Clips: 1970, June Lockhart gently challenges homophobia on THE VIRGINIA GRAHAM SHOW w/Rev Troy Perry 

She's a CANCER like me! The Sign of Empathy & Compassion!

Wow

Amazing. Good for June saying we should not moralize it. Wonder how Virgini'as gay friends felt about her reactions on this episode............

@@PracticalPerry What needed to be updated about it?

@@LeeKeels If she still feels the way she does or has more to add to it considering 1970 was a whole other generation, 50+ years into the past. A lot has changed since then regarding what we know about it.

history is so back and forwards on this, what is happening now is very common in history though, heteronormative gay people are gatekeeping, and there is precedent, there were gay people and jews in the SS and SA that thought picking on the more marginalized was fun until they were purged.

Virginia Graham was tired in her prime. My mom used to watch her every day, smoking cigarettes and drinking coffee, then get on the phone to her friend Ellen or Joan, and gossip about the show and eventually people they know.

I can attest to what it is to be a gay man even though I've chosen to live celibate. My dream of awakening in the morning as a lusting heterosexual ain't gonna happen, else it would've happened a long time ago.

Even in 1970 gay people had friends and relatives who supported them. Not as many as now, for sure, but the minority still existed. And clapping in a tv audience is mostly anonymous so people can circumvent the moral busybodies. It's the same way people tell political pundits one thing during elections and then once out of the public eye they have the anonymity to vote freely. Never underestimate the oppressive power of social pressure. It can be stronger than written law.

@@Ma1nguy Why don't you read your bible

Rev Troy Perry is the founder of the Metropolitan Community Church (MCC). A ministry started originally for lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender communities, in Los Angeles on October 6, 1968. At 83 yrs of age he's still with us today. A beacon of hope for millions.

He seems both cool AF and radically intelligent. Speaking here about how society has made people neurotic.

They are speaking openly and freely, with no thought of repercussions. I might suggest that indicates they are of their time.

What impressed me is that the crowd clapped and supported June and the preacher.

@@ziff_1 yes that was great.

Bullshit 😂😂

That way.

@@StonedUp1 Your response says more about you than anyone else could.

@@StonedUp1You are only old enough to understand the Power Rangers. Pfft.

Amen x

She's 99 and still going strong, from what I've heard.

@@markrichards6863YAY!! 🌹 I’ve always loved June Lockhart!

Mad props to June….VG uniformed , very disappointed.

@@DavidMcFarner Indeed. The next Gay icon if she isnt now. A class act, and may I say nice to see a show where people arent screaming over each other

Supporting perversion is not anything modern

I also posted another great clip of Rev. Perry here, talking in 1971 about the founding of his gay-friendly church: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-gNajAvP0nhA.html

I was very confused because I thought he was going to be the one June argues with.

​@@bondfoolIt's really a shocking plot twist, to see the man with the collar on this side of the debate, in a program from that era. I guess it just shows the changes happening at that time. The culture really went through some very rapid changes between 1965 and 1975.

The priest you refer to is Rev Troy Perry founder of the Metropolitan Community of Churches in 1968. He's still around today preaching the true word of the Gospel with his husband and soul mate along side him since 2003.

@@honestone490 a good person will always have a great life, he deserves a good life

I recall being head over heels over the Rev Perry as a youngster

The priest was very compassionate, but also very wrong. The Bible, God's Word, clearly prohibits the action in Leviticus, and again in several of the Pauline New Testament letters. Find a Biblical Concordance and look it up. That said, Jesus also commanded that we love one another, but He also always emphasized Repentance from sin.

@@roberthaber8510 There's a lot of disagreement on what the bible actually says, and many biblical scholars believe it's being misinterpreted in that sense. Leviticus, for example, is being debated on it's meaning. So, saying he's wrong for interpreting the bible that way is nonsense. There's not much consensus on the topic. Either way, you can't cherry pick what you like out of the bible and ignore the rest. You're either all in or all out.

​@@roberthaber8510 the Bible also says that eating pork products and shellfish is an abomination...sex while menstruating is an abomination, wearing two types of cloth... abomination... Also says you should stone your children if they misbehave... I don't see you bringing up ANY of those things.. The bible was written a very, very long time ago when people's understanding of the world was about a 50 mile radius... If you're going to use the bible as a shield for everything you dislike you should at least have an understanding of what it actually says ..

@@nagashtheforsaken Oh, I'm all in. Leviticus 20:13, "A man shall not sleep with a man as if with a woman - it is an abomination . . . " How can that not be clear? I'd you accept Jesus as Lord and Saviour, you will be cleansed from that sin, and forgiven. I know. Personally.

What risk?

​@@TigerPrawn_Homosexuality was less accepted back then than it is today.🤷‍♀️

@@TigerPrawn_ are you kidding me? You could be fired for being gay or supporting gay people. I had to stay in the closet and posed as a straight person at work because the office where I was employed was owned by the Catholic Church. Gay bars were constantly raided by the police. It was nothing like it is today.

I'm even more impressed with the Catholic priest not only defending their right to exist but offering them a place of worship if they choose. It was only last year Pope Francis openly declared that LGBTQ+ individuals were welcome in the Catholic Church (but with some conditions).

@TigerPrawn In the 70s, speaking up in support of homosexuality could cost a person their career. Many people in Hollywood were blacklisted and refused work if it was known that they were gay or supported gay people. Times have changed but still not enough.

It's called "the smiling assassin." (Usually behind your back.)

Perfectly expressed. And absolutely true. Virginia Graham shows are intolerance, and racial tendency.

@johnwalzer9187 I question if Virginia Graham really had ANY "homosexual" friends. If she never discussed it with them, how would she even know? Her attitude wasn't good at all, but it wasn't as bad as MAGA is today.

@@CoopyKat True enough, but it's one of conservatives' three excuses for bad behavior. Whenever a right-wing extremist says anything hideously inappropriate and there's blowback, the excuses are: (1) it was a joke; (2) it was taken out of context; (3) "I have friends in that community." I'd love to meet these Jewish friends who find holocaust jokes funny or black friends who find slavery jokes funny or gay friends who find AIDS jokes funny.

@@CoopyKat - The only reason Virginia Graham would have friends in the LGBT community is most likely it was gay men who wanted to dress up and wear wigs like her. Virginia's getup translates very well in a drag show.

There's no such thing as homophobia.

@@davidlafleche1142 your denial will not protect you.

@@davidlafleche1142 That's like a member of the Third Reich saying there is no such thing as antisemitism. LOL!!! 🤣🤣🤣

Now I have a better understanding of Dame Edna. Always loved June Lockhart🎉

@@davidlafleche1142If ur talking about the phobia part and thinking no one’s afraid of them, it sometimes means dislike rather than fear

"I've had a friend for seven years who I was told.... you know, is that way".

@@latvguy1”We never talk about it”. Sure, cuz you’d have one fewer friend

And she was a talk show host. I give her credit for having the conversation, but deduct points for walking through life we blinders on.

Ikr? “Some of my best friends are (put in marginalized group here).”🙄

@@danityvanityinsanity Yesterday I was trying to think of the term for that but couldn’t remember until seeing your message. “Virtue signaling” and it’s always SO obvious

Well, that settles it.

Virginia Graham and people of that time had been taught that homosexuality was wrong and disgusting. We should not expect many people to rise above the prejudices and ignorance of their time.

@@vernonfrance2974 It was categorized as a psychological abnormality until the 1970s.

​@@vernonfrance2974June did. I'm now very curious about her upbringing.

Virginia Graham seems close-minded

& he's a cutie. .

He is Troy Perry. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troy_Perry?wprov=sfla1

FYI - The minister, Troy Perry, is not and never was a catholic priest.

​@@SusanMarie3I'm surprised that he wears a collar then. I'm looking forward to finding out more about him.

​@janetbeatrice9505 Other Protestant denominations wear clericals like this.

She is so cool and she used to work with Jonathan Harris [Dr. Smith] in Lost in Space who was gay.

Haha June didn't get along with Mr. Harris. But not because he was gay. She is a lovely person.

Harris wasn’t gay

@@rayarena879 Jonathan Harris was married to his high school sweetheart for over 60 years until his death. Sounds pretty straight to me.

@@DadInTaiwan She could have been his "beard," [that is to say, his cover]. Back in those days when Jonathan Harris married, it wasn't uncommon for gay men to get married because it was what was expected. The stigma of being known as gay was too stigmatizing. Look, June Lockhart who knew him better than you and I has gone on record saying he was gay.

Nah. Stuff like this was shown on tv talk shows once in awhile. And it always did more harm to gays than good. Blame religion.

Not really. I lived 1970. Conservative talk shows like this were all about conserving values, not about imposing values. It was the time when conservatism still meant checking bath water for babies, before allowing the progressives to throw it away and run the next bath.

Groundbreaking like Maude and All In The Family.

@@cascade5682 Which happened after.

​@@Mister_Listener💯agreed...I'm 75 yrs old,gays had an onslaught of constant harassment in spite of a few shows that made lukewarm pro gay commentary,but credit due...

The worst part is they're not pretending. They really think we're damaged.

@@reverbscherzo7850not at all. I believe you are in sin and if you want to continue that way have at it. Not a very wise decision in my view because I am a Christian and I would love for you to understand the Bible and how and why it describes sins of all kinds. Yes God certainly loves you as we all should, as a brother for sure. But you are sinning, just as my huge sin is gluttony of food. And that is a very serious problem for me, it is as bad to me and for me as your sin is. Am I damaged? Not the word I would choose. I know full well I choose things that make my senses satisfied beyond just being satiated. I struggle. I know I shouldn’t be in this state. I just have a sin state that people don’t deminize the way they do sexual sin so it’s easier for me to hide it. But at the end of the day that sin dissapointed god as much as any of your sin. You aren’t damaged. Or maybe we both are. I’m sorry you have been treated that way. I am a long standing very devout Christian and nobody that calls themselves that should ever treat you as damaged. We all have a sin nature.

@@sandradelvecchio6894thats a lot of hatred. Sounds like an awful group of people you fraternize with each sunday morning. Awful!

"Damage" comes from abuse and neglect inflicted by others, not from a part of oneself one is born with. No one is born damaged, and the sexuality a person is born with does not make the person damaged.

@@sandradelvecchio6894Thank you for exemplifying exactly the crap we have to put up with on the daily. 🙄 You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Like saying oh I have many black friends/ remember that one?

Gays do the same thing by making homosexuality akin to being black. You're all hypocrites. Since when does the color of skin hue equal comparative your sexual deviance? Repent

I'm sure there are MANY things and people in this life who you don't know about and/or don't understand. Does that make YOU a bad person? Just stop....

@@notAsoccerMom I ve been on that end of being discriminted, so yes I understand a hateful Bitch bigot.

I like to respond to this sentiment with "they may be friends to you, but you are not a friend to them."

She was _always_ that way: Smiling while delivering instant, clever, razor-sharp retorts... one of the smartest, bravest, and quick-witted actors in Hollywood ever.

This is about homosexuality, same-SEX attraction. The gender identity letters have nothing to do with same-sex attraction .in fact, those letters deny homosexuality.

Thank you for these words of appreciation..she was very brave and true to her values.

Yes! If she ever sees this, she deserves much thanks & respect! ❤

And the audience was pretty supportive!

June Lockhart, we love you.

I’ve had the pleasure of meeting and chatting with her, just a few years ago, and she’s still exactly as you summarized.

And very intelligent.

Thank you! I was a member of Rev. Perry's church, MCC, in the mid-1970s. He gave me communion once. I was Out by then, of course. Don't know if that makes me a pioneer, but I'm glad I was Gay back then.

AND RESPECT THEM!

This is why they need to teach gay history in schools.

Yes Indeed!​@@openskies11

They sure do! My husband and I just celebrated our 43rd Anniversary, and I yalk to younger guys who truly don't know Anything about what it was like in the 70s with police raids, in the 80s with AIDS, and on and on

No she wasn't. There have always been folks like June and folks like that windbag prattling on about all her "Homosexual friends". The same types of people have existed as long as humanity has existed. We keep doing this over and over again.

Talk about pioneers, the priest was not only ahead of his time, but he's ahead of our time.

She is a friend to the community, 99 years old.

And when I hear Anne, I think of June! ❤

​@@carolynmckee4295 Anne looks so much like her mother, too.

The priest was not only ahead of his time, but he's ahead of our time.

@@kenbob1071 He's still right about the percentage of gays. Even today with more acceptance its still around about 4-7% in the US.

Reverend Perry and June were definitely ahead of the curve for 1970. Good on them both!

You can’t see me bowing before you for that comment 😂👍🏻👏🏻❤️

Divine would certainly approve. 😊

Only her hair dresser knows for sure.

I love that!

😂

He was an early hero to me. I wasn't able to overcome my Evangelical grooming until a few years later, but I was always grateful for his commitment to speak truth to the power of irrational hate.

Ther were , they were into perversion !

explains y she was getting testy. topic was too close for home having a gay closet hubby.

Or maybe that what the TV execs wanted her to say?

Of course she wanted it to be cured. She thought she'd be the one to cure her husband. Bravo June and, I'm sorry I didn't catch his name, the priest. True decent human beings.

In 1970, probably half the people in America felt that homosexuality was a choice that could be cured or overcome, and millions of people believed that it was a mental problem.

Well, we now see where her anger came from.

I went to church in the 80s while I was living with my fiancé (now my husband). We went to church because we “knew we should”. No one - not even our families said we were doing anything wrong. It doesn’t mean that we weren’t, though. We just did what we pleased. Years later when I underwent a spiritual conversion, I felt very ashamed of my actions. I went to church not knowing or caring about how God felt about my relationship with my fiancé. If you truly want to know and serve Jesus Christ, I suggest getting a Bible and reading it (if you haven’t already). Reading the Bible changed my life.

@@donnaleone3818 nobody is going to stop and read the Bible simply because you have a fetish for talking about it 24/7, dear.

@@Mister_Listener maybe someone will.

@@donnaleone3818 it is like a sickness for you…to rudely inject this into conversations all the time?

@@donnaleone3818 angry? You dont have that power. But it is annoying that a holy roller is trying to cajole gay people into joining a church filled with hate towards them. Those actions are hateful and judgmental, yet you think some idiot living in the sky is smiling and watching you bully LGBTQIA while you read the Bible?

Thank you for identifying him for us! He's so young I didn't recognize him. So eloquent.

99th* ;-)

I'm not interested in having a conversation with someone who thinks my sexuality is wrong. I refuse to keep justifying my existence to people who need explanations on empathy and understanding.

And it lasted under 4 minutes and the host of the show was pointing her finger at others. Which is rude in that type of setting. Plus she got very defensive. Like many still do today.

@@budgetcommander4849Are there limits to “empathy and understanding”?

Yeah, that was VERY motherly, and the way she voiced it with such protective love and concern. Also, called out the "we never discuss it" claim on that other lady in the end. Perfect. I also have a feeling her IQ is of the charts.

I love MCC, they were a home for me when I first moved to San Diego so many years ago. Beautiful community.

or as the doctor on Petticoat Junction

Right? She was fabulous in her insight!❤❤😂

She was a person of probably average intelligence (and ruthless ambition) who spoke for the peers of her day. Scary that that was 'average'!

True ally-ship right there!😊

She doesn't look like her or sound like her.

Definitely Dr Troy Perry, founder of MCC, though.

@@rongreen2976lol no signature hairstyle…i dont think it is her.

Yup! Nothing more need be said.

She really did read Graham in the nicest possible way.

Isn't it sad though that 50 years later we still have rampant homophobia and discrimination in this country.

She's not.....She's calling it what it is.......WRONG

@@user-gk1mn2wc9x nly religious zealot bigots believe that.

@@user-gk1mn2wc9x Bigots defending bigots. Nothing new to see here...

Ok folks! We have a MAGA dummy here!

@@user-gk1mn2wc9xOh my god! You have to know what right first. Let me inform you. From fraternal birth order studies and they have ALWAYS given the same result, the chance of a gay son goes up measurably. That statistic has never changed. If a mother is highly stressed during pregnancy, there's a greater chance (chance being a percentage amount higher than the background chance,) that if it's male, to be born gay. Sheep studies for rams show 8% are homosexual. And your god has no evidence for existence.

Sounds like "Some of my best friends are black".

I've heard that line from others. All they really mean is that they have acquaintances, known or assumed to be homosexual, who they pretend to tolerate (in person) but don't really accept.

@@darrelljustice6105That's absolutely right.

And I suspect many of those "homosexual friends" don't share much of their gay business with her because they've clocked her as a bigot :)

"Jews are so amazing people and extremely rich... 🤢" She looked from my point of view a little like a DRAG QUEEN😳

Yup, in 1970 the vast majority of people went to church, believed that homosexuality was a sin, that they sought to "convert" young boys, that it should continue to be illegal, and that its a repulsive practice. It was absolutely socially forbidden to talk about homosexuality in any way, even in a negative way. Disparaging jokes about the gays was considered hip and liberal. Never acknowleging that it even existed was the route most conservatives took. Homosexuality and prostitution were only legal in France, but the laws passed against it under Vichy were kept in place by DeGaul.

@@jsch9173 BWAHAHA! Spot-on, darling!

Divine came to my mind as well.

She must have known sparks would fly when she invited the "Right" Reverend. I'll bet she thought the guests and audience would be behind her, though... 😊

LOL ! You are right, those of us old enough to remember know how rare and important this giving of space was. And we needed to see ourselves soo bad! The John Water joke made me love you by the way!

Yes... sometimes people just need some time, because they have ingrained ideas passed down from their parents.

Good to know. I forgive her.

Meaning she knows some gay people that she doesn't call a gay slurs to, aleast to their face

The Stonewall Uprising was in 1969. I believe this show was filmed in NYC. I was not a fan of Virginia Graham, but I do respect that she was willing to have a public conversation on what was then a controversial topic. She had gay friends, but was more comfortable with the status quo than she was with change. June Lockhart was progressive, way ahead of her time.

& Disco!!!

@@stumack9755They actually are significantly related! In fact, the death of Disco was largely due to hostility for its queer membership.

@@budgetcommander4849 It didn't help any that the big disco clubs in NYC were doing illegal things and were being shutdown. Running a nightclub without a proper liquor license is one of the things that got Studio 54 shut down.

Billy Mumy said that she took him to see David Bowie in Concert.........Right On, June!

For those of us who knew, we knew time ago. 😉❤️

I never knew but know of that church. Nice of him to found MCC, but religion is the reason for all the hate. Best to forgo any sort of scripture based gatherings and find a better philosophy of life than church.