That's the bottom line. I don't know how its ever even a question whether or not Durant needed the Warriors more or if they needed him more. Durant would have ended up being a slightly better Melo without the warriors.
You are missing the point. Gsw are viewed as a dynasty because they have 4 rings . They would not be a dynasty without KD. Also curry would be looked at different without KD and LeBron would likely have more rings and looked at differently as well. So kd did change their legacy
@@propanetank8640 they prove 5 years later they can win another Ring 💍 if Lebron and Cleveland win 3 straight championships kyrie goes no where and Lebron stills happy in Cleveland with 5 or 6 Rings. Kevin Durant changed History do you guys realize that lol 😂
It is an excuse because when he got suspended they were up 3-1 and it completely changed the momentum of that series because if he doesn’t get suspended they win that series in 5
Warriors won 73 games, and had a 3-1 lead in the finals before they ran out of gas. Had they kept Barnes or brought someone else in not named KD,they still would have been a title contender. Bringing in KD just made them unbeatable in a playoff situation.
Being a title contender and winning titles are 2 different things. There's nobody other than KD who they could've gotten to help them beat Lebron and his Cavs.
You're out of your mind. And they already had a title and a 3-1 lead of the Cavs. Its amazing people always wanna acknowledge everything that went wrong for Cavs in 15 but not the Warriors in 16@@smoothsavage2870
@@gregoryevans8179 Draymond was there after the suspension. Yall act like he got suspended for the remainder of the series. The Cavs were in elimination games every game after game 4.
@@jasonharris8099 bro if a top player in the league wants to join your team that can’t beat you then why would you say no? That logic don’t even make sense KD lost to Steph not the other way around why would Steph feel away about a guy who he beat joining him?? Like dude I whoop yo ass then you call saying you want to be my best friend after I whoop you and somehow I look bad and not you?
@@jasonharris8099I hear what you’re saying but if your them you ain’t taking that call? If I’m them confident or not I woulda been thinking we can get KD? Well that’s atleast talk to him
They won with Harrison Barnes and then Andrew Wiggins at the small forward position. Kevin Durant was over the top, but all they needed was a serviceable small forward who could defend and give you 12 to 18 ppg a la Wiggins
Chris says the Warriors would’ve been motivated to come back and win in 2017, but who says they would’ve got there again? You can use the same argument that OKC would’ve been motivated to come back and beat the Warriors had KD stayed. Even the 2017 spurs would’ve proved a tough out for them especially if they didn’t have KD.
It wasn't just the Draymon Green Injury, both Bogut and Iggy got hurt game 5 when Draymon was out, so that series was definitely not the same after that
@@klssplash facts! Bogut was controlling the paint and I don’t mean dominant numbers, I mean influence of their defense in protecting the rim and keeping Tristan Thompson off the offensive glass. When he got hurt, all that changed
@@Warriors49ers definitely was a big reason they were able to chuck him like they were doing and Steph couldn’t do much against it. People forget they played physical against Steph in all 4 of the finals they played the warriors and that 2016 finals was really where that worked the most. I think it was like you said, due to injury
@@klssplashwhat gets lost is lebron almost beat them with Mozgov and Dellevadova as his co starts in their first rodeo when love and Kyrie got hurt That's why they flew to LI and begged KD to join them and they openly admitted they went to get him just to beat LeBron
Gilbert Arenas had a point that KD saved the legacy of Steph Klay and Draymond while at the same time tainting his own legacy, but Isaiah was definitely spot on
You clearly didn't read what I said cuz I'm sure klay and Draymond can't say they have finals mvps let alone regular mvps KD joining the warriors made klay and Draymond guaranteed HOF guys while we 💩 on KD for taking the easy way out
@@blazedup4208BS you don’t know what you’re talking about. They were beating everyone without KD being there. A lot of y’all just talk but don’t really know basketball. They would have probably beaten the Cavs if Draymond didn’t get suspended smh
@@ZimMill We dont know if KD would be ringless or not. Yall just assume that because you hate him. The way you think about KD NOW is because you hate him for going to the Warriors. The reason you respect the Warriors NOW is because you hate KD for going there and you praise them to spite KD. He DEFINITELY is the reason people view them in a good light these days.
@@smoothsavage2870 You Way Too Emotional Dude It Ain’t That Deep KD Been In The League For 17 Years & He Played 3 Years In Golden State So Do The Math… We Have A 14 Year Sample Size Of Evidence Where He Played Outside Of Golden State & He Is 0/14 As Far As Winning A Championship… KD Is A Champion Because The Warriors Made Him A Champion… The Warriors Are Champions With Or Without KD Nothing About This Has Emotion Involved, These Are Unimpeachable Facts
So, kD still hasn't won ish without them... Chris is right on this.... kD didn't have to play for them especially because they just beat him the year before.
@@sirwavydude5435you saying so is hilarious. Bruh 6 years later means that championship has 0 to do with 2016. Winning 6 years later doesn’t change that KD without question carry him
so what? they still had the same core in 2022 and you don't have to be unstoppable in order to win multiple rings. 2016 they barely lost in game 7 even with dray suspension and injuries. KD was paid 25+ mill a year on GS. If they didnt get him they would have that money to get another all star and bench players
Thank you everybody always makes excuses for everybody else Those injuries stopped lebron from beating them the 1st time He almost beat them with Mozgov AND Dellevadova The warriors probably never even win if that 1st series doesn't happen with those injuries to kyrie and Love
he plays PG on the roster. and is PG on the depth chart. Klay is the SG. How they play may not fully define the position, but we can't change their positions just cause.
Biggest reason Warriors lost was because Bogut got hurt. They had no inside presence once Bogut went down. For me, Bogut's absence hurt them more than Draymond getting suspended
@clarenspierre1013 You know two things can be true right? What does your comment have to do with mine? Ofc losing players affect outcomes. That's my point lol
@jandt3463 it's a reason not an excuse lol. An excuse would be playing badly and then making an excuse. Injuries are part of the game and hence, a legit reason for a team to lose.
Who had the weaker competition between MJ and Lebron. Who NEVER PLAYED OR BEAT A SUPERTEAM (3 HOFs on 1 team e.g. Jordan, Pippen, Rodman) on his many final appearances. Talk about weak. Chris thinks he's slick and we don't know basketball history. SMDH Some guy answered me the Pistons, but they had been to 3 straight Finals before Jordan beat them. If you know NBA History, after 3 finals the team is done by the 4th year. You can check every team. GTFOH
@@richardturner1063so by that logic Lebron only started winning bcuz Kobe was done right ?tf you talking about ? Do you know that d Wade is better at literally everything then Scottie Pippen ! Like who tf y’all think y’all be talking about ?
The thought of Durant not joining the Warriors and how Lebron could've won more titles is interesting for the GOAT debate. The warriors adding KD is clearly the best team of all time.
They Always Bring Up That Dray Quote That He Said When He Was Trying To Be Friendly On The Pod, But Never Mention The Quote When Draymond Told KD To His Face “WE DON’T NEED YOU. WE’LL WIN AGAIN WHEN YOU LEAVE” They Never Bring That Part Up Tho
Just a bunch of casuals bruh remember the majority is not always right these mfs think they can gaslight ppl that know wtf happened lmao and know basketball and been watching basketball for years. Yall just can’t gaslight us like that ain’t gon work on me 😂
@@ebonynerd That’s The Point… KD Was Never Needed. They Replaced Him With 2 High Quality Role Players & Won Again Meanwhile He’s Hopping All Over The League & Still Can’t Even Make It To A Conference Finals… Warriors Saved KD Legacy
The Warriors nearly won the 2016 Finals against Cleveland, which was actually a pretty great Finals. Let's remember that they were in game 7 all the way down to the last 2 or 3 minutes, even with Draymond Green's suspension and injuries to Andre Iguodala and Andrew Bogut and with Steph Curry not being 100% because of his knee. So, if KD had signed somewhere else, the Warriors had a good chance of coming back in 2017 if they had better injury luck and Draymond played more in control. KD signing just made them an uber-superteam that only injuries could stop. And injuries was how that team was stopped vs. the Raptors in 2019.
People will never accept the truth but they will accept the truth of the cavs being hurt in 2015. It’s asinine. The team won 73 games and were 2 minutes away from completing basketball. Yet folks say they never would’ve had a chance. It’s insane. Some folks should just shut up and not talk basketball. Could they have lost? Possibly, but they could have won just as much.
It was not colossal choke, this media play media tricks. I love how it’s not mentioned the warriors lost their center in game 4. Ain’t it weird to mention the lane was open because their only big was missing after game 4.
People forgot Bogut was injured, Iggy injured, Steph was dealing with injury also. Draymond suspended. CAVS caught the best break to win that series. So stop the nonsense.
Hell i knew before the video Chris would be oppose to it. He's hated KD since 2019 when KD called him a liar. Ever since then on EVERY show when Kd names come up Chris salts him. Now he disagrees with a professional.
Exactly. Chris even hates to bring up KD, unless it's something negative. I bet if KD wins a ring in PHX, Chris still will find a way to spin it in a negative way.
Mane I thought I was the only person who noticed Chris don’t mess with KD after he called him a liar.😂 It’s like everytime they talk about KD Chris got something negative to say about him
@@courtneywilliams394EVERYTIME breh . Even yesterday on FTF , Nick gave KD props on his recent play &Chris immediately said “but Shai’s better “ 😂 man got real hate for KD
Chris gets ultra sensitive every time it comes to these Steph and Warriors debates. I remember watching some podcast with a couple Warriors fans and Rob was their guest, and when Rob expressed his opinion about Steph not being the "greatest shooter" of all time, they let him finish his opinion before they express theirs. They're being chill about it. But Chris always has to interrupt.
Chris is so wrong on this one. The Warriors believed they couldn’t beat LeBron! That’s why they went running to the Hamptons to beg KD to come save them!
People that didn't play simply don't know how exhausting it is to win 73 regular games and then making it to the finals. People can talk all they want, but this Warrior's core (7th, 11th and 35th pick) already far exceeded the expectations.
They saved it together. KD needed a team without a nutcase, Golden State needed a boost after that catastrophic Finals loss. Ultimately KD was the difference. Saying KD saved them is a more exaggerated way of saying KD was the difference
It’s not exaggerated. Those boys went 73-9 after talkin trash about wanting Cleveland fully healthy. Lost then went to KD to literally make it the best team ever.
Draymond is also contradicting… he said those Cavs team was never beating them but then goes to say they wouldn’t have won without KD. Make it make sense, also everybody who played GS says the game planned for Steph really so how did KD save their legacy? They saved his by being the best team and letting him just put up numbers like he does, he has no real proof that he can actually LEAD a team being the absolute best player
@@christiansoldier77 we can say damn thing in 2016 if Draymond green doesn’t get suspended or Andrew Bogut doesn’t get hurt but I don’t bc I don’t play the what if games
Chris is the only one on the show providing FACTS. The only reason why the Cavs won that series is because Draymond was suspended!! There no other way the even come back!! Isaiah is wrong!!!
Why in these conversations do ppl not bring up how Bogut was out Games 5-7 to be replaced by Anderson Varejao? I get Steph didn’t play great all series but they were up 3-1. Then Draymond is suspended after having his tech upgraded AFTER THE GAME when LeBron petitioned to Silver. I don’t see how we just over look these circumstances to say “Oh GS had no chance at beating LeBron at all without KD.” Like they were close to doing it without KD
they couldn't win two, how did you come up with three? had the warriors not signed KD, it's safe to say they would've found a quality free agent. I love Zeke, but he's salty that Curry has dethroned him in the eyes of many as #2 goat pg. lebron seemingly bought Dray, & Rob is wet blanket on most topics
@@sv1global599 The entire team was back and healthy, if guys were traded or injured sure. The Cavs did make it back to the finals. The notion they wouldn't win without a DK Warriors and not let's say the series is 2-0 the Cavs will always feel like they have a chance. Or better yet 2--2 with the Warriors winning the last two, even with back to back wins the Warriors would always feel we played well the last 4 days but anything can turn. Thats not hate, the only one that could even guard Lebron on that team was DK. He guarded the best guy and still put up 30. Including hit two clutch shots in both finals, a random free agent thats not a top 5 guy won't be doing that. At that time outside of Steph DK was the second best player in the league.
Legacy looks very different with 2 rings, like Houston Rockets team in the 90's it's not a diss but that's the level they would be perceived as possibly even slightly worse given that 3 - 1 collapse.
The whole trajectory would have changed if KD never went there. The warriors were psychologically defeated during that series it was really a mental series. The way they kept attacking curry. Remember lebron even blocked his shot on a timeout
This is silly. The Dubs didn’t get swept by the Cavs, they came very very close to winning. This notion that they couldn’t compete is ludicrous. Getting KD ensured they would beat the Cavs, but the Dubs were not completely defeated and unable to compete.
People forget that the year KD tore his Achilles, he was out round 2-3 and the warriors ran through the playoffs without him. And if Klay and Cousins didn't get hurt in the finals it would've been a much different finals
I don't think the Warriors even make the finals in 2018 without KD. It took an injured CP3 & 27 straight missed 3PA for the Warriors to beat the Rockets in 7
@@jaylou8721 Obviously did not need KD since they destroyed the league and went 16-1 in playoffs in 2017. In 2019, Kd was injured and replaced by his backup. If they never got KD they would have 25 million in cap and got an all star and bench players. You cant just take KD off the team and not replace him lol
Everybody forgets Andrew Bogut, their premiere paint protector for the entire season got hurt as well. Once that happened Kyrie and Lebron had free reign at the rim
@asiantrick24 but they didn't need him cavs caught several breaks in order for them to barely win let's stop acting like the cavs just dominated the warriors to the point the warriors couldn't have beat them
Chris has said before that the dubs wouldn't have won in 2015 if Kyrie and Love were healthy, but now for the sake of this argument he keeps saying that they won before KD so they didn't need him. Clearly he's trying to diminish KD's titles with them because he balled against his boy Bron and was arguably the best player in the league.
cap they was beating they ass by 20+ a game with kyrie in the roster the suspension and injury to their rim protection is the only reason the cavs barely won plus iggy lebrons primary defender got hurt stop acting like it was impossible for the warriors to beat them
@@MaxPotentialGreatness People forget Bron did his dumb hero ball routine in the last minutes of game 7 going four straight possessions and missed every shot. The only reason they won is becuz he FINALLY passed to Kyrie who hit the game winner.
The problem with this argument is everyone is assuming that if KD never went to GS then the warriors team would have just stayed the same all thos years. More realistically if they didnt get KD rhey would have eventually went and got someone else or added more quality pieces and still won a couple more rings.
And you are assuming other teams don’t get better too. Kd and Russ with a bunch of guys who can’t shoot almost beat them. Give kd a team with shooters where they cant just load up on him and he’s killing them.
@@brendanbloom3366 And what team with the cap space to sign KD had a "bunch of shooters" to allow KD to play 1v1. Golden State was the only team that had the ability to provide him that at the time.
@@brandonb.5304 exactly why it made sense to go there. They still had to lose 2 starters and almost all their bench to do it. Kd could have done a 1 year deal in okc and by the next year a team could have created the cap space for kd. There was no point for a guy coming off a broken foot to do that tho. Okc could have not been cheap and kept harden in the first place.
Yeah, but the Cavs LOST the only game of the 2015 series that Kyrie was in, so he was not the Cavs secret sauce. Remember that he got injured in OT in game one, and the Dubs went on to win that game.
• Rob Parker, sad really sad. Kevin Durant was considered a joke when he joined a 73 win team with the 1st unanimous MVP. Giving the team that was 3 points away from being back to back champs, the last 3MVPs - 2014,15, 16. Anything to discredit Lebron. 'We ballers know what time it is' SMDH
@yannickdias9813 how many teams in history were both tops offensively and defensively and lost in the playoffs? The warriors were tops offensively and defensively 2014-2016. The warriors were going to win regardless bc what the cavs lost in offense they gained in defense. Kyrie played game 1 that year and the cavs lost that game right? They didn't start winning until he was out. But if you think differently, just provide those teams that have won when worse offensively and defensively. 😏
People forget that after Draymond's suspension there was a negative domino affect on the Warriors. They wound up losing Iguadola and Bogert, who were two of the warriors best defenders to injuries. Which drastically changed the dynamic of that series.
I get these guys are analysts and all, but I don't see how you can feel comfortable acting like your opinion is more valid than a two-time NBA champion lol. I'll never understand.
Dumars/Isiah tied mvp votes in each ring season, & Dumars won 1st FMVP, Isiah the 2nd, but Dumars was on all league teams those ring seasons, while Isiah wasn’t.
Because their job is to be analysts, not playing basketball. Isaiah Thomas is quite unsuccessful off the court, so it makes complete sense for analysts to consider themselves as better at ANALYSING than a basketball player, who's job it is to play basketball, not analyse it
This man Chris is crazy. First of all if they didn't need Kevin Durant they wouldn't have went to the Hamptons to recruit him. Also let's not forget that they lost the year they won all those games. Aand last people forget that when the Warriors won that first championship Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love was playing injured. We all saw what happened the next year when they were healthy and Kyrie took Steph to school. Last point is for those two championships Kevin Durant took over and dominated in the finals. He showed that he was the best player on the court in those championship series
Chris argument doesn’t hold any water. The warriors showed us they themselves didn’t believe they could run it back without adding KD. By literally adding KD
I’m a big Golden State Warriors fan but Chris is wrong if he’s thinking that Isaiah is wrong. The Warriors would’ve never recovered from going, 73 and nine and losing the finals. That was a totally different team after Katie joined and psychologically boosted the confidence of everyone. The Warriors if they did not have Kevin Durant will be playing like they are now. A play type of a team back then
@@jakieresykes3644but that’s not really proof of anything or and argument against the fact that he boosted that team to a level they never would’ve reached without him. At best they could’ve squeezed our one more ring that’s if they could’ve gotten past Houston (likely). But that’s all speculation, what we do know is GS players asked KD to come to the Warriors not the other way around. You don’t recruit someone unless you think you need them.
@@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen For me it is not speculation because people talk about the Warriors blowing a 3-1 lead to the Cavs people just ignore the fact that KD blew a lead to that same Warriors team and not only that do people forget that before KD went to Golden State he had a losing record against Lebron
lmao how you a big warriors fan and then say that a 73-9 team that was 1 minute away from winning the finals would have been a PLAY-IN team the following year with the same roster.
Did Magic save Kareem's legacy? Zeke needs to look at this in a historical context, all of the all time great players played with other all time great players to win their championships.
You can guarantee one thing, they weren’t demoralized after losing to the Cavs, they were pissed and felt like it had been stolen with all the league crap and injuries. They would have come back even more motivated
How? They even moderately upgrade from Harrison Barnes and they likely win another title in the next few years. Barnes was absolutely awful in the Finals as their starting 3. People pretending like a team that won 73 games that year was going to immediately crumble and break up is laughable. That team was nearly unbeatable for 95% of the season. It took an unfortunate set of circumstances, like Curry have no lateral movement from an injury a month earlier, Draymond get suspended, having no rim protector because of a Bogut injury, etc. for them to collapse in the Finals.
@@brandonb.5304it’s context. Brussaurd saying they “ran through” these teams like everyone was 100%. Injuries are obviously part of the game but you can’t look at that warriors team and think the can replicate their success against a healthy field
Zeke is spot on, GS was not going to beat Lebron those next 2 years without KD that’s just facts in fact 2018 Lebron was by far the best player I had ever witness with every tool in his Arsonal
Chris saying they would’ve came back and win in 2017 is cap. Maybe they could’ve. But I think losing the 3-1 lead against Lebron in the finals broke them. Why do you think they ran to kd? The spurs didn’t run to Kd back in 2014 when they lost to Lebron. Lebron would’ve won in 2017 and 2018. At least one of those years.
Let’s not forget that Harrison Barnes missed like a million 3s in that series. Any upgrade at Small Forward and the Warriors would have won the following year. They just happened to get the best possible upgrade at Small Forward imaginable.
Draymond was spot on! Not only would golden state have lost the following year if they didn't get KD, but they were planning to get KD anyway regardless of the outcome of the 2016 finals. That entire season whenever they played OKC, Kerr, curry, klay, and draymond were all very chummy with KD to the point that there was an inkling of chemistry budding. And yes, the league was beginning to catch up with golden state's style of play. KD was the perfect fit.
Pretty sure Steph and co. led to the Warriors to the Finals (sweeping the Blazers in the Conference Finals btw) while KD was injured. They did eventually lose against the Raptors but to say the league caught up with them is hyperbole
• Rob Parker, sad really sad. Kevin Durant was considered a joke when he joined a 73 win team with the 1st unanimous MVP. Giving the team that was 3 points away from being back to back champs, the last 3MVPs - 2014,15, 16. Anything to discredit Lebron. 'We ballers know what time it is' SMDH
@@jakieresykes3644 He was suspended one game out of seven. If the Warriors were the better team, then why didn't they close Cleveland out the next two games they had WITH Draymond? Better yet, why didn't they sweep Cleveland? Cuz Cleveland had already won a game before Draymond got suspended. That's a tired ass narrative Warriors fans use to cope.
The reason Chris is so pressed about this is because he wanted to continue the in “Mike era no one ate but Mike” now he has to accept that KD made it to where Bron lose 2 straight finals! Think about it! He would have at least 5 by now!
