off road bike, but many who've bought them don't ride them off road. The Voge 525dsx is a cracking bike, with more low & mid range grunt & a better road bike that will still do the off road...yet it's over looked due to the hype of the MT450. This is the power of the Internet, but I'd say more people ought to think of their OWN usage of a bike & go for a bike to suit...not just a bike that is hyped up to the nines.
The MT looks amazing! Unfortunately, it has A LOT to prove. I would not trust it for any long trip to remote areas as I do my DR650 and my old vstrom 650. May be for local rides and occasional Starbucks trips…
I much prefer a light bike. However, I'm a tourer, and not an adventurer. I simply avoid off road. Yet I cannot avoid deteriorated roads in Laos and some other countries in SE Asia. Also, I need motorcycle that can retain 120 kph. all day. The fairing is also a god bless on tall bridges across valleys in China. It helps against strong side winds. And finally, I need large gas tank.
@@Jonathan-L The curb weight of the 2024 Suzuki V-Strom 800 RE is 492 pounds (223 kg) Regretfully, it's too heavy for me. My limit is 430lbs (195 kg.) with full tank of fuel.
As a 2016 CRF1000 owner, who bought a new 2022 KTM 390 Adventure, the CF Moto 450 has been tormenting me. The WANT is strong. Bought the KTM for a RTW trip, as I won't be able to pick up the Africa Twin more than once a day. Also, trying to keep weight and crating size to a minimum for air freight. As much as the CF Moto is coming across as a Unicorn, im taking comfort in my decision to go with the KTM due to the CF's overall weight creeping up. Slight concern about availability of spares as well. But it does look like a gem.
Nailed it! No one really talks about the wet weight of the 450MT. For that weight I would prefer to stretch to a T7 or Transalp. I am currently installing a 301cc big bore kit and stage 3 ECU. So should no longer need to consider the 450MT.
I have both a cb 500 x and a crf 300 l…for me at 66 ,but fit,there is a huge difference in lifting it up on the tracks.Weight is so important also when riding narrow trails.Obviously since I have the 300 I hardly take the 200 kg cb 500 x offroad😮But I love to see the first 100.000 km review of the cf moto!
I bought the MT450 for my "European", adv riding. The huge miss on the 450 is the super short final gearing. All the benefits of that twin, 45ish hp, comfort, real life features............mostly washed away the first time I rode on highway at 120 (gps) kmh. I was looking at 7000 rpm, on an engine with 8500 red line. Yes 15t sprocket helped, but it's a compromise. My fixed up Rally (suspension, full intake mod including bigger intake snorkel, full exhaust, sweet 550 Performance ecu tune), is now awesome. I ride it here in Indonesia, 100 kmh is going fast. Yep I have close to 9k usd in it now........ 155kgs, Honda reliability, Honda we don't care about delivering a properly suspended, not all choked up motor, zero features (not even passing light switch), buy what we make product. Mt450 full of features, 200 kgs adv that is good for 100-110 mph cruising speed. Taller 6th gear would make the bike fit it's "purpose" so much better. If I had to have one bike, it still would be the Rally.
Light is always right for any kind of off road riding. This is why I ride a 20 years old xr650r. 123kg with fuel and 60hp. If that is not the right equation, I do not know what is. Come on Honda, this is simple math. (Please) Come back to the light side of the force. Somewhere we have lost the plot, heavy bikes do not work in the dirt. Light is always going to be more fun. Nice review and good question.
Weight is important. Point of forces and point of mass and the relation in between is equally important. And the relation between these three elements is essential .
I have got my old XT600Z 3AJ Tenere on some serious gravel roads in Bosnian mountains a week ago...If I was better raider off road, I guess I would feel it light at the 165 kg dry (and it was almost full 23 l tank, so close to 190 kg really). Ancient design as it was, the engine worked flawlessly, even suspension was fine (no jumps and stuff though), gearbox was crude but working, but the weight...I should have something lighter until I learn not to fall that much. The CF Moto 450 would not bring me any comfort there, but the CRF300 would.
The 450 is very intriguing. Lots to like. But, I do appreciate the weight difference of my now highly moded 300 Rally. Especially after the weight management mods I did to it. Its almost as light as my buddy’s 300l. Next season I will install the Big Bore kit, and I’ll have everything that I could ever ask for. Not that it needs it, but it gives me something more to look forward to.
I managed to get a test ride on the 450, it was great, in fact I was ready to sell my CRF and buy one but… I couldn't until next March due to no stock! So I thought, sod it I’ll keep the CRF ( as I love it) and I’ve bought a tried and tested T7
I’ve always been a great supporter of the CRF 300, but it's impossible to ignore the superiority of both the CF Moto and the Himalayan 450, which are also cheaper than even the CRF L, let alone the Rally.
I have two bikes a Honda 500X and a Voge 300 Rally. I have never considered the MT to be a competitor for the Voge, it’s size, weight and power output puts it in with the 500X. The 500X does what it dies brilliantly, it’s a great real world adventure touring bike and I think the compromises that the MT makes would make it an inferior replacement for the Honda. Yes, it may be better off-road but it’s still about the same weight as the Honda and the Voge would be the better choice by far when it comes to tackling difficult terrain where power doesn’t matter and weight becomes very important. That’s the trouble with compromises, they can never be as good as the bikes at either end of the gap that they’re trying to bridge. I’m happy with my two bike garage having two bikes that fulfil their roles really well is so much better than one which will rarely be exactly right. Price wise it may be a bargain but so we’re my two. Together they cost less than a Tenere. Horses for courses as they say and all too often the specialist horse will beat the wannabe all rounder. Sometimes being in fashion and being cheap does not mean it’s the best buy.
I went full Chinese on this. For road use i bought cfmoto 450nk naked bike, and for off road use voge 300 rally like you. Price difference compared to Japanese rivals are two folds where i live. I believe voge is reliable, lots of happy customers on RU-vid. Will see about 450nk. Buy it's promising right now.
Im a proud owner of a Honda 300 rally. My first bike, use it t commute no matter the weather, and spin around the countryside at the weekend. And planned my first multi week adventure next month. Anyway i just can't look past the Honda reliability and support network across the world. If your going to buy a bike and plan to keep it for 5+ years, surely has to be the Honda?
I've had the '21 Africa twin adventure sport, to DAMN Big... Then I got a '18 CRF250L rally absolutely love that bike from the way it road to the way it looked just an amazing bike! But I live in Phoenix AZ and not near enough for the highway so now I'm on the '19 cb500X not really good off-road I don't really take it out much just down dirt roads but on the freeway I can ride with my buddies who have Harley Davidson bikes, I put a one 🦷 bigger ⚙️ after trying the big bikes the small bikes I really miss my rally but this thing is a good middle ground
