Cheap turntables - Are they really THAT bad? 

A music lover listens to his records on his equipment, while an audiophile listens to his equipment playing his records.

I think a lot of vinyllovers people just don‘t realize that not everybody who likes vinyls is an audiophile.Some people just want to listen to records for fun and the vibe and not pay an arm and a leg.

Ok there's actually a little difference, but I'm starting to think that these audiophiles are just trying to justify they spent 600 dollars just to listen to stereo sound.

I definitely heard skipping on the daft punk track. It played the "we're up all night to get lucky" part repeatedly!

The snobbery surrounding adult hobbies is ridiculous. I run into the same attitudes in audio equipment, guns, home brewing, cars, retro video games, music, whiskey, home theater, pinball... That primitive tribal mentality is alive in well in modern men. Just do what you like and ignore the haters.

When this man busted out the Daft punk after seeing that windows 98 era desktop in the background made me fall out of my chair

Sounds like the people who talk these down are trying to justify buying an overly expensive unit by attacking something that just gets the job done without the bells, whistles or branding.

Yeah, reddit vinyl community is pretty much complete cancer. Thanks for the correct review, I'll buy myself the Sony player, since it's widely available in my country.

One time my friend said "it skips" and proceeded to smack the table to make it skip lol.

Good on you, defending these turntables and putting unfair criticism to rest about their specs. These are fine record players and will give the the people who own them many hours of enjoyable music listening. I've been an audiophile for many years and I say if you enjoy music then that's the only thing that really matters, no matter what the music is you enjoy or what you enjoy it on. I hate it when people knock on other people's audio equipment. There were times when I could only afford an AM radio that I bought in a thrift store but it made it so I could listen to music. Bottom line, if you are enjoying what you have for listening to music then be happy with it and don't let anyone tell you different. There's a real difference between being an audiophile and being a prigg. If you tell people that their equipment is crap then you're the latter. I'll set down with anyone to listen to music no matter what the gear is they are playing it on.

Thank you! I initially wanted the AT LP60 for a gift for my elderly Dad who hasn't had a turntable in 50 years but I remember fondly when he used to play records when I was a child. He still has the records. I did research and thought it wasn't a good choice but now you have explained my concerns I'm getting it for Christmas! Thank you, I subscribed 😊

As a person who just got an AT-LP60XBT today I can safely say that it plays a modern 180g record just fine.

"I can't believe nobody actually bothered to test this" - you mean, you expect the _explicitly anti-evidence audio-hipster community_ to actually *test* something?? =D

I've heard of Crosleys being bad, but not an LP60

This is why I am always torn about the audiophile community. On one end they can bring some great info to the table in regards to what equipment sounds good. But on the other they can be really annoying when they don't always understand why someone wouldn't want to spend a few grand on a record player and a few more on speakers and amps. Not all are like that but some get on my nerves, especially when they talk about hearing frequencies far above what the human ear could ever hear.

You know, I didn't know that some turntables had the spring mechanism in the tonearm before I watched this video. I always used to think "no counterweight, so it's bad". Now, I know that the tracking force is determined by other mechanisms apart from a counterweight, something I haven't heard from these "audiophiles". Thanks for this video.

I've had a AT-LP60 for a few years now and for my ears it's fine plus it always works. I could go buy a better turntable but I feel that money is better spent on buying more records instead.

This is why I love vwestlife. Very knowledgeable in his videos, and he covers a wide variety of equipment without being snobbish.

Yo personally take it from a man who’s owned a few different tables before I converted to the at lp 120. That audio technica lp 60 is not just popular but very dependable. It worked perfectly until the day I sold it to a friend. He has no complaints

The way that turntable handles a warped record is insane. As a person who mostly gets my records super cheap from goodwill or rummage sales, making bad records sound good is super important to me.

I can't say I've ever had any complaints about my Audio Technica AT-LP60. Sure it's cheap and lacks the alluring aesthetics of a Technics SL-1200 or any of its clones, but its modest price tag allow financial resources to be redirected to such things as acquiring more vinyl records. Audiophiles may forever disagree on and condemn the use of a budget oriented turntable for the long-term enjoyment of vinyl, but I'm content breaking the "rules." If somebody takes such great offense to your using a turntable that will "chew up and destroy" a record and its grooves, maybe they ought to incur the expense of buying an audiophile-approved model for you!

Audiophools just love to hate on anything that didn't cost thousands of dollars.

Top video, thanks to your review I'm getting an Audio-Technica AT-LP60 this Christmas, and you've gained a subscriber. Keep on shooting down the insecure audiophiles, and spreading actual researched information

Owners need to make sure their turntable is *level* if the anti-skating is to work properly so the record doesn't skip. I would have mentioned that. Fair reviews overall!

The audiophile crowd always knows better and are generally pretty grumpy. I say let everyone enjoy vinyl in his own way.

Many,many people do not have a lot of money to sink into the hobby. If this can provide enjoyment to them, the let us welcome them into the wonderful world of records.

I Bought the Audio Technia LP60, have it a Year, plays perfect, No Issues, Same Stylus, with cost me 150.00Euro, and a set of Speakers for the same price, Total 300.00 Euro.... No Complaints, great Turntable, the LP60.

The problem with your channel is you prove things with logic, reason, proof and evidence.. not hearsay and opinion. No one will believe your outrageous claims my friend! =P

For a budget vinyl enthusiast or a beginner, these turntables are a great value, and SOOOO much better than the cheaper Crosley style turntables. Of course audiophiles are going to say they are junk. There is a sweet spot with price to performance. Something like a Crosley isnt very good at a 59.99 price point, but going up another 40-60 dollars you get 10 times the performance for way less than 10 times the cost. I would say that turntables 300 dollars and above, that price to performance ratio drops way down, that you can spend thousands more to only get a negligible improvement.

Dude I love your channel, you are always so calm and rational that even when you make videos with no personal interest for me I still like to watch them. Greetings from Mexico!

Great video. You blew me away with all of the evidence shown. I recently got an ATLP60, and after going online, I found that it was shunned by a lot of people for a lot of the reasons you stated. I do plan on upgrading one day, but for now I'm content.

The title should instead be: "Expensive Turntables - are they really THAT good?"

The Crosley stuff, I get why people hate it. But, I wouldn't call these turntables horrible. In fact, I would RECOMMEND turntables in these price range for people who want to get into vinyl. And THIS is why I no longer consider myself an "audiophile".

That was great. I was about to ditch my Optimus Lab 1100 and spend $400 on a new turntable hoping for something better but I've never been unhappy with it. I just felt bad for having such a cheap turntable when everyone else has a cool one haha. In only use turntables to play music (mainly 80s 12" singles) not available anywhere else. I've changed my mind now.

Thank you for de-bunking so many myths. The world of Audio is full of snobbery and false claims, often commercially driven. This is the best video I can remember watching for a long time.

Extremely well done demo and review. Logical, sequentially intuitive, and clearly explained at every step. Great work! Thanks for posting.

That wasn't a blank disc. It was a recording of John Cage's 4'33". Very good video, BTW.

Of course 'audiophiles' will tell you it's bad. Buyer's remorse/stupidity won't let them say anything else.

I have no interest or intention to buy a record player but I watched the whole video or to me a great description of the record players. You did a very good job on explaining what a record player does and what to look for. I have knowledge on something I do not own because of you. Great job bro

Wow, what a well researched video. Gosh, you actually spent sooooo much time to get rid of common myths associated with turntables. I have a Pioneer one, came with the Hi-Fi (British) system. I'll dig it out now.

As a 17 year old that wanted to get into vinyl but was broke as hell, the AT-LP90 has done a great job for me. I got it about 8 months ago and the only complaint I have is that the speed went out of whack about 2 months ago, but this was fixed relatively easily and it has retained the correct speed. Overall it sounds great and does the job on a budget, not sure why people are getting all snobbish over it.

just yesterday I was looking for a turntable as a gift for my brother. now youtube is crowded with related video recommendations. at first I was annoyed. but now I am very glad I opened this video in particular. awesome explanation.

The lengths he goes to to prove the snobs wrong is really inspiring.

21:19 If it doesn't skip on _that_ it doesn't skip on daft punk's LP.

Bought two of these in 2005 they were $99 a piece and are great starter equiptment. I kept them long after I upgraded and gave them to people starting out, a good trick on these is to unhook the belt if you dont use the table frequently. What people tend to forget is that a very high percentage of used records were played on very low quality and/or un-maintained equiptment. One of these is not going to destroy a record. It may sound sonically different due to the wow and flutter, microphonics of the hollow body, or even the cartridge limitations but that stuff is not usually severe enough to ruin the average listeners experience anyways.

Excellent video. You obviously put a good amount of time, money and thought into it and it shows. Thanks.

2020: hOw ThE tUrNtAbLeS...

That blew my mind how well the Pioneer played the warped Elton John record.

I came across this while looking for a review on the Pioneer PL-990 that I am considering for my daughter who is getting into vinyl. What a great video: explanation of terminology, testing and empirical data presentation. I knew I wasn't going to buy a higher end turn table for her, just something to listen to her albums on a few times a week and this gives me a lot of confidence in either unit, but as stated the Pioneer has some speed adjustment so I'm happy with that. Thanks again, this is a great video!

I had one of these. They are great for the price. If you're in the market for plug and play, and new to records, I concur with the entire video. Vintage isn't for everyone. This is like the Toyota Corolla of record players.

I can't tell you how thankful I am for stumbling across your channel and these very helpful videos! I got one of those Victrola players a few weeks ago for my birthday. Thankfully (I'm taking it as a blessing), it didn't even work out of the box, so we sent it back, and I found Techmoan's video about the cheapness and how rampant the mechanism was. That led me to do research and discover the AT-LP60. Definitely going to be purchasing this one in the Victrola's place. Thank you VWestlife!

Thanks for the review. I bought a new Pioneer PL-99O on June 3rd, 2018 and it is an awesome turntable in a great price range too. I appreciate your taking the time and having the suggestion for others to choose.

Great video. I set up ultra high end turntables for a living, and it's refreshing to see a less hysterical and less cynical review of these. When my niece asked for a record player for her 16th birthday, I got her an AT-LP60. She loves it, and has now taken if with her to college.

The LP60 is definitely not as bad as Crosley, it's a little more 'low-end', but it's a good beginner's turntable. i'm an audiophile, but not a dickhead that shits on anyone that can't afford to spend 500 to 1000 dollars on a Pro-Ject or Technics turntable. People have budgets and these are good turntables

Extremely informative video! I was looking at both of these for my workshop and now I'm more confident to buy the Pioneer after listening to your reviews. Thank you!

I bought my daughter an Audio Technica turntable from Amazon for £99 so she could take some vinyl to university. Before she left home I hooked it up to my hi fi system which has a Thorens turntable worth £800. I swear I could not tell the difference in sound. If ever I need to replace my Thorens deck I’ll get one for myself. Absolute bargain, and my daughter loves it.

Wow , this really made me feel better about myself . I have a old Sony record player from the early 2000's . I was always told I was ruining my records by playing them on my Sony . I'm low on funds atm and I'm in the process of moving . Once I'm setup I can enjoy my records in peace :)

I don't see why these tables would have a problem with vinyl skipping given the modest 3.5g tracking force. I have a cartridge that recommends 1.5g of tracking force, and even that doesn't skip unless something is seriously wrong with the record! I'm actually surprised the wow/flutter rating on the AT-LP120 is 0.2%, the whole point of direct drive was to increase stability (the SL-1900 is rated at 0.03% WRMS, -70dB rumble). Also, audiophiles are never satisfied, hence the existence of things like the 700+lb Clearaudio Statement turntable that sells for a "bargain" $170,000.... and that doesn't include the recommended $15,000 Goldfinger Statement cartridge or the equally expensive pre-amp, amp, and speakers. At that rate, you might as well hire people for live performances, it likely sounds just as good ;). Heck, it might even be cheaper!

Amazing video! Thanks for making it. Really well done and thorough investigation of commonly available TTs with good suggestions on how to adjust/improve. Never take this down it needs to stand for reference!

Thank you for your unbiased review and in-depth testing of these turn tables.

This has been super helpful in my tough decision making venture of finding a good starter record player. Vwestlife, my hats off to you and your devotion to inform the people on the truth.

This is like a really kind "Fuck You" to all the people who think these turntables are as bad as a crosley.

Great video. Helped calm some of my worries about the lp60

You did such a great review. You tackled the review and also managed to teach a thing or two. Wonderful job. Thank you so much for the effort and work.

I can tell a lot of time and energy went into this video, well done. Good information.

This was so informing while looking to purchase these. Thank you so much for making this video.

Many thanks for doing this presentation! I am currently in the market for a turntable and do NOT have a lot of $$$ . This helped me immensely in finding one I can afford. Thank you! Patrick

I just bought a L250h for 20€ and it's working marvelously so I'm happy! My first record player. Thanks for all this knowledge.

Excellent review of the entry level tables. You make some excellent points. I would not recommend upgrading the stylus to anything "sharper" than a .4 X .7 elliptical. 3.5g VTF is very high, by modern standards. Installing a .3 X .7 will sound much more detailed, until it rapidly wears the grooves and the stylus itself due to the much smaller groove contact patch. These turntables come with a conical stylus for a couple of reasons. The first is cost. The second is record wear. These turntables are built to a price point, and as such they have to focus their available construction budget on what makes the most sense. They offer convenience features such as tonearm automation and a built in riaa preamp/equalizer. The cartridge and stock stylus' compliance are a decent match to the tonearm's effective mass, and should keep resonance down around 10Hz. The turntable motor's servo electronics are not all that great. They don't correct for dynamic stylus drag very well (unlike your Technics), but not much worse than competitors from the audiophile brands using AC synchronous motors. Vibration isolation is an afterthought on these basic turntables. Motor noise can be clearly audible (and picked up by the cartrdige), too, on well seasoned units. Are they terrible, no. Are they great, no. They're entry level. Use one for a year or two, and upgrade when you have the interest and funds. Jeez...that Daniel 45. I wouldn't even try to play it on one of my SL-1200s. Even the cheap cartridges I run are too expensive to subject to that kind of abuse.

Thanks for sharing this video. I bought an LP60 a few months back and noticed it was running a bit fast. Found the adjustment screws and got it dialed in perfectly! This is a great turntable, I highly recommend it.

I've listened to the LP60 I was pretty shocked at how good it was for 100 bucks or so. I would generally recommend someone get a used direct drive instead of one of these new but if you want to keep it simple and not have to deal with tuning everything on a DD table there's nothing wrong with one of these.

Awesome video. Snobbery is definitely in every hobby (talking as a photographer here hahah). Really glad you did your research and put a lot of these misconceptions to bed. Not everyone has thousands of dollars to drop for their music setup, so this was a very helpful and non-biased video! Thank you x

If people say these record players sound bad, they must be using cheap Logitec computer speakers, or some other cheap and crappy speakers.

Nicely done video! Great demonstrations to defend the points you make. I was pleased to see the strobe and pitch adjustment on the Pioneer. I had a Sony PS-LX250H that didn't have this feature and played noticeably fast. I recently replaced it with a Technics SL-BD22, which has it and two other features I found important: 1) A ground wire (the Sony was supposed to be self-grounding but produced a distracting hum between tracks even at relatively lower volume) and 2) A tone arm lock. I grew up in the 70s when vinyl was pretty much the only available retail music format (please don't remind me of 8 tracks). I got away from records beginning around 1990 with the explosion of CD popularity. And, honestly, the CD is a superior *storage* device. But I've recently renewed my interest in vinyl. I'll admit that nostalgia plays a part in my rekindled appreciation of vinyl. Some music sounds (perhaps subjectively) crisper on vinyl, some not so much. There's just something - maybe intangible, maybe personal, whatever - about albums; the covers (especially a gatefold), the artwork and liner notes, etc. seem to make for a somewhat fuller experience.

I've purchased mine today. Thank you for these accurate tests. You did a great work . It helped me a lot.

Excellent Presentation !!! You really did a deep dive on the theory and physics of the turntable & made it understandable & accessible. THANKS.

Man, I'm so glad I watched this video. I have been listening to my cheap Aiwa turntable play records too fast for so long without realizing how easily I could adjust the speed. Thank you!

After much deliberation about what turntable to go for, or whether to even get into Vinyl at all, I've just bought and set up an AT LP 60 after watching this video and enjoying my first foray in records and I'm loving it! So simple to get started and sounds great even with a modest older amp/speakers. I can always work my way up to something More sophisticated later, but this is plenty good enough, and cheap! Thanks again

Thank you for the honest straight forward critique. Very helpful. PF

thank you for this video! i've been looking at turntables, but it seems like i can't find an affordable one that hasn't been lambasted online for something or another. this clears a lot up, with actual evidence instead of just anecdote. much appreciated!

When you have cheap turntables from brands like Audio Technica, Pioneer, Sony, Dual, and Marantz, they can't be that bad, even if they're cheap. Brands like Boytone, Polariod, Crosley, and Victrola on the other hand...

I like my AT LP60. One criticism that I think is fair is that the build quality isn’t the best, but it isn’t total crap either. It’s mostly made of light plastic and the buttons do feel flimsy and like they’d break pretty easily, but having said that, I’ve had it for three years and have used it pretty regularly, and so far I have had nothing fail.

Very nice analysis and demo, very clearly done! Tks for the work!

Fantastic video! Lot of information and all of it well-explained with minimal jargon overload! Thanks for making it!

Im glad to have found this video haha. I have used and owned a Presidian turntable since I was like 13 years old. I finally got it out of storage yesterday and had a long awaited reunion with it. To me its always worked just fine and sounded good. Last night whilst browsing vinyl videos, I saw enough videos recommending 200 dollar turntables, that it made me feel like maybe my turntable is inadequate haha. It does have its issues, but it makes me happy. Thats all that matters

Great review, VWestlife! I've bought myself a Pioneer PL-990. I'm fine with it.

Thank you. Learned a lot. How to measure tracking force on those types of turntables correctly for instance. That they have anti-skating surprised me really and that even the audio technica has a speed control is great to know. This supports my opinion, that the audio technica is one of - if not *the* - best entry level turntable money can buy. If someone tries to argue about, I will send him to this video.

I was impressed with the info given. I already knew a few stats & specs, but the added info was great. I ordered a scale before I knew of this video and have an idea how to verfy the manufacurers weight of the tone arm. The anti skate info really will help with minor tweaking. I would have missed the correct weight and not tested the skating as well. I will be watching more of your youtube videos. There are always new ideas and tricks. Thanks, Wiloby

Amazing video. It's good to know these cheaper turntables aren't bad at all :D

im fine with my at lp60

Fantastic, informative video. Thank you very much for doing this.

The Audio Technice lp60 is a great player, never skipped once, speed is perfect, you wont go wrong with it. Sound is great through my Sony setup. This is a great informative review, probably the best out there .

This is the most helpful and informative video that i have watched this year so far. I was dissuaded to buy the Audio Technica AT-LP60 by so-called 'Audiophiles' but having come across this video i am glad to say that i will be buying one! I am glad that among the crowd of snobbish 'audiophiles' and 'vinyl enthusiasts' that like the shit on peoples dreams, there are genuine people like yourself. Thank you very much!

I've been using Turntables for decades. I have learn more in 20 minutes about turntables features and mechanism than in my previous 40 years!

As soon as I heard people saying anything with a strong bassline or drums was skipping I got really scared and looked over at my Bleach record. I’m thinking of getting an AT-LP60X and this really helped, so thank you :)

Awesome video, you've pretty much sold me on the Pioneer. The speed adjusting in the front and the auto loader and remover is exactly what I'm looking for on my budget. Thanks!

Very nice and informative video! Thanks for posting it!

This was the perfect video for me. I have an AT LP-60 and my faith has been restored in it! I may look at getting a different stylus and see if that’s a cheap upgrade worth doing! Thank you for the thorough review and explanations!

Audio-Technica LP60: *is in the thumbnail* me: *heavy breathing*

Thank you so much for making this video. I'm planning on buying an Audio-Technica AT-LP60 soon, because It's the best player I can get on a tight budget. I wasn't sure if it was good, and worth my money, and all these tests you've run have proven that it's just the one I need. Thanks!