Could This Tech Make Hydrogen Not Suck? 

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"one cassette would offer roughly the same amount of storage as a 5000 psi hydrogen tank..." Yeah but what SIZE 5000 psi tank?! That statement is unfortunate.

If the tape gets jammed, we’ll need to bring back another “old” technology: a #2 PENCIL!

I think you might have been trolled with this one? There's rather important bits of data missing, and by their own admission metal hydride is significantly better for energy density, and that's not revolutionising anything.

The Type 4 composite vessel used in the Toyota mirai has an energy density of 2247Wh/kg, although this is technically as heat energy. You would also have to account for a 50-60% fuel cell efficiency and the weight of the fuel cell and subsystems but the stats for lithium ion you used are for cell level density and in reality with bus bars, cooling systems, etc they are more like 167Wh/kg. For Liquid hydrogen vessels are more like 2956Wh/kg.

Energy on tape? Get reel!

Orkney in Scotland has wind farms that, when they need to be disconnected for grid balancing, are switched over to producing hydrogen instead. Can't get much cleaner than that.

Hydrogen is for 1% of cases where batteries are not usable (airplanes, ships).

the fact that all "negative" comments are deleted whenever it states the truth of how this isn't real 🤦

One data point that would really help to evaluate this as a potential replacement is the weight to power ratio of a hydrogen based cartridge system vs. a Tesla EV battery pack. If there are significant weight savings using a tape based hydrogen system vs. how heavy lithium ion battery packs are, then hydrogen tape power to weight ratio per kw/h becomes a real game changer in automotive, space, and flight based industries.

Thank You Ricky for listening to people like me blow my horn about this Scottsdale company.

You are famous now. Let the Thunderfoot deluge commence. Pick your topics more carefully next time.

How about the Specific Energy (KWh/Kg) for this scheme? Any substrate holding any kind of fuel will reduce both Specific Energy and Energy Density (KWh/m3) WRT pure molecular H2. It must have (potentially) better parameters than electrochemical batteries to be worthy of implementation.

4:50 hydrogen isn't positively charged. It has one proton and one electron = neutral

I like the storage method that doesn't require high pressure or really cold temperatures. The round trip efficiency going from electricity to green hydrogen and back is less than 40%, slightly better than today's gas engines, and on par with light diesel, Batteries are better than 90%.

the scientific illiteracy in this video is horrific!

Pie in the sky I would say, the logistics of shipping the tape will massively impact its efficiency, then there's weight of the equipment and housings in the car and the fuel cell overall it will likely add up to more weight than today's batteries

Its certainly interesting. The one thing that I know is that the conversion from hydrogen to electricity is an expensive piece of kit, at the moment. If this can be resolved then it would really help.

Many things need to be known before it can be used in cars, how big are the tapes? How fast is it at discharging? If the only way to effectively recharge them is by swapping out and putting a fresh set in, how exactly will that happen? It sounds like the tapes are gonna be huge…

Did you get any specifications from them that can let us evaluate it? This seems like metal hydride hydrogen storage in a slightly different form. So how does it differ from traditional metal-hydrid storage? Still sounds like a really complex battery to me, is the "pack level" density or power comparable to lithium?

This tech might be ideal for work sites. Useful for smaller types of vehicles like forklifts or the like.

At 7:20 there is a false statement: no energy to extract the solid H2 into a gas. Are you telling us that high-powered lasers consume no energy?

Please make this the norm for all vehicles. EV's are not well thought out and draining our resources. They are helping us bridge the gap between fossil fuel and sustainable hydrogen production but they're already causing massive problems because of all the batteries that need to be produced

I think I missed something, Hydrogen is not positively charged, as any element it has zero electric charge, of course, it can form ions with positive or negative charges, but those are other chemical species known as hydrogen ion (H+) and hydride (H-)

How much light energy does it require to liberate the hydrogen from the tape compared to the amount of energy you get back from that hydrogen via a fuel cell or combustion?

What is the expected efficiency in conversion to mechanical energy? Gas has ridiculously high energy density, but its coversion efficiency is very low - hence the rise of BEV's.

If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.

You would need somewhere around half or more of the volume of a Tesla battery pack in cassette tapes in your car to have an equivalent amount of energy. That’s an awful lot of cassettes of the size that were shown. I think you’d have to have a mega cassette that could be pulled out and replaced quickly. And the rate at which hydrogen was removed from the tape would have to be really fast, the tape would have to be flying past the lasers shining on it.

Thanks for showing us alternative energy sources. It's sounds interesting but still a long way off.

I heard that Plasma Knetics is working on a device that includes a spinning disk made of lead. When they point a laser at the disk, it turns to gold. It’s still in early development and investors are needed.

Thanks Ricky for covering this. You are the best!!!

Battery capacity will likely double in the next 15-20 years and require very little flammable chemicals and uses electricity which is found everywhere. Vs Hydrogen who's definition of storage probably includes the word "leaky", is highly flammable, highly explosive, might give you 2x more driving range, and you hope the next refill station has one available.

Very interesting indeed. The prospect of having a few dozen discs or tape cassettes, purchasable everywhere, enabling drivers picking up fuel in less than 5 min unless there is a line, sounds great

I just saw the creator of the sweet hydrogen tape deck say that when it is recycled it gives one of the special hydrogens that you said before is used to make the amazing material for batteries.( light doesn't dislodge the special hydrogen from the tape, which builds up,reducing efficiency, till it has to be recycled.

This solve some issues of storage, but not all. There is continuously the issue with the extremely low efficiency. Forget that tech apart from industry...

All sounds good, really good, specially the sizes of these things, you could have a LOT of "cassetes" (if those are up to scale), just imagine you could have a bunch of those on the floor of your trunk. Depending on how much they allow you to drive for each one, you could simply change them once a month or something, or just replace the ones that are fully depleted. Because H2 in the current form isn't neither cheap or clean (except green H2), you even have to change the H2 tanks every 15 years... BUT, its all about economics, lets see if this solution is financially viabel vs battery EVs.

The government was actually stealing the patents and found out they could not do it without this company. The company refused and the gov took away their ability to do anything with this product. Glad they are back.

I would be interested to see how long they can store them "charged." If they can't maintain the hydrogen for long term storage it might be problematic. Otherwise it seems like really cool tech. If it helps to remove some of the harmful stuff from the exhaust gasses then that is a Win Win I think. You might even be able to incentivize companies to install the capture devices in their smoke stacks. I think it. I hope they succeed.

Ok as the numbers show, the energy density isn’t great… but easy to store a few more in the trunk or refuel with a quick pit stop at the tape store.

Use solar energy to boil water to create the steam necessary for the process. Use fresnel lenses in sunny, hot locations to boil the water. Could also use the same plant for ocean water desalination

So the short version seems to be that they figured out how to use magnesium instead of palladium to store hydrogen and are using a tape form factor to maximize surface area so loading the materialworks faster. Which is pretty cool. If this works, it sounds similar to the battery swapping method of recharging EVs from a consumer perspective. Though from a logistical perspective you obviously can't just connect to the electric grid but instead have to physically ship cartridges. I mean if you look at all the charging stations popping up everywhere it's pretty obvious why EVs are the future and hydrogen is going to mostly be a dead end. But this could be useful for niches like long-haul commercial vehicles and aircraft where the infrastructure can be planned around specific routes instead of needing to be available everywhere.

What I like is that there’s no compression/decompression of the H2 required, nor freezing/vaporization of the liquified H2. This saves a ton of energy, money, and materials in the infrastructure and equipment normally used for these purposes. All these savings help negate the disadvantage of the low energy density of H2 stored on tape. Yea, you would have to haul swappable tape canisters to the refueling stations, but today you have to haul the compressed or liquefied H2 to refueling stations. Alternatively, to deliver compressed or liquefied H2, a very expensive and elaborate piping infrastructure could be built out to deliver the H2 to refueling stations. This is what they’re proposing in Europe. But the swappable canisters could be refueled at the refueling stations regardless of how the H2 is delivered there, e.g., trucked, piped, or produced on site from electrolyzer’s. But if the refueling site can’t have raw H2 sourced at the site, there can be a network of swappable H2 tape canister sites built out. The canister weighs 800 pounds I was told, therefore it would need a machine to swap it into/out the vehicle. (This would be analogous to BEVs swapping the battery, like NIO proposes.) But the 800 pound canister would take a passenger car 1500 miles, I was told. Still not sure if the laser uses more than a nominal amount of energy to release the H2 from tape. But I suppose we, who are rooting for this technology, (and who pray we’re not getting scammed yet again by some cockamamie claim 😄), need to see a working prototype to validate all the excitement.

To be clear, this technology can pick up hydrogen wherever it is. There's hydrogen in fossil fule emissions, so it can pickup hydrogen there, but it could just as easily be charged by electrolysis, or at a dairy farm.

Hi Rick How does this tape react to a naked flame? In the case of a collision with a chevvy bolt for example Causing a fire How volatile would it be?

This is a very interesting technology. The video kind of glossed over the actual production of the hydrogen that is put on the tape. Perhaps an answer would be something like the "solar dome" France and Saudi Arabia are designing. My understanding is that it is supposed to use sunlight to convert salty sea water into hydrogen and fresh water. Perhaps an idea for a future video? I've heard about a couple of additional issues with this system that might have to be addressed: * I understand that currently the hydrogen leaks off the tape quickly. This means that they could not be stored for a long time and would have to be used shortly after installation. * I've heard that these tapes are a couple of hundred kilograms each. Clearly, this is not something a normal driver would want to swap out themselves.

I’m pretty sure that means we already have hydrogen tape powered weapons

You can recharge spaceships with hydrogen out in space so we can build bigger and go further in our solar system.

"extremely flammable' is *really* underselling it. It burns at ~7000 feet per second. When I was a kid I tried making a hydrogen candle. Let's just say it didn't go well considering it explodes at an insanely wide ratio of hydrogen/oxygen. Hydrogen as energy storage is a terrible idea if efficiency is something you care about and even worse if you want long term storage. Personally the way I'd prefer to keep my hydrogen around is as methanol. I wish we focused more on fuel cells that use it vs hydrogen since you can store it using methods we've had for thousands of years, the bottle.

If the cassette tape needs to be 5,000 mile long, I hope we don’t need to be kind and rewind before returning.

H2 storage improvements are great, but the main knocks on h2 are production cost and environmental problems associated with producing it (which you note.) When h2 production issues are solved, that's when this storage tech can take off. Niche until then.

sources of steam that are renewable energy are nuclear, wood and biomass. All producing power and steam that is wasted after passing through turbine generators. Before condensing this process could extract hydrogen. Even current carbon based resources like natural gas turbines, coal plants and refineries could supply huge amounts of hydrogen with this technology. It is a huge step in clean and unlimited power.

Sounds good. I expect Hydrogen systems to be more used in shipping and air transport, so a weight/volume comparison to the diesel engines in freighter would be mice.

It would be great to have a solid whose surface would liberate hydrogen in the presence of some agent, in a reaction that would dissolve the substrate too, so it would automatically expose a fresh surface. The liquid spent substrate would have to be reconstituted into that solid upon gaining hydrogen. Maybe a slurry of tiny pellets instead of a block solid.

Storage is the main problem for hydrogen. But other problems have to be handled too. Magnesium is a fuel that is hard to fire extinct. If hydrogen is released, explosions can occur. But this technology can be important for many things, because hydrogen is very useful and abundant.

Sharing scam fakenews should be punished.

Amazing video first time I ever heard of Plasma Kinetics.

You’re welcome and thank you for the enlightenment!

I talked to plasma kinetics last week, and the plan is to roll out their technology in stationary power stations and backup generation first in order to stabilize the H2 grid in 2023. Once that is established, PK will enter the vehicle market. Exciting news for our Zero emissions mission.

I'm excited enough by your presentation that I'd like to learn the best ways to invest directly or indirectly in this form of energy storage.

Reguarding hydrogen as a fuel with just water as its exhaust and the statement "No greenhouse gasses"... technically water vapor released, as the exhaust, is a far more potent greenhouse gas than CO2. Granted, water vapor doesn't have as long of an atmospheric half life.

What about power output? Are the tapes able to extract power out of the tapes as much as batteries are?

Stan Meyers built a water fuelled hydrogen powered dune buggy 30 years ago made on board using voltages and frequencies tuned to the covalent bonds of the water molecule. Using an internal combustion engine! Too cheap clean and simple for mainstream use then and now. He thought he was saving the world from the oil embargo but fuel industry said no.

Stanley Meyer's on-board electrolysis technology, Daniel Dingel's, Denny Kline's also John Kanzius' electrolysis through radio waves, all ways to propel internal combustion engines that are already in existence which are in most vehicles. Much simpler solution it seems to me.. The problem is most of these inventors end up dead before they can bring this concepts to the mainstream.

We'll see if it ever leaves the lab but at least there will be greenhouse emitters for a long time yet so they'll have sources to "recharge".

"as we mentioned above" wtf, bizarre skeumorphism.

And this will be sold to you at a significant mark up at stations located everywhere, I think not!

Concrete products are a massive proportion of greenhouse exhaust gasses along with steel production, this could be used to offset to 90% of its emissions thus creating almost net zero . Let's not forget windfarms need massive amounts of Concrete in there sites.

In a fuel cell there is no pollution when it is burned in an internal combustion engine temperature gets hot enough to form nitrogen oxides. So it depends on how you use it but the biggest problem store enough to go 400 miles

The graph at 9:16 seems to imply that in order to get the same power/distance as you would from a fully charged tesla battery you would need to “swap out” approx 70% of the size or 50% of the weight equivalent in this new tech. That doesn’t seem like something easily done during a trip. Is this correct or am I misunderstanding?

I think the guy that was a whistle blower on area 51 has a corvette that runs on hydrogen and is stored in a similar manner. Apparently it's illegal to sell the manufacturing instrument but it is legal if you build it yourself.

Yes, but using methane reformation to create hydrogen is energy intensive, you need energy to liberate the hydrogen. Then there's transfer and storage costs. The problem isn't how efficient or energy dense hydrogen itself is, it's the cost of creating hydrogen that needs to be addressed on a massive scale. Cheaper just dumping the energy directly into a battery, fewer conversion losses.

As with all the new "game changing" technologies like Solid State batteries and ultra-capacitors. We should believe it once we see it in production. it doesn't affect what we already have in the here and now. If it's really that game changing it would naturally find its way into our every-day devices - unless it's killed in the cradle by vested interests.

Many decades ago we used town gas instead of natural gas. Town gas was 50% H2. It worked fine as a heating, cooking fuel, why don't we start mixing H2 with our nat gas supplies?

The original title/thumb kept me from tuning in. The new title "Forget tanks...." and the less busy thumb (with the cybrtrk) is much better. And the hydrogen mix tape sounds pretty cool too

H2 isn't literally the most common element in the observable universe. It IS the most abundant. There is NOTHING literal about it.

A lot of break thru tech has been discovered but the U.S. government has classified the patents so they can not be utilized by the public .. In 2017 there were over 5,700 classified patents

If the use of this technology became widespread there would probably be a VHS and Betamax version 😅

Use depleted uranium encapsulated in a aluminum + beryllium coat canisters immersed in water would percolate Hydrogen

An interesting idea that is "still under development". Maybe they can find a way to make it work. But I doubt we will see this in the near future.

In your opening remarks you claim that hydrogen, when used as fuel, "...emits nothing but water". Is this really true ? If you burn hydrogen in "air" you could easily produce nitrous oxide which seems to be the polluter of greatest concern at present.

Not properly explained: 4:49 "When exposed to greenhouse gases like exhaust from say a smokestack, the film can capture metric tons of pure hydrogen from the steam [...]" Exhaust does not in general contain pure hydrogen gas (H2). Exhaust sometimes contains water vapour which is H2O. Magnesium can be made to react with steam: Mg + 2H2O → Mg(OH)2 + H2 I guess that if you add at lease twice as much magnesium, you might in theory combine Mg + H2 → MgH2 with the above and get 2Mg + 2H2O → Mg(OH)2 + MgH2, but my web searches so far haven't confirmed this combination. I imagine it would be hard to catch all the hydrogen gas from the first reaction, and hydrogen gas released into the atmosphere could work as an indirect greenhouse gas by increasing the life time of methane. Hydrogen reacts with the hydroxyl radical (OH), which would otherwise react with and eliminate methane, to form H2O. Exhaust often contains greenhouse gases, but isn't identical with such, and typically contains nitrogen from the air used in the combustion. You can't get any hydrogen out of an exhaust that contains the greenhouse gas CO2 but no water vapour.

This would be an absolute game changer. The "cassettes" could all be produced with green energy and shipped throughout the US with green energy. Think about if your EV had a hydrogen fuel cell, could your car then power your house? That would be the quickest way to 100% renewable energy. Can't the ford f150 already power your house? Then why couldn't your fuel cell EV power your house?

Many miles yet to go for this tech. The valley of death awaits. The majority of new tech does not survive. I wish them luck. This looks promising.

This is a very nice technology breakthrough. If it's in the lab now, then we can estimate it will always be about five years from public consumption. My main problem is availability. One nice advantage Plug-in electric vehicles have over gasoline, for example; is that you don' have to go somewhere and pump fuel. Electricity is everywhere, and in some cases, it's FREE. Even when it's not free, it's cheap on a per-mile basis. Cheaper than anything you can pump. Trust me on that. Even if you're pumping hydrogen. Even if you're getting your hydrogen on a cartridge, like you have here, it's going to cost more than electricity. There will be other use-cases where cost is not a factor, like military vehicles on remote bases, for example. Or spacecraft probes all over the solar system and beyond. I.E. places where you don't necessarily have a Conoco station every 3 miles. I like this tech, but let's be realistic: It won't replace electric charging stations. It won't even supplement them. All good wishes.

High pressure hydrogen is not particularly dangerous - similar to other high pressure gasses with flammability concerns. It's safer than petrol really. If a hydrogen tank is punctured, the hydrogen may ignite, but will get colder as the pressure drops. It will likely not explode as the very light gas quickly dissipates & it will not pool for the same reason. This has been tested, look for hydrogen gas tank tests, or hydrogen gar crash tests.

Cella Energy UK found a way to store hydrogen in microspheres, so small that they could flow like a liquid. With a small modification, you could pump them direct into your car gas engine. A catalysing reaction released the Hydrogen to burn just like gasoline with heat and H2O as byproducts. Unfortunately, they never secured enough funding to bring to market, but the tech still exists.

there is in fact a very easy way to fill these tapes one that was said was incineration plants but the other would be waste treatment plants(sewage plants)

Sounds a lot better way forward than batteries that take time to recharge. However oil will still be needed for lubricants and manufacturing.

0:25 Because right now most hydrogen production comes from fossil fuels. What we need is a space tower or tether that can suck hydrogen from the upper atmosphere to the surface for processing. Better yet - use the low pressure aloft to suck CO2 from the surface at points of exhaust. Use a turbine to capture the energy of the flowing CO2 to compress the hydrogen which pushes itself back to the surface. Less energy to move products, the only downside is you have a turbine/compressor with a lot of moving parts 60 miles high in the atmosphere, so maintenance is going to be a real PITA.

Since the technology is so good in this so called absorbing freely available hydrogen, I am sure they can easily and simply tweak the amazing micro thin film to absorb deuterium and even some tritium that are also available freely in open air and then ouput some fusion energy as a side dish. /sarc I wish the creaters do some homework before dumping scam tech on youtube viewers. This so called hydrogen capture from air is so wrong on so many levels.

replacing the tape is same to replace a H2 tank, considering a standard size tank with pressure valve to restrict the gas output pressure.

I really hope this technology takes off. Sounds very promising. Just don't let big oil get a hold of it or we will never see it again !!!!!! It's beyond time to get off of fossil fuels !!!!

Solar-powered electrolysis plant for supply, there you have all green :D

The simple fact that the government tried to stop it means it's great.

This sounds like a solution for special applications such as aircraft, military vehicles, and heavy equipment (eg. Mining, construction, long distance trains, agricultural tractors ect.) And other applications where recharging batteries is impractical. Honestly if this technology is to have a good future I think the company should be looking into how it can fit into the world of energy storage far more than trying to run vehicles especially light duty ones.

I wonder if this could be used for commercial flight, given its lightness.

I guess the biggest question, is how easy will it be to change out the cassette? to give a 200-300 mile range, how large and how heavy will it be. How complex will the system be to activate, and then use, finally how safe if the vehicle is in a high speed crash? since its designed to break a part? How well can it be used on an aircraft?? again the tape is energy dense, but how much weight is added for the activation system, and how reliable will it be?

They always say this, breakthrough in battery technology, or breakthrough in hydrogen cell, now solid hydrogen. It never works like fossil fuel doesn't 👎

Galaxy FCT says: A sustainable and circular economy as the reinsertion of hydrogen, is recycling of the byproduct (NaBO2 back to NaBH4) .... - Energy zipper ( chemical zipper (NaBH4) to contain energy as hydrogen in a solid chemical as an element in a compound). - at that moment (hydrogen gas is release on-demand as hydrogen gas) - at location (hydrogen gas is released on-demand at user‘s sites when needed) - convert curtail, intermittent and wasted electrons harvested by RE into energy, stored as solid hydrogen. - remove all unnecessary costs from a hydrogen gas supply chain (Package the electrons into a permanent storage as "hydrogen solid" contain other in a chemical zipper. Hydrogen gas release without the need of any energy (electricity) input by a hydrolysis process by adding water and catalyst to the solid compound) and Spyros Panopoulos has the anadiaplasis hydrogen fuel cells 1750hp

Ammonia is much easier to use as a hydrogen source, its decomposition produces gaseous nitrogen and hydrogen, but at 25% of the energy cost using electrolysis. Used as an automotive fuel the reaction products are water and nitrogen.