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I think the "3 rule" works for a 12ax7. For a 12AY7, 4-5 is a great clean tone on the 57 Custom. And agree that the Vibro Champ reissue really is at its core a mini Princeton.
Have the Champ. Super fun with pedals. Always clean boost with my Klon clone. And of course, cranking it up a bit is very tasty. Definitely going for the 68 for my office. Sounds excellent. Great demo and explanation. Cheers.
You should try the 57 with a 12ax7 or at least a 5751. I just got one and pretty quickly popped in a vintage rca 12ax7, ge 5y3, and a vintage tung sol 6v6. It really wakes up the dynamics of the amp.
You should check out the tone king gremlin. It’s basically a mix between the two minus the reverb and with a tone control. It also has a built in attenuater for when you crank it. One channel for tweed/lead and one for the more 60’s tone with high headroom tone. Pretty versatile bedroom amp.
57 Tweed champ all the way..................And the mid range growl you'll ever want. The sweet spot is between clean/dirty on the guitar volume tone and your fingers.
I have two Vibro Champ XD's that Fender put out for a few years 10-15 years ago. love it. I have several high $ Mesa's but recording with the Champ yields better tones for some applications. Way better for practice also.
I really enjoy your playing on this comparison.A lot of players when playing these types of amps are too heavy handed and it kind of chokes the tone.Thank you.
From Leo: I would go 68 Vibro Champ all the way. Lots more options on the tonal palette. The old amp filled up the mid range from the weak single coils. I never cared for how they handled a higher output humbuckers, or Filtertrons. Enjoyed your presentation.
I am comparing your 57 tones to a Line 6 HD500x model of the champ and It actually has that vibe that comes from the real amp and 8" cab, I dig it. I don't know but it's a magic sound I like it a lot. Thanks for the tones.
Excellent video and very interesting comparison. I do not own either amp and going in thought I would be partial to the Vibro Champ simply because of the added features (especially since I think reverb in a pedal in front of an amp is not all that great sounding) 'but surprisingly enough, I thought the '57 Champ sounded better in every context including clean. It may be less versatile but its one sound, to me, is way better than any sound on the Vibro Champ. YMMV, thanks for the video, cheers!
I agree that the 57 sounds better. It has more clarity for clean sound, However considering the price difference the, the 68 Champ wins bigly, clarity of the the 68 maybe 2 or 3 degrees clearer. So, I think I need both of these little monsters
@@timetraveler_0 I ended up buying a '65 Princeton reissue instead. It also has reverb and vibrato. It's a great amp though pricier than the 57 or 68 Champ, also 12W so a different beast. I would still like a 5W Champ but got sidetracked with the Princeton haha!
A good thing to remember is that when you buy a vibrochamp reverb or a Vibro champ even though CBS took control in 65 you can still buy a silverface 66-67 Champ and they were using the same parts they were in 65 so you’re getting basically the old parts just with a silver face !
I rather have a real extern reverb tank like a surfy bear. When your recording and it goes somewhat loud you will hear the spring vibrating even when its off.
I wish that made a version with built in tube driven reverb. I hate using pedals. I don't know why Fender can make a hand wired tweed amp with reverb these days,, really?
Excellent comparison video. Tweed tone is very mid-rangey. The '68 VCR can get that by turning OFF the treble/bass knobs, but can also do the more scooped modern BF/SF sound with more shimmer. The 10" speaker is a plus too. I've gigged with the VCR, works great.
EXACTLY. I turn down the bass and treble to 2...or less...and crank the volume to 8 to 10 on my new '68 Custom Vibro Champ Reverb and get no flub. Just a great fat overdrive.
Excellent review. I would love to see a review of Supro amplifiers. The Robert Keeley's (1968rk) or 1970rk) or the 64' reverb.... Congratulations, excellent and detailed information I get from you channel. 😉😉
I have both of these amps. The 57 is the better tone for me. Its a thicker, creamier tone and I can get all the eq. I need from the guitar .The Weber speaker is so good. Its also a little louder and doesn't break up as easily as the 68.Someone here said you can turn off the bass and treble pots on the 68 to get more mids out of it and that's correct. The Celestion is a poor choice for the 68 amp. Its sounds so much better with a speaker upgrade. My vote is the 57.The tweed sound must be my thing, the blackface sounds a little brittle to me.
Same here. I bought the 57 for that thicker 60's blues rock sound. To me, you can get the Silverface Fender cleans on a lot of Fender amps. I also have the Sweetwater speaker upgraded Super Champ XD but my little champ is it. I was even playing the Monoprice clone before I pulled the trigger and that's a nice little bedroom amp too.
Good to know. I live in Asia and don't have much choice for gear. Had heart set on the Vibro Champ but can only get the tweed Champ. I might get a Strymon Flint to make up for lack of reverb and tremolo.
Iv'e had both amps and I stuck with the Vibro Champ. I am a big fan of both the tweed sound and the Princeton sound. After some trial and error, I ended up swapping and in the end I have a Fender tweed Pro Junior with external attenuation and the Vibro Champ reverb. I was never able to get a satisfactory clean tone from the 57 - but it was so cool that I wanted it. But perhaps I wasn't able to get what I needed from it even though there may have been ways to do that. I was not able to figure that out. I live in an apartment and that is also a factor here. The pro junior has more wattage, but I was able to temper that with a Bugera PS 1. The Jr. has a tone dial and that helps a lot. The Vibro Champ does strike me as a Princeton Jr. and that works out quite well for me. The reverb is not spring, but I happen to have a Boss Fender Spring reverb pedal that I bought long ago should I miss that sound terribly. Lastly I do use to low input jack so that I can push the tube sound a little bit. Thanks-
I think I like the Champ better 😛 In all seriousness - maybe the 57 Champ sounds slightly better to my ears, but the difference is not big enough to matter, and the 68 Vibrochamp has vibrato, reverb, bass and treble controls, and is slightly less expensive.. I just think it’s a better overall package.
Really glad I watched these videos on your Champ amps. If I do get one, I'd probably go for a no frills Silverface Champ or Vibro-Champ from the 70s or 80s. I think the 57' sounds great but its too expensive. Plus I have a Princeton wioth a 12" speaker so I don't want to get redundant. Thinking I need something that can do high gain well.
The comment on volume setting at 3 for the original champ may have to do with the taper used in the original pots. I believe the 1M pots used in the originals were linear taper and the current production are audio taper (logarithmic). Just a guess.
I have an original 57 Champ. Can hear hitting strings on vol 2/3 but I sort that out via pedals. From what I've seen via YT the reissue 57 doesn't sound much like an original but that's without ever trying one myself. Based on what I've seen, if I were buying this type of amp online today, I'd get a Rift Amps
Sorry for all the hand wired snobs out there but for me, the vibro champ sounds better than the 57 reissue. Just my personal opinion. I have just bought the vibro champ reverb ant it sounds awesome in flesh.
Hello from Ireland. 🇮🇪 Thank you for this review and your other reviews I find your videos very helpful and informative. I bought the 57 custom, it’s a great amp. Like you say though the vibrio champ is more versatile. I am seriously considering getting a vibrio champ to use alongside my 57 on a A/B pedal. Do you think this is a good idea or should I think about something else. I like a bit of reverb.
I have owned a couple of each...tweed reissue. 60's BF & 70's SF I wish I'd never sold anything! I miss the tweed the most. I currently own a 73 3 knob version Silver Face Champ
To me, the Vibro Champ is better for clean tones. I don’t care for the cranked Vibro Champ sound. The Tweed Champ is better for the cranked sound for me, more classic tweed tone.
I am new to electric guitars as I play acoustic and old 1920's style rag time stuff. When looking for a surf guitar amp, most if not everyone is a club player and insist on a big amp. I will just be playing at home and do not need to replicate the original surf sound, but need something clean and small. Also I was thinking of the Fender '57 Custom Champ 1x8" 5-watt Tube Combo Amp plus I was going to get the Fender 63’ Reissue Reverb Unit Brown Tolex to go with it. How does this combo sound and playing with a Fender American Ultra Jazzmaster - Cobra Blue with Maple Fingerboard? Thank You very much!!
I know people hate this point, but which has the better resale value? Don't know about the 68, but I know I can play my 57 for years and get my money back if I want to sell. Especially if they stop making them like the Clapton series. Would have been nice to have heard these with a Tele too, but thanks for the demo.
@@WS-bk7uu Depends on what you want it for, but yes, I believe you can find the Vibro cheaper. I wrote that above knowing that I hate when people bring up resale value. These tweeds do hold their value, but they are a niche sound, (which I love btw).
I am having that Champ GAS, but I am leaning to the head version of a Tweed Champ that Gries Amps offers. I was impressed by the Gries 5 Combo that the other guitarist in my band used for the recording we just did. Also, with a head I can change out the choice of speaker very easily. (Celestion Blue or G12H30?).
A better comparison is to use a Les Paul for the cranked overdrive. The guitar you used is just too anemic. I have a 1960 Champ Amp and found that Genelex 12AX7, JJ 5Y3S, and Tung-Sol 6V6-RT tubes work very well. What sort of tubes were you using in the test amps? That can make a huge difference if you were using different types of tubes between the two amps... I much prefer the '57 amp in your comparison. The '68 is noticeably lacking in mid-range and seems a bit tinny in comparison. Nice try but the '68 just does not deliver that 50s and early 60s Fender tone accurately. It sounds like it cannot decide if it wants to be a Champ or a Blackface and ends up being neither.
The strat seems to like the tweed champ and the gibson likes the vibro champ to my ears! Great shootout...I love Champs but never had an older one....I've had two newer versions...the one with the RCA stereo inputs and now I'm playing the Mexican made Champion 30 DSP which only has one preamp tube....the older one was all tube but I kept having issues with that amp so I sold it. I have a Crate club V5 pure tube amp that I run with a splitter box along with the Fender and love the combination of sounds...5 watt tube amps are great of those two I like the vibro champ
Nice amps, but pricey and limited in capabilities. I'll take my used Fender Super Champ XD any day. What's not to love? Tubes, 15 watts RMS, two channels you can foot or button switch,, 2 band EQ, 16 amp models, 16 effects, 10" speaker (can disconnect to push a 8 ohms cab), and a great line out for FOH on big gigs. Used one on about 30 gigs, always does very well. The line out is a secret weapon to use it at any gig. I never had to run it higher than 4 on the two volumes out live on the backline, to keep the stage volume reasonable.
Both amps are totally different . The XD is a decent hybrid amp . Power amp is all tube but the single 12ax7 is split and is used partly as a phase inverter for the 2 power amp valves and also in the pre amp . But due to the above all the overdrive and distortion sounds are solid state . That's how the different " models " are achieved . But if it sounds good and does a job , that's what matters 👍
5:10 Maybe the volume pot is logarithmic, but linear, so it takes some turning of the knob way past 3 to get more volume? The Blues Junior is pretty loud straight away, though that one is... 15 W?
Catalinbread formula 55 has a nice 6v6 tone. The Roland Blues Cube Stage and Artist are voiced like 6L6 fender amps and with the Ultimate Blues tone capsule you can change for 6V6 but the capsule is about 200 bucks. For instead I would buy the Catalinbread Formula 55 which is their 6V6 pedal. And it is portable you can use it with different amps.
Jack I have a friend that wants to sell me his 68 Vibro Champ Reverb at a really good price. I just don't know if that amp is going to be loud enough to gig with . The drummer is a finesse drummer for sure but he's still a drummer. Do you think this amp is loud enough to get the job done?
Right? I like the Champ better too. So I've seen greater Amp Tech minds than mine debate the preamp tube change.. some for it, some against it. I dunno. I just play 'em!
The 12AX7 is the highest gain (output) of all the tunes in that same family like the 12AY7 12AT7 12AU7. These other preamp tunes are drop in replacements for a 12AX7 so you can use any of them without needing to mod the amp in any way. The tweed Champ has quite a bit of gain with the 12AX7 so the other 12A__ tubes allow more headroom and a cleaner sound which is desirable to some people depending what kind of pickups you use and how exactly you like to gainstage things. Swapping preamp tube types is a cool easy way to change the response of your amp and it's just as easy to return it back to original if you change your mind. The tweed Champ because it has no tone controls (passive tone controls suck up a bunch of gain) is quite hot with a 12AX7, probably Fender back in the day thought this was a good thing for their guitars which were lower output than Gibsons with P90's and later Gibsons equipped with humbuckers. Input number 2 is yet another very useful way to get more headroom and less gain on the front end of the amp but it does load the pickups more than input 1 resulting in some high frequency loss so for some people going with a lower output preamp tube is a better way. It's all a matter of taste and what you happen to like so try both out and see what works to get you what you are after.
@@JackFossett Thanks I found this Fender Champ amp from the 70s online but there has already been offered 750 euro for it...Seems to be too pricey right?
That’s interesting the strat sounds warmer with the 57 champ but it seems like the Gibson much prefers the vibro champ. I have an SG so I guess the vibro champ would be better.
nice sound, I have the champ 57. Can I ask the height of all at your pickups? I like them as a starting point, I can’t set my properly in my strat… Thanks a lot
@@JackFossett from what I hear it’s 68 deluxe reverb and bigger amps I want a deluxe reverb but it’s a lot of money for me and don’t want to regret buying it for that much money
@@JackFossett Thank you for making these vids, Jack! My 68 Princeton has no hum either, except when you crank the reverb, but that is to be expected. My five watt is the EC Vibro Champ, which I play exactly as you described, with the volume on 6 or so. I don't like cranking this amp. And BTW, in my guitar dreams I play as well as you and make the same jokes. Take care!
Your Strat is beautiful and your system sounds good! I just bought a burst Strat! It's the first electric guitar with burst! I absolutely love Fender amps over Marshall, Black Star!!
