Compact tech-filled Technics Turntables - old vs older 

And Grado as well

Have you looked at the ADAT recording format? It's essentially an 8 track DAT recorded onto VHS tape. I used to work with them.

Yep: Audio Technica, Grado...and Ortofon do the OMP which uses the OM range of styli. Putting the Stylus 30 on an OMP on that turntable may well bring superlative performance with inner grooves and sibilance.

If you buy an older AT P-mount cartridge, all of the 100 series styli produced over the past 40 years for the standard half inch screw fit models will fit, including the current VM range. Must be the older body though popular in the 80s and 90s, not the current type.

I have that cartridge (with the elliptical stylus) on my SL-DD20 and must say it sounds fabulous compared to the original P-30 cartridge with a (less than 2 year old) "random" reproduction stylus that the previous owner put on there. Was about the same price as finding a no-name elliptical replacement stylus for the P-30. I know it's not "the best a man can get" but I bought the whole HIFI stack the SL-DD20 came with (including the cabinet) used (mainly for the turntable) and with that new cartridge it totaled me €120.

I trough fathers day was 10th nov?? Is it diffrent in different countrys

@@Rainbow__cookie yes.here in Chile is 19 th June

Having recently bought a new P-mount cartridge from Audio Technica I was hoping to find this comment somewhere. There are other companies still making P-mount cartridges, they're just a little harder to find than they may once have been.

Just in case someone comes across this comment train at some point looking for one, two models to throw into the room are the AT81CP (conical) and AT85EP (elliptical). Or just dig through Audio Technicas current phono cartridge catalog, which (at least in the 2019/2020 edition) shows one of these old silver Technics linear tracking turntables (with the red arrow LED as shown at 12:35 in here) as the background splash image for the P-Mount cartrige section, which is a nice coincidence

They are easy to find as a used cartridge on eBay I recently bought a Stanton 680el p-mount that I removed the extra weight from and I'm now have a D680EE stylus on it. I will be getting a new stylus soon so I can keep the actual Stanton as a reference. I know there are other p-mount cartridge still manufactured other than AT . I really like the Stanton 680/681 moving iron cartridge sound. I have the brush mounted and tracking force maxed out at 1.5 grams with my SL-7 yeah it works with the brush that add a gram and subtract a gram is zero grams. One side benefit no anti skating compensation needed at all . Self cleaning close"n"play.

Grado also makes a good quality P-mount

Most people watching him are jealous. Thats why. BUt he is so good at the presenting these items.

As a 61 year old audio electronics technician who first started fixing electronic devices around fifty years ago, I will take the basic belt drive turntables over any of these highly automated, microprocessor driven, mostly plastic units. These sorts of turntables sound okay, certainly not the equal of a good belt drive with a better tone arm, but the real problem comes when something goes wrong with them. Lots of electronics, loaded with capacitors that are pretty much ancient now, and often using photosensitive detecting devices for the arm position that are no longer available. And the linear tracking turntables have lubrication that dries up overtime, and the mechanisms to try to keep the tonearm perfectly parallel to the record while a motor drives the base of the arm straight across are finicky and hard to adjust. Typically these linear tracking mechanisms involve a motor, a belt or two, and a tightly stretched string.

And it's your honest choice, up to your preference really. If you want uncomplicated hi-fi device, you have a wide variety of models on the market and freedom to buy them, new or old. In the meanwhile, there are some people who apart from high audio quality like for example watching tonearm mechanically travelling to the exact position or when the device detects if you are playing 7'' single. And there are hardly any brand-new devices like this. I am aware of possible malfunctioning of used 30year old automatic turntables, that's why I wrote "when set up properly" - you have to take care of them. I did have to replace capacitator and photoresistors in mine... but it works. And maybe that's why appreciate it so much - because it is complicated enough to fail, but it doesn't. And that is brilliant about it. If something brings joy and isn't harmful, don't trample it with cold analitical facts. If so, collecting vinyl wouldn't be a thing.

@@sandr6769 , I understand where you're coming from, and I agree with you to some extent, but I disagree about the "cold analytical facts" as you put it. Mostly because we seem to be living in a non-fact-based world to a large extent nowadays, certainly here in the USA anyway, although that's a socio-political argument for another day and another different topic. But mostly, I feel sorry for the people who buy a complicated turntable which turns out to need service, even though oftentimes they were assured by the seller that it "works", or it's something that was used in their family 20 or 30 years ago and has been sitting in a garage or basement or attic since then, and they bring it into the shop hoping we can fix it for less than a hundred bucks say, and usually it cannot be be done for that minimal amount of money. On a rare occasion it can't be fixed it all. Which is why I tell the newbies anyway, or the people without prior knowledge and skills and access, to stick to the simpler record playing devices. Later on down the road when they're buying their second or third turn table, and have become more familiar with adjusting and fiddling with them or doing minor repairs, that's the time to buy something a little more complicated. It's kind of like my wife and myself and our three rescue dogs, we've been dog owners together for almost 25 years, mostly with large breeds such as Saint Bernards and German Shepherds, and so we have the general skills to deal with a traumatized dog who needs special help and attention to get past their behavioral issues. I certainly wouldn't advise a first time dog owner or dog rescuer to take on a dog with major behavioral problems, especially a large breed dog. I wouldn't call that a cold analytical judgment, I'd call it facing certain realities. You can't rescue and Rehab every dog, nor can you rescue and repair every turntable or other older piece of audio equipment. The woman who owns the kennel where we bring our dogs for daycare and play sessions and board them when we go away had rescued a large breed dog who had a history of biting, she worked with him for the better part of a year until he knew his commands upside down and inside out, his behavior was much improved and so she placed him in a new home, and he bit somebody. She took him back, and then he started to get in a fight with another dog and when the dogs were separated he was still in an agitated fight mode and tried to bite one of her employees, and so the dog had to be put down. Broke her heart, but that's the way it is with animals sometimes. And with audio equipment sometimes, or cars, or whatever.

@@goodun6081 If the processor goes out in my vintage turntable, I can replace it with a Teensy++ 2.0. You're right about the lubricants being difficult to access. I just bought some Krytox GPL 205 Grease, Pure PFPE/PTFE; I'm hoping it does the trick. BTW, I'm several years older than you.

And I got a similar pre-amp to the one shown in the video, its just not usb and doesn't have a headphone jack

they do they made an audiophile sl 1200 that I think they still sell

I’m not sure if that’s a positive endorsement, but have a good sleep.

@@Techmoan I do the same thing every now and then. It’s a positive endorsement from me. There’s only so many hours in the day and if I can’t watch a video because it’s time to hit the hay, well, listening is the next best thing. Drifting off into a slumber while hearing you talk about vintage pieces of audio equipment is a great way to go. Your channel is a favorite of mine, as well as LGR. Both channels have a cozy feeling and I really enjoy how informative and relaxed the vibe is. Received an SL-6 for free awhile back, and I am finally pulling it out of the box and getting it sorted out. Thanks for the detailed rundown!

@@seanfennel4845 Ha ! You are right thanks !

The more authentic the person, the less allergic they are to inconvenience.

Hey Catfish, yeah I've been listening to records since the late sixties and I have a Technics SL-1900 direct drive fully automatic turntable, I guess I'm not authentic enough, lol. BUT to be fair everyone has their own wants and desires when it comes to this sort of thing so I guess live and let live... it is cool that ANYONE is still listening to records (vinyl) these days!

@@jackallen6261 I'm 24 and listen to records all the time, probably my parents' fault. It does suck that none of the new players have any of these cool features. You either buy the newer player and know you can get cheap styli / cartridges or buy a cool older player and then have to spend 4 X as much on getting it to work :/ Wish I could find a good player, with all the best tech, which won't completely break the bank. For now, I've settled for a couple of hundred pounds spent on a nice looking, average sounding player.

Eh, vinyl records are niche enough as it is. No need to get all snobby & gatekeeper-y about it. As long as it ain't one of those Crosley/Victrola/suitcase players you can find at any department store, I could care less how many or little features you prefer.

I have a Sony PS-X75 that I bought new. The turntable has a Biotracer arm, which means it has sensors and motors to track horizontally and vertically. It also has optical record recognition and quartz speed control. In other words, it's complex. The primary failure is the computer chip stops working. This can be caused by caps in the power supply going bad and giving bad voltages to the processor. The processor is absolutely unobtainable. If the chip fails, it can be replaced by a Teensy++ 2.0 or other controller. The Teensy++ 2.0 supports 5 volts natively. Other controllers can be used with voltage converters. It takes some programming, but it works. The more challenging task is replacing the dried lubricants. There are very delicate coils that have to be removed to access bearings. In my case, the chip is working so all I have to do is make sure the power supply is robust.

I dunno, the Japanese stuff of this era was so reliable and well made that faults are rare even in old age (breakdowns are usually because they've been abused). I'm not saying it doesn't happen but motors and ICs can fail on anything, and I don't necessarily agree with the "more to go wrong" hypothesis generally.

I had the new Sony PS-LX310BT on order for six months with the idea of using it in the location I ended up putting the J300 in the video. They pushed back my preorder date so many times, a good deal on the Technics came along instead. I saved about £100, lost Bluetooth but gained a heck of a lot more. Apparently the Sony is pretty good though, but I’m happy with my choice.

@@Techmoan Oh I see. I'm kind of a Sony fan boy myself and have the PS-HX500 on my price notification service. When it drops again to about the price of the PS-LX310B I will hit the buy button. I missed it a couple of days ago when it hit the sweet spot price but sold out.

@@Techmoan I just got a j300 a few weeks ago, intended as a second player for in my work/hobby room, but ended up being so pleased with its performance and utter convenience, it ended up in my living, replacing the Denon dp-dj150 I was using there.. Looks like I'll need to get me a second j300.. Anyway, I've tried a few of the p30-es replacement styli, but am not very pleased with what I tried so far, and it is clear they were limiting the performance of the deck. My j300 came with the original p30 cartridge, and an original p30-es stylus which on inspection is not new, but still ok, and sounds a lot better than any of the off-brand clones I tried so far. I found a NOS Ortofon omp20 cartridge + stylus, which I'll be picking up tomorrow, but that may be a bit expensive to your liking at around 200 euros, the deck is worth such an investment tho imo, getting a new element and decent stylus, or a NOS original p30-es stylus highly recommended :-) One thing to keep in mind is the j300 and its ilk needing proper maintenance to keep their performance. The one I got needed lubrication of the platter bearing to get its rumble as low as that of my Denon, the linear tracking mechanism was still clean, and had its belt and radio tuning wire replaced in somewhat recent times from the looks of it. Making sure its rails is nicely clean and lubricated, and checking on the state of the radio tuning wire every so often tend to be a good idea, because the failure mode you can get if that mechanism fails with a broken wire likely results in a scratched record, and possibly a damaged stylus. If the wire is new, it should be good for many years if not decades, but if you don't know, its something to keep an eye on. As to linear tracking, while not as good as the high-end variations on that, you do still get a very low tracking angle error, which is pretty evident on my deck when compared to the Denon I have, especially at the end of each side of a record. This was somewhat evident with the off-brand styli I tried, much more so with the original stylus.

As do a lot of cheap K-Tel type compilations where they crammed as many tracks on as they could, probably to look impressive" the TV ads. Quality was always terrible though. The reason so many modern releases and reissues are spread across multiple records is that they can be cut with the groove deeper & wider spaced, giving higher sound quality.

@@chillstar Makes sense. Thanks for the info! :-)

Yes it didn’t make sense to me either - it was all going so well - a nice easy to follow sequence - and then they had to start throwing random letters in there.

I noticed something similar. The older one definitely sounds a bit rolled off in the high end compared to the newer one. It probably wouldn't sound awful on its own, but the direct comparison definitely favors the newer one.

I thought the imaging was much better on the old one though. With nothing to compare to yet, the new one immediately sounded squished to me.

@@Squonk06 I think in the first SL-6 vid, he put a conical stylus on it. if the newer one had a decent elliptical, that can make the difference.

Wrong channel my friend. Matt doesn't do 'audiophile' stuff.

don't bother, Mat. LP12 was/is the worlds most over-rated hifi component. coloured sound,fiddly to set-up,ricuously expensive in any guise, imo. the non-Linn things fitted to it, distributed by Linn, are reason it was sucessful, - grace arm, supex cartridge, etc.had it, but was less 'fi' than my technics SL-150,so sold it. Linn could'nt afford to develop a direct-drive model, so was stuck with wobbly old LP12's puffy upper bass (clangy platter). diabolical marketing hype swallowed by the gullible, tho.- Linnies :).

Yes. There have been releases of well-regarded jazz albums that have been re-released on 45 RPM sets.

Yes totally.

Lots of companies still make or sell p mount cartridges. Not sure why he thinks they don't. Amazon sells many of them, a lot from Audio-Technica which still makes a lot of p mount carts. I have a new Audio-Technica cartridge on my Technics SL-QD3.

Turntables with optical sensing should generally be avoided. Original parts are no longer available, and Scavenging the relevant parts from other identical units there's no guarantee that you'll get good working and long-term reliable parts. I work for an audio repair shop and I dread it when somebody brings in a Denon or a Sony or anything with motorized, servo-driven tone arms, or photo-optical sensors for record size and set down pick up points. Many of these types of units use opto isolators in the circuitry that are no longer available.

@@goodun6081 That's not exactly helpful after I already spent the money. xD Seriously, though, for me repairing the stuff is where most of the fun is. If I was worried about what happens when any of this stuff breaks, I wouldn't be buying it in the first place.

@@MatroxMillennium , for those who are technically skilled and have the tools and the basic know how to be able to fix their own audio equipment, that's great, and more power to you and two others like you! Those without such skills, and who don't have an audio shop nearby that can fix stuff for them, are the ones that end up wasting a whole lot of money trying to buy a used turntable that works. As an audio technician, we see numerous examples of people buying used equipment that supposedly Works, according to the seller, but turns out to be severely messed up and sometimes almost done fixable, at least not for a reasonable price. That's why I tell people that if they're going to buy used gear, then they should either by the simplest, Least Complicated type of device, or only buy it when they get a ridiculously low can't lose price, or when they have the right to return it for a full refund. I hate to see people discouraged from a fun hobby and from listening to music because they bought used equipment that just isn't practical for them to repair themselves, or get it repaired by another technician, or that they cannot afford to get repaired. Or something where critical parts simply aren't available at any price. That's why I usually tell people to look for something like a slb2 or sl-220 or similar semi-automatic belt-drive Technics turntable. As long as the motor is good, all it will need is a little bit of lubrication and a belt. And a cartridge or stylus perhaps. It's extremely rare for us to see one of those types of Technics turntables that can't be repaired. A Pioneer PL 5- something series turntable is usually another good choice. Of course, there are lots of other valid choices, but generally when it comes to turntables, especially used ones, I subscribe to the "keep it simple stupid" KISS principle.

@@goodun6081 My "main" turntable is actually a Pioneer PL-4. :) Everything else I have I mainly just keep around for the novelty factor.

@@MatroxMillennium , my main turntable is an older Linn sondek LP12 (I worked for a Linn dealer in the late 80s), but I've owned everything from a Technics sl B2 to a 1200 Mark II, various Thorens models (though the TD125 mkII was the only one worth owning), a highly modified old AR with a Merrill sub chassis e, a Regaplanar P3, an Ariston Rd 11s, and Ariston rd80, a Systemdek, a couple of older pioneers, and so on. With the exception of the Garrard changer I was using when I was 13, I'd actually say the worst of the more "modern" and generally well thought of record players I ever had was a Thorens TD 115. Crappy tonearm, the whole thing was way too resonant, weird sub- chassis suspension, and speed that drifted all over the place until I modified the pitch control circuit with a different potentiometer and some resistors. I've had some weird tone arms too, there's a stick-like tonearm called the Mission 774 if I remember correctly that actually works extremely well, but just look strange (it can be used with silicone damping fluid if you'd like, but it's not strictly necessary); and then I had a Keith Monks unipivot tonearm that actually used pools of *mercury* !! to float and balance the arm as well as transmit and transfer the audio signal from the cartridge into the base of the tonearm and turntable. Good luck getting that thing past the EPA nowadays! I modified it with actual tonearm wires and dispensed with the mercury. I don't even remember what turntable I had it on. Gee, where could the brain cells assigned to that particular memory have gone to? /s

It is rare to hear of one of these that fails. my SL-6 works great, aswell as the SL-5 I used to have.

an ADC Accutrac 4000 img205.imageshack.us/img205/9417/adcaccutracad0001ay6.jpg

@@rupertrooksby That's Brilliant, thank you!

I'm subbed for the puppets.

Top lads

So good definition old vs older

There's no school like old school.

@@grizzly6699 Old linear turntable or new manual turntable ?

Thanks for the insight!

Thanks Anders!

Thanks for commenting

Thanks for the comprehensive comment, getting back into music production and I'm very interested in why vinyl sounds the way it does, I love the saturated sound ;)

I love your music. Finally broke down and ordered the cassette of vol. 3 and digital download. I can hardly wait. Love that FM Love. Thanks for making this music. It really makes my life a little better.

Grove, did you mean groove, I'm confused?

@Dezwarteschijf More groove, not more grooves!

@Dezwarteschijf A longer groove is more groove though. The same way a person with a two-pound cake has "more cake" than a person with a one-pound cake - even though they both have one cake.

WHOOSH!! and this comment flew COMPLETELY over some peoples head, lol. Remember Ronco people??? I guess not, lol. Nice to see you here Fran I am a subscriber of yours as well.

K-Tel in America used to have 22 tracks on a single LP!!!!

The mechanisms behind audio recording is always pretty fascinating to think about, from squiggly lines in pieces of wax, insect resin, and PVC, to electromagnetic signals on a strip of plastic covered in metal powder, to 1's and 0's on a shiny plastic disc and a computer.

Ah yes sound music, my favorite kind of music

FACT: Listening to sounds, is one of the best ways to hear things.

Lucky bugger. I had to settle for a pair of socks and an argument.

At least here in the west coast of America lol

Umm, it's 6 months later and it's giving me a late night craving for my Croz.

@@seventeesweremagic Technics fans unite! ;)

g2macs Ha brilliant... and now he’s Sir Sugar....

Amstrad, do you you remember those emailer phones? I think he bought Sinclair as well.

Built In Shoeburyness by ex EKCO/Pye/Phillips employees IIRC.

lol! Funniest comment I have read all day.

So you got one of the better ones huh

Whoops.

He's British, it's the form they use over there ^^

@@TwoWholeWorms The American "I could care less" makes no sense as an expression, because the only thing it rules out is not caring at all, which is exactly the sentiment it's supposed to convey.

That’s not an American expression. Only hill billies say it that way.

@@shaun9107 I was refering to the end of turntable advanced in the mid 80's because of CD... but now we know the compromises (and compression) they had to do with the music to get it on cd.

@@shaun9107 Yeah, but that's because it's digital...

@@shaun9107 Yeah.. i know.. i have several vinyl record players (a semi portable (Sony PS F5), a portable one (Numark PT 01 with custom tone arm and cartridge) a high end one (Pro Ject RPM 1 Carbon) and a automatic one (Sharp RP-117) and each record sounds different on every player, and the 'vibe' they give... a simple cd can't replace that...

@@shaun9107 The soul must come from a musician, the artist, a human. It's not playback equipment's place to have one.

Saw hd dvd on the reciever and laughed. Still have my hd dvd for my 360. Never use it but not like anyone will buy it off me for much now

Half the discs I have are already unreadable. Good riddance.

I still can't believe hd-dvd was once a thing.

the print I missed was "in the style of"

I agree - it’s one I’ve had my eye on too.

It’s an excellent machine. Built like a tank with the same specs as the sl-10 but without the built in mc preamp.

The SL-15 goes for big $ and justifiably so- it's all aluminum and examples are included in Museum of Modern Art and Design. Not to be mistaken for the 'plastic' models. ;)

Helium Road And now that casseiver is here in my studio. I bought it recently. 😂

I have an SL-D202, and it's served me well for... 38 years. Man, I'm old.

Don't discount the original EP series carts fitted to these 'tables. They were quite good carts and they can be seriously upgraded with hyperelliptical and even fineline/Shibata types that yield fantastic sound.

Real music fans collect the vinyls! I find it insane that people play them though - don’t people realise that they are basically dragging a knife across the vinyl every time they play them??? It’s crazy.

@@Zveebo Actually listening to the music you buy? CRAZY.

C. H. I preserve the pristine analogue sound onto MiniDisc then preserve the vinyl by vacuum sealing in a nitrogen environment and storing in a temperature-controlled vault. Giving me the best of both worlds - you don’t need to play vinyls to enjoy them.

@@Zveebo I take pictures of the covers and run them through software that reads the audio from the impressions the vinyl makes on the paper and cellophane and encodes them as 8kb/s mono .amr files for that pristine 2002 audio experience. Then I lock them in a sterile room at least 2m apart from one another and brick the doorway so they stay 100% unusable.

Zveebo it’s not the same experience man....